BvS All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - Part 98

[Black Narcissus]

The Penguin will be one of the villains in BvS.- Elmaybe

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

BREAKING NEWS COOL KIDS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Alfred will wear a 3 piece suit with white gloves!!!!!!

 

[The Question]

I saw this post on cinemablend and it made me chuckle In response to those worrying about BvS juggling far too many characters:

Captain America
Thor
Iron Man
The Hulk
Black Widow
Hawkeye
Nick Fury
War Machine
Scarlet Witch
Quicksilver
The Vision
Baron Wolfgang Von Strucker
Maria Hill
Peggy Carter
Dr. Selvig
and of course
Ultron

The problem isn't that BVS is juggling too many characters. The problem is that Zack Snyder is juggling too many characters. Joss Whedon is a superior storyteller to Snyder in almost every respect. He is capable of pulling off such a difficult task. I see no evidence that Snyder is.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

Eh Maybe's scoop:






Batman and Superman will be in the movie "Batman V. Superman: Dawn of Justice."

 

[CK_ALL_DAY]

The problem isn't that BVS is juggling too many characters. The problem is that Zack Snyder is juggling too many characters. Joss Whedon is a superior storyteller to Snyder in almost every respect. He is capable of pulling off such a difficult task. I see no evidence that Snyder is.

Watchmen?

 

[Black Narcissus]

Watchmen?

Great movie, but don't say that around the hype.

Also, Terrio is by his side.

 

[The Question]

Watchmen?

1: All of the characters, with the exception of Dr. Manhattan, came from the same place (the alternate history superhero subculture). A lot less to juggle there than characters with completely unrelated origins.

2: Watchmen was an adaptation of a specific story by a much more talented storyteller than either Snyder or Whedon who already worked out that judging act in the book. BVS, on the other hand, will be an adaptation of pre-existing characters but an original narrative.

3: Watchmen was a pretty bad movie. Mishandled the big character moments, awkwardly paced, goofy tone, it was a pure surface adaptation that didn't adapt any of the real meaningful backbone from the book.

 

[The Question]

Great movie, but don't say that around the hype.

Also, Terrio is by his side.

Terrio, a literary fiction writer who has never once written a genre film before, let alone one of this magnitude.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Terrio, a literary fiction writer who has never once written a genre film before, let alone one of this magnitude.

He wrote the screenplay to Argo.

 

[The Question]

He wrote the screenplay to Argo.

Which is the same thing as a big budget sic-fi/fantasy/action/superhero movie how, exactly?

 

[Black Narcissus]

Terrio, a literary fiction writer who has never once written a genre film before, let alone one of this magnitude.

Sounds exciting to me. You also forgot Oscar winner to that title.

Argo handled many different characters. He will probably also write JL, so there you have two.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Which is the same thing as a big budget sic-fi/fantasy/action/superhero movie how, exactly?

How is the guy that wrote Memento perfect to write a big budget action superhero movie?

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Watchmen?

And DAWN OF THE DEAD, AND 300. Those three are really ensembles, even with Butler getting the lion's share of screen time as the Spartan King in 300. I don't remember his handling of those casts as being another in the long line of fanboy sins he must atone for, but alright... Let's throw that one in there too.

 

[Black Narcissus]

How is the guy that wrote Memento perfect to write a big budget action superhero movie?

The Question is asking all the wrong questions.


THis is too much for me.

 

[The Question]

Sounds exciting to me. You also forgot Oscar winner to that title.

It's exciting that the writer of this film has never written anything that would require the skills necessary to write a film like this?

Oscar winner or no, writing genre like this film requires a very specific skill set that writing movies like Argo doesn't.

Argo handled many different characters.

None of those characters were aliens, or immortal magical amazons, or eccentric billionaire crime fighters. None of those characters flew through the air or came saddled with their own mythologies and supporting casts. None of the characters in Argo requires Terrio to make them seem credible, which is a challenge that every genre writer faces and requires a very specific set of skills.

Making aliens and magical warriors seem credible isn't something that you learn how to do by writing Argo.

I'm not saying he can't do it, but there's nothing to suggest that he can, and there is a long history of brilliant writers attempting genre for the first time and failing spectacularly because they don't know how to make the silliness credible.

 

[The Question]

How is the guy that wrote Memento perfect to write a big budget action superhero movie?

Because he was. Because he proved himself to be. And because the superhero he worked on was a lot closer to Memento than Superman and Wonder Woman are to Argo.

I'm not saying it's physically impossible for Terrio to do well on this. I'm just saying that nothing he's written so far suggests that this is an area where he will do well, and that being a good writer doesn't mean that you're capable of writing every kind of story. He might turn out to be brilliant and writing superheroes, just like Chris Nolan did, but until that happens I will be a little skeptical.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Who would have thought the guy who wrote Little Miss Sunshine could write a film like Toy Story 3.

Your logic is bad, you should feel bad.

 

[michael1975]

I saw this post on cinemablend and it made me chuckle In response to those worrying about BvS juggling far too many characters:

Captain America
Thor
Iron Man
The Hulk
Black Widow
Hawkeye
Nick Fury
War Machine
Scarlet Witch
Quicksilver
The Vision
Baron Wolfgang Von Strucker
Maria Hill
Peggy Carter
Dr. Selvig
and of course
Ultron

First off most of those characters have either had solo films (i.e Captain America, Ironman, Hulk, Thor) other characters where slowly introduced slowly though Marvel Universe (i.E Hawkeye, Blackwidow, Nick Fury, Maria Hill, Peggy Carter, War Machine.). So audience who's knowledge of Marvel Universe weren't thrown in to the lions den with characters they know nothing about.

In fact there is a reason Disney never went straight in for Avengers; which they did think about doing. There where two reason. The first is not to overwhelm the audience with characters they know nothing about. The second was to give the actors time to get use to the role before being slammed together with other actors playing other Super heroes. O the third reason is that it allows them not to devote screen time to explain all these new characters.

So let's look at DC. So far we have Batman and Superman covered. So instead of focusing on characters people have no knowledge of they choose characters audience have been seen before. In Batman vs Superman we have Wonder-Woman, and possibly the Flash Aquaman who will more then likely only have quick appearance.

So by time we get to Justice League the only two characters that audience will have any real knowledge of is Batman, Superman, a tad bit of WonderWoman and maybe Green Lantern.

WB isn't even being smart and doing a Wonder-Woman movie between Batman vs Superman and Justice League. Which I thought they would do but what do I know.

Maybe it will pan out I don't really know. It's hard to say. I just know they are bring actors to in to roles for the first time with other major actors and not allow them to develop those roles before Justice League. I think this will hurt the film more then it will help it. I also fear that the movie will be lost to the audience because they have no idea who most of these characters are.

However will see. I will wait and see the trailer to decided if I want to see it or not.

 

[KillerMcQueen]

Because he was. Because he proved himself to be. And because the superhero he worked on was a lot closer to Memento than Superman and Wonder Woman are to Argo.

I'm not saying it's physically impossible for Terrio to do well on this. I'm just saying that nothing he's written so far suggests that this is an area where he will do well, and that being a good writer doesn't mean that you're capable of writing every kind of story. He might turn out to be brilliant and writing superheroes, just like Chris Nolan did, but until that happens I will be a little skeptical.

I'd hardly say you're a "little" skeptical. You're probably one of the most skeptical and pessimistic people on this site.

 

[fake]

I'm not saying he can't do it, but there's nothing to suggest that he can, and there is a long history of brilliant writers attempting genre for the first time and failing spectacularly because they don't know how to make the silliness credible.

There is also a long history of writers attempting genre for the first time and succeeding spectacularly as well. If we are looking at the negative side, we need to consider the positive sides as well.

For example, since you are saying Argo does not prepare someone to write a straight up superhero movie with superstrength and flight and so on, the super strength and the flight does not make a superhero, those are additions on to an existing character. The ensemble work in Argo was top notch, with everyone from the producer, the writer, the hostages, the CIA and Tony Mendez getting defined arcs or character moments.

Only Batman actually comes into the movie with his own baggage, every single other character is a blank slate, and Superman has been established from MoS. If some of the audience goes in with their own baggage on these characters, that is not on the writer of the movie.

Because he was. Because he proved himself to be. And because the superhero he worked on was a lot closer to Memento than Superman and Wonder Woman are to Argo.

I'm not saying it's physically impossible for Terrio to do well on this. I'm just saying that nothing he's written so far suggests that this is an area where he will do well, and that being a good writer doesn't mean that you're capable of writing every kind of story. He might turn out to be brilliant and writing superheroes, just like Chris Nolan did, but until that happens I will be a little skeptical.

So basically, someone is a good pick because you say he is, and someone isn't because you say he isn't. Got it.

 

[Steamteck]

1: All of the characters, with the exception of Dr. Manhattan, came from the same place (the alternate history superhero subculture). A lot less to juggle there than characters with completely unrelated origins.

2: Watchmen was an adaptation of a specific story by a much more talented storyteller than either Snyder or Whedon who already worked out that judging act in the book. BVS, on the other hand, will be an adaptation of pre-existing characters but an original narrative.

3: Watchmen was a pretty bad movie. Mishandled the big character moments, awkwardly paced, goofy tone, it was a pure surface adaptation that didn't adapt any of the real meaningful backbone from the book.

in super minority here but I thought the graphic novel was a mess that the movie cleaned up nicely. The again Alan Moore's talent like Quentin Tarantino's has always eluded me.

 

[The Question]

Who would have thought the guy who wrote Little Miss Sunshine could write a film like Toy Story 3.

Well, for starters they're both heartwarming comedies with a dark edge to them.

But more importantly, you keep bringing up examples of people who proved themselves capable of writing a genre film after not having done it before as if that somehow proves that everyone who is a good writer of non-genre films is thus capable of doing the same.

Terrio has never written a movie like this before. Thus, I'm a little skeptical of his ability to pull it off. That does not mean that it is inherently impossible for him or anyone else like him to pull it off. It simply means that this current project will require skills that he has never been shown to have before, and that's worth being skeptical of.

Your logic is bad, you should feel bad.

You don't seem to understand what my logic is.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Well, for starters they're both heartwarming comedies with a dark edge to them.

But more importantly, you keep bringing up examples of people who proved themselves capable of writing a genre film after not having done it before as if that somehow proves that everyone who is a good writer of non-genre films is thus capable of doing the same.

Terrio has never written a movie like this before. Thus, I'm a little skeptical of his ability to pull it off. That does not mean that it is inherently impossible for him or anyone else like him to pull it off. It simply means that this current project will require skills that he has never been shown to have before, and that's worth being skeptical of.



You don't seem to understand what my logic is.

The Russo brothers never did anything like Cap 2 and look at what we got.

 

[Mrs. Wayne]

Ah that deja vu feeling.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

Ah that deja vu feeling.

The irony of it all.