Arrow Arrow General Discussion Thread - - - - - - - - - - - Part 25

Status
Not open for further replies.
Eh? Do tell?
The CW Television Network has released an official synopsis for the May 11 episode of Arrow, which is titled “Monument Point.”

TOM AMANDES RETURNS AS NOAH KUTTLER – When Team Arrow learns what Damien Darhk’s (guest star Neal McDonough) next move is Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) realizes she needs to ask her father, Noah Kuttler (guest star Tom Amandes), for help. Noah and Oliver (Stephen Amell) have a heart to heart talk that leaves Oliver rattled.

Kevin Tancharoen directed the episode written by Speed Weed & Jenny Lynn.
 
I wonder, if the ratings start to fall because people finally realize how much Arrow sucks right now and that there are other, better super hero shows to watch and enjoy, would the Arrow writers take the hint and start writting decent storylines not focused on Felicity and her relationship with Oliver?
 
The CW Television Network has released an official synopsis for the May 11 episode of Arrow, which is titled “Monument Point.”

TOM AMANDES RETURNS AS NOAH KUTTLER – When Team Arrow learns what Damien Darhk’s (guest star Neal McDonough) next move is Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) realizes she needs to ask her father, Noah Kuttler (guest star Tom Amandes), for help. Noah and Oliver (Stephen Amell) have a heart to heart talk that leaves Oliver rattled.

Kevin Tancharoen directed the episode written by Speed Weed & Jenny Lynn.


I already threw up in my mouth a little.
 
I wonder, if the ratings start to fall because people finally realize how much Arrow sucks right now and that there are other, better super hero shows to watch and enjoy, would the Arrow writers take the hint and start writting decent storylines not focused on Felicity and her relationship with Oliver?

No kidding never thought I'd say this but Gotham is better than arrow right now.
 
I wonder, if the ratings start to fall because people finally realize how much Arrow sucks right now and that there are other, better super hero shows to watch and enjoy, would the Arrow writers take the hint and start writting decent storylines not focused on Felicity and her relationship with Oliver?

They'll probably write more olicity thinking "this is the audience who is sticking with us, better not piss them off" :oldrazz:
 
I know this doesn't affect most people here who seem like they aren't going to watch anyway, but this gap is killing me. Flash is back, how long until Arrow finally ends their break?
 
I know this doesn't affect most people here who seem like they aren't going to watch anyway, but this gap is killing me. Flash is back, how long until Arrow finally ends their break?

They stuck around an extra week when Flash went on break. It'll be back Wednesday.
 
I know this doesn't affect most people here who seem like they aren't going to watch anyway, but this gap is killing me. Flash is back, how long until Arrow finally ends their break?

Yeah, same here. Despite the sour taste the last episode left in my mouth, I am still looking forward to the next episode.
 
Gotham is better solely because there is no Olicity, IMHO

Just be glad it's not a Berlanti production or Felicity would somehow make an appearance, all the characters would praise her and Jim would fall in love with her :whatever:

Meanwhile, I've been hearing good things about the 2nd season and knowing that it is Berlanti-free and safe from Felicity shilling just might give me the extra incentive to start watching!
 
Felicity is really only a problem on Arrow. She appears every once in a while on Flash, had a voice cameo in Vixen, and has been mentioned on Legends but all of the drama and baggage associated with her doesn't come for the ride. And obviously she's a world away on Supergirl.

It's not a Berlanti problem, it's an Arrow problem. Or, more precisely, a Guggenheim/Mericle problem.
 
Indeed. When she's on Flash, she goes back to the fun likable Felicity from seasons 1&2.

True. But I'm so sick of her on Arrow I don't want to see her when I watch another show. But if they were to move her full-time to Flash (hypothetically since there's really no "room" for her with that full cast) I'm sure I'd find her likeable again. I don't think I've seen her on Flash by herself this season -- has she been and I missed it?

I do find it annoying though that not only do I have to listen to practically everyone on Arrow praise her, but it also pops up on the other shows. And I consider that to be a Berlanti problem b/c Guggenheim is not a showrunner on the Flash. There has been talk of an Arrow/Supergirl cross-over next season and if that were to happen, it'd be interesting to see if Felicity were to be involved somehow and how she would come across
 
If there's a Supergirl/Arrow crossover the Felicity component would very likely involve nerding out with Wynn, which really wouldn't be bad.
 
Are you kidding? Even when she's on flash, she's the one that defeats the bad guy. I will stick with arrow until the end of the season, because I don't like to leave in the middle of something, but I won't watch season 5. I genuinely hoped season 4 would be better than 3, and it is, because at least darkh is an entertaining villain, unlike Ra's who would do nothing but bathe all the time, but it's still really really bad. Even Amell doesn't believe in the show anymore and has stopped trying to act at all. The action has been really weak too, save for two episodes. There is no redeeming qualities anymore. They should be honest and start calling it "keayboard: felicity and her friends".

The writing is definitely to blame, but the actress is annoying as hell too. I was among those who couldn't stand Laurel during season 2, but it was because of the awful writing. as soon as they stopped making her a witch, I wasn't bothered by Laurel. Whereas their attempts at showing how Felicity is better than anyone in the world is seriously dumb. Making Ray Palmer a tool just to show how great she is was laughable for instance.
 
So I'm in the middle of re-watching S2.. Can I just say how absolutely poorly written and pathetic they made Slade. This agenda he has w/ Oliver over Shado is utter trash. Shado and Slade shared ZERO scenes together that showed they had any chemistry or any chance of being romantically involved. If anything she put him in the friend zone and only shared a meaningless sympathy kiss when Shado thought Slade was about to die. Baffling how the writers took something that wasn't there AT ALL and made it the whole reason for Slade to go after Oliver. I mean what kind of voodoo did Shado's coot coot have over this guy??????? Simply baffling. What an awful way to turn Slade Wilson into the villain of S2. What a waste.
 
So I'm in the middle of re-watching S2.. Can I just say how absolutely poorly written and pathetic they made Slade. This agenda he has w/ Oliver over Shado is utter trash. Shado and Slade shared ZERO scenes together that showed they had any chemistry or any chance of being romantically involved. If anything she put him in the friend zone and only shared a meaningless sympathy kiss when Shado thought Slade was about to die. Baffling how the writers took something that wasn't there AT ALL and made it the whole reason for Slade to go after Oliver. I mean what kind of voodoo did Shado's coot coot have over this guy??????? Simply baffling. What an awful way to turn Slade Wilson into the villain of S2. What a waste.

They should have built it up more, his love for Shado seemed to have come out of nowhere. They did show Shado care for Slade when he was in very bad condition and tend to his wounds, and even get in bed with him to keep him warm. I can buy that Slade started to develop feeling for Shado then, but more than that should have been shown. It was also what he felt was betrayal on Oliver's part, that made him hate him. He spoke in season 1 about how much loyalty meant to him, after Billy Wintergreen, his partner and Godfather to his kid, betrayed him and joined Fryer's and his men.

From what he heard about what happened with Shado from Ivo, he felt Oliver had chosen Sara, an outsider who was working with Ivo, over Shado, who was part of their group and who had fought, hunted, lived and survived with Oliver and Slade on the island for almost a year, as well as look after them. He couldn't believe Oliver would chose an outsider over the people who had looked after him, survived with him and were his best and closest friends on that island. Slade was in the wrong of course, like villains usually are, but it is easy to see where he was coming from, even if more scenes with him and Shado being close should have been shown, rather than just two.

It is funny, in a way it is similar to Slade in the comics. In the comics, Slade blamed the Teen Titans for his sons death, even though H.I.V.E gave him the formula which ultimately caused Grant's death, but he still put the blame on the Titans, to complete his sons contract (in the comics, he always said that he honoured his contracts, and Slade on the show constantly saying that he keeps his promises was a reference to that). Slade put more blame on Oliver than Ivo, the same way he put more blame on H.I.V.E rather than on the Teen Titans, even though Ivo/H.I.V.E were more to blame (he obviously felt more hurt by Oliver, because Ivo was never Slade's friend, so he did not expect anything from him).

What the comics did was have it be Slade's son that caused his hatred of the heroes, and you do not have to show scenes of a father loving his son, because you just assume that they do. They did not have to build things up. Arrow chose to have it be a woman that he loved, so they had to build it up more and they didn't. That hurt the feud in a way, but Manu was still able to sell it, and Slade was still very accurate to the comics in so many ways.
 
Last edited:
They should have built it up more, his love for Shado seemed to have come out of nowhere. They did show Shado care for Slade when he was in very bad condition and tend to his wounds, and even get in bed with him to keep him warm. I can buy that Slade started to develop feeling for Shado then, but more than that should have been shown. It was also what he felt was betrayal on Oliver's part, that made him hate him. He spoke in season 1 about how much loyalty meant to him, after Billy Wintergreen, his partner and Godfather to his kid, betrayed him and joined Fryer's and his men.

From what he heard about what happened with Shado from Ivo, he felt Oliver had chosen Sara, an outsider who was working with Ivo, over Shado, who was part of their group and who had fought, hunted, lived and survived with Oliver and Slade on the island for almost a year, as well as look after them. He couldn't believe Oliver would chose an outsider over the people who had looked after him, survived with him and were his best and closest friends on that island. Slade was in the wrong of course, like villains usually are, but it is easy to see where he was coming from, even if more scenes with him and Shado being close should have been shown, rather than just two.

It is funny, in a way it is similar to Slade in the comics. In the comics, Slade blamed the Teen Titans for his sons death, even though H.I.V.E gave him the formula which ultimately caused Grant's death, but he still put the blame on the Titans, to complete his sons contract (in the comics, he always said that he honoured his contracts, and Slade on the show constantly saying that he keeps his promises was a reference to that). Slade put more blame on Oliver than Ivo, the same way he put more blame on H.I.V.E rather than on the Teen Titans, even though Ivo/H.I.V.E were more to blame (he obviously felt more hurt by Oliver, because Ivo was never Slade's friend, so he did not expect anything from him).

What the comics did was have it be Slade's son that caused his hatred of the heroes, and you do not have to show scenes of a father loving his son, because you just assume that they do. They did not have to build things up. Arrow chose to have it be a woman that he loved, so they had to build it up more and they didn't. That hurt the feud in a way, but Manu was still able to sell it, and Slade was still very accurate to the comics in so many ways.

I get where you'e coming from. However, Slade doesn't bring up having a loyalty issue. He continually brings up how Oliver took Shado, the love of his life, away from him. Now he's out to take away the ones Oliver cares about the most, or at least threaten them. I mean come on, he has his own personal Shado talking to him telling him to kill for her... And how creepy is it that he gets off the island and tracks down some pretty personal home movies of Shado.. So she tends to his wounds and makes sure he doesn't freeze to death and that makes you love the chick? To that extent I should really fall head over heels with the doctor I go to annually for a physical. They're making sure I'm healthy and okay, right?

There had to be a much better way of making Slade into the villain, and not only do they royally screw the pooch this time but they DO IT AGAIN in S3 by having him appear in some meaningless role only to have Thea of all people, Thea! take him down with ease.. Oh boy. Makes so much sense by Manu Bennett didn't want to return and thought the character was wasted.
 
I get where you'e coming from. However, Slade doesn't bring up having a loyalty issue.

It was still shown how important that it was to Slade in season 1 and he spoke about it then. It was laying the seeds for Oliver's ultimate "betrayal". I agree that it was not brought up enough. Exposition was never this shows strong point, even in season 1 and 2. I re-watched season 2 and 3 recently enough though, and him feeling that Oliver betrayed Shado for an outsider was one of the reasons for his motivation that I took away from it, as well as his love for Shado, which came out of nowhere. Maybe I am remembering things wrong, but that is what I took away from it. Something must have been said by Slade or someone to have made me think this, but like I said, I might be remembering it wrong or perhaps I misunderstood something that was said.

He continually brings up how Oliver took Shado, the love of his life, away from him. Now he's out to take away the ones Oliver cares about the most, or at least threaten them. I mean come on, he has his own personal Shado talking to him telling him to kill for her... And how creepy is it that he gets off the island and tracks down some pretty personal home movies of Shado

Yeah, I agree with that. They never made it clear if his love for Shaod was exaggerated by the mirakuru, or if he really felt that strongly for her without it. The way he was hallucinating about her makes me think that it was the mirakuru, but he then said that he hates Oliver even when he was cured, and in season 3 he still hated him (and I think it was still over Shado). They did not make things clear, perhaps because the writers are not sure themselves. Maybe they want to leaves things open so that if they bring him back, they can have him as either an anti-hero or a villain, and then choose whether it was the mirakuru or not.

So she tends to his wounds and makes sure he doesn't freeze to death and that makes you love the chick? To that extent I should really fall head over heels with the doctor I go to annually for a physical. They're making sure I'm healthy and okay, right?
This is a bad comparison, I am sure you know this. Are you close with the doctor and have you spent lots of time alone with her for a long period of time, like Slade did with Shado? Did you fight together, hunt together, survive together and live together?They were close for a long time as friends and allies. It is perfectly understandable that he could have slowly developed feelings for her overtime, but they get much stronger in that moment, when she stayed with him even though he was just a dead weight, slowing her down and probably endangering her.

they DO IT AGAIN in S3 by having him appear in some meaningless role only to have Thea of all people, Thea! take him down with ease.. Oh boy. Makes so much sense by Manu Bennett didn't want to return and thought the character was wasted.
This never happened. It is sad that your silly exaggerations are taking away from your valid points. Thea did not beat Slade. She got a few shots in, but it took both her and Oliver to take Slade down. I agree that he was completely wasted in season 3 thiough. They could have used any villain of the week in his place and not much would have changed. That episode did not progress Oliver and Slade's relationship and feud at all.
 
Last edited:
I wonder, if the ratings start to fall because people finally realize how much Arrow sucks right now and that there are other, better super hero shows to watch and enjoy, would the Arrow writers take the hint and start writting decent storylines not focused on Felicity and her relationship with Oliver?

Ratings will be fine.

This is The CW. Shipping is what keeps their shows afloat, and they only need about a million viewers for renewal.

I think the showrunners have realized they can't please the comicbook fans, so they're focusing their efforts on keeping the CW shipper crowd tuned in.
 
I get where you'e coming from. However, Slade doesn't bring up having a loyalty issue. He continually brings up how Oliver took Shado, the love of his life, away from him. Now he's out to take away the ones Oliver cares about the most, or at least threaten them. I mean come on, he has his own personal Shado talking to him telling him to kill for her... And how creepy is it that he gets off the island and tracks down some pretty personal home movies of Shado.. So she tends to his wounds and makes sure he doesn't freeze to death and that makes you love the chick? To that extent I should really fall head over heels with the doctor I go to annually for a physical. They're making sure I'm healthy and okay, right?

There had to be a much better way of making Slade into the villain, and not only do they royally screw the pooch this time but they DO IT AGAIN in S3 by having him appear in some meaningless role only to have Thea of all people, Thea! take him down with ease.. Oh boy. Makes so much sense by Manu Bennett didn't want to return and thought the character was wasted.

Let's not forget that the mirakuru addling his brain greatly enhanced the rage and betrayal he felt, and the focal point was Shado (as Roy showed, the mirakuru seemingly manifested itself as a person the victim knew, when it was talking to him through a Thea vision). By the time Slade was cured of the mirakuru, his brain had been focused on nothing but killing Oliver out of vengeance for Shado for five years.

I'd recommend reading Arrow - Vengeance, the novel that came out a couple months ago. It gives us a good look into Slade's head and balances what we see in S2 with a more cunning, somewhat stable mind than what we ever see in the show. I will say, however, that Slade still being obsessed over Shado in S3 was a major mistake. The ideal there would've been for him to tell Oliver "I'm over it, but screw you, we're done forever," and escaped the island to become a mercenary.
 
Let's not forget that the mirakuru addling his brain greatly enhanced the rage and betrayal he felt, and the focal point was Shado (as Roy showed, the mirakuru seemingly manifested itself as a person the victim knew, when it was talking to him through a Thea vision). By the time Slade was cured of the mirakuru, his brain had been focused on nothing but killing Oliver out of vengeance for Shado for five years.

I'd recommend reading Arrow - Vengeance, the novel that came out a couple months ago. It gives us a good look into Slade's head and balances what we see in S2 with a more cunning, somewhat stable mind than what we ever see in the show. I will say, however, that Slade still being obsessed over Shado in S3 was a major mistake. The ideal there would've been for him to tell Oliver "I'm over it, but screw you, we're done forever," and escaped the island to become a mercenary.

Is this any good? I picked it up recently, but I haven't gotten around to reading it yet.
 
Is this any good? I picked it up recently, but I haven't gotten around to reading it yet.

I enjoyed it. Gives some good backstory to Slade, Blood, and Rochev. Also explains (maybe?) why the son seen in LOT is different than the one Slade mentions in S1. What it doesn't explain is where the LOT kid comes from; Slade has to have had a relationship with some woman off-screen either this season or in the next one or two, given the kid's apparent age 30 years from now (as in, mid-20s or right around 30).
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread

Staff online

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
202,269
Messages
22,077,639
Members
45,877
Latest member
dude9876
Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"