Arrow Arrow General Discussion Thread - - - - - - - - - - - Part 25

[SpideyVille]

The whole thing is weird though, because if Cassidy didn't like the character or her castmates or whatever, she wouldn't have to do the conventions or the Flash/LOT guest appearances. It could just be Guggenheim, but I don't think they will admit that until it is cancelled.

To be fair, Smallville ended 5 years ago and they still haven't admitted that they used the CG Superman because Welling didn't want to wear the suit, even though we all know that that's most likely the case.

Truth of the matter is, the last thing you want to do in Hollywood (Acting world) is talk trash about your co-workers. It can help you gain support in the moment with the fans, but it won't get you any love backstage, especially if you're auditioning for a role and the casting director just so happens to be the best friend of the person you talked bad about publicly.

Not to mention, I don't think she hates EBR. It's more of the direction that the show has taken her character. It's completely the opposite of what was promised, and even though she finally became Black Canary last season, that didn't change much for her role. She is supposed to be Ollie's support, and throughout the series, they've shown her to be his opposite on nearly every argument, and in most cases, he acted like she was beneath him. Laurel still needs training, but she is not supposed to be a sidekick. Thea is, but Laurel is not supposed to be, yet they treat them both the same, as incapable heroes.

 

[Slade W]

Like I said before, allowing the photos to leak was amateurish (unless they allowed certain things to be seen to trick fans, but that is unlikely). Guggenheim is right about it being poor on the paparazzi's part, but that is how it is for every show, they all have to deal with it. The people working on the show should have dealt with it better.

 

[marvelrobbins]

recent comments make it clear the set lpics spoiling death are real.

 

[Primal Slayer]

Like I said before, allowing the photos to leak was amateurish (unless they allowed certain things to be seen to trick fans, but that is unlikely). Guggenheim is right about it being poor on the paparazzi's part, but that is how it is for every show, they all have to deal with it. The people working on the show should have dealt with it better.

They could've easily CGI'd the name on there, but they didn't care that much to cover it up. Just like with The Flash crew waving at the person recording them the other night.

 

[bes628]

Guggenheim is a *****n Hack. Jesus.

 

[SpideyVille]

Like I said before, allowing the photos to leak was amateurish (unless they allowed certain things to be seen to trick fans, but that is unlikely). Guggenheim is right about it being poor on the paparazzi's part, but that is how it is for every show, they all have to deal with it. The people working on the show should have dealt with it better.

I didn't see him complaining when they were photos of Oliver proposing to Felicity.

 

[SuperAl]

I can't believe these are the same people making Flash. How can one show be so good and the other so bad?

 

[SpideyVille]

I can't believe these are the same people making Flash. How can one show be so good and the other so bad?

They're not. It's Bertlanti's team, but it's not the same people running both shows. The Producers from season and two got split across the two shows once Flash got picked up.

 

[Loki882]

It's perfectly possible that Cassidy doesn't hate her co-stars (the BTS stuff and photos that I've seen of them interacting seem to indicate that they get along well-enough). Her problem is more with the writers/EP. Heck Manu Bennett also famously expressed his frustrations in that regard (to the point that I don't know that we'll ever seem Slade back on the show at all, which is a shame).

 

[DeadFan]

I don't think Guggenheim and Mericle are doing a very good job as showrunners, but if the ratings hold up, Berlanti will probably think they're doing just fine if not great

 

[Paradox1]

I'll be watching tonight hoping they don't do the incredibly dumb thing I think they are. I might continue the season, I might not, but being a viewer for the 5th season is far less unlikely. The season started with so much promise and none of those story lines teased then have gone in a pleasing direction.

 

[chamber-music]

These people are total hacks:


Mericle and Guggenheim said the writers didn't want to kill off the character in question, but they felt they needed to pay off the storyline set up in the premiere. At the time of the premiere, the writers hadn't yet figured out who they were going to put in the grave.


from here:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/li...-tease-grave-reveal-880680?utm_source=twitter


you know who is dying because they stuck to a stupid idea from the premier.

So these idiots wrote themselves into a corner?

 

[SpideyVille]

I knew from day one that the show was in bad shape when they were relying on teasing a mystery death.

That's one of the cheapest way to gain or maintain viewership.

 

[Slade W]

Who do people think will kill off whoever (we all know who it is, I am just trying to avoid spoiling it for someone that does not follow news about the show) it is that will die? Personally, I think it will be Darhk that does it. Every major villain has killed off someone important or close to Oliver and has caused damage and inflicted serious pain upon him, in one form or another. Slade killed Moira, took his company and house, turned Thea against him, which led her to Merlyn and came close to destroying the entire city.

Ra's gave Oliver the beating of his life and came very close to killing him, and he would have died, if it were not for penicillin and willpower . He also killed Thea, then brought her back with side-effects, forced Oliver to give up being "The Arrow" due to the "The Arrow's" reputation being ruined, with Ra's revealing his identity to Lance playing a big part in that, and because of Ra's, Roy had to give up his normal life and go on the run so that Oliver did not have to go to jail. He also came close to destroying the city.

Merlyn, well, he has caused more pain for Oliver and his team than anyone else on the show has. He does not need another win on the "villainous deeds" column at this stage. Darhk, for all his power, intelligence and resources, has not really done anything serious so far. It is likely that the writers will want to have him do something that will cause lasting pain for Oliver and his team, so that is why I think it will be him. If he doesn't, he will be remembered as the funny, entertaining guy with the magic, that talked a lot, but didn't really do anything.

 

[SpideyVille]

Who do people think will kill off whoever (we all know who it is, I am just trying to avoid spoiling it for someone that does not follow news about the show) it is that will die? Personally, I think it will be Darhk that does it. Every major villain has killed off someone important or close to Oliver and has caused damage and inflicted serious pain upon him, in one form or another. Slade killed Moira, took his company and house, turned Thea against him, which led her to Merlyn and came close to destroying the entire city.

Ra's gave Oliver the beating of his life and came very close to killing him, and he would have died, if it were not for penicillin and willpower . He also killed Thea, then brought her back with side-effects, forced Oliver to give up being "The Arrow" due to the "The Arrow's" reputation being ruined, with Ra's revealing his identity to Lance playing a big part in that, and because of Ra's, Roy had to give up his normal life and go on the run so that Oliver did not have to go to jail.

Merlyn, well, he has caused more pain for Oliver and his team than anyone else on the show has. He does not need another win on the "villainous deeds" column at this stage. Darhk, for all his power, intelligence and resources, has not really done anything serious so far. It is likely that the writers will want to have him do something that will cause lasting pain for Oliver and his team, so that is why I think it will be him. If he doesn't, he will be remembered as the funny guy with the magic, that talked a lot, but didn't really do anything.

I have a strong feeling it will be Merlyn, considering it will be a "twist" on the Him that Felicity mentioned. We automatically assumed it was Darhk, but I think it will be Malcolm.

Although with the end of last week, I think it could also be Andy. Not to mention, Malcolm is supposed to be back next season, so I don't see how he can be unless he is the main villain next season, but he shouldn't make it out of this season alive if that's the case.

 

[DCnightwing23]

Question, so a few episodes back they had the scene at the grave where Oliver gets into a car where it's revealed Felicity is there with him. She says something along the lines of "You've got to kill Dhark for doing this", also Oliver tells Barry that "he's going to kill Dhark" but how and why is Dhark involved with killing off [BLACKOUT]Laurel[/BLACKOUT] if he's stuck in prison and HIVE has effectively kicked him off their team. I don't see the connection between these two. Keep in mind I haven't watched the last two episodes, so is there something in these last two episodes that links the two together?

 

[Slade W]

I have a strong feeling it will be Merlyn, considering it will be a "twist" on the Him that Felicity mentioned. We automatically assumed it was Darhk, but I think it will be Malcolm.

Although with the end of last week, I think it could also be Andy. Not to mention, Malcolm is supposed to be back next season, so I don't see how he can be unless he is the main villain next season, but he shouldn't make it out of this season alive if that's the case.

You could be right, but maybe he will be involved in it, but does not directly kill the character. Maybe Oliver and Felicity will just be more angry towards him than Darhk, because they have spared him for so long and this is one betrayed too much. I hope Darhk gets some sort of "win" over Oliver and his team (although I wish it could come in some other way, rather than killing off one of my favourite characters, which, unfortunately, is how this "win" for Darhk will most likely come). He is a fantastic character and villain, played by a superb actor. I hope he does something that will cause lasting pain, so that he will leave behind a good legacy on the show and go down as one of Oliver's greatest and most powerful foes (and perhaps one of the most personal too).

It seems that the more powerful and resourceful the villains are, the less damage they cause to Oliver and his team. Malcolm is the weakest main villain that has been on the show, yet he has caused the most damage. Darhk is the most powerful, yet he has caused the least amount of damage (so far). Ra's was the second most powerful, yet he caused less damage than Merlyn and Slade (who caused the 2nd most damage), but more than Darhk has.

 

[Slade W]

Question, so a few episodes back they had the scene at the grave where Oliver gets into a car where it's revealed Felicity is there with him. She says something along the lines of "You've got to kill Dhark for doing this", also Oliver tells Barry that "he's going to kill Dhark" but how and why is Dhark involved with killing off [BLACKOUT]Laurel[/BLACKOUT] if he's stuck in prison and HIVE has effectively kicked him off their team. I don't see the connection between these two. Keep in mind I haven't watched the last two episodes, so is there something in these last two episodes that links the two together?

I think that Merlyn will break him out, perhaps in exchange for getting his arm back.

 

[SpideyVille]

Question, so a few episodes back they had the scene at the grave where Oliver gets into a car where it's revealed Felicity is there with him. She says something along the lines of "You've got to kill Dhark for doing this", also Oliver tells Barry that "he's going to kill Dhark" but how and why is Dhark involved with killing off [BLACKOUT]Laurel[/BLACKOUT] if he's stuck in prison and HIVE has effectively kicked him off their team. I don't see the connection between these two. Keep in mind I haven't watched the last two episodes, so is there something in these last two episodes that links the two together?

[YT]MhkTpi3KLt0[/YT]
She never says "Kill Dhark". We all think that's who she meant, but she never names him specifically.

EDIT: Also, Oliver never names him either.

[YT]aSenjmFxhV8[/YT]

 

[SpideyVille]

You could be right, but maybe he will be involved in it, but does not directly kill the character. Maybe Oliver and Felicity will just be more angry towards him than Darhk, because they have spared him for so long and this is one betrayed too much. I hope Darhk gets some sort of "win" over Oliver and his team (although I wish it could come in some other way, rather than killing off one of my favourite characters, which, unfortunately, is how this "win" for Darhk will most likely come). He is a fantastic character and villain, played by a superb actor. I hope he does something that will cause lasting pain, so that he will leave behind a good legacy on the show and go down as one of Oliver's greatest and most powerful foes (and perhaps one of the most personal too).

It seems that the more powerful and resourceful the villains are, the less damage they cause to Oliver and his team. Malcolm is the weakest main villain that has been on the show, yet he has caused the most damage. Darhk is the most powerful, yet he has caused the least amount of damage (so far). Ra's was the second most powerful, yet he caused less damage than Merlyn and Slade (who caused the 2nd most damage), but more than Darhk has.

I almost feel like Dhark is playing the Brother Blood role. The only issue is then who is playing the Slade role this season.

I feel like Project Genesis will move forward without Dhark, and Oliver's focus will be on stopping that, and I feel like Malcolm can't stand being a minion, he needs to be in complete control. The problem with that is that he's just not written as well as Slade. He's written more to just be involved because he's Barrowman, and that's really who they want on the show, the actor not the character.

 

[Legendver2]

Wait, so it's been leaked that the death is [BLACKOUT]Laurel[/BLACKOUT]?

I don't usually keep up with the spoilers, I just watch it. But I don't mind being spoiled for this show at least, since it's not a priority in terms of getting hyped for

 

[Slade W]

I almost feel like Dhark is playing the Brother Blood role. The only issue is then who is playing the Slade role this season.

I feel like Project Genesis will move forward without Dhark, and Oliver's focus will be on stopping that, and I feel like Malcolm can't stand being a minion, he needs to be in complete control. The problem with that is that he's just not written as well as Slade. He's written more to just be involved because he's Barrowman, and that's really who they want on the show, the actor not the character.

That is likely, but Darhk is still a bigger and more important character on this show than Blood was. He could still leave a mark. My feeling is that it will be Talia al Ghul who will be the Slade of the season.

In regards to your second paragraph, I think that is partly true, but they have still had him do a lot. He has caused more damage to Oliver than any other villain has, much more. Barrowman said that they wanted him to be the Joker of the show, and he has been. A big reason they keep him around his because they view Merlyn as GA's greatest villain (like he is in the comics, along with Vertigo), and that is another reason why they want to keep him around.

 

[SpideyVille]

Wait, so it's been leaked that the death is [BLACKOUT]Laurel[/BLACKOUT]?

I don't usually keep up with the spoilers, I just watch it. But I don't mind being spoiled for this show at least, since it's not a priority in terms of getting hyped for

Yes, set photos from both Arrow and Legends seem to confirm this.

That is likely, but Darhk is still a bigger and more important character on this show than Blood was. He could still leave a mark. My feeling is that it will be Talia al Ghul who will be the Slade of the season.

In regards to your second paragraph, I think that is partly true, but they have still had him do a lot. He has caused more damage to Oliver than any other villain has, much more. Barrowman said that they wanted him to be the Joker of the show, and he has been. A big reason they keep him around his because they view Merlyn as GA's greatest villain (like he is in the comics, along with Vertigo), and that is another reason why they want to keep him around.

The problem with him being the Joker is that he isn't like that at all. He's hiding behind the scenes half the time, and when he does appear, it's to get people to do things for him, or cry like a baby that is scared of losing his toys.

He was awesome in season one, decent in his limited role in season two, and started off season three good, but after the Sara stuff, it was clear that he was more a plot device than a character.

 

[vantheman77]

Since they leaked the photos online, I'm not sure if i want to watch Arrow again after this episode. All this for Oliver and Felicity?

If it's true that there are some conflicts in the cast and maybe the WB wanting certain characters for the movies, I can understand that.

Truth here is that this season was not well-planned, especially when they had to launch Legends of Tomorrow.

 

[Slade W]

The problem with him being the Joker is that he isn't like that at all.

When I said that they want him to be the shows's Joker, I didn't mean behave like the character. I meant that they want him to be the main hero's most persistent villain, that causes more suffering for the hero than anyone else. Malcolm has caused more damage and inflicted more pain on Oliver than anyone else, just like the Joker has with Batman.

He's hiding behind the scenes half the time.

It is about quality of time over quantity of time. They obviously have to focus more on the heroes, over the villains. They have more developing to do. When he has appeared, he has generally had an impact and played a big part. Oliver's conflict with Ra's was because of Malcolm, who was desperate and sick of running from the LOA, and wanted Oliver to kill Ra's so that he could be free. A desperate plan from a desperate man, who will use anyone to get what he wants.

when he does appear, it's to get people to do things for him, or cry like a baby that is scared of losing his toys.

How is this bad exactly? This is a villain after all, he is not supposed to be likeable or helpful.

it was clear that he was more a plot device than a character..

While this show is inconsistent with its accuracy to the Green Arrow comics, it has done right by them in how it has had Merlyn be Oliver's most persistent foe. Merlyn, along with Vertigo, is Green Arrow's greatest villain. They did a crap job with Vertigo, but they have done a good job with Merlyn as he has caused much more damage than any other villain on the show. There are times where it has been pretty silly in how they have kept him around (although I would say that about a lot of heroes main villains in the comics, where they do similar silly things to keep them around), but he has still been the main cause of most of Oliver's problems. That is what a heroes main villain should do. Things like Oliver handing him the LOA were silly though. They should have come up with a better reason for giving it to him (like have Malcolm mention how important the LOA are, and that if Oliver disbands them then other threats like HIVE will have more power).