Comics Boycotting Spider-Man

It insults me that JQ has said all the storys the past 2 years were orchestrated to get us to this "point". It insults me when JQ says he is doing this to give us "good storys" again. So, he planned all this lame stuff, and is writing this CHEESE now: crap that even JMS doesn't want to be tied to.....for the "purpose of giving us good stories"?? Oy..

I've even read OMD, although at the stand and not with my cash, since it is turning out even worse than i had dared imagine they'd go for..

So basically you make out JQ to be the anti-christ, but yet it's okay for you to "steal" a comic at the local comic store.:whatever:

truth is...I did, they just didn't want to listen. It isn't about the readers anymore and Joey Q has made that clear.

Actually, the "truth is" it is a business, if books don't sell, they get cancelled. Maybe more people should buy them, instead of reading them at the Comic store.
 
So basically you make out JQ to be the anti-christ, but



Actually, the "truth is" it is a business, if books don't sell, they get cancelled. Maybe more people should buy them, instead of reading them at the Comic store.

I see it, I like it, I buy it. If I see it, I don't like it, guess what, I don't buy it. I've been screwed too many times just pickn up a spidey title, buy it and the story sucks, especially when they put all the advertisments in there, there didn't used to be that many in a comic book. Also Joe raised the price and reused drawings in pannels, not to mention his "muppet" artwork sucks. Reason why people don't buy it because there is a HUGE selection of other comic books out there that they enjoy better, so why bother with Spidey (especially now, thanks a lot JOE) when they can go over to other comics.
 
spidergreg: So basically you make out JQ to be the anti-christ, but yet it's okay for you to "steal" a comic at the local comic store.:whatever:



Uh...first off.....i've given JQ props MANY times for what he's done for the industry. Go thru and read all my posts...which are quite fair and not one of those that outright bash the guy.

Second...don't go starting something, it's not like i am making fun of people SPENDING money to read about Mephisto the anti-marriage fairy.

If you want to purchase it, fine....and if you find a way to enjoy OMD and find it intelligent and interesting..that is fine too. To each his own. If i choose to skim it over at the grocery store or whatever...that doesn't make me a villian in any way, so let's not all try getting into THAT line of arguement again.

I'm one of the people who've kept all the spidey people in business since the beginning, thank you very much, and will continue buying tons of spidey stuff...just not poorly written FORCED AGENDAS, period. There are other comics i AM buying right now (that JQ is editor of) that are WORTH the money.

It IS sad , the state of sidey specifically right now tho, imo. If you think JQ is really doing a great job with OMD....great. What is it about it that made you like it and WANT to spend your money on it?
 
If I had started a drinking game where I would take a shot every time farmernudie said "cheese" or "forced agenda," I would have long since died of alcohol poisoning.

:oldrazz:
 
mephisto the ani marrage fairy?
and here i thought wrecking pete and mj's marrage was the black cats job
 
Blader: If I had started a drinking game where I would take a shot every time farmernudie said "cheese" or "forced agenda," I would have long since died of alcohol poisoning.

I had CHEESE last nite, actually...crackers, pepperoni too...and it tasted GREAT...nothing like a "forced agenda" really.

:woot:

lol

I'll have to start saying "cornball" more i guess...:oldrazz:
 
Uh...first off.....i've given JQ props MANY times for what he's done for the industry. Go thru and read all my posts...which are quite fair and not one of those that outright bash the guy.

But you do overreactively claim to be "insulted" for the sole fact that the character isn't being taken in a direction that you like. You're taking it a little too personal and being a bit pretentious.
I don't like everything JQ does either but he is trying to look long term on the character (20-50 years) He's got stones and taking a bullet on this one. I seriously doubt he likes the abuse that others have given him. I don't think I could do the same and I got to respect him for that.

Second...don't go starting something,?

Not starting anything, just posting at a forum, it's nothing personal, you're free to disagree all you like. :yay:

it's not like i am making fun of people SPENDING money to read about Mephisto the anti-marriage fairy.

Thank you for putting that as maturely and delicately as possible.:whatever:


If you want to purchase it, fine....and if you find a way to enjoy OMD and find it intelligent and interesting..that is fine too. To each his own.

Thank you for the approval. :cwink:

If i choose to skim it over at the grocery store or whatever...that doesn't make me a villian in any way.

Interesting..I haven't seen comics in grocery stores in years. :cwink: Just curious, if you only skimmed the issue, how do you know it's badly written? :huh:


so let's not all try getting into THAT line of arguement again.

Again? it's the first time I brought it up.

I'm one of the people who've kept all the spidey people in business since the beginning, thank you very much,

um....your welcome? :huh:

just not poorly written FORCED AGENDAS, period.

So you didn't buy the original marriage issues? that was a poorly forced agenda


It IS sad , the state of sidey specifically right now tho, imo. If you think JQ is really doing a great job with OMD....great. What is it about it that made you like it and WANT to spend your money on it?

I'm not a fan of the marriage, and am looking forward to the new direction. I'm guessing that if OMD didn't have it's inevitable outcome the story and the art would not get the blatant hatred it's getting now.
Feel free to disagree.
 
Well, Doc Strange did say Peter was the fulcrum of a great mystical war. Maybe Mephisto getting in first 'dibs' has something to do with that. Or it could be a bunch of hoo that will be forgotten.
 
For the record, the marriage itself is the result of a contrived, forced agenda. What goes around, comes around. :oldrazz:
 
Interesting..I haven't seen comics in grocery stores in years. :cwink: Just curious, if you only skimmed the issue, how do you know it's badly written? :huh:


Yeh...we're VERY rural here. Our grocery stores sell them, tho not big variety.

Small book store half hour from here sells them , but not lots.

Barnes and Nobles 2 hours form here sell them, but not lots. They also sell tpb's. Everytime i go to BandN, everyone is sitting around reading comics, books, EVERYTHING they sell there.



Again? it's the first time I brought it up.


I was talking about, one of these threads, weeks back, turned into a big moral debate about where and when a person can read/skim/dissect comic books and whether it was "moral" or not. THAT"S what i meant by again. Didn't take part in it the first time, didn't appreciate you saying i was "stealing" when i read/skimmed/looked over (whatever word i use(d)) for this particular comic. Thought that was kinda a little too strong of an accusation...for someone who doesn't know a thing about me.

Look, i am not a big fan of reading them over first, tho i don't ever think when i see someone reading one ANYWHERE as that person being a thief. I personally always buy, not that i care to talk about it or defend myself to you. If a comic shop or anywhere has a rule not to read, and doesn't outright encourage it, then i think everyone should abide by the rules of where they are, imo.

The only reason i am looking over OMD instead of buying, is because it came along with a two year long "Warning" of what they were gonna do (from JQ), as well as controversy currently from the writer himself (JMS) about how bad it is....so while i am , or was, holding out hope, I did approach this PARTICULAR "comic" CAUTIOUSLY. With all that i buy, i don't want to flush $4 downt he drain, which is what i would've done by purchasing this comic. And no, I've never once sat down in B and Nob. to read a book or novel or tpb or whatever. I know what i like and i just buy,...always! But again, those that do, i would never tell them they're "stealing" like you did me.

And i buy LOTS of stuff in under JQ and have never been one to say he is the anti-christ, as you put it, and as some people actually say on here. I've given him lots of props MANY times. (not that it's a contest, just pointing out) I don't take it (the JQ bashing) too seriously, ..however, i do find his SPIDEY decisions to be SILLY and ODD...basically, off base...again imo.


So you didn't buy the original marriage issues? that was a poorly forced agenda. I'm not a fan of the marriage, and am looking forward to the new direction. I'm guessing that if OMD didn't have it's inevitable outcome the story and the art would not get the blatant hatred it's getting now. Feel free to disagree.

I've said before, and admit, I AM for the marriage. I've always admitted that frankly, so, i still wouldn't like a story ruining it blatantly...yet, I COULD at least ADMIT to a story that would've done it more intelligently and given it THAT.

You, and others however, still haven't here or anywhere, stated why you LIKE the OMD arc. IS everyone off base, including JMS, for thinking it is overly forced and kinda dippy in premise? For those that just DEFEND OMD and get mad at those that don't like it...why do they not tend to say anything about what is making this story good to them??

And, i personally thought the marriage was something that made SENSE in the progression of things. I don't see it as anything as forced as OMD is, not even in the same league. It made sense after all those years for them to hook up and move on.

Nothing in OMD mades sense like that. OMD just moves all the characters to point B of no marriage. And in a silly way...like a child might write it...

MEPHISTO: I WILL HEAL AUNT MAY AND TAKE YOUR MARRIAGE IN RETURN. >POOF<

That to me is silly. ANd i've explained in detail how it doesn't even fit continuity of any of the characters to back up, my "opinion" of that.

Now, with this OMD foundation, JQ is basically outlawing progression...because the characters cannot move past the phase of singleness in spidey specifically. No drama there??
 
You, and others however, still haven't here or anywhere, stated why you LIKE the OMD arc. IS everyone off base, including JMS, for thinking it is overly forced and kinda dippy in premise? For those that just DEFEND OMD and get mad at those that don't like it...why do they not tend to say anything about what is making this story good to them??

And, i personally thought the marriage was something that made SENSE in the progression of things.

Now, with this OMD foundation, JQ is basically outlawing progression...because the characters cannot move past the phase of singleness in spidey specifically. No drama there??

I don't think anybody here is particularly admitting that they like OMD... clearly, I have not enjoyed it myself.

But I have seen "agendas" before in Spidey comic books...

The marriage to Mary Jane was a forced issue... Stan Lee was going to do it his comic strip, therefore, Jim Shooter & Co. decided to do it for the comics... they had a wedding ceremony at Shea Stadium.. but it really came outta nowhere... she had rejected his first wedding proposal, and they were barely dating when he pops the question again...

The death of Gwen Stacy came as a result of an inabilty to move her character forward, because after the death of her father, she became a two-dimensional "I hate Spider-Man" character that had lost all meaning, and rather than finding a way to progress HER character, it was decided to simply kill her off because Marvel was TOO LAZY to write her in an intelligent manner...

Whether these stories, along with OMD, feel forced is irrelevant.
Some stories just feel forced.

The bottom line is that the people who are all saying that they will continue to buy Spider-Man is because at the end of the day, we're all reading Spider-Man comics, and if this marriage has to fail because they were backed into this choice, the so be it and it's time to move onward. A lot of us "continuing to buy Spider" buyers may not like OMD and its aftermath, but we've all seen good times and bad times with our favorite ArachKnight, and we're hoping that the promise of what BND is promising comes true, and we just move on hopefully reading better quality stories than what we've been subjected to (in ASM only here) for the last 3 years (Avengers story excluded).

And even though Mephisto has been dragged into this sorry affair, if the story works within the confines of continuity and nothing will have been "erased" from Marvel's rich history, then I can personally deal with the outcome of this rather dull story.

And I hope that clears up where I stand on this issue... one that I feel will be shared by many long time readers on this board. (they all knowwho they are :cwink: )

And having said all that, I hope that all Spidey-Fans have some great holidays over the next little while.

Cheers,

Mike

:batty:
 
Thanks for your views there TMOB.

:yay:

I just think that some people (it feels that way when you read their words) are overly critical at times,...when all of us here are fans. I mean, some of us from the beginning. And this forum is for debate and people's views to begin, regardless of WHAT they are. I enjoy hearing differing views actually, especially when worded nicely.

And whether some of us stay or leave, after OMD, doesn't mean any of us are better or worse spidey fans compared to the others.

As i've said, i in no way want to boycott spidey, marvel comics, JQ, etc. I will still buy MANY MANY comics. MArvel, DC, others.

I will still buy lots of spidey stuff.

I do draw the line here and there....as to how cheesy things can get (or insulting) before i don't want to buy something that has crossed that line...which has only happened once before...(during the clone saga, when many long time fans were understandably unsulted). Still, if long time fans liked it and kept with it during that time...that is fine too. It doesn't matter to me, we each make our own choices, but just because i stopped then didn't make Spidey suddenly my least favorite character.

Fact is: he's my favorite now and has always been and will be. Reading spidey is what got me into the other comics i read.
 
Now, with this OMD foundation, JQ is basically outlawing progression...because the characters cannot move past the phase of singleness in spidey specifically. No drama there??

The marriage itself is a a cul-de-sac of character progression. There is nowhere to take it, and it has essentially stunted the melodramatic aspects of Peter's life.
 
The marriage itself is a a cul-de-sac of character progression. There is nowhere to take it, and it has essentially stunted the melodramatic aspects of Peter's life.
Well, Alot of us have gotten attached to the marriage. I can see ending it if it's a bad thing and nobody like it, but it's not bad and alot of us love it, which is one of the reasons I think they should stay married.
 
Yet everything they say they are going to do, CAN be done WITH the marriage.

And it seems one fo the bright spots during some of the more poorly written storylines was the marriage...imo.

I think the things that have hurt sales are things like the advent of the "arc",....the advent of "Relaunches" and new "#1's". The advent of "events" that must each produce a new big shock and awe moment. The advent of new creative team announcements with every "arc". Comics sometimes never get a chance to catch their groove, because of this. The rise in prices in comics and the rise in prices in everything in general have hurt, as well as many more other gimmicks that are out there that didn't exist when it was just 12 issues and an annual every year. Also, children in general are not reading (comics) as much compared to when we were kids.

The marriage is not one of the things most fans seem to have a problem with, nor what is dragging down spidey, imo. From what I've seen at the various sites, the majority of fans like the fact that Pete and MJ are married.
 
"Arcs" have been around since the Lee/Ditko days. You guys are complaining about things that have been there since the beginning. :whatever:
 
The marriage itself is a a cul-de-sac of character progression. There is nowhere to take it, and it has essentially stunted the melodramatic aspects of Peter's life.

Yet, having Peter Parker date a variety of women only to eventually break-up with them because "Spider-Man" keeps getting in the way of his personal life could arguably be considered a "cul-de-sac of character progression" as well. In other words, all you're really doing is arguing against character stagnation by proposing character progression that, in reality, is regressing back to another form of character stagnation.
 
"Arcs" have been around since the Lee/Ditko days. You guys are complaining about things that have been there since the beginning. :whatever:

By "Arcs" I'm guessing that the meaning for "Arc" in this case is the over extension of certain stories that could be told in 1-2 issues being stretched out into 5-6 issues in order for them to fit in a TPB. In some cases they are stretched into 12. Most of these "arcs" have the "Mini- Event Syndrome" In which Spidey's core is shaken into a mess, until the Big Event comes.

Not really, Spider-totems were not on the beginning, Mephisto's Forced Agenda with Extra Cheese anti-marriage fairy thing wasn't since the beginning, Joe Quesada wasn't there since the beginning...

Regarding the Forced Agenda with Low Fat Cheese that is the marriage... If the Creator says that Spidey should be married, who am I to argue with the Creator?
But in a weird way it kinda makes sense as character progression... Even Gwen's death... But having THE devil saving Old Ladies' lives in order to erase the exsistance of a marriage? I do not think so...

If they wanted to eliminate the marriage, they could've done it in a way that isn't insulting to the characters or the fans... I would've complained, but after letting it sink in it would've made sense... I had accepted MJ's death when the stalker kidnapped her... It sucked, but I was ready to move on when they brought her back... Using the Devil as a Deus ex Machina (notice the Irony here...) is not the most plausible way to have the character progress...
 
"Arcs" have been around since the Lee/Ditko days. You guys are complaining about things that have been there since the beginning. :whatever:

Lee/Ditko days didn't have arcs that ran more #'s than it needed. Most arcs now a days are usuaslly 6-12 parts, even though they usually can be told in 2-3 parts and don't need crossovers into other spider-books.
 
Yet, having Peter Parker date a variety of women only to eventually break-up with them because "Spider-Man" keeps getting in the way of his personal life could arguably be considered a "cul-de-sac of character progression" as well. In other words, all you're really doing is arguing against character stagnation by proposing character progression that, in reality, is regressing back to another form of character stagnation.

You're right, it's a catch-22. The only difference is that a single Spidey would have some degree of variety to it, while a married Spider-Man only offers one character in that regard. I'm not saying one is better than the other, just that single life offers more potential stories than marriage does.

Lee/Ditko days didn't have arcs that ran more #'s than it needed. Most arcs now a days are usuaslly 6-12 parts, even though they usually can be told in 2-3 parts and don't need crossovers into other spider-books.

That's more of the result of the TPB market than anything else. Decompressed storytelling has become the norm for all comics; it's really not something that can (or should) be chalked up to JMS or Quesada.
 
And even though Mephisto has been dragged into this sorry affair, if the story works within the confines of continuity and nothing will have been "erased" from Marvel's rich history, then I can personally deal with the outcome of this rather dull story.

Same here.

If it fits within continuity and does not erase past events then I can deal with it. If any of Spidey's history is wiped away, then I will quit the book.
 
Blader: You're right, it's a catch-22. The only difference is that a single Spidey would have some degree of variety to it, while a married Spider-Man only offers one character in that regard. I'm not saying one is better than the other, just that single life offers more potential stories than marriage does.

Hmn...i beg to differ....married life offers MORE potential stories than single.

You can do pretty much everything plus more, WITH married life....not to mention, we've already been there, done that, with "single life Pete" since the 70's.
 
That's more of the result of the TPB market than anything else. Decompressed storytelling has become the norm for all comics; it's really not something that can (or should) be chalked up to JMS or Quesada.

I wasn't blaming them alone.
 

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