The Mandalorian Chapter Sixteen Spoiler Discussion

[scarlet-witch]

I need to re-watch that episode of Rebels because I was sure Sabine also just handed Bo Katan the dark saber and it wasn't a big deal.

I liked the episode overall, and as cool as it was to see Luke with his green saber and how giddy that made me...I still wish it had been Ezra that showed up because the prospect of him and Thrawn at this point is more interesting to me. I really hope that Grogu doesn't stay with Luke long, and finds his way back into Mando's life next season.

Everyone kept tweeting about how they should just cast Sebastian Stan as younger Luke if they're going to keep him around, and I kind of agree. That CGI was too uncanny valley for me.

 

[matt47]

The greatest Star Wars tradition? R2 meeting the newest cutie in the GFFA.

When he saw R2 it made me think that Grogu knew R2 from the temple and that's why he left more comfortable going with Luke

 

[Schlosser85]

When he saw R2 it made me think that Grogu knew R2 from the temple and that's why he left more comfortable going with Luke

R2 seemed to recognize Grogu. He did that excited beeping and rocking.

 

[DarkKnight88]

Could be he just thought it was Yoda.

“All living organisms look alike!”

 

[Detective Conan]

I’ve been seen watching live fan reactions to the Luke scene which really captures how powerful this scene was for many.

 

[Snow Queen]

I need to re-watch that episode of Rebels because I was sure Sabine also just handed Bo Katan the dark sabre and it wasn't a big deal.

I was sitting there the whole scene thinking about how they're pulling this whole "you must beat me in combat for it" thing when Rebels prominently just handed it straight over... but I do think they tried to fanangle that one a bit. Gideon talks about how it's the story, not the Darksaber, that really matters, that gets people to follow the holder. So it's possible the idea is that, after that scene, the clans didn't really end up following her in the long run because she hadn't earned the Darksaber the traditional way.

 

[DarkKnight88]

I’ve been seen watching live fan reactions to the Luke scene which really captures how powerful this scene was for many.

Sorry to be cynical but people filming their own reactions to things... Ugh.

 

[Schlosser85]

Sorry to be cynical but people filming their own reactions to things... Ugh.

I've never seen the point of watching reaction videos. Why do I want to see someone else's (frankly melodramatic) reaction to a scene instead of the scene itself?

 

[Weather Witch]

but I do think they tried to fanangle that one a bit. Gideon talks about how it's the story, not the Darksaber, that really matters, that gets people to follow the holder. So it's possible the idea is that, after that scene, the clans didn't really end up following her in the long run because she hadn't earned the Darksaber the traditional way.

Yeah, that's how I read the scene as well.

 

[metaphysician]

I want a time jump show of Grogu as a Jedi.
I just want it to be canon that he wasn’t killed in Luke’s academy

Why hope for that, when you can hope for F&F to retcon the whole sequel trilogy out of existence?

 

[Detective Conan]

As much as the moment with the baby going to Luke is powerful...

I just realized that the Mando just gave his child to the same dude who will (briefly) contemplate killing his nephew in his sleep, leading to his students getting slaughtered and become a recluse and let millions die in a war he involuntarily helped create as he sits on his ass drinking space cow milk.

When one looks at it from that angle, you could argue Grogu is actually better off with Mando than he is with his “own kind.”

 

[DJ Kornphlake]

When Grogu and Luke got on the elevator to leave, I was really hoping Din was going to pull out control knob he salvaged from the Razor Crest and have Grogu Force pull it one last time before the door shut.

And I have no problem with Bib Fortuna surviving the barge explosion if Boba could survive the sarlaac pit.

 

[antsman41]

Obi-Wan is 38 at the end of TCW. We know this because he was 25 in TPM, 10 years pass between TPM and AotC (Anakin tells us this at the start of the film), the war is 3 years. Satine and Obi's thing happened while he was teen (15 I believe canon has confirmed). So unless Obi was macking on a literal child, Satine is a similar age to Obi-Wan.

Bo is not 10 years younger then her sister. More like 3-5 at most. That means that at the end of the war she is over 30 years old. Most likely, mid-30s. Which makes sense when we see her in Rebels. Where she should be 50, if not over it. This show takes place 9 years after the Battle of Yavin, which is 10 years after her appearance of Rebels. Bo is somewhere between her late 50s and her mid 60s.

Boba was 10 at the start of AotC. Free, unaltered clone for Jango at the start of the process. It has been 30 years since the start of the Clone Wars on the show. Boba is 40ish.

Plus, Mando’s have better genes than other human species in Star Wars... hell, look at how good J-Lo or Monica Belluci looks and they’re 50ish.

 

[The Caped Knight]

I love that they incorporate a combination of Anakin/Vader in Luke’s saber technique showing the deeper father and son connection. The difference is Luke isn’t filled with rage, instead he is righteous with purpose and accurate precision in his attacks.

 

[Spider-Fan]

As much as the moment with the baby going to Luke is powerful...

I just realized that the Mando just gave his child to the same dude who will (briefly) contemplate killing his nephew in his sleep, leading to his students getting slaughtered and become a recluse and let millions die in a war he involuntarily helped create as he sits on his ass drinking space cow milk as a recluse.

When one looks at it from that angle, you could argue Grogu is actually better off with Mando than he is with his his own kind.

Not a problem if you liked TLJ

 

[antsman41]

Jacen also joined Luke's Jedi Order...

Ugh I hate that that happened. We could have had Kylo run away and still have some new Jedi.

Whatever, I’m over it. [crying into my Grogu plush toy]

 

[Marvolo]

R2 seemed to recognize Grogu. He did that excited beeping and rocking.

I took it as R2 just being excited to have a new little buddy.

 

[metaphysician]

I'm glad that Disney and Lucasfilm doesn't let the imperfections of cgi actors stop them from doing something that makes sense for the story and canon. And something thats just a lot of fun.

Pretty much this whole episode was one huge series moment after another. Things that I expected to see in the show, but spread across the entire series after much more teasing. Favreau and Peyton and Filoni are like, "Nope, I think we'll just do all this cool **** right now!"

Gideon setting up that conflict between Bo and Din is so ****ing frustrating. And Bo... turns out she's more of a fanatic about tradition than Din. Din should put that sabre out an airlock, and tell Bo if she wants to pull her head out of her own ass and go get it she can, and then leave her. Its not Din's responsibility to stick around, and let her attack him just because she's having a personal crisis with tradition. It sure as **** isn't his duty to let her kill him.

Being very fair, its not like Bo-Katan immediately jumped to "Rar, kill". She believes she needs to take the Darksaber, but she's not at all thrilled by the trap Gideon laid for her. And its a real trap. You can say "its just tradition", but its not about *Bo-Katan's* tradition or beliefs. Its about the beliefs and traditions of the collective Mandalorians in exile. The Darksaber is valuable precisely because it is a symbol, if it loses that symbolic power, Bo-Katan is back at square one. If the story and legend is broken, then its useless for rallying support behind her.

My suspicion is that season 3 is going to revolve around this conflict. Bo-Katan wants to unify and rebuild Mandalore, and she wants to rule over it as well, both of which are easier for the "rightful" holder of the Darksaber. However, she doesn't especially want to fight Din for it, for a wide variety of reasons. The probably settles into an initial plan where Din effectively joins her effort, and if functionally the Mandalore figurehead for a while, while both of them try to come up with some way to transfer that symbolic authority over without losing it all. All the while Din has to worry that Bo might decide "**** it, I'm sorry but my cause takes priority", and tries to murder Din. . . and Bo has to worry that Din might decide "**** it, I've help you enough, I'm leaving", and the whole symbolic power of rule evaporates.

 

[Monsieur Xavier]

Awesome finale.
Lambda class shuttle !

A screen shot I took with the Slave I, the Lambda shuttle and a random craft


Me when it happened :

 

[Mani-Man]

Ugh I hate that that happened. We could have had Kylo run away and still have some new Jedi.

Whatever, I’m over it. [crying into my Grogu plush toy]

Its Star Wars, i dont believe for a second that all Jedi where at the temple when it happened.
So in my head there are tons of Jedi out there for years.
There were many that were able to hide from the Empire for dozens of years, im sure the rather incompetent First Order even with the help of palpatine or so, hunted them all down later.

As far as im concerned, Grogu is somewhere "nice" during the ST.
Preferably with Mando/Din.

 

[Schlosser85]

Being very fair, its not like Bo-Katan immediately jumped to "Rar, kill". She believes she needs to take the Darksaber, but she's not at all thrilled by the trap Gideon laid for her. And its a real trap. You can say "its just tradition", but its not about *Bo-Katan's* tradition or beliefs. Its about the beliefs and traditions of the collective Mandalorians in exile. The Darksaber is valuable precisely because it is a symbol, if it loses that symbolic power, Bo-Katan is back at square one. If the story and legend is broken, then its useless for rallying support behind her.

My suspicion is that season 3 is going to revolve around this conflict. Bo-Katan wants to unify and rebuild Mandalore, and she wants to rule over it as well, both of which are easier for the "rightful" holder of the Darksaber. However, she doesn't especially want to fight Din for it, for a wide variety of reasons. The probably settles into an initial plan where Din effectively joins her effort, and if functionally the Mandalore figurehead for a while, while both of them try to come up with some way to transfer that symbolic authority over without losing it all. All the while Din has to worry that Bo might decide "**** it, I'm sorry but my cause takes priority", and tries to murder Din. . . and Bo has to worry that Din might decide "**** it, I've help you enough, I'm leaving", and the whole symbolic power of rule evaporates.

I think it at least partially is about Bo's own traditional beliefs.

If Bo-Katan was purely pragmatic, then she could just say she took the Darksaber from Gideon herself, and nobody outside of the few people on the bridge of Gideon's ship need to know any differently.

Cara and Fennec don't care about Mandalorian internal politics, and Din already freely offered it to her, so who's going to contradict her except maybe Gideon, and who would believe his word against Bo's?

 

[Snow Queen]

Awesome finale.
Lambda class shuttle !

A screen shot I took with the Slave I, the Lambda shuttle and a random craft
View attachment 40725

That's no random craft, that's the Mandalorian Kom'rk I've been dying to see show up in live action

 

[Marvolo]

Being very fair, its not like Bo-Katan immediately jumped to "Rar, kill". She believes she needs to take the Darksaber, but she's not at all thrilled by the trap Gideon laid for her. And its a real trap. You can say "its just tradition", but its not about *Bo-Katan's* tradition or beliefs. Its about the beliefs and traditions of the collective Mandalorians in exile. The Darksaber is valuable precisely because it is a symbol, if it loses that symbolic power, Bo-Katan is back at square one. If the story and legend is broken, then its useless for rallying support behind her.

My suspicion is that season 3 is going to revolve around this conflict. Bo-Katan wants to unify and rebuild Mandalore, and she wants to rule over it as well, both of which are easier for the "rightful" holder of the Darksaber. However, she doesn't especially want to fight Din for it, for a wide variety of reasons. The probably settles into an initial plan where Din effectively joins her effort, and if functionally the Mandalore figurehead for a while, while both of them try to come up with some way to transfer that symbolic authority over without losing it all. All the while Din has to worry that Bo might decide "**** it, I'm sorry but my cause takes priority", and tries to murder Din. . . and Bo has to worry that Din might decide "**** it, I've help you enough, I'm leaving", and the whole symbolic power of rule evaporates.

The only people that know Din ever had the saber are on that bridge. Din doesn't care, Cara doesn't care, Bo's long time friend isn't likely to blackmail her, Fennec has her own plans, and Gideon can be killed. Shoot Gideon in the face so he can't tell anyone, and take the saber. Or Din can leave it behind and Bo can either get over it and take it or leave it behind.

 

[Schlosser85]

The only people that know Din ever had the sabre are on that bridge. Din doesn't care, Cara doesn't care, Bo's long time friend isn't likely to blackmail her, Fennec has her own plans, and Gideon can be killed. Shoot Gideon in the face so he can't tell anyone, and take the sabre. Or Din can leave it behind and Bo can either get over it and take it or leave it behind.

Cara wanted Gideon alive to be taken to New Republic Intelligence.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

As much as the moment with the baby going to Luke is powerful...

I just realized that the Mando just gave his child to the same dude who will (briefly) contemplate killing his nephew in his sleep, leading to his students getting slaughtered and become a recluse and let millions die in a war he involuntarily helped create as he sits on his ass drinking space cow milk as a recluse.

When one looks at it from that angle, you could argue Grogu is actually better off with Mando than he is with his his own kind.

Exactly. As exciting as it was to see Luke and the idea that he will train Grogu, knowing what the future holds, mostly ruined any of that excitement. I was left with a feeling of, in more capable hands, we could have gotten a much better story for Luke.