🌎 Discussion: Civil Rights, Affirmative Action, Critical Race Theory, Systemic Inequality, and Racism - Part 4

[Aximili86]

Yeah any backlash to the Neeson thing is moronic. A close friend (girlfriend? didn't seem clear) was raped, said it was a black guy, and he went through a period of some dumb rageful behavior, revenge-fantasies, came to his senses before ever acting on it, says he regrets the stuff going through his head.

Most guys, regardless of their own color or the description of the guilty guy, are probably going to go through a similar phase in the days after the fact. Black guys with latinos, latinos with asians, black guys with white guys, whatever the circumstances may be.

 

[hellified]

Yeah any backlash to the Neeson thing is moronic. A close friend (girlfriend? didn't seem clear) was raped, said it was a black guy, and he went through a period of some dumb rageful behavior, revenge-fantasies, came to his senses before ever acting on it, says he regrets the stuff going through his head.

Most guys, regardless of their own color or the description of the guilty guy, are probably going to go through a similar phase in the days after the fact. Black guys with latinos, latinos with asians, black guys with white guys, whatever the circumstances may be.

whats disconcerting to a black person is the fact the rape seems to be an excuse and the bigger motivating factor in his rage was the color of the person who committed the crime. And what would have made him feel good in that moment was to kill ANY black man he could provoke or would cross his path.

Heck the man lives out revenge/retribution fantasies for a living everyone can understand that and black men enjoy and support those kinds of films he makes.



that skit plays off that..but to find out he had (maybe still has) some kind of deepseated hatred for black people would give them pause you could understand....

 

[Teelie]

what was the mistake he made??

That he singled out black men instead of trying to find the one man who actually committed the rape. Though I suspect had they been another race he probably would have had a similar reaction.

Not acting on it should be considered instead of he briefly had a racist reaction and therefore should forever more be condemned as a racist even though he never actually did anything.

 

[Aximili86]

And what would have made him feel good in that moment was to kill ANY black man he could provoke or would cross his path.

Which he knew was irrational and stupid, and reigned himself in.

You're honestly going to say if she'd said it was an Asian guy, a Latin guy, a guy with a Russian accent, he wouldn't be out in the local haunts trying to profile the same way, when he's in that primal irrational vengeful state of mind? Stereotyping in his head, probably some slurs rattling around?

It's a crazy situation - someone close to you being hurt that way, people tend to go a little temporarily bat****. Doesn't make it right, doesn't make it justified, of course. But as he said right there, he knew it was wrong at the time. He caught it before he did anything stupid, the id lizard-brain lost out to the evolved adult. Like it would in 95% of guys.

Sounds like this was probably what, 80s, maybe late 70s. He was young & stupid, 20s, maybe early 30s. Neeson's that sort of alpha big-dog type of guy, comes from a boxing background, it was Northern Ireland at a time there was a pretty big culture of violence & revenge on the mind.

Not all that surprising some stupid thoughts ran through his head. That being said, a black woman's raped by a white man in Compton or Baltimore, there's a segment of the young black male community that's going to be indulging in some pretty remarkably similar fantasies. Just the way it goes, human nature. Thankfully the smart side of Liam won out over the reckless emotional one.

 

[Zarex]

I posted this on another thread, but it fits here. Oftentimes it seems like the Social Justice Purity Police have no goal other than to be self satisfied in their own moral superiority and the tantalizing smell of their own intestinal gas. Destroy ANYONE who may have had awful opinions at ANYTIME in their past such as Gunn, Hart, Neeson & Northam. Ignore all apologies, along with their current opinions and behavior. Rake them over the coals, force them out of their current jobs, regardless of their performance, and smugly claim victory after the person is appropriately punished. It truly is disgraceful.

 

[Schlosser85]

I posted this on another thread, but it fits here. Oftentimes it seems like the Social Justice Purity Police have no goal other than to be self satisfied in their own moral superiority and the tantalizing smell of their own intestinal gas. Destroy ANYONE who may have had awful opinions at ANYTIME in their past such as Gunn, Hart, Neeson & Northam. Ignore all apologies, along with their current opinions and behavior. Rake them over the coals, force them out of their current jobs, regardless of their performance, and smugly claim victory after the person is appropriately punished. It truly is disgraceful.

All of this.

 

[Erzengel]

It's always very easy to point out other people's faults and mistakes and harder to direct that criticism inward.

 

[Schlosser85]

That, and somehow they’re so superior as to be exempt from the standards they hold everyone else to. They can cyberbully and call names all day long and hound people off social media and tell them to kill themselves, and somehow they are never problematic.

 

[RockSP]

 

[Teelie]

I stay away from certain platforms (Twitter, Instagram, etc) because of the self-righteous types, left or right or whatever they claim to be. No one is perfect, except their own little group, until someone in that little group says or does something they disagree with, then they are also part of the problem.

Eventually it will be everyone else is the problem, you are the only one who is good and decent... until someone else finds your mistake in life and uses it against you.

 

[hellified]

That he singled out black men instead of trying to find the one man who actually committed the rape. Though I suspect had they been another race he probably would have had a similar reaction.

Not acting on it should be considered instead of he briefly had a racist reaction and therefore should forever more be condemned as a racist even though he never actually did anything.

actually he did act on it the only thing that happened was no one took the bait. The man admitted he walked around for a week looking for something to go down so he could kill a black b******...

thats not NOT ACTING on it thats just dumb luck that no black guy looked at him crossways during that time.

 

[AResistor]

I posted this on another thread, but it fits here. Oftentimes it seems like the Social Justice Purity Police have no goal other than to be self satisfied in their own moral superiority and the tantalizing smell of their own intestinal gas. Destroy ANYONE who may have had awful opinions at ANYTIME in their past such as Gunn, Hart, Neeson & Northam. Ignore all apologies, along with their current opinions and behavior. Rake them over the coals, force them out of their current jobs, regardless of their performance, and smugly claim victory after the person is appropriately punished. It truly is disgraceful.

I was with you - up until you said Hart and Northam whose current "behavior" are quite odd.

"Saying I wanted to attack my son because he might be 'gay' is funny! But, people became too flustered by it so I stopped making those jokes years ago, there that's my apology - I said I'm sorry now can everyone stop attacking me! I'm the real victim here! ME!!!!"

"Nah, that wasn't me in blackface. You know though, I love Michael Jackson so let me tell you about the one time that I did do blackface haha (smiles for the cameras)."

/\ Gotta be two of the weirdest responses I've ever heard (along with Rosanne's blaming sleeping pills).

That being said, a black woman's raped by a white man in Compton or Baltimore, there's a segment of the young black male community that's going to be indulging in some pretty remarkably similar fantasies

If it similarly makes them think "all white people are the same, all white people must be at blame for this, I must kill whitey" - then, yeah I'd call that racist too.

With that said, I honestly think Neeson has changed and that he's still haunted by it. He just wasn't thinking in his right mind when he said it so he forgot to specifically say what he regrets which leaves it open to interpretation for those who want to doubt him.

 

[Zarex]

I was with you - up until you said Hart and Northam whose current "behavior" are quite odd.

"Nah, that wasn't me in blackface. You know though, I love Michael Jackson so let me tell you about the one time that I do blackface haha."

It's certainly odd - and definitely racist - for Northam to have done blackface back over four frikkin' decades ago. But what annoys me about the futile goal for absolute purity of thought is that the current behavior of a person, regardless of whether it be Hart or Northam, is dismissed in determining whether or not they are worthy of punishment. If either of them had displayed hostility to blacks or gays outside of an offensive costume or a few stupid tweets than they may be deserving of our collective scorn. But I don't see that as being the case in these two and many other cases.

 

[AResistor]

It's certainly odd - and definitely racist - for Northam to have done blackface back over four frikkin' decades ago. But what annoys me about the futile goal for absolute purity of thought is that the current behavior of a person, regardless of whether it be Hart or Northam, is dismissed in determining whether or not they are worthy of punishment. If either of them had displayed hostility to blacks or gays outside of an offensive costume or a few stupid tweets than they may be deserving of our collective scorn. But I don't see that as being the case in these two and many other cases.

Yeah, well plenty of black people as well as lgbtq people (especially black lgbtq people) do.

What matters is how it effects the group who were targeted, those are the voices that matter the most. Of course a straight person can easily give Hart a pass, but just take a look at "gay twitter" to see that so many in the lgbtq community (especially black lgbtq people) don't. If a gay comedian joked about attacking straight people and pulled the same stunt Hart did - then, straight voices would matter the most and as a non-straight person I wouldn't have the audacity to speak for them.

I'm with you on the message, just not those names.

As a bisexual dude it's still heartening to see how many likes this tweet got:

 

[SuperT]

The reaction to Neeson's interview from white people is W I L D. The call for us to forgive it as a simple mistake yet if a black man had said that same thing about white people, he'd be raked over the coals and never work a day in his life again.

He literally said he wanted to beat up random black men. WTF?!?!

 

[AResistor]

Some may take issue with what's being said here, but I'd also say it's the truth.

I would alter "white" to "all people" though -


To be honest, whenever I see a white person with a flag or a pickup truck or who doesn't look affluent now being in a red state - my mind jumps to them being a Trump supporter just by looking at them (and more than half of the time I'm wrong). I can also say I am statistically unlikely to be the only non-white person to think this way.

 

[AResistor]

The reaction to Neeson's interview from white people is W I L D. The call for us to forgive it as a simple mistake yet if a black man had said that same thing about white people, he'd be raked over the goals and never work a day in his life again.

He literally said he wanted to beat up random black men. WTF?!?!

I'd also say if the races were reversed - all of those white people complaining about black people taking it to heart would instead be reacting like black people are. People typically "act" like they're above it until it happens to someone like them. This is why the opinion of the targeted group matters the most.

I'd say as a non-black person this article highlighted aspects I wouldn't have otherwise thought about:

 

[Schlosser85]

All white people are racist? White people in interracial marriages and such are racist too?

 

[AResistor]

All white people are racist? White people in interracial marriages and such are racist too?

ALL people have had racist thoughts in their life and internal racism against others is important to counter as well. Conley was clearly talking from his own perspective as a white male. That is why I stated ALL to include my additional thoughts as a hispanic (which it spoke to me as a hispanic about being a hispanic).

Unless you honestly want to imply you're a special case where you never had or held a racist thought at all?

If so, congratulations, but I (and I'm guessing most here) would have trouble believing you or anyone else who would hold claim to it because most people do hold racist thoughts and beliefs.

All white people are racist because ALL people are racist (Indian, Asian, Black, Pacific Islander, White, etc.).

We all are.

See, I'm comfortable including myself (and I did in my first post as well) because introspection is important.

Here's some articles that delve into how we all hold racist beliefs at one point or another:

BBC Article:
Is everyone racist?

NYT:
Opinion | Is Everyone a Little Bit Racist?

Guardian:
Everyone’s a little bit racist, sometimes | Dean Burnett

This isn't about shaming, otherwise I wouldn't have noted the bias I have in seeing certain white people as Trump supporters in that same post, rather it's about introspection. BTW, I blend in as white.

 

[Holiday]

I admit I got a laugh out of this even though he is being dishonest about what people are skeptical about with that story.

 

[SuperT]

All white people are racist? White people in interracial marriages and such are racist too?

LOL @ thinking white people in interracial relationships can't be racist. Sometimes they are the most undercover racist and ignorant.

 

[Pink Ranger]

If Liam Neeson's friend was raped in China by a Chinese man and Liam went around talking about how he went around trolling for Asians to pick a fight with, a guarantee you about half the people upset with him now would be instead talking about how "alpha" he is.

 

[AResistor]

If Liam Neeson's friend was raped in China by a Chinese man and Liam went around talking about how he went around trolling for Asians to pick a fight with, a guarantee you about half the people upset with him now would be instead talking about how "alpha" he is.

Hopefully not. Hopefully people would still see it as racism towards Chinese people - just like it would be an incident of racism if Liam Neeson was black and the rapist white.

Different people would take issue though. Many of the same people not saying it was racism would still say it wasn't. Many of the same non-black people saying it was racism would still say it was. Black people would be divided in how they want to label it. Chinese people would be speaking up most about how it is racism.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Media Matters - Fox guest: "What you have in Ocasio-Cortez are Latin American values. Instead of us assimilating them, they are assimilating us."
Peter Morici: Ocasio-Cortez is "a demagogue" who wants "to bring the kind of socialism that destroyed Venezuela, and frankly Mexico, here."

 

[hellified]

ALL people have had racist thoughts in their life and internal racism against others is important to counter as well. Conley was clearly talking from his own perspective as a white male. That is why I stated ALL to include my additional thoughts as a hispanic (which it spoke to me as a hispanic about being a hispanic).

Unless you honestly want to imply you're a special case where you never had or held a racist thought at all?

If so, congratulations, but I (and I'm guessing most here) would have trouble believing you or anyone else who would hold claim to it because most people do hold racist thoughts and beliefs.

All white people are racist because ALL people are racist (Indian, Asian, Black, Pacific Islander, White, etc.).

We all are.

See, I'm comfortable including myself (and I did in my first post as well) because introspection is important.

Here's some articles that delve into how we all hold racist beliefs at one point or another:

BBC Article:
Is everyone racist?

NYT:
Opinion | Is Everyone a Little Bit Racist?

Guardian:
Everyone’s a little bit racist, sometimes | Dean Burnett

This isn't about shaming, otherwise I wouldn't have noted the bias I have in seeing certain white people as Trump supporters in that same post, rather it's about introspection. BTW, I blend in as white.

racism is a verb its an action. When its systemized its the way things are. By and large in a society thats based on an arbitrary racial concept like skin color designations (white and black) generally speaking white people regardless of their class benefit from a system that favors white over non white even if the benefit is not being denied opportunity. But the most basic benefit whites enjoy regardless of class is just not being perceived a threat in the same way nonwhites are in society.

Liam Neeson was exercising not just bigotry in his reaction and blind rage. But living in a country where being white is a distinct advantage over non white in terms of how the justice system works there its a pretty fair bet that had be actually killed a random black man he would have most likely gotten off much lighter than if the situation was reversed. The system would have worked to some degree in his favor. You want a historical example of that...read the case of emmett till.