The Dark Knight Establish the Coin in TDK?

[Elisha Cuthbert]

I want to see the coin in the trailer, with Aaron Eckhart playing with it. Maybe just a brief glimpse, but something so people are like "oh **** two-face".

 

[Dirt Like Me]

Personally, I don't think Dent should have any documented history of mental illness, and his descent into darkness should borrow from two sources: THE LONG HALLOWEEN and the exceptional "Eye of the Beholder."

First off: I agree with everybody who favors subtlety in introducing the coin in TDK.

Second: I haven't read "Eye of The Beholder" (that's the Annual, with Two Face on the cover, right?), so if what I'm about to mention is addressed there, then I apologize.

Anyway, the more I think about Harvey the more reluctant I think he should be to work with Batman. As a Prosecutor he's part of a larger justice system and took vows to uphold the Constitution. In working with Batman he's--to a degree--admitting that the system he has invested his life into doesn't work (i.e. If police and prosecution could get the job done, there'd be no need for Batman). He's also violating a lot of Constitutionally-protected liberties in the process. That'd be a pretty harsh realization for anybody to handle.

It seems to me like you could say that the first step in his descent into Two Face would be when he agreed to work with a vigilante. The next step, his scarring, obviously is a much larger part of that descent, but I hope they show some real reservation in Dent initially, and it wouldn't take too much screen time. And the coin could play into this pretty nicely: Maybe when he's anxious about meeting Batman on the rooftop he could be flipping the coin as a kind of nervous tic.

 

[Schlosser85]

If they're going to use it when he becomes Two-Face, then I think they should have Harvey Dent do it as a mannerism, it would make more sense than he just suddenly starts it out of nowhere when he gets scarred.

 

[itsthebatman]

If TDK mentions the phrase "Big Bad Harv", I will double over in laughter and need medical assistance.

I fear for Stormin Norman's heart if this phrase is used. And frankly, I fear the wrath he will unleash on everyone else in the theatre.
You wouldn't like him when he's angry.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Not sure the best way to do it but they definitely need to introduce it as a precursor

 

[Ecstasy]

They, at the least, have to introduce the coin, either subtly or any other way. Let's just hope it's not too big and grand. The coin is just a signature aspect of Two-Face.

 

[Agentsands77]

Second: I haven't read "Eye of The Beholder" (that's the Annual, with Two Face on the cover, right?), so if what I'm about to mention is addressed there, then I apologize.

You should check it out. It's great. THE LONG HALLOWEEN borrows a lot from it, and it goes much more in-depth into Harvey's psychology and history. Great stuff.

Anyway, the more I think about Harvey the more reluctant I think he should be to work with Batman. As a Prosecutor he's part of a larger justice system and took vows to uphold the Constitution. In working with Batman he's--to a degree--admitting that the system he has invested his life into doesn't work (i.e. If police and prosecution could get the job done, there'd be no need for Batman). He's also violating a lot of Constitutionally-protected liberties in the process. That'd be a pretty harsh realization for anybody to handle.

That's a valid interpretation, but THE DARK KNIGHT seemingly isn't going with that. In the sides, Harvey Dent defends Batman and admires him, quickly commenting that in a city as corrupt as Gotham, the law is already a secondary consideration. In fact, he's so praiseworthy that the girl he's talking to actually asks whether he himself is Batman.

 

[Agentsands77]

Edited

 

[Dark Sentinel]

i dont think TDK will delve as much into Harvey's pshychological background as we'd like, but maybe save the scarring of the coin for Film 3?

actually i had the idea that Harvey uses the coin in the same way as some people use a stress-ball: when he gets nervous or impatient or whatever, he flips it or something. just a thought

 

[ironmaidenrules]

First off: I agree with everybody who favors subtlety in introducing the coin in TDK.

Second: I haven't read "Eye of The Beholder" (that's the Annual, with Two Face on the cover, right?), so if what I'm about to mention is addressed there, then I apologize.

Anyway, the more I think about Harvey the more reluctant I think he should be to work with Batman. As a Prosecutor he's part of a larger justice system and took vows to uphold the Constitution. In working with Batman he's--to a degree--admitting that the system he has invested his life into doesn't work (i.e. If police and prosecution could get the job done, there'd be no need for Batman). He's also violating a lot of Constitutionally-protected liberties in the process. That'd be a pretty harsh realization for anybody to handle.

It seems to me like you could say that the first step in his descent into Two Face would be when he agreed to work with a vigilante. The next step, his scarring, obviously is a much larger part of that descent, but I hope they show some real reservation in Dent initially, and it wouldn't take too much screen time. And the coin could play into this pretty nicely: Maybe when he's anxious about meeting Batman on the rooftop he could be flipping the coin as a kind of nervous tic.

i disagree

harvey and batman always got along
thats one of the sad things

jim and harvey-batman's greatest friends, think so very little of bruce

while harvey may be super law, he does see the need for batman
gotham is super corrupt and he loves gotham and wants to save it

for the 3 of them(jim,harv,bat) they are working towards a world that doesn't need batman

 

[Dirt Like Me]

while harvey may be super law, he does see the need for batman
gotham is super corrupt and he loves gotham and wants to save it

I agree with all that. What I'm saying is that in making the realization that Gotham needs Batman, Harvey would have to concede that his career is grounded in futility. And I think that showing Harvey wrestle with this idea (an impartial justice system versus the lure of vigilantism) could be an interesting way to establish some inner conflict within the character as a precursor to seeing Two Face in the third movie, without being unfaithful to the comics.

(I've never actually read a comic where the first meeting between Harvey and Bats in shown. In Year One we see Bats hiding in Dent's office, which gives the impression that they're already acquainted).

Agentsands: I'd forgotten about that side you mentioned. Thanks for the reminder.

 

[Steelsheen]

It would be interesting to get a bit of a look of where it comes from in the movie version. maybe as rachel meets dent for the first time in his office, she sees it displayed on a mantle and asks about it. he says it is a reminder that unlike the coin, every story has two sides, and justice is a balance...that instead of shades of grey, it helps him to see the black and white.

alright, since there's interest in this topic, here's my idea:

the coin is a gift, from Bruce to Harvey, after Harvey is appointed DA. in the dialogue, we find out that Harvey and Bruce became friends at Princeton, and that Harvey is an avid (albeit amateur) coin collector.

i like these.

 

[Brian Braddock]

Have Harvey at the crime scene of one of Joker's latest bank robberies for some reason. There could be coins scattered all over the floor and Harvey picks one up and just takes a moment, just staring at it with a strange sense of foreboding/fascination. He gets called over by Gordon or whoever and he immediatley forgets about the coin and goes back to his business.

Just a small throwaway moment that could be cool if done right and would mean a lot to us fan-boys.

????

 

[Agentsands77]

The problem with that, Super, is the question - why would a two-headed silver dollar be sitting in a bank stash... I guess you could do it, somehow - maybe a guard is picking the coins up and says, "Hey, this one's got two heads..." and Dent takes it, or something to that effect.

But personally, I think the coin has the most significance when his father gives it to him, with the background of using the coin for child abuse when Harvey was younger.

 

[Brian Braddock]

Gotcha.

I always preferred the idea that the coin was Maroni's, over the abusive father tbh, but that's just me.

But I digress, I wasnt particularly talking about the actual 2 sided coin that Two-Face would later utilise - it was just an idea that I had that maybe the fans would latch on to and maybe get a kick out of seeing:-

Just Harvey messing around with a coin.

As to how he gets the actual two-sided coin?

I'm open to ideas.............coz I really havent got a clue

 

[Agentsands77]

As to how he gets the actual two-sided coin?

I'm open to ideas.............coz I really havent got a clue

A gift from Harvey's dad. The child abuse is what makes his fragile sanity so plausible. Otherwise, it just seems to come out of nowhere, and while there's an idealistic tension, I don't think it's enough to bring a man to insanity.

I have issues with the coin being Maroni's. If it is, it has no deep personal significance to Harvey, there's no reason he'd have it before the scarring (if it was a gift, he could have it with him at the scarring, and it could even have been damaged by the acid), and no-one would give it to him while he's in the hospital (and one of the scenes I most relish is Dent with the coin in the hospital, ala THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER).

 

[IndianaJones]

actually i had the idea that Harvey uses the coin in the same way as some people use a stress-ball: when he gets nervous or impatient or whatever, he flips it or something. just a thought

That's fantastic. I had a similar idea. It'd be a great aesthetic if he rolled it along his fingers as well.

 

[Dark Sentinel]

That's fantastic. I had a similar idea. It'd be a great aesthetic if he rolled it along his fingers as well.

interestingly enough thats something i can do

but in order for that, the coin couldnt be much larger than the new Gold Dollar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidential_$1_Coin_Program)

 

[IndianaJones]

Are they using such a coin?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I always thought Dent had a half-dollar coin.

 

[Agentsands77]

Dent had a two-headed silver dollar, if I'm correct.

 

[Dark Sentinel]

Dent's coin was a gift from his abusive father. I don't recall it ever having a specific denomination. Anyway it's a rare two-headed coin with the inscription E Gothamus Unum (which is really a mistranslation of Latin, I mean come on--"In Gotham, one?")

but in my above post, i was referring to the physical size of the coin itself, not its appearance. I just wouldnt want it to be like the huge coin that was made for Batman Forever (which i happen to havet. i would prefer something a little larger than the new gold dollar coin, silver, and maybe the Statue of Liberty as the image. but no E Gothamus Unum, please!

 

[Agentsands77]

Dent's coin was a gift from his abusive father. I don't recall it ever having a specific denomination. Anyway it's a rare two-headed coin with the inscription E Gothamus Unum (which is really a mistranslation of Latin, I mean come on--"In Gotham, one?")

Wasn't that inscription just in the film? I don't ever remember that appearing in the comics. As far as in the comics, it was given as specific denomination, though. In the original appearance of Two-Face, way back in the day, it was a silver dollar. In the revised origin in Batman Annual #14 ("The Eye of the Beholder"), it's also mentioned as a silver dollar.

Nolan can do whatever he wants with the denomination as far as I care, though. As long as it's a trick coin with two heads, I'm fine.

 

[Dark Sentinel]

Wasn't that inscription just in the film? I don't ever remember that appearing in the comics. As far as in the comics, it was given as specific denomination, though. In the original appearance of Two-Face, way back in the day, it was a silver dollar. In the revised origin in Batman Annual #14 ("The Eye of the Beholder"), it's also mentioned as a silver dollar.

Nolan can do whatever he wants with the denomination as far as I care, though. As long as it's a trick coin with two heads, I'm fine.

true. i haven't been obsessed with comics since my parents threw my big box of Batman comics out when i was 10.

ok now back to what i was originally going to say: I would think that since coins don't usually have their value written on the obverse ("heads") it wouldnt be necessary to specifically say "dollar coin" or "half-dollar" or whatever. just as long as it's silver.

 

[IndianaJones]

but in my above post, i was referring to the physical size of the coin itself, not its appearance.

I get that.

And I refered to a half-dollar coin(which I think I'm thinking of a silver dollar, in retrospect) being a big ass coin. It's a big coin.

 

[smatt584]

Seeing as how Two-Face is almost certain to make an appearance, (although perhaps a short one), I was interested as to how his coin should be "treated" in TDK. In many of the comics his coin is his moral gauge, his deciding factor in whether to perform "good" or "bad" actions. In The Long Halloween, Harvey says that a mobster was released as if it were decided by the flip of a coin. In "Arkham Asylum", it is how is makes all of his decisions, (including whether to go to the bathroom, which is a little extreme for me). How much of this should be developed in TDK?

Will they explain where it came from?, Will it be mentioned early on in the story?, If so, will it be used throughout or just make a brief "cameo"?, Will it be scratched from the start or will he scratch it on one side only after he is scarred?

What do you think?