EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

[DrCosmic]

He definitely is a lot like Batman. There are some very... notable differences though.

 

[roach]

actually he was closer to pulp heroes like The Shadow than Batman...it wasnt until recent years that they tried to make him a Batman cypher

 

[Paradox1]

here is a little comparison

near genius intellect- check
unlimited resources -check
frightening suit meant to instill terror- check
strategist- check
martial artist- check

They are gonna have some aspects which are different because if they weren't DC would of sued Marvel's ass a long time ago like they did with another popular hero who outshined Superman. Even though they are similar I don't think any of that takes away from BP at all. Batman is an obvious rip on Zorro and Sherlock Holmes among others. I would also like to add though Superman is always depicted as a white skinned character he is in fact the first minority superhero.

 

[chamber-music]

Black Panther is really a flip side to Doctor Doom in many ways I always thought. A genius monarch of a fictional isolationist country.

 

[roach]

here is a little comparison

near genius intellect- check not really unless this is a new thing
unlimited resources -check
frightening suit meant to instill terror- check not meant to instill fear
strategist- check
martial artist- check

They are gonna have some aspects which are different because if they weren't DC would of sued Marvel's ass a long time ago like they did with another popular hero who outshined Superman. Even though they are similar I don't think any of that takes away from BP at all. Batman is an obvious rip on Zorro and Sherlock Holmes among others. I would also like to add though Superman is always depicted as a white skinned character he is in fact the first minority superhero.

Im not sure about what they have done with the character now but the one I am familiar with was a mercenary who died and was brought back to life by the god of the moon. He was to act as the moon's vengeance. He had multiple identities including a rich playboy...but Marc Spector wasn't Bruce Wayne. He wasnt super smart and kept in touch with experts as part of his Shadow Cabinet...they would advise him on things...

 

[E-Man]

Black Panther is really a flip side to Doctor Doom in many ways I always thought. A genius monarch of a fictional isolationist country.

I've been saying this for years. He's a monarch with a ton of resources that make them formidable opponents for anyone. Doom though is too powerful. He's kinda like the Batman of villains in the sense that he can do everything without weakness with the way some people write him.

 

[tvor03]

Im not sure about what they have done with the character now but the one I am familiar with was a mercenary who died and was brought back to life by the god of the moon. He was to act as the moon's vengeance. He had multiple identities including a rich playboy...but Marc Spector wasn't Bruce Wayne. He wasnt super smart and kept in touch with experts as part of his Shadow Cabinet...they would advise him on things...

Paradox was talking about Black Panther. Not Moon Knight.

 

[roach]

Paradox was talking about Black Panther. Not Moon Knight.

my bad

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

I've been saying this for years. He's a monarch with a ton of resources that make them formidable opponents for anyone. Doom though is too powerful. He's kinda like the Batman of villains in the sense that he can do everything without weakness with the way some people write him.

But just like Batman, being so formidable and incredibly prepared is what makes them both such so incredibly badass.

I love BTAS when Batman clears a room of thugs without breaking a sweat or looks like he's doomed and escapes thanks to his various mastered skills.

 

[Red Mask]

Hey don't get me wrong Pacific Rim looks awesome and is my number two most anticipated movie of the summer. Them making it may open up the possibility for more anime inspired movies like Akira, Battle Angel (Cameron make the damn movie already), Cowboy Bebop or Ninja scroll. By the way Man of Steel looks to be by far the best movie of the summer.

I need something different. Man of Steel is still an origin story of Superman. He starts from Krypton, grows up on Earth, and must learn to find his purpose as he fights a big threat. The visuals don't impress me, especially with that costume design.

Black Panther is different and should be made. Have you noticed that Hollywood doesn't make big adventure films that happen overseas anymore? Only the horror films where American tourists can get killed or have a comedy, or just the political war films. Evangelion 3.0 and Pacific Rim are different and they look exciting. Wolverine takes place in Japan, but I'm wary of its success. I'd watch more documentaries if they bothered to show them at the local theaters here.

 

[RockSP]

He definitely is a lot like Batman. There are some very... notable differences though.

Definitely. There would have to be or dc would sue, lol. I wasn't trying to say MK is just like Bats, but there is no denying there are obvious similarities between the two.

 

[Hyde]

Question: did T'Challa take up the Black Panther mantle AFTER T'Chaka died? Can he do it before or can't he considering it's a family thing?

 

[E-Man]

Question: did T'Challa take up the Black Panther mantle AFTER T'Chaka died? Can he do it before or can't he considering it's a family thing?

T'Challa didn't take up the mantle until well after T'Chaka died. Once T'Chaka died he could have been king, but since he was too young his uncle took up the mantle while T'Challa was educated in the West and in Wakanda. After he got old enough T'Challa challenged for the title of Black Panther, and he fought and beat his uncle. Theoretically anyone in Wakanda can be Panther if they're good enough to beat Black Panther in a fight. Usually no one is good enough because of the training and skill it takes to be BP, and there's the enhanced powers with the heart shaped herb. T'Challa put on a mask though so that they didn't just give him the title, and when he won he unmasked to show them how far he came.

 

[alexnyc]

Yo guys hands down the best black actor that i think that could play and bring out all characteristics of BP would be michael jai white. I'm surprise that no one here even mention him, i mean i like him in spawn it was a pretty good move for me don't know about anybody else. But um right now i feel that if marvel is gonna do this movie MJW is the man!. The guy is big and strong.....no homo ok? lol He's a martial art expert and he can beat the **** out of anyone. And that's what BP needs to show in order to be a good solo movie. Forget chestnut, though he's a good actor he got nothing on MJW. Snipes would be my 2nd choice but right now homie got some serious financial problems. I know hollywood don't wanna hear that **** and use someone like him right now for this movie......just saying.

 

[Hyde]

T'Challa didn't take up the mantle until well after T'Chaka died. Once T'Chaka died he could have been king, but since he was too young his uncle took up the mantle while T'Challa was educated in the West and in Wakanda. After he got old enough T'Challa challenged for the title of Black Panther, and he fought and beat his uncle. Theoretically anyone in Wakanda can be Panther if they're good enough to beat Black Panther in a fight. Usually no one is good enough because of the training and skill it takes to be BP, and there's the enhanced powers with the heart shaped herb. T'Challa put on a mask though so that they didn't just give him the title, and when he won he unmasked to show them how far he came.

Ah, right, thanks. So if T'Challa appears in The Avengers 2 with T'Chaka still alive and ruling it would just be T'Challa and not BP?

 

[E-Man]

Ah, right, thanks. So if T'Challa appears in The Avengers 2 with T'Chaka still alive and ruling it would just be T'Challa and not BP?

It's definitely possible for that to happen. It would take away from some great character development though. T'Chaka's death was seen as something that catapulted him into being seen as the greatest modern Black Panther chieftain. He was a great king when he was alive, and he went down defending his kingdom from armageddon in Klaw. T'Challa gets brownie points for saving the day, but a lot of people look at T'Chaka as a martyr. With T'Challa being the follow up there isn't too much he can do to overcome that, and coupled with him leaving the country a lot to be on the Avengers it makes some Wakandans a little upset at him although he was doing it to protect the kingdom.

But I digress, to your original point T'Challa can show up and not be the Black Panther. In fact there was a time when he was king, but not the Black Panther. Don't want to spoil who the Black Panther was since it's an awesome story, but basically the king of Wakanda is in T'Challa's bloodline while the Black Panther is the title of the clan that rules Wakanda. So in effect you can have a king that isn't Black Panther. Right now they have this crap with Shuri, T'Challa's sister that didn't exist until Hudlin created her 8 years ago, being the Black Panther of Wakanda while T'Challa is the Black Panther of the dead. They're ignoring it a bit though, so I don't know how long that will last.

 

[DrCosmic]

Ah, right, thanks. So if T'Challa appears in The Avengers 2 with T'Chaka still alive and ruling it would just be T'Challa and not BP?

Pretty much, yeah. Another interesting take would be if T'Chaka appears in Avengers 2, especially if he dies in Avengers 2, and T'Challa is still in the states somewhere.

 

[Steve Holt]

MJW is more of a Blade actor. Hard to take him serioously as an actor (do like him though), if they made a retro Luke Cage movie then sure, but i don't see him as a monarch.

A young Hemsworth type is what they should look for, and fill the movie with the actor that should had been BP but are too old.
Chiwetel Ejofor - T'Chaka (in flash backs 40's/50's/60's)
Djimon Honsou - S'yan (modern/90's/80's)

someone like Chadwick Boseman (42, the movie not his age) or Tongayi Chirisa (Crusoe)

 

[OnTheAir]

MJW is more of a Blade actor. Hard to take him serioously as an actor (do like him though), if they made a retro Luke Cage movie then sure, but i don't see him as a monarch.

A young Hemsworth type is what they should look for, and fill the movie with the actor that should had been BP but are too old.
Chiwetel Ejofor - T'Chaka (in flash backs 40's/50's/60's)
Djimon Honsou - S'yan (modern/90's/80's)

someone like Chadwick Boseman (42, the movie not his age) or Tongayi Chirisa (Crusoe)

We agree with Michael Jai White. Yes, he's ripped, yes, he's a martial artist...but I don't think he's that good of an actor. Certainly not good enough to carry such an important role. Like you, I like the guy. But this isn't Spawn. This is Black Panther: the first (and in my opinion, the most important) Black superhero. Marvel needs to get this right. We've spent page after page in this thread going over why this movie should or should not be made...who will or will not go see it...why it will or will not be a success. All of this debate and conversation tells me that whatever the outcome, IF they are going to do it, then they need to do it right. Every detail, from script to choice of director to locations to casting to marketing needs to be perfect. Yes, that can be said about any film, but we've already gone over (and over and over) why this film would be unique, and somewhat challenging, as opposed to the other MCU releases.

That said, the choice of the lead actor is crucial. And MJW just doesn't come across as the regal T'Challa to me. Not to mention that he is 45. I don't know why that bugs me here, when Mark Ruffalo being 45, RDJ and Don Cheadle being 48 and Jeremy Renner being 42 doesn't (even though I don't like Renner in the role of Hawkeye, his age isn't the reason). I just think a 45 year old MJW is too old for T'Challa (coupled with my other reservations about him).

Where we disagree is on Chiwetel Ejiofor. At 35 (36 in another month or so), I don't think he's too old to play T'Challa.

Since his age appears to be your only reservation, I'm sure we DO agree on everything else: he has the talent (Shakespearean actor), martial arts background and the pedigree (son of Nigerian parents) to make the perfect Black Panther.

But, if they want to go younger, Chadwick Boseman works for me as plan B.

 

[DrCosmic]

Ejiofor is hard to argue with. Now, if he ends up being the 12th Doctor he might be busy for a while, y'know.

But in addition to having all the fight and fitness cred MJW has, he's got incredible acting skill.

[YT]http://youtu.be/bSH-TAX_9Ts[/YT]

 

[OnTheAir]

Ejiofor is hard to argue with. Now, if he ends up being the 12th Doctor he might be busy for a while, y'know.

But in addition to having all the fight and fitness cred MJW has, he's got incredible acting skill.

[YT]http://youtu.be/bSH-TAX_9Ts[/YT]

Thanks for sharing! This absolutely emphasizes my point that Ejiofor has the acting range to pull off T'Challa both as a regal king and a fierce warrior/superhero.

I can easily imagine an intense scene where he holds his own with actors the caliber of RDJ, Ruffalo, Sam Jack, Hiddleston, Cheadle, etc.

MJW? Morris Chestnut? Not so much.

 

[Hyde]

Thanks for the info guys. I'm developing an Avengers 2 story in which a lot of the first act takes place in Wakanda (with T'Chaka still alive - there's a flashback scene where Cap visits the country in WW2 and T'Chaka is just a baby) and wasn't really sure whether I could include BP or not

 

[Steve Holt]

don't get me wrong, i would love for Chiwetel to be T'challa, i've been wanting him to be BP since serenty (was Djimon before that) but i don't think Marvel will get him for T'challa, i think they'll go younger so they wouldn't have to recast for a long while (in theory), but more so that they'd have the leverage to pay a lower rate over the course of the appearances. What young black actor wouldn't want the lead in hopefully 3 tentpole blockbusters and one of the leads in however many Avengers movies past that.
hope that didn't sound offensive, but i think you guys know what i mean.

But if they did cast Chiwetel as T'challa, I'd do the Charlton dance

 

[chamber-music]

Director joe wright (Hanna, Atonement, Anna Karenina) is directing ejiofor chiwetel at the young vic theatre this summer in 'a season in the congo'.

Chiwetel Ejiofor is returning to his stage roots next summer, when he'll play the Congolese nationalist hero Patrice Lumumba, in poet and political activist. The gripping drama charts the rise and fall of legendary leader Patrice Lumumba, whose passionate determination to free his people from Belgian rule inspired great courage and betrayal.

Lumumba was the first prime minister of the newly independent Congo after its release from colonialist Belgian rule. However, his plans for the future of the country were considered too radical and threatening by some, and he was overthrown in a coup, and assassinated in 1961 in a CIA-backed plot

Even on stage ejiofor chiwetel is playing an African hero.

 

[terry78]

How much of a chance is there of an actual guy from Africa getting the role? I mean somebody that grew up there.