Lord of the Advice: Fellowship of the Relationship

[Anita18]

And I could easily go the rest of my life doing that. Having 'flings' with people I meet, but never defining it, and always getting out before it gets too serious.

Maybe that'd just be better.

You'd be protecting yourself sure....but you'd also be missing out on probably the best part of the relationship. Having someone always in your corner making you want to be a better person. That's the line that we crossed when we looked at each other and was like, "Yeah, we'd like to be married."

Unfortunately, your mom won't be around forever. And yeah, lovers can come and go as well, but at least there's a chance they'll stay.

She tried talking so much. I mean, this has been going on for a year or more, with her saying she is going to leave him and then he'd do something nice and she'd doubt herself. She tried every which way to get him to see that their relationship needed to change because she wasn't happy, but he just wouldn't step up.

And if it has STAYED her choice, if she'd continued feeling this was the right way to go and not seeing the relationship as a failure because it was ending on good terms, it would have been okay.

He's just really sent her into a state of shock with what he's done, and now it doesn't feel like it's her choice she's actually started acting love sick... she was telling me today she is worried she made the wrong choice. And I have to remind her constantly of all the reasons why she did.

Yeah, as I said...once communication fails, the relationship is as good as done. There's no hoping for it to work out anymore. It's done.

And her talking to him does no good if he doesn't listen. That's not communicating. That's nagging.

She really did try her best. It's all on him for not stepping up, as you said.

Family means nothing to me other than my mother. So it's really hard for me to understand all of that.

She's the only person in the whole world who wouldn't leave me. My Dad never bothered. My grandparents never bothered. My Aunt doesn't bother with me any more. Even my god parents don't bother with me any more... In my experience family means absolutely nothing to people, and fades away the minute your out of sight out of mind. Amd i'm not trying to sound sorry for myself I genuinely just think it's just how people are, and i'm fine with it.

But yeah, I do think it'd be a struggle to find someone who wanted me for my whole life... who'd commit to me in that way. And I don't wanna fret over it. I don't wanna spend my whole life constantly dissapointed. I'd rather just accept that this is the way people are, certain people never get the 'forever' kind of love and i'm one of them.

TBH I rarely talk to anyone in my family besides my mother and maybe my sister and cousin when they have time. But I know if I were in a pickle, I have people I can call. That's really all you need - knowing that someone would be there for you if you need it. That's what close friends can do as well. And I think people should have someone to turn to when the going gets rough.

To be fair, I wouldn't need a bf for that if I had a friend close by whom I could really count on, but I don't. I care about my friends here a lot, but it's the kind of relationship where I'd feel like a bother if I were call on them all the time. Having a bf means being needy sometimes, and also being there when he's needy too. That's the part that's takes commitment, and that's the part where you acknowledge that your partner is like family. They're not gonna be fair-weather friends, but someone who is there for you unconditionally.

Expecting everyone you meet to be that committed would obviously result in constant disappointment. You can't push it, or expect it. You start out by liking each other's company, and then slowly commitment starts to show. It takes patience, and a little faith.

Thanks

Yeah that's how she feels at the moment. I just gotta be strong and get her through this.

The hardest thing right now is that she doesn't work. She's managed to sell the house super fast, and is now staring at blank bookshelves all day, or talking and talking and talking about what's happened... no wonder it's making her sick.

But how can I take her mind of it? What can we do that'll get her head to stop swimming in circles?

Does she have any hobbies? Is she up for trying anything new? Maybe just going out and watching a movie will help. Just getting up and doing SOMETHING is better than sitting at home feeling sad.

 

[WillardNation]

I officially never want to be in love.

I can't believe it was only a little while ago I was posting on here about how my mum was the perfect example of someone who didn't need a relationship and was strong enough to end hers and still be okay with a future in which she was on her own...

Now she's had her heart actually broken she's a complete mess. She's crumpled. She does nothing but talk and cry. She wakes up at night and cries. She isn't eating, she feels sick and in pain all the time.

And I just found out today that my mum, 37 years sober with the AA and NA, got 3 valiums and a pack of propananol (sp?) from the doctors because she doesn't think she can take it.

She said she only got the valiums as a safety blanket, but I just don't know what to do with that. I freaked out, but she's asked me to trust her so i'm trying, but this is like nothing i've ever been through before... my mum is stronger than this.

But it's love. That's what's done this to her. The devestating, life and soul destroying capabilities of love.

And you can say it's just because she chose the wrong guy... but she really didn't. He's a good person, he was right in a lot of ways, he has been a great dad to me these last 10 years and he did a lot right. But it's just not worked... and it's taken all the strength she had away from her.

I've been in love once, and it took all my strength away too. And looking at my mum going through the same thing, panicking and wishing she was back together with him, blaming everything on herself, too sick to take a bite out of a peice of toast, just talking and talking all day with friends who are just as worried as I am... well it just confirms for me that being in love is a horrible and destructive thing. And i'm never going to fully give in to it again.

I'm not saying I couldn't have a commited relationship though. I'm saying I really don't think I want to.

It's not just my mum. This is just all around me, all these messed up relationships that are either failed, failing or probably will fail somewhere down the line. And you know what's there if they don't fail? Some one is left widowed. Got two of those happened in the last few weeks to locals in my pub... and they're broken shells of people now... they lost the love of their lives.

It's not that i'm 'afraid' of it not working out.

It just seems like looking at it, the sensible thing to do is NOT to try and make someone yours forever. Because no one can ever be yours forever.

So I think i'll approach every relationship as one that'll last as long as it lasts, and i'm not going to fall so in love that I can't ever imagine being with anyone else... because that's when all you'll get at the end is pain.

Yeah, it's a ****** world we live in where we are forced to play ****** games, isn't it?

Gotta say, I'm totally on Hopeful's side in this discussion. I've long hated feelings and emotions and have always questioned why we're forced to be tortured with them. My best hook ups have always been the FWB where there was an agreement that there would be no emotions and no one would like each other or one night stands. Every time there's emotions involved, things turn out really bad.

 

[Anita18]

Yeah, it's a ****** world we live in where we are forced to play ****** games, isn't it?

Gotta say, I'm totally on Hopeful's side in this discussion. I've long hated feelings and emotions and have always questioned why we're forced to be tortured with them. My best hook ups have always been the FWB where there was an agreement that there would be no emotions and no one would like each other or one night stands. Every time there's emotions involved, things turn out really bad.

But see, you KNOW you hate them. hopeful is afraid of them, and she's relegating herself to have your lifestyle out of fear.

It's a different mindset. I totally understand if you honestly hate sappy emotions and have no wish to make your own family. I mean, I don't really understand it, but if you're honestly happy with the way things are, c'est la vie. But when someone deep inside wants that but is afraid of getting hurt, that's a totally different thing. From hopeful's recent posts, it's the latter.

Unless you're saying that you too were like hopeful and then turned that fear into hate.

 

[WillardNation]

But see, you KNOW you hate them. hopeful is afraid of them, and she's relegating herself to have your lifestyle out of fear.

It's a different mindset. I totally understand if you honestly hate sappy emotions and have no wish to make your own family. I mean, I don't really understand it, but if you're honestly happy with the way things are, c'est la vie. But when someone deep inside wants that but is afraid of getting hurt, that's a totally different thing. From hopeful's recent posts, it's the latter.

Unless you're saying that you too were like hopeful and then turned that fear into hate.

[BLACKOUT]Nothing in this world is without reason, Anita.[/BLACKOUT]

 

[terry78]

But see, you KNOW you hate them. hopeful is afraid of them, and she's relegating herself to have your lifestyle out of fear.

It's a different mindset. I totally understand if you honestly hate sappy emotions and have no wish to make your own family. I mean, I don't really understand it, but if you're honestly happy with the way things are, c'est la vie. But when someone deep inside wants that but is afraid of getting hurt, that's a totally different thing. From hopeful's recent posts, it's the latter.

Unless you're saying that you too were like hopeful and then turned that fear into hate.

You do know that jedi smiley has basically become a metaphor for an erection. Or was that your intention all along?

 

[Anita18]

You do know that jedi smiley has basically become a metaphor for an erection. Or was that your intention all along?

Maybe.

 

[Anita18]

[BLACKOUT]Nothing in this world is without reason, Anita.[/BLACKOUT]

You're only running from yourself, young padawan!

 

[Manic4Love]

What do you do if you fall in love with a married woman?

 

[Anubis]

Bang her in their bed.

 

[Anita18]

Bang her in their bed.

I was gonna suggest dunking his junk in a bucket of ice water, but whatever works.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

You'd be protecting yourself sure....but you'd also be missing out on probably the best part of the relationship. Having someone always in your corner making you want to be a better person. That's the line that we crossed when we looked at each other and was like, "Yeah, we'd like to be married."

Unfortunately, your mom won't be around forever. And yeah, lovers can come and go as well, but at least there's a chance they'll stay.

I guess it's even worse because I see so many similarities between my mum and I and how we approach relationships and why we spend most of our time single.

So watching what's going on right now is like watching what will happen to me if I try the committing and moving into together thing when that's perhaps not the kind of thing i'm supposed to do.

I mean, they were together for 5 years before moving in together, and the relationship was much much better that whole time.

If they'd just carried on as it was, there would have been none of this damage. She wouldn't be loosing the home she put so much work into the last few years. She wouldn't be loosing the man she loved, and her best friend.

If they NOT committed in that way, they would probably still be together and still be happy.

Yeah, as I said...once communication fails, the relationship is as good as done. There's no hoping for it to work out anymore. It's done.

And her talking to him does no good if he doesn't listen. That's not communicating. That's nagging.

She really did try her best. It's all on him for not stepping up, as you said.

Thanks. I keep trying to tell her that, but it helps to have someone else reassure me of it.

TBH I rarely talk to anyone in my family besides my mother and maybe my sister and cousin when they have time. But I know if I were in a pickle, I have people I can call. That's really all you need - knowing that someone would be there for you if you need it. That's what close friends can do as well. And I think people should have someone to turn to when the going gets rough.

To be fair, I wouldn't need a bf for that if I had a friend close by whom I could really count on, but I don't. I care about my friends here a lot, but it's the kind of relationship where I'd feel like a bother if I were call on them all the time. Having a bf means being needy sometimes, and also being there when he's needy too. That's the part that's takes commitment, and that's the part where you acknowledge that your partner is like family. They're not gonna be fair-weather friends, but someone who is there for you unconditionally.

Expecting everyone you meet to be that committed would obviously result in constant disappointment. You can't push it, or expect it. You start out by liking each other's company, and then slowly commitment starts to show. It takes patience, and a little faith.

I'm lucky that I have a few friends who do take the place of family

Does she have any hobbies? Is she up for trying anything new? Maybe just going out and watching a movie will help. Just getting up and doing SOMETHING is better than sitting at home feeling sad.

Unfortunately she isn't open to any suggestion that has her going out, as she's not well. She's had M.E. my whole life, and obviously this on top is just flooring her.

I need activities to take her mind of things, that I can do indoors, that aren't just watching tv... see my problem?

Yeah, it's a ****** world we live in where we are forced to play ****** games, isn't it?

Gotta say, I'm totally on Hopeful's side in this discussion. I've long hated feelings and emotions and have always questioned why we're forced to be tortured with them. My best hook ups have always been the FWB where there was an agreement that there would be no emotions and no one would like each other or one night stands. Every time there's emotions involved, things turn out really bad.

Thankyou!

But see, you KNOW you hate them. hopeful is afraid of them, and she's relegating herself to have your lifestyle out of fear.

It's a different mindset. I totally understand if you honestly hate sappy emotions and have no wish to make your own family. I mean, I don't really understand it, but if you're honestly happy with the way things are, c'est la vie. But when someone deep inside wants that but is afraid of getting hurt, that's a totally different thing. From hopeful's recent posts, it's the latter.

Unless you're saying that you too were like hopeful and then turned that fear into hate.

Why do you think i'm afraid of them reather than hate them?

When did I say that

I'm not afraid of overpowering love. It's an incredible feeling that I crave like crazy sometimes.

I'm saying that I think my life would be better off without it because I can see logically why it causes more pain that it's worth.

 

[Anita18]

I guess it's even worse because I see so many similarities between my mum and I and how we approach relationships and why we spend most of our time single.

Tell me about it. My fiance's work situation right now is mirroring my dad's almost to a tee. My mom quipped it was interesting watching me go through what she did.

BIG difference is that my dad's precarious work situations at various startups were AFTER they'd had us. So there was naturally a lot more pressure for my mom to step up with her job, if my dad couldn't help as much financially.

Right now we don't have anywhere near that kind of pressure, so I figure it's fine to let him find himself career-wise.

But yeah, I also know friends who have similar relationships as their parents, and sometimes that's decidedly not a good thing. I wish parents were able to realize this sometimes, that their kids are internalizing how they treat their partners.

So watching what's going on right now is like watching what will happen to me if I try the committing and moving into together thing when that's perhaps not the kind of thing i'm supposed to do.

I mean, they were together for 5 years before moving in together, and the relationship was much much better that whole time.

If they'd just carried on as it was, there would have been none of this damage. She wouldn't be loosing the home she put so much work into the last few years. She wouldn't be loosing the man she loved, and her best friend.

If they NOT committed in that way, they would probably still be together and still be happy.

So you think the huge change of them moving in together was the thing that did them in?

It really depends on the people in the relationship. Some can't handle the kind of commitment that comes with living together, but are fine with being exclusive. You really do have to be aware and honest with yourself about that, though.

Unfortunately she isn't open to any suggestion that has her going out, as she's not well. She's had M.E. my whole life, and obviously this on top is just flooring her.

I need activities to take her mind of things, that I can do indoors, that aren't just watching tv... see my problem?

My mom is a dork and has picked up quilting, cross-stitching, and crocheting for when it's too hot to garden outside. She also knows how to play piano and she also has a dog to keep her company. They're admittedly old-lady kind of suggestions, but hey, it keeps my mom entertained. (Your mom is about the same age as my mom!) I even taught her how to knit, LOL.

Why do you think i'm afraid of them reather than hate them?

When did I say that

I'm not afraid of overpowering love. It's an incredible feeling that I crave like crazy sometimes.

I'm saying that I think my life would be better off without it because I can see logically why it causes more pain that it's worth.

Sorry, just the vibe you were giving off by listing all the cons about being in love and how your mom is dealing with it.

But I also think it's not something you can necessarily decide. Maybe (just maybe) you'll meet someone awesome tomorrow and it would be a shame if you threw that opportunity away because you didn't think a relationship would be worth the pain.

Obviously finding a partner shouldn't be your top priority. The rest of your life should be. But I don't think you should turn down anything that come your way. That's just cutting off a lot of potential good things.

 

[Godzilla2000]

Is it too forward of me to tell a guy I really like that really likes the way my posterior swells it's okay if he gives it a good squeeze? I'd been thinking that it would be fun to see how to get away with such fresh behavior in a public setting without people catching him goosing me. Was also thinking of keeping a score of how many times we've been caught and not caught too.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

Tell me about it. My fiance's work situation right now is mirroring my dad's almost to a tee. My mom quipped it was interesting watching me go through what she did.

BIG difference is that my dad's precarious work situations at various startups were AFTER they'd had us. So there was naturally a lot more pressure for my mom to step up with her job, if my dad couldn't help as much financially.

Right now we don't have anywhere near that kind of pressure, so I figure it's fine to let him find himself career-wise.

But yeah, I also know friends who have similar relationships as their parents, and sometimes that's decidedly not a good thing. I wish parents were able to realize this sometimes, that their kids are internalizing how they treat their partners.

It's shocking how much of an effect it has. And the tiniest details in people's 'story' can make huge difficulties.

Do you think you picked a guy whose like your dad then? I always kind of felt that myth was true.

So you think the huge change of them moving in together was the thing that did them in?

It really depends on the people in the relationship. Some can't handle the kind of commitment that comes with living together, but are fine with being exclusive. You really do have to be aware and honest with yourself about that, though.

Yeah I think that's right.

As soon as they started living together, you could tell it wasn't right. They bought the house together, but he took ages to move all his stuff in and still kept his flat for much too long a time. In the meanwhile, my mum was getting all this work done on the house and she kept saying how she felt like it wasn't really theirs cause he was dragging his feet.

Then slowly they got into this rut, where she ended up feeling like a housemaid and a mother all rolled into one. He worked, she didn't. She was out in the sticks so a bit lonely in the day, and then he'd get back and just go on his computer or sleep. And he didn't (in her own words) 'have a fire in his belly' for her anymore.

He was still incredibly supportive and still her best friend though. When she had grandad down to stay, he took the week off work and put tonnes of effort into making things easier for her. He's moved me into 6 different houses over the years. He is very generous in that way.

But just not very good emotionally. I mean, one time my mum was crying in bed next to her and he didn't move. He said he didn't think she wanted him to fuss... Idiot!

And because of stuff like that, she started to get resentful. He wasn't there for her emotionally, and so she froze up physically. Eventually she had to ask him to sleep in the spare room because she couldn't stand him trying to sleep with her cause it felt so empty and functional.

Of course all of this she was completely sure of. Until he moved on and left her standing there going 'wait... Is that it?'

My mom is a dork and has picked up quilting, cross-stitching, and crocheting for when it's too hot to garden outside. She also knows how to play piano and she also has a dog to keep her company. They're admittedly old-lady kind of suggestions, but hey, it keeps my mom entertained. (Your mom is about the same age as my mom!) I even taught her how to knit, LOL.

My mum does cross stitch too

Unfortunatey our dog died a few months ago That doesn't help at all.

I just tried asking her what I can bring to help take her mind off it, but she saids she's too tired to have the concentration span for anything much, and just my company will be enough to make her feel better.

So I guess that'll have to do!

Sorry, just the vibe you were giving off by listing all the cons about being in love and how your mom is dealing with it.

But I also think it's not something you can necessarily decide. Maybe (just maybe) you'll meet someone awesome tomorrow and it would be a shame if you threw that opportunity away because you didn't think a relationship would be worth the pain.

Obviously finding a partner shouldn't be your top priority. The rest of your life should be. But I don't think you should turn down anything that come your way. That's just cutting off a lot of potential good things.

If I felt it was worth it, I'd try. Because the ideal version of it is something I imagine to be wonderful.

It's just looking around at the moment the reality of love doesn't seem worth it.

My work mate last night showing me her broken phone her boyfriend smashed up and saying her landlord has said he has to move out or they both do. But she won't leave him... She loves him... And yet she's secretly going on 'dates' with another guy whose madly into her... But he has a girlfriend whose just found out she's pregnant...

Where's the good in there?

And every weekend nights out are ruined by one couple or another in my friendship group argueing. And it's usually me the girls come crying too, and I get a bit sick of saying 'well you know what to do if the relationship is making you this unhappy'... But they don't. Cause it's a ****ing sickness, love!

And then like I said, watching people grieve when things are over. Either by death or by being 'dumped' or cheated on.

Watching my mum basically dealing with the fact she will grow old alone like she always thought she would, and her fantasy that maybe she HAD managed to find that true love at the last hurdle is stripped away and she's just left with the harsh dissapointment of a reality in which there are just no guaranteed happy endings in life.

Can someone tell me what is 'worth it' about trying to find that lifetime partner if the result could be that devestating? Isn't it better to embrace and face the reality that you might NEVER find that, and don't spend all your time banking on it as the key to happiness.

There isn't much you get from a relationship that I don't get from my good friends? Or even that I wouldn't get from a casual relationship, or even an exclusive one that just doesn't lead to living together or getting married?

All I'd be missing is someone loving me in 'that way'.

But since no one has yet and I've got to the age of 24/25 without it just fine, I'm just wondering if it's actually all that important to me.

I mean, it's basically just like a drug. A eurphoria. A feeling of being flattered and warm and content whenever their around. And even then it might be all a lie, when it turns out they never actually loved you.

Maybe I am afraid. I dunno. Maybe a little

But only because I know that when I fall in love, it IS the forever kind of love. I still love my ex now... And he cheated on me with men, and treated me generally like **** while he was lying to himself. It just doesn't go away.

So I don't see how I could just keep trying over and over. Falling in love over and over again.

I see people doing it all the time, but that's just not me. That's not how I see love.

And I definitely don't want to get to my mums age and still be looking for that kind of love and have to accept I'm going to die without ever having found it.

I'd rather just stop looking for it now and have a whole life of fun, fleeting affairs and be complete within myself and not NEED that ending.

 

[Anita18]

It's shocking how much of an effect it has. And the tiniest details in people's 'story' can make huge difficulties.

Do you think you picked a guy whose like your dad then? I always kind of felt that myth was true.

I'm not sure if it's detail as it is simply respect. My fiance's parents divorced, and they were nothing but absolutely civil to each other. It IS possible to come out of a serious relationship like that with all parties unscathed.

My fiance is very much like my dad in many ways, but he's the opposite in probably THE most important way - in temperament. I like to say my fiance is just like my dad, except he doesn't freak out. My dad happens to be the irrationally paranoid parent of my set...

But it's probably not a surprise that I feel comfortable in this relationship because I've seen how my parents relate to each other, and I feel we relate to each other in similar ways. It's like I mentioned - you internalize your parents' relationship and that's the kind that's more comfortable to you.

My fiance might disagree though. His mom has remarried but continues to be an incessant nag to his stepdad. (She's a sweet woman, but the irrationally paranoid parent of that set ) By some miracle, he managed to find someone who wasn't really like his mom at all, relationship-wise. So having the intelligence/awareness to acknowledge what you like or don't like about your parents' relationship helps too.

Yeah I think that's right.

As soon as they started living together, you could tell it wasn't right. They bought the house together, but he took ages to move all his stuff in and still kept his flat for much too long a time. In the meanwhile, my mum was getting all this work done on the house and she kept saying how she felt like it wasn't really theirs cause he was dragging his feet.

Then slowly they got into this rut, where she ended up feeling like a housemaid and a mother all rolled into one. He worked, she didn't. She was out in the sticks so a bit lonely in the day, and then he'd get back and just go on his computer or sleep. And he didn't (in her own words) 'have a fire in his belly' for her anymore.

He was still incredibly supportive and still her best friend though. When she had grandad down to stay, he took the week off work and put tonnes of effort into making things easier for her. He's moved me into 6 different houses over the years. He is very generous in that way.

But just not very good emotionally. I mean, one time my mum was crying in bed next to her and he didn't move. He said he didn't think she wanted him to fuss... Idiot!

And because of stuff like that, she started to get resentful. He wasn't there for her emotionally, and so she froze up physically. Eventually she had to ask him to sleep in the spare room because she couldn't stand him trying to sleep with her cause it felt so empty and functional.

Of course all of this she was completely sure of. Until he moved on and left her standing there going 'wait... Is that it?'

Yeah...lack of honest communication definitely starts to fester like that. It's really a shame when so many relationships go so far south because people don't talk to each other and get resentful in the meantime.

My coworker's marriage is like that. She started to resent him a long time ago. To the point where she told him she was attending grad school across the state...two weeks before classes started. She did the interviewing without telling him her plans. This was 5 years ago. They're still married, although they HATE each other and only acknowledge each other's existence when their 2 kids are around. She's only holding out for the sake of her children. They stay with her mostly and she doesn't want them traveling across the state every weekend to visit their dad. It's understandable, but at the same time it's also immensely that she let it get so bad she planned to move across the state by herself without telling her own husband. I think a lot of his current resentment of her stemmed from that one decision. I don't necessarily blame him for that, but he also failed to hold up his end of the marriage for other reasons. It always takes two, and neither of them has decided to be an adult about it.

I guess some people want to be in denial about that stuff, but geez! If it quacks, it's a duck! Time to sort things out!

My mum does cross stitch too

Unfortunatey our dog died a few months ago That doesn't help at all.

I just tried asking her what I can bring to help take her mind off it, but she saids she's too tired to have the concentration span for anything much, and just my company will be enough to make her feel better.

So I guess that'll have to do!

Being there for her will definitely help. Sometimes that's what someone mostly needs.

Can someone tell me what is 'worth it' about trying to find that lifetime partner if the result could be that devestating? Isn't it better to embrace and face the reality that you might NEVER find that, and don't spend all your time banking on it as the key to happiness.

There isn't much you get from a relationship that I don't get from my good friends? Or even that I wouldn't get from a casual relationship, or even an exclusive one that just doesn't lead to living together or getting married?

All I'd be missing is someone loving me in 'that way'.

But since no one has yet and I've got to the age of 24/25 without it just fine, I'm just wondering if it's actually all that important to me.

I mean, it's basically just like a drug. A eurphoria. A feeling of being flattered and warm and content whenever their around. And even then it might be all a lie, when it turns out they never actually loved you.

Those fairy-tale happy endings don't exist. Life is a journey, full of ups and downs and no guarantees. The choice, as I see it, is whether you want to have someone there facing all that, by your side.

Finding a partner is absolutely not the key to happiness. I'd be pretty happy now if I were single, I bet. It's just that I feel my life is relatively better with him around. It doesn't have to be extremes. Live your life first, get comfortable with yourself, and then you can be open to trusting people.

And seriously, if you want a faithful, devoted man, the socially awkward nerds will never let you down. If anything, they're too lazy to find someone else after they've already got a woman. It's an ongoing joke in my workgroup, actually. At least between the girls with nerdy male partners.

 

[Erzengel]

All I'd be missing is someone loving me in 'that way'.

But since no one has yet and I've got to the age of 24/25 without it just fine, I'm just wondering if it's actually all that important to me.

This is one sticking point that I was alluding to in my other posts. It's like a lot of former/current posters here who've never had a real relationship. Those who consider themselves, battle hardened, jaded, victims of love that they are now so world weary because they haven't found someone that they "poo poo" any notion of ever being in love or having someone love them in return.

You're still young at 24/25.

And it's great that you're happy at being single, one should always be at that state even when they are looking to be in a relationship.

I don't think anyone here is telling you, you need to find someone to be happy.

My only point was just to have a little perspective of where you are, and where you could be. I wouldn't want you miss something really great because of your fears and because you've witnessed a lot of break ups/losses, etc. Who knows what will happen when you're 28? Or 30? What happens when you move?

To just say no to anything prospective just seems like a defense mechanism.

 

[The Guard]

There have never, ever been any guaranteed happy endings in life. In fact, we all know how life ends. We die.

Fairy tale happy endings exist. But not everyone has them. Not everyone wants them, and not everyone ends up with the same person their whole life. The ideal is nice...but its rarely realistic, and in the end, can be somewhat boring or unfulfilling. Many people just aren't wired that way. Those who are, in my experience, generally aren't being honest with themselves or their partners on some level.

Just because you lose a relationship at 60 does not mean your romantic life is over. You're not young, but neither were you young at 55. There is still time to learn, to apply what you have learned, and there is no age range for love or marriage. And there are lots of fish in the sea.

In my mind, there are definitely things that you can get from a relationship that you can't get from good friends. Not on the same level. There a different dynamic to the interactions, a unique exchange of energy and emotion.

Love is not one thing. It's not just a warm, fuzzy feeling. It is many things to many people. And love doesn't mean that people can't fail each other sometimes. People hurt, lie and cheat, even when they're madly in love. And it's not as simple as "I never actually loved you". People have communication and compatability issues, and they can fall in and out of love. That's how it works. Just as we find new friends and lose contact with old ones, etc, so goes love.

A true, honest relationship involves love, compassion, and understanding, and also a fair amount of struggle, pain and sacrifice. And when it's over, you'd better believe it can hurt.

I wouldn't have it any other way. It makes me feel alive to know that I, and others, can FEEL that much over something that is relatively common. It's a gift we give ourselves, and each other.

It's called "true love", which to me means "Honest love", not what a movie told me I should want.

The idea should not be to find some vaguely defined version of true love, but to find someone who truly complements you. What you want is sometimes not what you actually need. Sometimes you can get hurt emotionally, yes. Sometimes if you don't take that risk, you harm yourself more in the long run.

And it's okay to be afraid of it, and to be awed by it. Its impact is enormous.
And there's nothing wrong with not living your life in pursuit of it. It doesn't have to be as important to you as it is to others. Plenty of people don't get married or have long term relationships, and live full, happy lives.

 

[SpaceWay2009]

Yeah, it's a ****** world we live in where we are forced to play ****** games, isn't it?

Gotta say, I'm totally on Hopeful's side in this discussion. I've long hated feelings and emotions and have always questioned why we're forced to be tortured with them. My best hook ups have always been the FWB where there was an agreement that there would be no emotions and no one would like each other or one night stands. Every time there's emotions involved, things turn out really bad.

I agree with you here. Sometimes, it's better to not just get too attached. It's much better of it's the other way around, though. lol

 

[The Guard]

Controlling emotions is one of the silliest things I've ever heard people do.

"Let's not like each other, ok?"

Half the time, it seems things turn out badly because people tried to repress and control their emotions.

There's going to be some level of emotion to sex, even if its just attraction or lust.

 

[Erzengel]

Well...unless you're a Jedi....

 

[hopefuldreamer]

I'm not sure if it's detail as it is simply respect. My fiance's parents divorced, and they were nothing but absolutely civil to each other. It IS possible to come out of a serious relationship like that with all parties unscathed.

My fiance is very much like my dad in many ways, but he's the opposite in probably THE most important way - in temperament. I like to say my fiance is just like my dad, except he doesn't freak out. My dad happens to be the irrationally paranoid parent of my set...

But it's probably not a surprise that I feel comfortable in this relationship because I've seen how my parents relate to each other, and I feel we relate to each other in similar ways. It's like I mentioned - you internalize your parents' relationship and that's the kind that's more comfortable to you.

My fiance might disagree though. His mom has remarried but continues to be an incessant nag to his stepdad. (She's a sweet woman, but the irrationally paranoid parent of that set ) By some miracle, he managed to find someone who wasn't really like his mom at all, relationship-wise. So having the intelligence/awareness to acknowledge what you like or don't like about your parents' relationship helps too.

You're right.

Instead of just saying 'I'm just like my mum so I'm going to end up in the same situation' I should be saying 'I'm just like my mum... What can I do to change that'.

And maybe it was my mums lack of commitment to earlier relationships that is why she is alone now... Not the failure of this last ditch effort.

I mean, she said she has one guy she regrets.

It's the guy she was seeing when she slept with my dad

He was the love of her life, and she wished like crazy for him to be the father and not my Dad... But life wasn't that kind to her unfortunately.

Though she did get me out of it, and I know she doesn't regret that one bit

Yeah...lack of honest communication definitely starts to fester like that. It's really a shame when so many relationships go so far south because people don't talk to each other and get resentful in the meantime.

My coworker's marriage is like that. She started to resent him a long time ago. To the point where she told him she was attending grad school across the state...two weeks before classes started. She did the interviewing without telling him her plans. This was 5 years ago. They're still married, although they HATE each other and only acknowledge each other's existence when their 2 kids are around. She's only holding out for the sake of her children. They stay with her mostly and she doesn't want them traveling across the state every weekend to visit their dad. It's understandable, but at the same time it's also immensely that she let it get so bad she planned to move across the state by herself without telling her own husband. I think a lot of his current resentment of her stemmed from that one decision. I don't necessarily blame him for that, but he also failed to hold up his end of the marriage for other reasons. It always takes two, and neither of them has decided to be an adult about it.

I guess some people want to be in denial about that stuff, but geez! If it quacks, it's a duck! Time to sort things out!

Denial and dellusion are so hard to overcome in bad relationships sometimes!

It's easier for us on the outside to see though, whereas from the inside it's all warped.

Those fairy-tale happy endings don't exist. Life is a journey, full of ups and downs and no guarantees. The choice, as I see it, is whether you want to have someone there facing all that, by your side.

Finding a partner is absolutely not the key to happiness. I'd be pretty happy now if I were single, I bet. It's just that I feel my life is relatively better with him around. It doesn't have to be extremes. Live your life first, get comfortable with yourself, and then you can be open to trusting people.

And seriously, if you want a faithful, devoted man, the socially awkward nerds will never let you down. If anything, they're too lazy to find someone else after they've already got a woman. It's an ongoing joke in my workgroup, actually. At least between the girls with nerdy male partners.

Unfortunately I couldn't love a guy like that I don't think, at least not at this place in my life.

I feel like I'm channelling SuperMike here but I genuinely do prefer alpha males.

This is one sticking point that I was alluding to in my other posts. It's like a lot of former/current posters here who've never had a real relationship. Those who consider themselves, battle hardened, jaded, victims of love that they are now so world weary because they haven't found someone that they "poo poo" any notion of ever being in love or having someone love them in return.

You're still young at 24/25.

And it's great that you're happy at being single, one should always be at that state even when they are looking to be in a relationship.

I don't think anyone here is telling you, you need to find someone to be happy.

My only point was just to have a little perspective of where you are, and where you could be. I wouldn't want you miss something really great because of your fears and because you've witnessed a lot of break ups/losses, etc. Who knows what will happen when you're 28? Or 30? What happens when you move?

To just say no to anything prospective just seems like a defense mechanism.

Of course it's a defense mechanism.

I want to defend against unneccesary pain, that is mostly caused by what society and movies tell you that you should be looking for. And I want to do that by ripping away the illusion of finding that one true love that lasts forever, and just veiwing relationships as something fleeting. Never letting my head and my heart get sick with addiction to a person... Trying to have some self control by just treating every relationship realistically instead of daydreaming about weddings and growing old together.

I'll probably have relationships in my life I'm sure.

I just don't ever want to get so dependant on the other person that and so delluded by my love for them, that leaving them is either impossible or physically detrimental.

It seems like that kind of love is an indulgence. And just like drugs, the more you indulge, the bigger the come down.

There have never, ever been any guaranteed happy endings in life. In fact, we all know how life ends. We die.

Fairy tale happy endings exist. But not everyone has them. Not everyone wants them, and not everyone ends up with the same person their whole life. The ideal is nice...but its rarely realistic, and in the end, can be somewhat boring or unfulfilling. Many people just aren't wired that way. Those who are, in my experience, generally aren't being honest with themselves or their partners on some level.

Just because you lose a relationship at 60 does not mean your romantic life is over. You're not young, but neither were you young at 55. There is still time to learn, to apply what you have learned, and there is no age range for love or marriage. And there are lots of fish in the sea.

In my mind, there are definitely things that you can get from a relationship that you can't get from good friends. Not on the same level. There a different dynamic to the interactions, a unique exchange of energy and emotion.

Love is not one thing. It's not just a warm, fuzzy feeling. It is many things to many people. And love doesn't mean that people can't fail each other sometimes. People hurt, lie and cheat, even when they're madly in love. And it's not as simple as "I never actually loved you". People have communication and compatability issues, and they can fall in and out of love. That's how it works. Just as we find new friends and lose contact with old ones, etc, so goes love.

A true, honest relationship involves love, compassion, and understanding, and also a fair amount of struggle, pain and sacrifice. And when it's over, you'd better believe it can hurt.

I wouldn't have it any other way. It makes me feel alive to know that I, and others, can FEEL that much over something that is relatively common. It's a gift we give ourselves, and each other.

It's called "true love", which to me means "Honest love", not what a movie told me I should want.

The idea should not be to find some vaguely defined version of true love, but to find someone who truly complements you. What you want is sometimes not what you actually need. Sometimes you can get hurt emotionally, yes. Sometimes if you don't take that risk, you harm yourself more in the long run.

And it's okay to be afraid of it, and to be awed by it. Its impact is enormous.
And there's nothing wrong with not living your life in pursuit of it. It doesn't have to be as important to you as it is to others. Plenty of people don't get married or have long term relationships, and live full, happy lives.

That's an awesome post

 

[Erzengel]

Of course it's a defense mechanism.

I want to defend against unneccesary pain, that is mostly caused by what society and movies tell you that you should be looking for. And I want to do that by ripping away the illusion of finding that one true love that lasts forever, and just veiwing relationships as something fleeting. Never letting my head and my heart get sick with addiction to a person... Trying to have some self control by just treating every relationship realistically instead of daydreaming about weddings and growing old together.

I'll probably have relationships in my life I'm sure.

I just don't ever want to get so dependant on the other person that and so delluded by my love for them, that leaving them is either impossible or physically detrimental.

You make it sound like falling in love is almost like contracting a disease.

And maybe it would help you if you stopped thinking of relationships like some sort of destination.

I think most people in a successful relationship realize that it's not a perfect, happy ending, movie scripted relationship. It's a lot of work and yeah sometimes it doesn't work out. You start dating, someone, you develop feelings for them, a relationship progresses.

You are thinking in extremes and being somewhat over-dramatic and a little too pessimistic. What's the sense in doing anything?

Why get a pet when their lives are so short? Why have friends because eventually you drift apart? Why do anything?

 

[hopefuldreamer]

You make it sound like falling in love is almost like contracting a disease.

And maybe it would help you if you stopped thinking of relationships like some sort of destination.

I think most people in a successful relationship realize that it's not a perfect, happy ending, movie scripted relationship. It's a lot of work and yeah sometimes it doesn't work out. You start dating, someone, you develop feelings for them, a relationship progresses.

You are thinking in extremes and being somewhat over-dramatic and a little too pessimistic. What's the sense in doing anything?

Why get a pet when their lives are so short? Why have friends because eventually you drift apart? Why do anything?

I don't think of relationships as a destination. That's exactly what I am saying. I don't think it'll all have a happy ending at all.

I am saying I want to guard against being sucked into that kind of thinking once I'm happy. To constantly be aware that as much in love as it feels like we are and as much as someone promises he will never stop loving you... It doesn't mean it they will. I'm not saying I won't get involved with guys at ever.

And I treat friendships and pets in the same way. I've had plenty of friends drift out of my life, and it doesn't bother me in the least bit. If I see them, it's lovely, but people come in and out of your life all the time.

And asd for pets, I'm basically saying I'd love to get a pet, I just wouldn't believe a vet who told me he was going to live forever.

 

[enterthemadness]

Being in relationship is hard work.

Well, no contact since Monday from that one woman. She never called or nothing. Rude. Immature. I also wanted to talk to her in person to get...to see for myself. On her public Facebook break up, her BF at the time made serious drug allegrations at her. Of course she denied it and deleted the posts...but at sane time I don't know her well and wanted to talk to her cause she's hot and I wanted to see for myself.

 

[steintym]

ETM ... I think you need to let that one go ...