Marvel Now - Part 5

[runawayboulder]

The reaction is a recycling of the same fanboy of that for Superior Spider-Man and Batman RIP and WinterCap. Sure, some can argue that it's been done before, but at this point, everything's been done to death -- Thor fought Galactus how many times? Odin died how many times? Surtur unleashed his fury how many times? Etc. Etc. Etc. Etc.

Those are horrible examples.

You're misusing regular stories with major status quo changes.


In other news, Tom Brevoort is betting fans online $100 a person that these changes will not be reverted in time for the AoU movie. This is the same guy that said people would forget about Peter Parker when Ock became Spider-Man.

 

[Mad Ones]

Will people say white men are being pandered to when the status quo of Thor and Captain America eventually reverts back? Probably not.

 

[CaptainWagner]

The problem with some established superheroes' being switched from white to black, or hell, even the other way around, or for example Thor being a woman (why the hell is she called Thor anyway?), is that it feels forced no matter how they do it.

They can keep doing it, it will still feel forced, it will still feel like pandering to the minorities, so they can better "identify" with their superheroes, it will still feel like a PC move "oh look how progressive we are, fabulous isn't it?". Any way they approach this, it is pandering.

Many have said it before, but just create new superheroes, new characters that can be black, asian, or whatever, don't just lazily pick a character that's been established for decades and go "oh well you know what, doesn't matter, it'll just be another guy behind the mask", yeah, well, it does matter.

-But why is that? It makes perfect sense for Steve Rogers to choose his best friend and long time partner Sam Wilson as his replacement. That shouldn't be seen as "pandering" unless you're already wanting to call it that. There are tons of great, new stories that can be told with an elderly Steve and Flacon as Captain America. Marvel has been adament that these changes will not change back any time soon, and I hope they don't. It would be a shame to waste the oppurtunity for so many potential great stories.

 

[Brainiac 8]

Sam taking over as Cap from Steve is not pandering and actually makes sense considering the character and his friendship with Steve over that last many years.

Girl Thor is dumb and definitely feels like pandering.

 

[BoredGuy]

Yeah, girl Thor is super dumb, plus it just annoys me that they keep insisting "she IS THOR". You wanna say "she IS THE GOD OF THUNDER"? Fine, but she's not Thor, period. Dunno why that bothers me so much but it does.

As for other changes, I always hear these "it opens up so many stories" arguments, but I wanna ask, like what? Is there really years worth of stories out of having Old-Man Steve and Falcon America??? How would they differ from any other story with an older mentor character and regular cap?? Will they be dealing with racism constantly, (because a black Cap in real life WOULD deal with it constantly) but in a comic that could get very heavy-handed and preachy and boring...

I dunno, all these changes at once- Dead Logan, Falcon cap, she-Thor, the return of d*ckhead Tony... Comic-readers are well known to be a somewhat stubborn lot, afraid of big changes, so to do all this at once seems like a ballsy, but ultimately pretty dumb idea on Marvel's part.

All that said, I don't really want a reboot, because I do not want to read another f**king rehash of an origin story we've all seen a million times.

I know the changes are most likely temporary, and they just seem to enjoy getting the fanboys up in arms by claiming they're "totally 100% permanent" when we all know they're not

 

[chamber-music]

I have no problem with changes if we get great stories out of them but some of the stuff that goes on in comics isn't done for the benefit of telling great stories.

Call me a cynic but I think some things in comics are just done as stunts, gimmicks, sensationalism and to get attention.

It is hit and miss. Sometimes we genuinely get great stuff and big revamps or changes and sometimes we get forgettable rubbish.

 

[roach]

I don't mind a female becoming the goddess of thunder...just confused how she'll be Thor

 

[Mulholland-Jr]

Will people say white men are being pandered to when the status quo of Thor and Captain America eventually reverts back? Probably not.

No, they'll be pandering to the movie audience.

 

[OriginalMiles]

Guys, what if these changes do turn out to be permanent? It's not impossible.

 

[Anubis]

Yes it is. Don't know how long you've been reading comics but let me tell you this. No matter what. They will always revert back to the status quo. Thor will always be a man, Wolverine will be an alive and mysterious and yet not mysterious loner who somehow is on fifty teams, Mutant from Canada. Steve Rogers will always be Captain America. Maybe you'll get a retcon where Logan is actually a half Skrull/half Shi'ar bird dude from Brazil, but in then end, he'll go back to being the tall dwarf/short man from Canada.

That's just the way it is with the big 2. Sooner or later, it will always revert back to the way it was. Change, character development, these things are all temporary at best with Marvel/DC.

Which is why I just can't see the point in getting up in arms over any of this.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Once you get to a certain level of popularity/recognition, you're pretty well set in stone. Quasar might lose an arm and turn into a cyborg forever if it proves popular, but Cap will return to being Steve Rogers and Thor will return to being the Thor we know sooner or later. Assume if they've got a solo movie, they'll snap back to their usual status quo eventually.

 

[Anubis]

Good point. The more popular you are, the more likely change is meaningless.

B through Z listers are rife for change and disfigurement.

 

[roach]

Once you get to a certain level of popularity/recognition, you're pretty well set in stone. Quasar might lose an arm and turn into a cyborg forever if it proves popular, but Cap will return to being Steve Rogers and Thor will return to being the Thor we know sooner or later. Assume if they've got a solo movie, they'll snap back to their usual status quo eventually.

and this isn't the first or second time Cap lost the Super Soldier Serum

 

[Havok83]

Yes it is. Don't know how long you've been reading comics but let me tell you this. No matter what. They will always revert back to the status quo. Thor will always be a man, Wolverine will be an alive and mysterious and yet not mysterious loner who somehow is on fifty teams, Mutant from Canada. Steve Rogers will always be Captain America. Maybe you'll get a retcon where Logan is actually a half Skrull/half Shi'ar bird dude from Brazil, but in then end, he'll go back to being the tall dwarf/short man from Canada.

That's just the way it is with the big 2. Sooner or later, it will always revert back to the way it was. Change, character development, these things are all temporary at best with Marvel/DC.

Which is why I just can't see the point in getting up in arms over any of this.

10 years later, Jean Grey is still dead

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Emma's more interesting anyway.

 

[Havok83]

Emma's more interesting anyway.

 

[roach]

10 years later, Jean Grey is still dead

that's because Marvel still profits from teasing fans about her return

 

[Havok83]

that's because Marvel still profits from teasing fans about her return

Its been a year since Xorna. Im surprised we haven't had a tease this year yet unless Im unaware of one

 

[Anubis]

10 years later, Jean Grey is still dead

That's cuz she's B-list.

 

[Mad Ones]

lawl Jean is defs A-list

 

[Anubis]

Maybe in your mind but lets face it, outside of Wolverine, all the X-Men are B-List and under.

Flash Fact.

Well, maybe Storm, though I have no idea why.

 

[Gamma Goliath]

Guys, what if these changes do turn out to be permanent? It's not impossible.

If they were permanent then I see marvel running two universes, the permanently changed 616, and a rebooted universe restarting every character from the beginning with an update on their classic origins (so its not the ultimate universe all over again)

Or have an event that will new 52 the entire MU.

 

[Mad Ones]

Maybe in your mind but lets face it, outside of Wolverine, all the X-Men are B-List and under.

Flash Fact.

Well, maybe Storm, though I have no idea why.

What makes a character A-list? I figured Jean's been in enough comics, movies, video games, and cartoons over the years to count as A-list. Not that I really care.

 

[chamber-music]

10 years later, Jean Grey is still dead

Teen Jean is still running around in Bendis X-Men so it doesn't really feel like she is gone.

 

[Havok83]

What makes a character A-list? I figured Jean's been in enough comics, movies, video games, and cartoons over the years to count as A-list. Not that I really care.

IA. Dead or not, Marvel always pushes her forward when it comes to promoting the franchise. Non-comic fans definitely know who she is bc she has a consistent presence outside of the books. She's not like a minor character either as many significant stories revolve around her and her mantle. She's definitely an A-list X-men

Teen Jean is still running around in Bendis X-Men so it doesn't really feel like she is gone.

but that just adds to the point of the status quo changing and not reverting back to how it was. 616 Jean has been dead for 10 years and they still haven't brought her back. Instead there is this teen version out there which isn't quite the same. Most big changes within Marvel are usually reverted back within 2-3 years but they've seem to make this a bit more permanent than those