The Amazing Spider-Man Script getting a rewrite

[©KAW]

I've always said that some of the best comic book movies ever made, were comic book-like films. Like the original Alien and Predator, not to mention Terminator 2, The Abyss and Blade Runner. I even think The Matrix is beyond what most comics book films are doing today. To me the balance between a combination of realism, fiction, action and good story telling is how comic book films needs to made.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Absolutely, I consider the Matrix to be one of the greatest superhero origin story of all time.

 

[Infinity9999x]

sam's first two movies made more than nolan's first two movies so their positions were after the sequel were pretty much the same. the difference being WB are more hands off than sony (I've seen and read loads of examples where they've let people just get one with it, look at watchmen).

I definately wouldn't walk away from spidey, it would be my dream project. without being big headed if I made spidey the fans would love it because I would love it.

btw if you drop sandman and venom takes his place daughter and all, when spidey gets the black suit how would you motivate peter to attack for no reason? would you just say the suit makes peter a bad guy - the end - that's all the explaination the audience needs?

Sorry man, but companies don't think that way. SM1 and SM2 may have made more then Nolan's two movies (barely) but there's a ton more hype and public support behind the man who directed the second highest grossing movie EVER. That's more clout, plain and simple.

And I wouldn't have Peter "attack" Brock so to say. He would be annoyed with Brock, because Brock would be kind of a dick to him (but have some redeeming qualities that make us feel for the guy a bit) so under the black suit Spidey would do stuff like smashing his camera, maybe take some ideas from the TAS spidey's and have him threaten Brock to stay out of his way. Then when Brock steals Pete's pictures to make money, Pete exposes him (under the influence of the black suit) and Brock loses his chance to get money to help his daughter. Plenty of motivation to be pissed at Pete right there.

 

[weezerspider]

personally I think all writers are hit and miss and depends if they bring their 'A' game to the table. for instance goyer wrote blade 3 and helped script TDK.
sergent wrote SM2 people are entitled to their opinion but in my opinion that is the the second best superhero movie ever made. I saw IM yesterday and TDK on friday and I still think SM2 is the second best superhero movie ever made.

Goyer helped come up with the story with Jon and Chris. Jon wrote the script alone. Goyer knows the comics. He helped the Nolan bros with making the story fit the characters and that kind of stuff. Jonathan Nolan wrote the actual script by himself. That said, I agree it depends on if you bring your A game, I'm just pointing out Goyer is probably not the best example of that.

 

[weezerspider]

I would have gone with dumping the script as well and starting over. However, I suggested swapping Sandman for Venom because of how easily Venom could assume Sandman's role. He still has the daughter, but now instead of being in jail, the guy has gambling debts that he has to pay and he can't afford to get her medical care. Make him a mix of the sympathetic Marco and the jerk-off Brock, so he's a character with more dimension. He doctors Pete's pics to get money for his daughter, Pete, under the influence of the suit, gets him fired. Now Brock can't get money for his kid, but instead of blaming himself (since his own gambling is the reason he didn't have the money to begin with) he focuses his rage on Pete.

Also, I see where you're coming from, but I wouldn't compare Raimi to Nolan after TDK. I mean, SM2 was very successful, but Nolan had literally just made the second highest grossing movie EVER. That's a little more clout then Raimi had.

And honestly, like I said, would any of us risk the chance of losing the chance to work on our favorite character? I know I wouldn't.

That Spiderman 3 would have been sick. Heck, I like the GG2 plot. If they had mixed Sandman's story with Brocks and got rid of Sandman all together I would have enjoyed the film quite a bit.

 

[mre]

Then when Brock steals Pete's pictures to make money, Pete exposes him

That was lame how he did that in SM3. How did Brock think that Peter wouldn't have noticed? Peter is the only guy in the city who can get pics of Spider-Man, and Brock (who is competing against Peter for the SAME JOB) steals from him? What? Really?

 

[spider-neil]

Sorry man, but companies don't think that way. SM1 and SM2 may have made more then Nolan's two movies (barely) but there's a ton more hype and public support behind the man who directed the second highest grossing movie EVER. That's more clout, plain and simple.

SM - WW gross - 821m
SM2 - WW gross - 783m

total 1,604B

batman begin - WW gross - 372m
TDK - WW gross - 1,001B

total - 1,374B

remember, when sam made SM2 TDK didn't exist, heck when sam made SM3 TDK didn't exist. if two movies that have made a fortune and critical acclaim doesn't earn you carte blanche, what does?

 

[spider-neil]

And I wouldn't have Peter "attack" Brock so to say. He would be annoyed with Brock, because Brock would be kind of a dick to him (but have some redeeming qualities that make us feel for the guy a bit) so under the black suit Spidey would do stuff like smashing his camera, maybe take some ideas from the TAS spidey's and have him threaten Brock to stay out of his way. Then when Brock steals Pete's pictures to make money, Pete exposes him (under the influence of the black suit) and Brock loses his chance to get money to help his daughter. Plenty of motivation to be pissed at Pete right there.

you explaining why brock would be angry at peter, not why peter would be 'really' angry at brock. when spidey takes down sandman (who would be replaced by venom in the fan's script rewrite) you could feel his anger, 'good riddence', the uncle ben retcon was lame but at least it gave peter real motivation. where would that motivation come from with venom?

 

[Crook]

SM - WW gross - 821m
SM2 - WW gross - 783m

total 1,604B

batman begin - WW gross - 372m
TDK - WW gross - 1,001B

total - 1,374B

remember, when sam made SM2 TDK didn't exist, heck when sam made SM3 TDK didn't exist. if two movies that have made a fortune and critical acclaim doesn't earn you carte blanche, what does?

Consistency and/or pushing the envelope. That's how the likes of Spielberg, Hitchcock, and Scorsese did it. For everyone else, the general rule of thumb is you're only as good as your last movie.

 

[spider-neil]

Consistency and/or pushing the envelope. That's how the likes of Spielberg, Hitchcock, and Scorsese did it. For everyone else, the general rule of thumb is you're only as good as your last movie.

he made SM and then SM2 - consistancy

I don't see how TDK is 'pushing the envelope'. matrix pushed the envelope TDK did nothing you haven't already seen albeit in difference genre. the train fight pushed the envelope with regards to superhuman's fighting.

 

[Spider-ManHero12]

^^ this.

 

[Victarion]

you explaining why brock would be angry at peter, not why peter would be 'really' angry at brock. when spidey takes down sandman (who would be replaced by venom in the fan's script rewrite) you could feel his anger, 'good riddence', the uncle ben retcon was lame but at least it gave peter real motivation. where would that motivation come from with venom?

If we're talking about Raimi's version of Peter, then recall it seemed like he always got pushed around. This is just another instance of him being pushed around...except the suit convinces him to stand up for himself.

 

[Infinity9999x]

you explaining why brock would be angry at peter, not why peter would be 'really' angry at brock. when spidey takes down sandman (who would be replaced by venom in the fan's script rewrite) you could feel his anger, 'good riddence', the uncle ben retcon was lame but at least it gave peter real motivation. where would that motivation come from with venom?

Peter has never, ever, had enough anger at Brock to try and kill him (before he became Venom). So We wouldn't see anything to that extreme.

However, we would see instances that I already described in my above posts. Pete would be annoyed that Brock is competing with him to get pictures of Spider-man, so under the black suit, when he sees Brock, he smashes his camera (like in the movie). Of course now smashing the camera is a bigger deal because he needs to get Spider-man pics to help his daughter, cameras cost money, he doesn't have any. Brock keeps trying to tail Spidey. Spidey get's annoyed, tells him to stay out of his way and them webs him upside down to a lampost, humiliating him and making it so Brock can't get pictures of Spider-man. Maybe Brock actually does take some pictures of Spidey doing something that looks incriminating, Spidey gets really pissed and finds Brock and threatens him, ect. ect.

Stuff like that, that would build up, until finally, when Brock steals Pete's pictures to get the money he needs, and when Pete gets him fired, all of it weighs on him and he snaps.

You wouldn't see Peter going after Brock trying to kill him, because even under the black suit he would never go that far. I would change scenes of that to Harry. Spidey beats the crap out of Harry and then nearly kills him, (and I'm talking more then the pumpkin bomb throw, I'm thinking something like, after the big fight, Harry is pretty much lying there, helpless, and Pete is standing over him with one of his own goblin swords seriously considering ending him) and then he realizes how far the suit is pushing him.

It wouldn't be appropriate to see Pete get to that level of anger with Brock, but he would do lots of very mean and ******* things that finally cause Brock to snap.

 

[spider-neil]

Peter has never, ever, had enough anger at Brock to try and kill him (before he became Venom). So We wouldn't see anything to that extreme.

However, we would see instances that I already described in my above posts. Pete would be annoyed that Brock is competing with him to get pictures of Spider-man, so under the black suit, when he sees Brock, he smashes his camera (like in the movie). Of course now smashing the camera is a bigger deal because he needs to get Spider-man pics to help his daughter, cameras cost money, he doesn't have any. Brock keeps trying to tail Spidey. Spidey get's annoyed, tells him to stay out of his way and them webs him upside down to a lampost, humiliating him and making it so Brock can't get pictures of Spider-man. Maybe Brock actually does take some pictures of Spidey doing something that looks incriminating, Spidey gets really pissed and finds Brock and threatens him, ect. ect.

Stuff like that, that would build up, until finally, when Brock steals Pete's pictures to get the money he needs, and when Pete gets him fired, all of it weighs on him and he snaps.

You wouldn't see Peter going after Brock trying to kill him, because even under the black suit he would never go that far. I would change scenes of that to Harry. Spidey beats the crap out of Harry and then nearly kills him, (and I'm talking more then the pumpkin bomb throw, I'm thinking something like, after the big fight, Harry is pretty much lying there, helpless, and Pete is standing over him with one of his own goblin swords seriously considering ending him) and then he realizes how far the suit is pushing him.

It wouldn't be appropriate to see Pete get to that level of anger with Brock, but he would do lots of very mean and ******* things that finally cause Brock to snap.

if I were rewriting the movie I would have all of peter's anger directed at harry, brock would be an irritant who is foiled at every turn by peter.
then I would take it one of two way

a) sony tells me its okay to kill MJ
I would have harry kill her and then have spidey acciedently kill harry in return

b) sony tells me I can't kill MJ
I would have peter go on the rampage (similar to superman 3 with supes in the dark suit) and the twist would be harry stepping in to save the city, he pays with his life

both intenses would result in peter going to the bell tower and losing the suit to EBJ, then in the next movie (venom wouldn't appear in my SM3) venom would be motivated by all the crap things peter did to him in SM3.
so you completely side step the need for peter to be angry at EBJ.

 

[Infinity9999x]

if I were rewriting the movie I would have all of peter's anger directed at harry, brock would be an irritant who is foiled at every turn by peter.
then I would take it one of two way

a) sony tells me its okay to kill MJ
I would have harry kill her and then have spidey acciedently kill harry in return

b) sony tells me I can't kill MJ
I would have peter go on the rampage (similar to superman 3 with supes in the dark suit) and the twist would be harry stepping in to save the city, he pays with his life

both intenses would result in peter going to the bell tower and losing the suit to EBJ, then in the next movie (venom wouldn't appear in my SM3) venom would be motivated by all the crap things peter did to him in SM3.
so you completely side step the need for peter to be angry at EBJ.

I completely agree in the above assessment of Brock. Brock is an irritant to Peter. But since he's in the Black suit, instead of ignoring him like he normally would, he lashes out at him a bit.

And I would have definitely saved Venom for a fourth movie had that been possible. However, my script idea is set up for the same situation Raimi was in. Raimi couldn't save Venom for the next movie. He was forced to include him in one movie by the suits. We all know that doing Venom in one movie doesn't really do the character justice, but Raimi didn't have that option.

That's why I have the write up I've described. I would have loved to take that treatment and expand upon it through two movies (which I think you need to do to be able to make the black suit/venom saga really effective) but Raimi didn't have that option.

I don't know if Pete going on a rampage would be the best idea, simply because I can't see him ever getting to the point where he randomly destroys objects that could endanger innocent lives. Getting to the point where he nearly kills Harry would be enough to snap him out of it I believe. Similar to the TAS where he nearly kills Rhino and Shocker and realizes how far he's been pushed by the suit.

 

[weezerspider]

I don't see how TDK is 'pushing the envelope'. matrix pushed the envelope TDK did nothing you haven't already seen albeit in difference genre. the train fight pushed the envelope with regards to superhuman's fighting.

TDK was the first Comic Book movie to be nominated , and win, a major Academy Award( Best Supporting Actor).

TDK wasn't afraid to make the hero lose. That has yet happened in a comic genre film.

TDK wasn't written as a superhero film. It was written as a crime drama that happened to involve a superhero. That has yet to happen in the comic film genre.

TDK had heavy political undertones and real life issues. Yet to see that in a comic book film since.

Spiderman 2 also "pushed the envelope". Spiderman 2 wasn't a superhero movie. It was written as a coming of age story that happened to be about a superhero. That there is its greatest strengthen, IMO. The train scene is easily the best comic fight scene. Spiderman 2 was the first Comic Book movie to get any type of Academy Award.

I agree Spiderman 2 pushed the envelope. I have a deep love for Spiderman 2 that is almost as much as my love for TDK, but to say TDK didn't "push the envelope" is a little naive.

 

[Infinity9999x]

TDK was the first Comic Book movie to be nominated , and win, a major Academy Award( Best Supporting Actor).

TDK wasn't afraid to make the hero lose. That has yet happened in a comic genre film.

I agree with all your other points, but actually Batman Returns was one of the first comic movies to have the hero "lose," in a sense. It was similar to TDK. Yeah, he stopped the evil villain, but he still lost the woman he loved.

 

[spider-neil]

TDK was the first Comic Book movie to be nominated , and win, a major Academy Award( Best Supporting Actor).

you could argue it was the actor rather than the movie pushing the envolope

TDK wasn't afraid to make the hero lose. That has yet happened in a comic genre film.

its been done before just not to a superhero (ESB) also technically batman didn't 'lose' as the joker was captured, the hostages freed and two face subdued/killed.

TDK wasn't written as a superhero film. It was written as a crime drama that happened to involve a superhero. That has yet to happen in the comic film genre.

that's not pushing the envolope that is making a stylistic choice.

TDK had heavy political undertones and real life issues. Yet to see that in a comic book film since.

the director's cut of daredevil

 

[weezerspider]

you could argue it was the actor rather than the movie pushing the envolope

TDK won what, 3 awards? Thats a first. Also The writing of the Joker character was just as important to Heath's success as The Joker as his actual acting.

its been done before just not to a superhero (ESB) also technically batman didn't 'lose' as the joker was captured, the hostages freed and two face subdued/killed.

Batman lost. He's on the run. Gotham's hope, Harvey Dent died. Gotham's hope is dead. How is that winning?

that's not pushing the envolope that is making a stylistic choice.

You can make that argument ^ for anything. I could say the exact same thing about the train scene in sm2 if I wanted too, but I don't because 1. thats a dumb excuse and 2. thats a great scene.

the director's cut of daredevil

I don't recall it building its own war against terrorists...maybe it was too soon after 9/11?

 

[Dark Knight]

Going for the kiddie demo-graphic is a silent killer to the creativity and quality of any comic book film. This should be branded on the face of every comic book director, so that when he looks in the mirror, he's reminded of what NOT to do.

Yep....they think they can tap into the Twilight/Glee/High School Musical tweeny crowd with this new Spidey film....and that is a BIG mistake IMO.

 

[weezerspider]

I agree with all your other points, but actually Batman Returns was one of the first comic movies to have the hero "lose," in a sense. It was similar to TDK. Yeah, he stopped the evil villain, but he still lost the woman he loved.

Can I be honest with you? I have never finished Batman Returns

so thats my bad. You can take that point away then.

 

[chaseter]

Sony/Marvel hiring the hack Sargent again proves they have some issues over there....

I had this avatar first

 

[mre]

TDK was the first Comic Book movie to be nominated , and win, a major Academy Award( Best Supporting Actor).

Spiderman 2 was the first Comic Book movie to get any type of Academy Award.

One of these statements has to be false. They both can't be the first comic book movie to get an Academy Award.

 

[weezerspider]

One of these statements has to be false. They both can't be the first comic book movie to get an Academy Award.

Please re-read. I said TDK was the first to get a "MAJOR" Academy Award.

 

[echostation]

what is all this nonsensical talk of Matrix and the Abyss... and dark knight, focus on the script rewriting process

does anyone know who the main villains are in this Vanderbilt based script? Someone mentioned that there are reviews out there of the script but I've searched and haven't come across anything... I wonder who the main villains are... I hope the rumor of a teenage High Schooled Kraven as a russian foreign exchange student aren't true.