The Daily Planet - Superman News and Speculation Thread (🚨TAG SPOILERS🚨)

[GreenKToo]

I’ve been around this stuff for a long time too. There was a ton of negativity toward The Dark Knight for a time, people treated its tweaks to Joker like ****ing heresy. What really impressive, interesting franchise movie wasn’t kinda divisive? It remains divisive but the whole idea of Phillip’s Joker was an internet-wide laughing stock.

The Snyder movies were also closer to straight negative with a devoted minority than ‘divided’. You’re underestimating the incredibly good publicity this is going to get in the mainstream as well, especially if they nail the right director and star.

I hope you are right. I'd love to see this be a hit and scare a billion, or even pass it, at the b.o.

Like I said, I'm open to this and will see where it leads.
If I don't like the direction it takes, I will bow out without crying and moaning about it, and leave it to those who do like it.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I hope you are right. I'd love to see this be a hit and scare a billion, or even pass it, at the b.o.

...and hopefully if it doesn't clear a billion they don't panic, declare it a failure and stick Batman and Wonder Woman in the sequel this time!

 

[GreenKToo]

...and hopefully if it doesn't clear a billion they don't panic, declare it a failure and stick Batman and Wonder Woman in the sequel this time!

A reboot, imho, should be considered a success if it can get close to 550/600 mill, has rave reviews, and leaves the fans and public wanting more.

 

[Calvin Ellis]

As I said before many times I think they should use Calvin Ellis if they want to start fresh. Or use Val-Zod if you want to continue off of Snyder's work where Val could be the one from the open pod and during the Knightmare time line use him like how he was used during the Earth-2 storyline.

 

[writer0327]

A reboot, imho, should be considered a success if it can get close to 550/600 mill, has rave reviews, and leaves the fans and public wanting more.

Kinda like Man of Steel.

 

[LifesEnd]

Kinda like Man of Steel.

that had rave reviews?News to me. In fairness it had the signs of the future shiftiness from the snyder era.WB were dumb to entrust him with so many movies.Dumb to have writers that also dug his vision too

 

[Spider-Aziz]

A reboot, imho, should be considered a success if it can get close to 550/600 mill, has rave reviews, and leaves the fans and public wanting more.

Reasonable.

that had rave reviews?News to me. In fairness it had the signs of the future shiftiness from the snyder era.WB were dumb to entrust him with so many movies.Dumb to have writers that also dug his vision too

It did earn $600 million at the box office, so it got one of three. And I guess it could be argued that it encouraged people to want more, to a certain degree.

On the flip side we got Batman Begins which earned less than Superman Returns, but surprised people with its rave reviews and how much it pushed people to want more.

 

[GreenKToo]

SR had rave reviews, did pretty good at the b.o. for 06, but it left the fans and public meh over it.
A sequel never caught any serious traction.
BB was in the same boat, except fans were screaming for more and more they/we got.

 

[flickchick85]

SR did not get rave reviews. It got solid reviews. BB got better reviews and audience scores.

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

Favreau is just as nostalgic as Abrams, dude, the only writer on Mando who strikes me as having much of a unique voice is Famuyiwa. There's nothing singular about his vision. The Mandalorian is every bit as much empty calorie fan service as TFA but without any of the interesting subtext about generational failure/conflict Kasdan's screenplay for TFA had. It's not as similar in terms of plot obviously but the second season in particular is pure, pure pandering. I like Mandalorian, but I don't need anything else like it - content like Mando should be a fun treat, not the norm. The only thing really special about it is the unique, touching relationship between Mando (who isn't any more complex or unique a character than Rey) and Grogu but apart from that it's... pretty shallow.

Let's put the Star Wars stuff to bed though, the last thing the Internet needs is more Star Wars debates.

And, no, I'm quite confident saying Coates is a better writer than most of of the relatively mediocre screenwriters who get superhero gigs. His comics work is excellent and he's a beautiful novelist and memoirist. Doesn't always translate to screen, Michael Chabon is transparently a better writer than most yet his screenwriting is inconsistent, but it's certainly encouraging.

we shouldn't put the star wars stuff to bed, because if star wars is so easy to get and understand how did JJ mess it up? because that's concerning to me, if somebody can't "get" star wars, how am i supposed to expect them to "get" superman? because we all know of JJ's Flyby ideas, and that was as anti-superman as synder's vision was/is. why are we supposed to accept him as this franchise savior, when all i've seen is him crash 2 different franchises

as for coates, his comic work is not excellent at all. it's middle of the road. that is worrisome because it's in the medium. he's got a way with words but it's his idea and POV that should be worrisome. i'd much rather compare somebody already in the realm of comics vs somebody who is a "regular" writer making the jump to full movie screenplays. if a guy like garth ennis who absolutely hates "capes" can write one of the best takes on superman in a single issue by removing his own feelings on the material and channel the character, then that's good writing. i don't think coates is capable of writing it from anything but his own pov.

superman, original OG, golden age, whatever you want to call it, superman, at his core, is the ultimate immigrant story. he's a blue-collar farm boy who goes to the big city and does tremendous things. i don't think coates is capable of illustrating that for ANY superman, black OR white, that's the problem. just like snyder's take on superman comes from his own need/want/desire? to try and prove superman's "place" in the modern world. they both aren't necessary, there is nothing wrong with the concept of superman, the only thing wrong is the multiple failed attempts by WB to execute it, perhaps because they themselves have too many cooks in the kitchen or more than likely just don't "get" superman themselves

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

Is Mandalorian that of a singular vision? Lol idk

How is hiring Coates them stuck in their old ways though? Why are you assuming his Superman will be brooding the whole time? & couldn’t there be an arc if he started that way, like most stories? And plenty would say Coates is a singular voice; without a doubt. He’s not a screenwriter, no, but his voice goes beyond that. We’ll have to see how he does. He may even tap a co-writer who has experience.

it absolutely was, favreau wrote the series on spec, was the showrunner and wrote every episode except for 4, 2 of which were backdoor pilot/setups for the rest of the universe. i would definitely qualify that as a single vision

because hiring somebody like coates screams "we need to do a superman movie but THIS TIME with XYZ." how about just getting a superman movie right first? tapping coates is gimmick/hook here. it might reel people in early, but i believe it'll be more lip service than substance based on his work

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

and idk where this idea that joker was going to be bad? at worst everybody knew it'd be a great performance from phoenix, because that's what he does

seems like revisionist history to me

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

that had rave reviews?News to me. In fairness it had the signs of the future shiftiness from the snyder era.WB were dumb to entrust him with so many movies.Dumb to have writers that also dug his vision too

snyder wasn't their first choice, and he himself was hesitant, especially with the time constraint, but he still jumped in to do it. all parties involved were wrong

 

[Boy Scout]

and idk where this idea that joker was going to be bad? at worst everybody knew it'd be a great performance from phoenix, because that's what he does

seems like revisionist history to me

Not true. Plenty of people here either thought it would be bad or didn't think it needed to be made in the first place. You can check the Joker thread if you want proof.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

and idk where this idea that joker was going to be bad? at worst everybody knew it'd be a great performance from phoenix, because that's what he does

seems like revisionist history to me

Not remotely. Joker was relentlessly mocked and ridiculed outside of comic book movie circles from the moment it was announced in large part due to Todd Phillips. In these circles it was more mixed, but there was an enormity of negativity toward it. Doesn’t mean there weren’t plenty of people excited, but that movie got a mountain of **** from day one.

 

[emielaen]

it absolutely was, favreau wrote the series on spec, was the showrunner and wrote every episode except for 4, 2 of which were backdoor pilot/setups for the rest of the universe. i would definitely qualify that as a single vision

because hiring somebody like coates screams "we need to do a superman movie but THIS TIME with XYZ." how about just getting a superman movie right first? tapping coates is gimmick/hook here. it might reel people in early, but i believe it'll be more lip service than substance based on his work

I guess so. We may just have different ideas of what that is.

& they can make a good Superman movie even while attempting to go bolder than a standard, fun time. Neither negates the other anyway. & the “right” Superman movie can mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people. That doesn’t really mean anything. How you feel about his work is another story. I’ve enjoyed what I read. Need to read some more actually.

 

[jetage]

Not a fan of Star Wars so I can't judge anything JJ has done there, but as a Star Trek fan, he did totally and completely ruin the franchise. While it is true the franchise was already in deep decline in the movies, his movies were not embraced by most, if not all Trek fans. The look, and the casting were decent, but he never really understood the franchise, the tone, or the philosophy of what Roddenberry wanted to accomplish with the series.

Not a good start, we shall see.

 

[Vaibow]

As I said before many times I think they should use Calvin Ellis if they want to start fresh. Or use Val-Zod if you want to continue off of Snyder's work where Val could be the one from the open pod and during the Knightmare time line use him like how he was used during the Earth-2 storyline.

I said the same thing two days ago in another thread... imagine if that's the teaser at the end of the Snyder Cut...would be pretty epic.

What I also find interesting, is Val doesn't have to belong to Metropolis, he escaped the pod, he could have went anywhere... he wasn't raised as one of them, so naturally he will fear them, he won't have powers straight away... how does he fit in, where would he fit in? Would society welcome him as just a man... what does a homeless black man do, with no credentials, paper work... say in America, Europe... even Africa... like such amazing potential...

Martian Manhunter steps in for sure and shields him after maybe he has a run in with the military - maybe a jet or something... or perhaps when Zod contacted earth, Val took ti upon himself to find someone to offer help... and that's where he found Swanick.

 

[AverageMan]

So now that ZSJL is out and seems to be generally pretty well conceived WB have already played the role of Major Buzzkill by saying there is no more planned Snyder-verse content.

When do you think we'll start seeing more info drip through for this project? Once the script is done?

 

[Vaibow]

I skimmed through the Snyder's JL last night - I'm not sure how much of the theatre cut I remember, or want too, but what I saw last night, I loved WW, the terrorist scene was great, I actually liked AM's portrayal so much and felt he had the best treatment.. Cyborg was very cool, loved the cash scene with the single mum... these characters got lost in it all, also I loved Bruce, how he acted, behaved... was very good... totally the opposite of BvS. Made me think that BvS in hindsight was such a pointless misstep.
Barry, was the same same for me, I felt at times it felt a bit forced... maybe that's Ezra's fault... but over all I wasn't put off and want see more.
Superman, we got more classic superman, but there was no development there for me, he was the plot device.

I loved the final battle... that was bad ass.

For me, what I would have done, with all the footage and perhaps with reshoots, as they did do... (Batfleck was noticeably slimmer, good for him tho...) is I would have made mini episodes on each character... then one episode of the battle.. see it from each hero's perspective.. a self contained story arc, so you can focus on them... some episodes would have repeated key scenes but that's ok as it would have made sense why...

For me, Snyder is a fantastic ideas man, but is a unique director that imo just doesn't mesh well with general audiences esp those that are family orientated.

I don't want directors moving forward to be held hostage by this movie... I mean, has it been a movie to retcon the verse? for us die hards maybe...

I feel moving forward, flashpoint, will reset a lot... in the sense that it gives directors a clean slate and they can just say - flashpoint.

WW, AM and Shazam! can do what they like...

it's only really Batman and Superman moving forward that need the most attention..

If they retcon superman, to make it lighter, more natural humour, give Cavill some more meat I feel people won't even remember what came before it... I hate to use it as an example, but Thor:ragnorak changed the tone and it was well received and no one was like 'hang on, he's changed a lot why???'

Give us a superman movie where he and Lois have fun keeping his identity a secret, give us clark, Lois and DP crew as the heart of the movie. Give us sporadic amazing feats where superman comes to the rescue. Give us a final third where clark has to be the hero, in the sense it's a real world event where he steps up and becomes a super man..

Batman, it all depends what flashpoint does... but I would stop team up movies, focus on each other, people will suspend belief for this.

 

[Yellow Cyclone]

So now that ZSJL is out and seems to be generally pretty well conceived WB have already played the role of Major Buzzkill by saying there is no more planned Snyder-verse content.

When do you think we'll start seeing more info drip through for this project? Once the script is done?

i think that's WB just covering their bases because they already have a lot in the pipeline. they have their own numbers on how many streamed JL, so they can always go back whenever they want

i don't think it'll happen personally, but i don't think the door is shut on it either

 

[Deck Rickard]

SR did not get rave reviews. It got solid reviews. BB got better reviews and audience scores.

I roll my eyes when people say “Donner nostalgia” is the only reason why some fans and critics didn’t like MOS, BvS and ZSJL. But I do think some critics and fans were blinded a bit by Donner nostalgia when it came to SR. That movie was just a cover band version of Superman ‘78, but it proved that all it took to win over some critics was playing the classic theme over and over and casting a Christopher Reeve mannequin. Superman comes off as bland and silent in that film as he did in ZSJL and BvS, and Kate Bosworth is probably the least likable Lois of all time. Spacey (aside from being a huge creep and I’ve heard stories that him and Singer were particularly gross toward Routh on set) was phoning it in and even admitted in an interview to not researching the character because “the script was so good.” Such a letdown.

Superman has so much potential on the big screen. I don’t know why they keep handing him over to people who either make him a non character or turn him into a blunt instrument (or both).

 

[Captain Tired]

I just want to see Superman, as a mythos, finally be faithfully translated to the big screen, and not be technologically limited in the way that Reeve's series ultimately was.

I want to see him razzling outrageous villains like Mr. Mxyzptlk, Parasite and Brainiac. And not in a lame, borderline CW way where their costumes are all drab and dark and shying away from the colourfulness of the comics.

I don't want to see Superman used as a vehicle to shoehorn in Batman or any other DC heroes, either. Sometimes I think that's all Snyder regarded MOS as: a stepping stone to Batman and other heroes he was more interested in.

 

[Deck Rickard]

I just want to see Superman, as a mythos, finally be faithfully translated to the big screen, and not be technologically limited in the way that Reeve's series ultimately was.

I want to see him razzling outrageous villains like Mr. Mxyzptlk, Parasite and Brainiac. And not in a lame, borderline CW way where their costumes are all drab and dark and shying away from the colourfulness of the comics.

I don't want to see Superman used as a vehicle to shoehorn in Batman or any other DC heroes, either. Sometimes I think that's all Snyder regarded MOS as: a stepping stone to Batman and other heroes he was more interested in.

Yep. I initially thought that Snyder had an intention of continuing Clark’s story in a MOS trilogy but then when it underperformed a bit, WB pushed the Batman panic button. But looking back on it now, especially after seeing how he handled Superman in BvS and JL, it made me realize that Snyder never cared about the character and was much more interested in Batman and his angsty version of Aquaman. I agree that he just used MOS as a stepping stone to get ahold of characters that actually mattered to him (i.e., anyone who spends the whole movie scowling and bitterly throwing shade at everyone around them).

 

[Vlyse]

I really like the concept of Superman birthing the modern DC era and the Justice League but unfortunately it didn't come out right - not even in the fabled Snyder Cut.

It all came at the expense of doing anything meaningful with Superman himself.