The Dark Knight Rises The Dark Knight Sequel Info Hunters

[Tacit Ronin]

If Nolan does refer to past movies, it will be TDK. Not Begins. Begins is completely stand alone. Hell even the titles evoke that.

 

[Seen]

No it won't. Did the TDK refer to Begins AT ALL? Other than a two second Scarecrow cameo?

In all fairness, Nolan did re-use Rachel Dawes from Batman Begins.

Not this trilogy. What did TDK bring back from Begins?

We saw many of the same themes just expanded upon, including the theme of escalation that Batman and Gordon talked about in Begins (also, where the Joker card strongly hinted at the Joker in the next film, and of course, we saw him in The Dark Knight). Falcone was referenced in TDK and it very much felt like a continuation from Batman Begins, whilst still feeling very much like a standalone story.

I'm still iffy on whether or not Nolan would use Talia (since if she was used, it would make more sense to see Ra's return as well for the last act of the story, and we all know Nolan likes open-ended ideas). However, in order for The Dark Knight Rises to feel like the caper to a trilogy, it does need to reference some pivotal story elements from the first two films, especially the last film (for example, Batman on the run will probably be a very important story element in TDKR, which will be carried over from TDK).

So in that sense I feel like these films will definitely feel standalone but they also must on some thematic level reference each other in order to feel like they belong in the same overarching story thread.

 

[SrsBsns]

No.

No it won't. Did the TDK refer to Begins AT ALL? Other than a two second Scarecrow cameo?

Not this trilogy. What did TDK bring back from Begins?

Hell, there was no mention of Bruce's parents, a big emotional thread in Begins.

Nolan treats these films as stand alone. You could watch and enjoy TDK without watching a second of Batman Begins.

And you're getting all your information about this movie from where?...

 

[redhawk23]

^
These are YOUR opinions,dear...
Maybe Nolan doesn´t share the same opinion as you.
He knows what is the better for the movie.

that is true, but Nolan has said a number of times, that the biggest reason that he was hesitant to come back after TDK (speaking in lat 08) was that he would start the movie, get halfway through it and realize the whole thing was redundant. He has spoken to this on a number of occasions. His attitudes in this respect point directly away from "bringing back something from the first" Talia would be his Second Death Star.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

In all fairness, Nolan did re-use Rachel Dawes from Batman Begins.

Nolan also reused Gordon, FOX and Batman OMG!!!

Not the same as bringing the daughter of a dead villain from the first one.

 

[baleheadbrasil]

I think one of the big streanghts of TDK was that it worked so well as it's own movie, in fact I know a lot of people who loved TDK that to this day have never seen Batman Begins. For this reason I don't think this movie needs to "Come Full Circle" or at least not iny Ras related respect. I'm all for tying up some themes or ideas perhaps, but I don't think that needs an al Ghul. This is Bruce's story after all, not Ras's.

Nolan already said he does not want "blow up the balloon and expanding the story"...
This quote says everything,dear...
TDKR will bring the full circle!
It´s the end of the trilogy.

 

[Seen]

Nolan also reused Gordon, FOX and Batman OMG!!!

Not the same as bringing the daughter of a dead villain from the first one.

Ra's body was never found. He was never confirmed as dead. For all we know, he could have slipped away and survived that train crash. Who knows.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Seems to me like he is treating Batman Begins as a stand alone prequel and TDK and TDKR as one story. Smart way to avoid the three sequel curse. But if that's true expect no ties to BB.

Ra's body was never found. He was never confirmed as dead. For all we know, he could have slipped away and survived that train crash. Who knows.

Not the point I was making. Dead as in narrativley.

 

[Gianakin_]

Well, this trilogy will break that rule I guess?

We don't know that. Personally I get this rule and I like it, but harkening back to BB doesn't necessarily mean in terms of Al Ghul's return. The Batcave alone is enough to comply to that rule. If they also mention the parents again, even more so. And if they focus back to Bale in terms of screentime, this also complies to the rule (but in a more technical term).

 

[redhawk23]

and this is why none of us are allowed anywhere near a director's chair.

 

[Gianakin_]

If Nolan does refer to past movies, it will be TDK. Not Begins. Begins is completely stand alone. Hell even the titles evoke that.

The title means nothing. He can mention anything he wants if it suits him.

 

[redhawk23]

We don't know that. Personally I get this rule and I like it, but harkening back to BB doesn't necessarily mean in terms of Al Ghul's return. The Batcave alone is enough to comply to that rule. If they also mention the parents again, even more so. And if they focus back to Bale in terms of screentime, this also complies to the rule (but in a more technical term).

Exactly, there are so so so many ways of "bringing it full circle" other than redundant villians.

 

[Seen]

Seems to me like he is treating Batman Begins as a stand alone prequel and TDK and TDKR as one story. Smart way to avoid the three sequel curse. But if that's true expect no ties to BB.

I don't think so. Nolan said that he views The Dark Knight Rises as the culmination of a story that started with Batman Begins, and he keeps on saying that this film will have a sense of closure and finality, and I'm not quite sure he views Batman Begins as this franchise's version of The Hobbit.

In any case, The Dark Knight Rises is the third installment in the franchise so even if Nolan had that mentality (which I doubt he does) the notion of avoiding the fact that this is the third film in a series is just obtuse. I think Nolan is very much aware that this is the third film, and while it might not overtly reference Batman Begins, I'm sure Nolan will realize that film's importance in the overarching story sense of things.

In any event, Nolan always mentioned that his films are essentially depicting the early years of Batman, and by the end of his series, Batman will have come full circle.

 

[Seen]

and this is why none of us are allowed anywhere near a director's chair.

No truer words have been spoken.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

he Batcave alone is enough to comply to that rule.

The inclusion of the batcave doesn't harken back to Begins. It harkens back to Batman's canon. By your logic TDK harkened back to Begins cause he used the Tumbler.

And if they focus back to Bale in terms of screentime, this also complies to the rule (but in a more technical term).

What does Bale's screentime have to do with Begins?

 

[baleheadbrasil]

Talia is a very underestimated character...that´s why I like her !
I found this:

 

[Seen]

Not the point I was making. Dead as in narrativley.

Until we know Nolan's plans for The Dark Knight Rises, arguing the narrative decision process seems kind of pointless.

 

[SrsBsns]

Seems to me like he is treating Batman Begins as a stand alone prequel and TDK and TDKR as one story. Smart way to avoid the three sequel curse. But if that's true expect no ties to BB.




Not the point I was making. Dead as in narrativley.

LOL please explain your logic. Please.

 

[Seen]

Talia is a very underrating character...that´s why I like her !
I found this:

Hey, that's me.

 

[GarzaUK]

The theme of the last two movies is basically esculation, the rise of the freaks. Would be a bit weird if the bunch of ninjas come back into the picture.

Three things this film needs to bring trilogy full arc.

~ the demise of the mob
~ the dominance of the freaks
~ the redemption of batman

 

[Seen]

The theme of the last two movies is basically esculation, the rise of the freaks. Would be a bit weird if the bunch of ninjas come back into the picture.

Three things this film needs to bring trilogy full arc.

~ the demise of the mob
~ the dominance of the freaks
~ the redemption of batman

Ninjas are plentiful freaky, my friend.

 

[Gianakin_]

The inclusion of the batcave doesn't harken back to Begins. It harkens back to Batman's canon. By your logic TDK harkened back to Begins cause he used the Tumbler.

Think SM3. The Uncle Ben killer is part of the SM canon. He was absent from SM2 but appeared in SM3 again to tie the trilogy together.

What does Bale's screentime have to do with Begins?

It was lessened in TDK. Not the best of examples for the trilogy rule, but hey.

 

[baleheadbrasil]

A secret society of 2000 years of existence like the League of Shadows never would disappear only because their leader was killed.
Never!
Just saying.

 

[Gianakin_]

A secret society of 2000 years of existence like the League of Shadows never would disappear only because their leader was killed.
Never!
Just saying.

It's true.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Think SM3. The Uncle Ben killer is part of the SM canon. He was absent from SM2 but appeared in SM3 again to tie the trilogy together.

uncle Ben and the sandy nature of his killer =/= The frickin' Batcave. The Batcave was present in the 60's Batman and Burton's Batman.