The Flash The Flash General Discussion and Speculation Thread - Part 8

[Syncos]

So... Is Jesse L. Martin going to be killed off as Joe West only the come back as Max Mercury?

Only after a third version of Harrison Wells turns up as Johnny Quick, considering Jesse Quick is his daughter.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Only after a third version of Harrison Wells turns up as Johnny Quick, considering Jesse Quick is his daughter.

You joke but with this show's track record...

 

[Lencho01]

CW Fall Premiere Dates Announced For The Flash, Arrow, Supergirl, And More

 

[TheRedWraith]

We've seen the 90s character references on Earth-1, which is definitely its own thing. Likewise, while Shipp is playing a Flash, its Jay Garrick, not Barry Allen, so his Earth isn't the 90s one either. Thus, neither set of data actually gives any evidence for an "Earth-90s Flash". However, they are a consistent array of relevant easter eggs, and the way the setting is done so far certainly makes such an Earth *possible*. Thus: no evidence as such, but high likelihood. The likelihood just relies on meta-hints involving creator intent.

You know what is so great and ingenious how they handled Jay Garrick that earth 3 with Jay Garrick was named such prorably because his mother got pregnant but never married and she named him Jay while in earth 1and presumably 2 as well the dad persuaded for Henry while I the 90's show Barry/Jay/Henry would have been born later and his older brother Jay Allen would have been given the Jay name that the mother liked and instead of settling on Henry in the 90's verse they settle on Barry.

 

[CLARKY]

^ They can't use Boomerang, I'm fairly certain

Why not ?

 

[Mike Murdock]

He's in the movie, iirc.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Supergirl is getting use of Superman though. There may be changes happening on that front.

 

[SpideyVille]

Supergirl is getting use of Superman though. There may be changes happening on that front.

Superman was already established on that show though. He was already a major character even though he hadn't been seen.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Superman was already established on that show though. He was already a major character even though he hadn't been seen.

And... Boomerang had already appeared in the Berlantiverse with an actor cast. Just saying, if they have loosened up the reigns with Superman, well, that could indicate a change for the lesser characters like Boomerang or Deadshot ect.

 

[SpideyVille]

And... Boomerang had already appeared in the Berlantiverse with an actor cast. Just saying, if they have loosened up the reigns with Superman, well, that could indicate a change for the lesser characters like Boomerang or Deadshot ect.

In comparison, Boomerang is a very irrelevant character compared to Superman. The Flash can easily get by without ever referencing him again. Their main focus is establishing the film version as the definitive one.

The biggest reason Superman was cast is because he was already a character on Supergirl, they just didn't show him. But it was getting to the point where it was hurting the show by the half-ass way they were using him. If anything, they may introduce him in one episode and something happens where he disappears and Kara has to save him by season's end. It's not like he's a series regular all of a sudden.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

I agree that compared to Superman that Boomer is a lesser character... Which again is why actually having him portrayed by an actor now on Supergirl could portend a shift especially with LESSER characters like Boomer. If they can live with two live action portrayals of Superman on TV and in movies then why not two versions of Boomer? Notice, COULD, I'm not saying this is what is, or has to be. Just that it's not insane to suggest that loosening up with Superman of all characters might mean something for the wider array of characters.

 

[Lantern Venom]

Just that it's not insane to suggest that loosening up with Superman of all characters might mean something for the wider array of characters.

Casting another Superman does confirm what I've suspected all along about WB: they're full of Bantha poodoo when it comes to Green Lantern. Supposedly, Green Lantern is "too big" for Flash, but somehow Superman isn't too big for Supergirl? That's ludicrous reasoning and they know it. The cold, hard truth is that they're scared.

 

[Astro13Zombie]

Casting another Superman does confirm what I've suspected all along about WB: they're full of Bantha poodoo when it comes to Green Lantern. Supposedly, Green Lantern is "too big" for Flash, but somehow Superman isn't too big for Supergirl? That's ludicrous reasoning and they know it. The cold, hard truth is that they're scared.

We don't even know how much supes will appear in the show.

 

[TheRedWraith]

We don't even know how much supes will appear in the show.

I personally think they are going to do a one-and-done bring him in for the two episodes and kill him so they can then do the multiple succesors/superman storyline with Supergirl serving to become the world's preeminent hero and step into Supes's shoes.

 

[Astro13Zombie]

I personally think they are going to do a one-and-done bring him in for the two episodes and kill him so they can then do the multiple succesors/superman storyline with Supergirl serving to become the world's preeminent hero and step into Supes's shoes.

Maybe

I'm thinking that we'll be seeing him about as much as we saw him in season 1.
He'll just be....not blurry this time.heh
And some lines too obviously.
Can't imagine it being much more than that.

 

[SpideyVille]

You also have to remember that Supergirl is part of Superman's story. To remove him altogether wouldn't make any sense because she's directly tied to him.

Boomerang and even Slade, at this point, have no ties and their arcs have been concluded. They will only be necessary if the plot calls for them, but right now, it doesn't.

 

[metaphysician]

Casting another Superman does confirm what I've suspected all along about WB: they're full of Bantha poodoo when it comes to Green Lantern. Supposedly, Green Lantern is "too big" for Flash, but somehow Superman isn't too big for Supergirl? That's ludicrous reasoning and they know it. The cold, hard truth is that they're scared.

Eh. . . I'll be fair, and say they aren't really the same thing. Putting Superman on Supergirl is no additional SFX burden, because he uses the exact same effects as Supergirl and the various Kryptonians. Green Lantern, by contrast? Is kind of a mess of SFX demands, since depending on exactly how he is used, you need:

1. Decent looking flight
2. Ring constructs that don't look terrible ( not, "terrible" != "unrealistic" )
3. Space and otherworldly locales
4. Aliens

Using a Green Lantern in any but the most passing and trivial role would be a huge headache.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

Grant Gustin revealed the name of the first episode of season 3, and it should surprise nobody.

Spoiler

Flashpoint

 

[BMCAABY]

Superman was already established on that show though. He was already a major character even though he hadn't been seen.

Yea but we won't be seeing him at all. Hopefully never in that garbage of a show. But that's not going to happen because they need to boost the ratings, so they will put him in like 2 episodes.

 

[Syncos]

And... Boomerang had already appeared in the Berlantiverse with an actor cast. Just saying, if they have loosened up the reigns with Superman, well, that could indicate a change for the lesser characters like Boomerang or Deadshot ect.

I hope you're right, and this is my assumption too.

Hopefully Geoff Johns is rationalizing things to the WB now that he's in control of their Cinematic Universe.

That being said, Flarrowverse went through the trouble of literally killing off all members of the Suicide Squad because of the movie. So chances of seeing boomer again are slim.

However, I'd argue that Boomerang is more important to flash than any of the Suicide Squad is to Green Arrow. They were pretty much just crammed into that show to begin with. At least Boomer is one of Flash's primary rogues.

 

[metaphysician]

Eh, they killed Amanda Waller stone cold no-ambiguity dead ( and good riddance, she deserved it ), but they killed Deadshot in a classic "never found the body" manner. Granted, I'm not at all sure what that *means*. It could have just been random whim of the writers at the different times.

 

[Lantern Venom]

Eh. . . I'll be fair, and say they aren't really the same thing. Putting Superman on Supergirl is no additional SFX burden, because he uses the exact same effects as Supergirl and the various Kryptonians. Green Lantern, by contrast? Is kind of a mess of SFX demands, since depending on exactly how he is used, you need:

1. Decent looking flight
2. Ring constructs that don't look terrible ( not, "terrible" != "unrealistic" )
3. Space and otherworldly locales
4. Aliens

Using a Green Lantern in any but the most passing and trivial role would be a huge headache.

Compared to the likes of King Shark and Grodd, not to mention the speed force effects, GL should be comparatively easy. We've also seen segments on Supergirl that are set on Krypton and Mars, with numerous aliens. Flash's finale included an light effects-heavy villain flown off by two CGI villains. Thus, I don't buy the "too complicated" argument for any character after what we've seen on these shows.

 

[Nathan]

The only thing I would worry about, is if they'd be able to give Green Lantern a decent costume. But effects wise, after everything we've seen them do, he'd be a piece of cake.

 

[DrCosmic]

Casting another Superman does confirm what I've suspected all along about WB: they're full of Bantha poodoo when it comes to Green Lantern. Supposedly, Green Lantern is "too big" for Flash, but somehow Superman isn't too big for Supergirl? That's ludicrous reasoning and they know it. The cold, hard truth is that they're scared.

The WB doesn't consider Flash and Supergirl equal. So Superman and Green Lantern are too big for Flash, but neither are too big for Supergirl. Supergirl is too big for Flash too. She hasn't shown up there, and they aren't even allowed to mention that whole event. The closest they were allowed to get was Barry confused about how long he was gone for a second.

The cold hard truth is, they like Supergirl and don't like Flash. The Flarrow actors know this, and have expressed as much. Supergirl doesn't have that problem, even after she moves to the CW, she's considered greater and more important. Maybe it's just ratings, maybe it's because the Superman mythos hold a greater place in the hearts of old executive types, maybe it's because Supergirl is, critically speaking, a better show. Maybe they're just Ally McBeal fans. Not sure. Either way... Supergirl and Flash are not on the same level in the eyes of the people making decisions.

I agree that compared to Superman that Boomer is a lesser character... Which again is why actually having him portrayed by an actor now on Supergirl could portend a shift especially with LESSER characters like Boomer. If they can live with two live action portrayals of Superman on TV and in movies then why not two versions of Boomer? Notice, COULD, I'm not saying this is what is, or has to be. Just that it's not insane to suggest that loosening up with Superman of all characters might mean something for the wider array of characters.

There's no shift bro. They don't care. The actors know they don't care. Superman gets to be on Supergirl because Supergirl was made with a special deal, and even then, they couldn't show his face. They aren't even allowed to mention Supergirl on Flash. There's no loosening up.

The only thing I would worry about, is if they'd be able to give Green Lantern a decent costume. But effects wise, after everything we've seen them do, he'd be a piece of cake.

Why does a costume seem difficult, but flight, realistic CGI, sci-fi locations and the practical effects that should go along with big energy powers seem easy? Is it because Flash throws some chintzy 30 second CGI sequence in once every 3-5 episodes? I feel like if you'd ever had to do those things, or pay for those things you'd see which ones were actually difficult and expensive.

Compared to the likes of King Shark and Grodd, not to mention the speed force effects, GL should be comparatively easy. We've also seen segments on Supergirl that are set on Krypton and Mars, with numerous aliens. Flash's finale included an light effects-heavy villain flown off by two CGI villains. Thus, I don't buy the "too complicated" argument for any character after what we've seen on these shows.

But he's not easy compared to them. Making a CGI beast is fine, because you do it all on the computer, and if it doesn't look human, it's okay, it doesn't have to. Also... those CGI creatures aren't supposed to be generating light, which makes the whole thing another level of headache.

But that's not even really the core issue. Putting aside Flash at it's best, Green Lantern can't get away with all the episodes and minutes where there isn't heavy CGI. There are simple TV effects Flash can do to make his powers happen to be a superhero without blowing up the budget. That's a lot harder a sell for Green Lantern. He becomes a different character when he isn't able to make big constructs when there's trouble. And it's bad enough when Barry gets sucker punched by something mundane, imagine Green Lantern, whose ring is supposed to protect him getting trapped under a bookshelf.

Green Lantern can't be shrunken down to TV size as well as Flash can. Look at Flash's Rogues, the most TV ready of all rogues galleries, Batman's included, imho. Look at Green Lantern's enemies... big headed psionics, death gods and lots and lots of other Lanterns.

Me personally, I'm all for a shrunken down Green Lantern, who uses his powers about as often as we see Grodd/King Shark/Time Wraiths. I'm down for that. Most people aren't though.

 

[Nathan]

Why does a costume seem difficult, but flight, realistic CGI, sci-fi locations and the practical effects that should go along with big energy powers seem easy?

You have seen the biker club known as the CW heroes, right? 99% of their heroes have a jacket/pants leather combo.