The Avengers The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 3

[Norm3]

The Thing is treated like a Monster especially in the early days of the FF. If the average person can deal with the Thing talking I'm sure they can handle the Hulk. The Hulk not talking to his teammates in the Avengers would seem silly too me. A non talking Hulk equals a monster to me. No one knows how he will respond & does he even understand speech. A talking Hulk make him more human & sympathetic.

 

[El Payaso]

The Thing is treated like a Monster especially in the early days of the FF.

You mean that people thought he was a monster or that he was a monster himself?

But again, what Stan Lee about why monsters were needed to talk in comics.

If the average person can deal with the Thing talking I'm sure they can handle the Hulk.

Most probably.

The Hulk not talking to his teammates in the Avengers would seem silly too me.

I can agree with that.

Now this is going to be a bloodbath. But I actually feel that having Hulk in the middle of an organized group of superheroes is silly to start with.

Unless, lets' say, Banner is in control of the beast. Which for me is like a happy Batman, Peter Parker with a well-payed good job getting everywhere on time, or Frankenstein monster being handsome and accepted by society.

For me the best part of Hulk is the tragedy, a beast that's uncontrolable, not Dr. Banner's cool super-power. He wants to get rid of him, not like, say Superman, who's more than cool being super-powered.

But that's just me. It has probably been done on comics before and therefore expected to be taken to the screen.

A non talking Hulk equals a monster to me. No one knows how he will respond & does he even understand speech. A talking Hulk make him more human & sympathetic.

Which is why Hulk in an organized group just doesn't work.

 

[Kirmit]

El Payaso, you say Hulk shouldn't talk because he's set in a realistic world yet this world has a god who can control the weather, a super soldier war hero brought back to life good as new half a century after disappearing, a master of magic and many more things, sorry but imo your argument doesn't hold up.

 

[Venom'sDad]

How is this film being set in a more realistic world, do not accommodate the Hulk being able to speak?

 

[El Payaso]

El Payaso, you say Hulk shouldn't talk because he's set in a realistic world yet this world has a god who can control the weather, a super soldier war hero brought back to life good as new half a century after disappearing, a master of magic and many more things, sorry but imo your argument doesn't hold up.

God damn me if I ever said that Hulk shouldn't speak.

 

[DyeLorean]

I think the "Leave me alone" line from TIH worked great as both dialogue for Hulk/Banner and acknowledgment of his interior monster. It was a perfect step from Ang Lee's Hulk and what we might see on Avengers.

 

[Kirmit]

God damn me if I ever said that Hulk shouldn't speak.

Sorry, you didn't say that but my point still stands, you said the Hulk can't be compared to the characters I mentioned because he isn't from a fantastical world or is portrayed realistically, yet as my previous post proved, he is from a fantastical world that does deal with magic etc.

 

[El Payaso]

Sorry, you didn't say that but my point still stands, you said the Hulk can't be compared to the characters I mentioned because he isn't from a fantastical world or is portrayed realistically, yet as my previous post proved, he is from a fantastical world that does deal with magic etc.

Well, no. Hulk is not from a fantastical world. It is from our world.

But Hulk is about science fiction. It wasn't a wizard who came and cursed Banner to become a troll whenever he was angry. It was radiation. Sure, fantasy is involved, but not magic. The fact that fantasy and magic have appeared in some of the comics doesn't mean it is the core of Hulk.

The character and his world are associated to Frankenstein, Jekyll & Hyde, even King Kong (the misunderstood monster) but even when those characters and their worlds have fantastical elements they're far removed from concepts such as Wizard of Oz, Chronicles of Narnia or even Harry Potter. That is magic and fantasy.


Stan Lee himself has said how he didn't know anything about radiation but still he tried to justify things as scientifically as possible. He's mentioned how he didn't like how Superman could fly without any explanation and, even when not real world physics, he tried to give Thor a justification for his flying ability (which is that he twirls his hammer and then it's the hammer's impulse what makes him fly).

 

[Ahura Mazda]

Well, no. Hulk is not from a fantastical world. It is from our world.

But Hulk is about science fiction. It wasn't a wizard who came and cursed Banner to become a troll whenever he was angry. It was radiation. Sure, fantasy is involved, but not magic. The fact that fantasy and magic have appeared in some of the comics doesn't mean it is the core of Hulk.

The character and his world are associated to Frankenstein, Jekyll & Hyde, even King Kong (the misunderstood monster) but even when those characters and their worlds have fantastical elements they're far removed from concepts such as Wizard of Oz, Chronicles of Narnia or even Harry Potter. That is magic and fantasy.


Stan Lee himself has said how he didn't know anything about radiation but still he tried to justify things as scientifically as possible. He's mentioned how he didn't like how Superman could fly without any explanation and, even when not real world physics, he tried to give Thor a justification for his flying ability (which is that he twirls his hammer and then it's the hammer's impulse what makes him fly).

I am quoting your whole post to give it some context but I am referring specifically to the bolded statement. The Hulk does not come from our world. he comesfrom a world where fantasy and magic exist. Now he was handicapped by a TV show which showed a waterred down version of him in a realistic setting but his comic setting which this is an adaptation of is anything but.

The hulk should talk and I agree with otheres who stated the Avengers cartoon captured it quite well. However, I will say, for me, I would love it if it was the Green Scar Hulk (which I know will never happen).

 

[BigThor]

The hulk should talk and I agree with otheres who stated the Avengers cartoon captured it quite well. However, I will say, for me, I would love it if it was the Green Scar Hulk (which I know will never happen).

Hopefully if a sequel to TIH is ever made, then the third film could be the "Planet Hulk" storyline with him being sent to Sakaar at the beginning of the film.

Then at about an hour and 15 minutes into the film Hulk can come back to earth and go on a rampage influenced by the "World War Hulk" storyline.

^^^ They could either do it like this or they could make them into seperate films, but I'd rather it be done this way.

 

[Hunter Rider]

I think to get the budget for a Planet Hulk film they'd need to have a big hit Hulk movie first.

 

[BigThor]

I think to get the budget for a Planet Hulk film they'd need to have a big hit Hulk movie first.

Yeah, but since all these films are coming from the same studio each of their successes puts more money in the bank for film's with larger budgets.

If Hulk is well recieved in The Avengers that could mean more success for a potential sequel to TIH.

 

[cherokeesam]

I am quoting your whole post to give it some context but I am referring specifically to the bolded statement. The Hulk does not come from our world. he comesfrom a world where fantasy and magic exist. Now he was handicapped by a TV show which showed a waterred down version of him in a realistic setting but his comic setting which this is an adaptation of is anything but.

The hulk should talk and I agree with otheres who stated the Avengers cartoon captured it quite well. However, I will say, for me, I would love it if it was the Green Scar Hulk (which I know will never happen).

But the fact that Hulk exists in a world where reality and magic coexist doesn't mean that magic plays a part in *his* storyline at all. Yes, the Marvel Universe is a mishmash of nuts-and-bolts science fiction, alien realms and dimensions, "realistic" costumed crime fiction, supernatural horror and full-blown fantasy; but it doesn't mean that Hulk should *magically* gain the ability to "talk pretty."

Personally, I think Hulk *should* speak more often (and more intelligently) than previous film incarnations, but it should be shown as a gradual evolution as Banner gains more and more control over the beast within.

Yeah, but since all these films are coming from the same studio each of their successes puts more money in the bank for film's with larger budgets.

If Hulk is well recieved in The Avengers that could mean more success for a potential sequel to TIH.

I don't think the success of Avengers will increase the chance of a TIH sequel at all. I think Marvel has made it very clear that they're concentrating Hulk on the small screen for now. *If* the TV show bombs big time and gets yanked after a couple of episodes (hell, at this point, we're still just waiting on it to materialize), *then* they might rethink Hulk on the big screen.

 

[Gamma Goliath]

double

 

[Gamma Goliath]

Not movie related but an interesting bit on Fred Tatasciore on voicing Hulk. I like his understanding of the character. He brings up an interesting view on the hulk/banner relationship that would be very cool to see on the big screen imo.

http://marvel.com/news/story/16945/the_avengers_earths_mightiest_heroes_voicing_the_hulk

 

[El Payaso]

I am quoting your whole post to give it some context but I am referring specifically to the bolded statement. The Hulk does not come from our world. he comesfrom a world where fantasy and magic exist.

It's incredible how you said you wanted to give that sentence context and then you totally stripped it from it. I addressed that in Hulk's comics there's magic and whatnot but magic is not what made Banner the Hulk but science plus fiction.

Now he was handicapped by a TV show which showed a waterred down version of him in a realistic setting but his comic setting which this is an adaptation of is anything but.

If by handicapped you mean made more popular, serious and realistic than what comics could have ever make it to be, then I agree.

The hulk should talk

And El Payaso has not said otherwise.

 

[Godzilla2014]

I didn't feel that way at all. From onset, the movie established that Ross was obsessed with the Hulk's capture. Like the comic, he was tunnel-visioned, hard-headed, and reckless. The man almost kills his own daughter (and constantly puts his soliders in harm's way) because he's so fanatical about taking Banner into custody.

It took Abby's carnage for Ross to finally realize that he had been acting like an idiot. I never thought that TIH's dynamic was overly ambiguous in that aspect.

It's not overly ambiguous about whether or not Ross is the antagonist, but it's somewhat dishonest in that portrayal. You have to remember that 10s, 100s, or even 1000s of people could be at risk when Bruce Banner loses control. He is best labeled a "person of mass destruction". That's where the awkwardness comes in.

Yeah I don't understand what they're complaining about. The movie clearly set Ross as the antagonist, which in turn makes the military the antagonist. Don't know how anyone was confused as to who to pull for.

The movie kind of ignores the fact that Ross has a point. Bruce Banner is pretty much like a living nuclear weapon waiting to be set off, putting a lot of innocent civilians at risk when that happens.

 

[HUMANIMAL]

he should and will talk...not whole grammatically correct sentences i guess...well in a movie he could go totally mute...i mean it could be done but not so in a comic book. that would be boring to read.....

 

[El Payaso]

he should and will talk...not whole grammatically correct sentences i guess...well in a movie he could go totally mute...i mean it could be done but not so in a comic book. that would be boring to read.....

That's what Stan Lee explained. He had Hulk speaking mainly because it'd be boring to see him mute on the page.

Hulk could speak. Grammatically correct or not, to me the problem is what is he going to say and how.

I loved what he said in TIH. I have said that in this very thread. But sitting on a table exchanging opinions with Iron Man, Thor, etc? I can see that on comics, but not so much on a movie.

 

[HUMANIMAL]

with grammatically correct im basically ment whole sentences...from a to b...and i totally agree with your statement that he has to ineract but done in a good manner

 

[BigThor]

I don't think the success of Avengers will increase the chance of a TIH sequel at all. I think Marvel has made it very clear that they're concentrating Hulk on the small screen for now. *If* the TV show bombs big time and gets yanked after a couple of episodes (hell, at this point, we're still just waiting on it to materialize), *then* they might rethink Hulk on the big screen.

I didn't say the success of the Avengers would increase the chances of a TIh sequel, I said they could increase if Hulk is well recieved in The Avengers.

 

[Venom'sDad]

That's what Stan Lee explained. He had Hulk speaking mainly because it'd be boring to see him mute on the page.

Hulk could speak. Grammatically correct or not, to me the problem is what is he going to say and how.

I loved what he said in TIH. I have said that in this very thread. But sitting on a table exchanging opinions with Iron Man, Thor, etc? I can see that on comics, but not so much on a movie.

I don't think we will ever see Hulk sitting at a table, exchanging ideas & opinions; he will have calm down by that point....lol, but I get what you are saying, and I agree to a point. The situation will dictate what he will say. I'm more concern with how it is delivered. I think he should struggle with clarity, and not necessarily with grammar. The fact that he struggles with making himself clear & with concise thought, and them not fully understanding what he's trying to convey, make him even more angry, thereby, breaking rank and/or tactics, into do his own thing, that may put the team or situation, in harm way. Another reason why the team skeptical about his inclusion with the team.

He should speak intelligently, not primitive, but struggles with clarity, cant find the proper wording in getting his point across. Thought process just a little bit slower than it would be as Banner...so he struggles.

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

I don't think we will ever see Hulk sitting at a table, exchanging ideas & opinions; he will have calm down by that point....lol, but I get what you are saying, and I agree to a point. The situation will dictate what he will say. I'm more concern with how it is delivered. I think he should struggle with clarity, and not necessarily with grammar. The fact that he struggles with making himself clear & with concise thought, and them not fully understanding what he's trying to convey, make him even more angry, thereby, breaking rank and/or tactics, into do his own thing, that may put the team or situation, in harm way. Another reason why the team skeptical about his inclusion with the team.

He should speak intelligently, not primitive, but struggles with clarity, cant find the proper wording in getting his point across. Thought process just a little bit slower than it would be as Banner...so he struggles.

I didn't understand that. Would you put an example of the Hulk speaking that way?

 

[LOBO3315a]

The difference would be "Hulk Smash!" vs "Hulk smash you!"

The first statement would indicate that he is smashing anything that gets in his way. The second is that he is aware that he just needs to smash 1 thing. There's a world of difference in that 1 word.

 

[Doc Samson]

If he does speak more frequently, I hope they just let him talk, all that third person nonsense will get old very quick, at least to me, and I'm one of the biggest fans in the world.

I also wish they would use whoever that was that did the "Puny Human" in Ang's film, it was the perfect voice IMO. I like Lou and everything, but something new wouldn't hurt