The Dark Knight The Rachel Dawes thread

[magicangel1989]

Maggie Gyllenhall was ten times better at playing Rachel then Katie Holmes was, no doubt about that.

 

[fabman]

Thank God they cast Maggie as Rachel, otherwise I don't think I would've cared for her death. That scene was beautiful, so tragic.

 

[Star]

I just watched BB today and I can tell you right now that it just pointed out how much better Maggie was. Katie Holmes is a terrible actress and played Rachel as being a huge self righteous idiot.

Yes, she was written that way, but somehow Maggie just seems all the more likeable.

And I understand that people think Maggie is ''ugly'' (which I don't at all) but in my mind, Katie is the ugly one.

Because Talent is way more attractive.

 

[Crook]

Sounds like something you'd say to ugly people to make them feel better.

 

[Star]

Or, something I'd say because Katie Holmes is a dog beast who can't act and Maggie is 'ugly' but CAN act.

Which makes Maggie superior.

 

[GCityCoffee]

I don't find Maggie ugly, she can be pretty attractive sometimes IMO. I've always thought Katie Holmes was overrated when it came to her looks, and as everyone has already said, Katie can't act. With Maggie playing Rachel, I liked her character a lot more.

 

[Heretic]

You know, I've never seen Maggie in any movie prior to Dark Knight, and from what i have seen in just this one movie, I don't find her to be a spectacular actor. She was mostly unbelievable in the role...and a few lines were worse than anything Katie Holmes delivered in Begins. I'm sure there are movies where maggie is just phenomenal, but all i can go on is this one film, and though she handled the death scene quite well, every other scene she was in just seemed phone in. Katie isnt starting up any acting schools herself, but her character at least seemed like a girl who had known Bruce her whole life. She wasnt as smart or talented as Gotham needed her to be, but she tried anyway. That challenge gave her character that attitude that people seem to view as the actress being in over her head (which she may very well have been).

So, am i saying that katie Holmes is more talented than maggie gyllenhall? No. Ive seen one Maggie movie, and I think 2 or 3 that had katie in it (yes, I got dragged to see Teaching Mrs Tingle). I cant judge their careers. In this role, in these movies, I preferred Katie.

IN FACT...in the scenes where Maggie hams it up...such as the "I know these like the back of my hand" or the "Jim Gordon, he's a friend"...I truly believe that Katie would have delieved those very same lines as a woman who wasnt even sure of herself. Maggie seemed to bark stuff out, while Katie would have had doubt in her voice (probably because she was doubting her own acting performance, but it fits the character).

 

[Zero_Vault]

Well said.

Bravo.

 

[Star]

No, urgh. Like I said I watched BB today (one of my favourites) and I just...

Can't. Stand. Katie. Holmes.

She doesn't fit the movie at all.

Maggie was much more likable for me.

 

[Heretic]

No, urgh. Like I said I watched BB today (one of my favourites) and I just...

Can't. Stand. Katie. Holmes.

She doesn't fit the movie at all.

I keep hearing people say that they dont like katie holmes, shes a teen drama queen, shes in bad movies and the like...but honestly...how was she not Rachel Dawes? I think some of you are putting what you THINK rachel Dawes should have been over what the character actually is...

I said that Katie played the role as a woman who doubted herself, while maggie was overconfident and bossy...

Well, Rachel was assistant DA, and then when the DA job opened up, someone leapfrogged right over her and got the job...she didnt even try to get it. She KNEW she wasnt good enough. Katies rachel shows that, maggies does not.

Rachel was torn in her feelings for Bruce. It was a lifetime of feeling let down by him, mixed with moments of incredible love and respect...and that carried over into conflicting with her feelings for other men. Katies Rachel showed that, while maggies was barking out confidence. There was little sense of the first movies baggage there...the character simply brushed it off because she was displaying Girl Power or something.

Rachel was a fragile charachter who was in over her head at all times and tried desperately to convince herself that she wasnt. katie pulled that off, and a better actress did not.

 

[Zero_Vault]

Right on, brotha!

 

[Star]

Rachel as a whole is an unlikable character. Maggie made her slightly more bearable.

You may think that Katie was a 'better version of her' but since I can't stand Katie, I prefer the Maggie version.

 

[Heretic]

What exactly is bearable about a bossy, overconfident person?

Rachel Dawes is a far more textured character than what people have ever given her credit for. Of course, to admit that the character is multi-dimensional means that Maggies one dimensional performance that completely contradicts the character from the first movie is not up to par with what that crazy chick from Dawsons Creek did.

 

[Mrs.J]

She was hot in stranger than fiction.
But i liked her performance way better than katies. hands down.

 

[Doc Samson]

I keep hearing people say that they dont like katie holmes, shes a teen drama queen, shes in bad movies and the like...but honestly...how was she not Rachel Dawes? I think some of you are putting what you THINK rachel Dawes should have been over what the character actually is...

I said that Katie played the role as a woman who doubted herself, while maggie was overconfident and bossy...

Well, Rachel was assistant DA, and then when the DA job opened up, someone leapfrogged right over her and got the job...she didnt even try to get it. She KNEW she wasnt good enough. Katies rachel shows that, maggies does not.

Rachel was torn in her feelings for Bruce. It was a lifetime of feeling let down by him, mixed with moments of incredible love and respect...and that carried over into conflicting with her feelings for other men. Katies Rachel showed that, while maggies was barking out confidence. There was little sense of the first movies baggage there...the character simply brushed it off because she was displaying Girl Power or something.

Rachel was a fragile charachter who was in over her head at all times and tried desperately to convince herself that she wasnt. katie pulled that off, and a better actress did not.

Your right my friend, at least in my estimate. A better actress does not mean better chemistry, regardless of what some people might think. Katie seemed to have true real feelings with Bruce and I didn't get any of that from Maggie at all. I actually thought her acting in her final scene in the warehouse was bad, really bad, with the fake voice cracks and irritating screams. I can't see Katie doing any worse really, I think when this comes out on DVD (or Blu ray for the lucky ones) and the hype and excitement dies down, people will start to see just how weak she was in this film, IMO of course. People just don't like Katie Holmes, for whatever reason, and that's why they like to bash her, but if your honest with yourself, at worst, she did just as well as Maggie

 

[elgato]

Maggie as Rachel was one of the best female performances in a comic book movie, (well at least she was better than Katie)

 

[Lobo]

I hated Maggie as Rachel.

 

[elgato]

Well good for you I loved her, I hated Kate Bosworth as Lois Lane, and other people loved her, so...

 

[Lobo]

Exactly. To each his own

 

[SuperSarah!]

Maggie Gyllenhall was ten times better at playing Rachel then Katie Holmes was, no doubt about that.

agreed.


I love Maggies voice and the way she carries herself. so classy.

Katie Holmes will always be the little ****e off Dawsons creek to me.

 

[I Am The Knight]

dog beast.

:gray:

 

[Majik1387]

Well good for you I loved her, I hated Kate Bosworth as Lois Lane, and other people loved her, so...

Umm, not what I've heard...

 

[Marx]

Umm, not what I've heard...

Me either Majik. I have heard very mixed reviews on Bosworth's Lois Lane. I think those who liked her are in the minority.

 

[Batgort]

Umm, not what I've heard...

Kate Bosworth did suck as Lois Lane, and Maggie is better than Katie at Rachel.

But these are just opinions, and everyone has them, the box office speaks for itself.

 

[BatmanFanatic]

Okay, here is a big question for everyone. I haven't read this entire thread so my apologies if it's been asked already.

Do you think that Rachel Dawes acted reprehensibly toward Bruce? I mean, did she mess with his feelings or play him for a sap because she didn't want him turning himself in? Or is she just a tease? Or can she not make up her mind? And what about that letter... that really got me -who tells someone who loves them something that important with a "dear John" letter? That seemed really cold to me.

So I wonder what you guys think about that, because I was a little put off by Rachel's manipulating and coldness towards Bruce in the film. And felt even worse for him because he never found out about any of it, and will end up very heartbroken for a woman who doesn't completely deserve it.

Thoughts?