The Dark Knight The Rachel Dawes thread

[CConn]

I don't want to shoot her in the face like Fudd, sexually that is, but that's the movie where I first saw her charm as well, so it's funny you said that. I don't think she's hot, but I don't think Holmes is either, so they're on the same playing field on that one, not that looks matter to me, if I want hot I'll go watch porn, if I want a good narrative I want a capable actress and some semblance of aethetic appeal.

Exactly.

The point I was sorta making with that also was that sexiness or attractiveness goes beyond a pretty face. While I think Gyllenhaal's not particularly hot, like you said, she has great charm. And that can really make a difference. Especially since Holmes, well, didn't.

Those were the dark ages, scoundrel.

The only thing that was worse, was the rumor about Edge playing Egghead.

How did you survive not laughing to death?

 

[Crooklyn]

Exactly.

The point I was sorta making with that also was that sexiness or attractiveness goes beyond a pretty face. While I think Gyllenhaal's not particularly hot, like you said, she has great charm. And that can really make a difference. Especially since Holmes, well, didn't.

I've only seen Maggie in 'Secretary', but she surprised me with this almost child-like voice she had in the movie. I don't know if that's her real voice or not, but damn was it hot. So....innocent.

 

[CConn]

Exactly, pedo.

 

[The Watchman]

Goes with the pedo avvy.

 

[Crooklyn]

No fair, 2 against 1.

 

[JackBauer24]

Boy, I hope Nolan never reads or pays attention to anything discussed on this board. Some of the comments I've been reading here are really embarrassing for all of us. Maggie is a perfectly good-looking young woman (and a better actress than Katie Holmes). It's not like they went and cast the Elephant Man.

 

[kingdomhearts]

I found some recent pics the two have from the Oscars and with the same poses and the two look nothing alike.

http://www.maggie-gyllenhaal.net/gallery/displayimage.php?album=191&pos=5

Katie has become a beautiful whoooaa-man.
http://www.katie-holmes.org/gallery/displayimage.php?album=1007&pos=188

A Maggie fan said the two dont look alike but she's the one that looks like Maggie's twin and she's right.
http://myspace-169.vo.llnwd.net/01511/96/17/1511767169_l.jpg

Even if its Blunt or McAdams I hate recasts.

 

[Dark Knight]

First of all, nobody said they look "alike". We said they have "a similar look," which means quite a different thing.

Secondly, you chose a glamor shot of Katie (which is not how she actually looks) and a much more candid shot of Maggie, which is hardly fair as a comparison.

Observe:

Take a look! The resemble each other!

Exactly.

 

[Justice Bringer]

Gyllenhaal is kinda fugly.

Hopefully Bruce will eventually get some Catwoman action to make up for this.

 

[Matt]

I'm not sure how I feel about this. On one hand, Maggie Gyllenhall is definitely a step up in terms of acting quality. On the other hand I am never a big fan of the same character/different actor format. Especially considering that it had a role in doing the Batman franchise in, last time. I think they should just drop the character all together if they can't get Katie back.

 

[Matt]

Gyllenhaal is kinda fugly.

Hopefully Bruce will eventually get some Catwoman action to make up for this.

I dunno, she is kind of like the "Two-Face" from Seinfeld. Sometimes she is really unattractive, other times she just oozes sex appeal. It depends on what she's in, what she's wearing, what her make up and hair are like, etc.

 

[Showtime]

I didn't think the character of Rachel Dawes was created for eye candy, and I didn't expect that in Begins and don't expect it in Dark Knight. What I expect is a solid performance from Maggie and I assume that is what we will get.

 

[Winter Spleen]

I would have much preferred a brief Rachel appearance with Holmes rather than recasting... but if it must happen, Gyllenhaal is nice.

 

[Matt]

I didn't think the character of Rachel Dawes was created for eye candy, and I didn't expect that in Begins and don't expect it in Dark Knight. What I expect is a solid performance from Maggie and I assume that is what we will get.

I don't think so either. Still, like I said...she served her purpose in Begins and is an easy enough character to simply write out. I'd rather see Holmes take it or not have the character at all.

 

[Showtime]

I don't think so either. Still, like I said...she served her purpose in Begins and is an easy enough character to simply write out. I'd rather see Holmes take it or not have the character at all.

I agree with you there my man. When I saw her kiss Bruce and walk away at the end, I thought that was that last we would see of her. I was suprised that I was hearing Rachel would be carried over to a sequel after I saw the movie.

I don't understand why the character needed to be brought back, I am not a fan of recasting, but since they decided they must I can dig Maggie.

 

[dollarbill]

Im busting out laughing at other boards when fans say Maggie will be fine with lots of make up and they really need to glam her up. Katie does not need all that because Katie with no make up and with make up is HOT.
Katie these days is really blossoming well into a hot woman.
Maggie looks so old for a 29 year old. Pardon my sarcasm when nudity and getting down on all fours makes her a solid actress. Its safe to say many actress can do porn if they want to. I really need a drink to see her as Rachel Dawes when most of her movies had nudity and banging different guys.

We got the Audrey Hepburn type of lady and now TPTB gave us Marilyn Monroe.

 

[itsthebatman]

I agree with you there my man. When I saw her kiss Bruce and walk away at the end, I thought that was that last we would see of her. I was suprised that I was hearing Rachel would be carried over to a sequel after I saw the movie.

I don't understand why the character needed to be brought back, I am not a fan of recasting, but since they decided they must I can dig Maggie.

Nobody has read the script. Rachel could, hopefully does, have a major role that depends on her prior relationship with Bruce as established in BB. She may be coming back because no other female character (Talia, Selina being the obvious ones) can fulfil the role the Nolans have envisaged for her in this series. I for one would like to see a female character being fully developed through this series of movies, rather than one per movie, as previously.

 

[Crooklyn]

...makes you wonder why they didn't just go for Selina then.

 

[itsthebatman]

...makes you wonder why they didn't just go for Selina then.

All things being equal, I would have preferred Selina in this franchise, absolutely. But Rachel had a role in BB that depended on her being a long-time friend of Bruce's, and an assistant DA, and a former love interest. There is no character in the mythos that could fulfil that role. Selina would had to have been in BB as a separate character, which would have cluttered up the cast even more.
At least, that's the way I see it.

 

[itsthebatman]

Im busting out laughing at other boards when fans say Maggie will be fine with lots of make up and they really need to glam her up. Katie does not need all that because Katie with no make up and with make up is HOT.
Katie these days is really blossoming well into a hot woman.
Maggie looks so old for a 29 year old. Pardon my sarcasm when nudity and getting down on all fours makes her a solid actress. Its safe to say many actress can do porn if they want to. I really need a drink to see her as Rachel Dawes when most of her movies had nudity and banging different guys.

We got the Audrey Hepburn type of lady and now TPTB gave us Marilyn Monroe.

I really can't believe this post. Have you actually seen a Maggie Gyllenhall movie, or are you just imagining them? Have you seen Secretary? If you regard that as porn, you obviously don't get out much. She is a damn fine actress, with a more impressive resume than Holmes, and is generally held in high regard in Hollywood, and not as a porn actress. I also have no idea what your last sentence means. Comparing Katie Holmes to Audrey Hepburn (ina ny capacity), is just dumb, and Maggie and Marilyn? What? Are they your idea of porn actresses.
Muppet.

 

[Crooklyn]

All things being equal, I would have preferred Selina in this franchise, absolutely. But Rachel had a role in BB that depended on her being a long-time friend of Bruce's, and an assistant DA, and a former love interest. There is no character in the mythos that could fulfil that role.

The first isn't even remotely necessary, the second would've been filled by Dent, and the third by Selina. That's really my top reason for hating her, she took out 2 of the most valuable characters.

Selina would had to have been in BB as a separate character, which would have cluttered up the cast even more.
At least, that's the way I see it.

Or, you know....work her into the story the same way Nolan invented a completely new character and managed to intertwine her with everything else.

 

[itsthebatman]

The first isn't even remotely necessary, the second would've been filled by Dent, and the third by Selina. That's really my top reason for hating her, she took out 2 of the most valuable characters.


Or, you know....work her into the story the same way Nolan invented a completely new character and managed to intertwine her with everything else.

I do think her role did depend on her being a childhood friend of Bruce's, so unless you put Tommy Elliott in there, who else is there? We're getting Harvey in the next two movies, so no problem there.
Regarding Selina - yes, I would have liked her there from the start, that's a given. But at this stage, i would honestly prefer them to continue with the character and flesh her out, rather than start from scratch. It's not my ideal situation, but there's bugger all we can do about it now.
And, i repeat, we do not know what they plan for Rachel in this movie. So saying things like 'There's no need for her' and suchlike, is pure speculation when we have no idea either way how valuable she is in TDK.

 

[Crooklyn]

I do think her role did depend on her being a childhood friend of Bruce's, so unless you put Tommy Elliott in there, who else is there?

I meant in the sense that every single one of those things were fabricated just so Rachel could fit into the movie. Her being a childhood friend did nothing for Bruce but be the conventional love interest, her advising Bruce about justice/revenge just made him more incompetent, and her being an Assistant D.A. was so she could be worked into the mob subplot and eventually be saved.

We're getting Harvey in the next two movies, so no problem there.

One, actually. My point was if Harvey would've been in this franchise from the beginning, we would've gotten more time to develop him as a character. The more time with him pre-scarring, the better.

Regarding Selina - yes, I would have liked her there from the start, that's a given. But at this stage, i would honestly prefer them to continue with the character and flesh her out, rather than start from scratch. It's not my ideal situation, but there's bugger all we can do about it now.

Yeah, well the thing is, BB left a pretty good bookend to the character. So the option was definitely there to just leave it at that. There was no sense of "oh, I wonder what she'll do in the sequel". A concrete ending was made. Just the thought of Rachel becoming the MJ of this franchise, when it should rightfully belong to Selina...irks me to no end.

And, i repeat, we do not know what they plan for Rachel in this movie. So saying things like 'There's no need for her' and suchlike, is pure speculation when we have no idea either way how valuable she is in TDK.

Like I said, it'll just be a result of fitting her into the movie. I'm well aware they probably do have something in store for her, but more likely than not there could've been an alternative to that situation without her presence.

 

[Macphisto]

Has anyone posted the Hollywood Reporter article? Again, not much info but at least it's got a comment from Nolan in regards to Maggie's casting.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr...ews/e3i119db77792cbaa01061df0399d2b3081?imw=Y

 

[ultimatefan]

I´m tired of this hotness argument... I just don´t care that much...So, has anyone seen Katie´s boobs in The Gift...t: