The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - Part 10

[Willie Lumpkin]

Only I was talking about if "Marvel" made the movie....I'm not even "THINKING" about Fox doing another FF movie. I didn't make that clear.

Yeah, I don't think it's "likely". I just think it could be really interesting because, well, (non-Fox) DOOM is interesting.

I don't agree that SS didn't do well. Next to some other, ah.....movies??? (I'm searching for the right word here and it's not quite coming to me ), SS was a tremendous hit.

Fox tried Doom (a couple of times) and Silver Surfer. I don't see them going to the Silver Surfer well again. They may try Doom (God hate them for it if they do), but if there's a quality clause, Fox is screwed one way or the other.

D'oh!! Yeah, I think Marvel could definitely do it. I know we've talked on here before about a possible Netflix show that would focus on the early Doom years, and I think that would be very doable in the right hands.

As a kid, fighting the rich and powerful in Latveria, he could even be something of a hero. But would that be a problem down the road? Could you make him a hero as a child who later becomes Doom? I guess Star Wars did that with Anakin - though I would make him much darker and harder edged even as a child than Anakin was. I'd make him nasty - but with antagonists that are even more nasty so you're rooting for the nasty little kid to take them down.

 

[Zarex]

The entire plan for Dark Phoenix seems ridiculous. With JLaw, Fassy and McAvoy signed to hefty new contracts, along with alien sets, makeup and computer effects, DP (tee hee!) looks like it is getting a not insignificant budget increase over Apocalypse. But, according to Deadline, Apocalypse didn't crack the top 53 most profitable movies last year, largely due to it suffering a 27% BO decrease from DOFP.

So FOX is releasing a sequel to the poorly received film with a newbie director a hefty budget and opening it on the same week as a Disney live action fairy tale (Mulan). Maybe they will make a sequel to FFINO after all.

 

[wobbly]

I'm getting the feeling that people didn't think much of the initial Dark Phoenix........and don't think much of Simon.....am I missing something? LOL.

By initial you mean X3: Last Stand? Simple Simon co-wrote that crap. In fact his resume is mostly a testament to piss poor films. The few successes on it were in collaboration with betters (so a resounding yes to not thinking much of Simon, lol)

As for the new film....Why the haste (again!) to go right into Dark Phoenix? They took about 3 years from her becoming Phoenix and around 30 issues in the books to build up to that, and when it happened it was amazing comic book storytelling. I was a teen when she killed herself in 137 and was seriously moved by it (back then it wasn't quite as much a given that dead characters always come back).

Imho, they'd be better off having one film focused on the core X-Men (no more Mystique ffs and Magneto and his face-heel turn shenanigans could do with a rest too...) with a good Phoenix, solidifying her & Scott's love for each other, and dropping hints to her turn to to the dark. They could bookend it showing there is alien (Shi'ar) interest in that, then go for the Dark Phoenix in the follow up.

As is it seems like they are just gonna rush the whole thing. Again.

 

[Dark Raven]

There is no Phoenix in the movies. It's straight from Jean Grey to Dark Phoenix. Nothing in between.

 

[Zarex]

That was my thinking as well. Try to build up audience interest after the disappointing Apocalypse with a more human story involving Jean being seduced to the dark and struggling to control her powers. Then go with the outer space adventure in the follow up.

 

[Dark Raven]

No-one will care about Jean Grey turning into Dark Phoenix, because we just haven't come to love her character yet or even really know her, as played by Sophie Turner. It has to seem like a tragedy, not just the go-to next phase for her.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

(no more Mystique ffs and Magneto and his face-heel turn shenanigans could do with a rest too...) [/B]

Seriously! It's like they're absolutely determined to tell the same story with the same characters over and over again just to see how many times they can do it before people get physically ill.

And now they're bringing in a new character... Dark Phoenix... yeah, that will freshen things up.

I imagine two Fox big-shots locked away in a private room somewhere smoking cigars and sipping brandy and arguing over just how stupid the American film-going public is. They have a private wager on how many times they can make the same movie and still make money doing it.

And this time around, after surprising even themselves regarding how stupid their audience is, they decided to really up the stakes and put Simon frickin' Kinberg in charge of the mess.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

... and I don't know if I should be glad that they're taking one step closer to turning the X-Men rights back to Marvel or terrified that they're going to suck the life out of the X-Men and have no choice but to reboot FF.

 

[Dark Raven]

... and I don't know if I should be glad that they're taking one step closer to turning the X-Men rights back to Marvel or terrified that they're going to suck the life out of the X-Men and have no choice but to reboot FF.

They will reboot Fantastic Four and do it as a crossover with a loose adaptation of this story:

So it will be the same old thing again. But this time, not only will it show the FF's origin yet again as they're hit by a cosmic storm, but they'll encounter another ship in that storm that is piloted by Jean Grey who turns into the Phoenix as both the X-Men ship and the FF ship crash into the Jamaica Bay. On board the X-Men ship will also be Magneto and Mystique. It will feel completely fresh.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

No-one will care about Jean Grey turning into Dark Phoenix, because we just haven't come to love her character yet or even really know her, as played by Sophie Turner. It has to seem like a tragedy, not just the go-to next phase for her.

Didn't stop Winter Soldier reveal from working.

If Phoenix fails it won't be from not following a longer road to evil.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

So FOX is releasing a sequel to the poorly received film with a newbie director a hefty budget and opening it on the same week as a Disney live action fairy tale (Mulan). Maybe they will make a sequel to FFINO after all.

I think Sony's bumbling with the Spidey franchise is gonna give them their answer. Maybe they'll get Ridley Scott to do it as payment for Covenant tanking.t:

 

[First Avenger]

I have been assuming that the FF would be introduced as part of the All-New, All-Different MCU after the 2019 Avengers film, but the "no plans" and "no discussions" comments are much more disheartening than a simple "no comment". I can't begin to understand the logic in handing over additional rights to the X-Men character family to FOX without insisting on early reversion of the FF rights. But I guess that's why they get paid the big bucks.

I get the feeling the dream is dead.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I get the feeling the dream is dead.

If you were hoping to hear something in July, that's probably unlikely, but the time is ticking away every day.

By 2022 - just five short years from now - if Fox isn't filming, Marvel gets the rights.

And that means we'll realistically know in 4 years. If Fox hasn't announced a film and isn't working on getting a script, director etc. in 2021, then the rights are Marvel's.

Fox announced the last reboot in 2009 - 2 years after ROTSS. To follow a similar pattern, they'd have to announce the next reboot this year - and that's not going to happen.

 

[nyyarod]

I desperately need Marvel to get the rights to X-men back. I fear I am never going to get an X-men movie that's close to the animated series or the comics even

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I desperately need Marvel to get the rights to X-men back. I fear I am never going to get an X-men movie that's close to the animated series or the comics even

Well from a Marvel getting X-Men rights back perspective, I couldn't imagine better news than Simon Kinberg directing.

That not only is likely to result in an epically bad film, but it also seems to indicate Fox isn't invested enough in the franchise to take it seriously and hire a real director.

 

[Vader's Fist]

We know that for the F4 it's seven years, but how much time has to pass between lack of production on an X-Men film before the rights revert to Marvel? Or has this info ever even been disclosed?

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

We know that for the F4 it's seven years, but how much time has to pass between lack of production on an X-Men film before the rights revert to Marvel? Or has this info ever even been disclosed?

I think it's shorter, but they've also got several different films going.

But with all the potential they have, I'm perplexed by the direction they're going. The choices they're making on New Mutants seem highly questionable and now we've got this Kinberg news.

Deadpool seems to be the closest thing they have to a sure-thing, but even that is very questionable with a new director.

For the last several years, I've imagined an amazing universe Fox could build by focusing on individual characters and building a world of diverse, interesting heroes.

... but they seem to just be fumbling blindly and not taking advantage of the really cool characters and stories they have at their disposal.

 

[Vader's Fist]

I desperately need Marvel to get the rights to X-men back. I fear I am never going to get an X-men movie that's close to the animated series or the comics even

One reason why I'm sick to death of Fox's approach is that it feels too much like militaristic Sci-Fi and less Superhero, with the black leather outfits and gloomy color palettes, where almost everything is blue, grey silver or a combination of all three. You know if Marvel got the rights back they'd actually make them feel like movies based on comic books, with much more vivid hues and varieties of costumes.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

One reason why I'm sick to death of Fox's approach is that it feels too much like militaristic Sci-Fi and less Superhero, with the black leather outfits and gloomy color palettes, where almost everything is blue, grey silver or a combination of all three. You know if Marvel got the rights back they'd actually make them feel like movies based on comic books, with much more vivid hues and varieties of costumes.

Throughout Fant4stic, Kinberg justified some of the choices they were making such as the containment suits and the 'grounded' feel by saying they didn't want it to be too 'comic-booky'.

These are films based on comic books! Fox needs to get over their fear that people won't think they're cool if they have colorful costumes and characters.

 

[Vader's Fist]

These are films based on comic books! Fox needs to get over their fear that people won't think they're cool if they have colorful costumes and characters.

The fear of costumes and colorfulness might have have been logical shortly after Batman and Robin, but we're well past that era. This why in addition to the F4, I think Fox's time with the X-Men is up. They simply can't seem to wrap their heads around the idea that it's not 2000 anymore.

 

[Dark Raven]

If you were hoping to hear something in July, that's probably unlikely, but the time is ticking away every day.

By 2022 - just five short years from now - if Fox isn't filming, Marvel gets the rights.

And that means we'll realistically know in 4 years. If Fox hasn't announced a film and isn't working on getting a script, director etc. in 2021, then the rights are Marvel's.

Fox announced the last reboot in 2009 - 2 years after ROTSS. To follow a similar pattern, they'd have to announce the next reboot this year - and that's not going to happen.

Just wait. Tomorrow we'll now get the reboot announcement with a director and cast named.

 

[Endeavor]

simon kinberg confirmed to direct dark phoenix.

https://deadline.com/2017/06/x-men-...bender-james-mcavoy-simon-kinberg-1202113290/

 

[Vader's Fist]

I've given it some thought and I'm starting to think that the X-Men franchise has a stronger chance of going back to Marvel than we think. Dark Phoenix with an inexperienced director at the helm could easily be a disaster. This would mean that the only bonafide successes in the core X-Men series (Not counting the spin offs like The Wolverine or Logan) in 15 years (X2 came out in 2003) have been First Class and Days of Future Past. Deadpool could very well be only a one hit wonder, while New Mutants just sounds like more of the same as Fox's previous efforts, with no costumes and lack of fidelity to the source Material. Combine this with the fact that they no longer have the draws of Jackman, Stewart or McKellan. Now, I don't want to delude myself, but I still can't shake the feeling that the franchise is about to take a major nose dive once again.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I've given it some thought and I'm starting to think that the X-Men franchise has a stronger chance of going back to Marvel than we think. Dark Phoenix with an inexperienced director at the helm could easily be a disaster. This would mean that the only bonafide successes in the core X-Men series (Not counting the spin offs like The Wolverine or Logan) in 15 years (X2 came out in 2003) have been First Class and Days of Future Past. Deadpool could very well be only a one hit wonder, while New Mutants just sounds like more of the same as Fox's previous efforts, with no costumes and lack of fidelity to the source Material. Combine this with the fact that they no longer have the draws of Jackman, Stewart or McKellan. Now, I don't want to delude myself, but I still can't shake the feeling that the franchise is about to take a major nose dive once again.

They've definitely been hit and miss, and if you take Bryan Singer out of it, they've had a lot more bad films than good films (particularly counting FF, Elektra etc). So now that Bryan Singer's gone how will things go?

I think it could get ugly, but they have so much to work with, it's hard to imagine them giving up.

Unlike Sony and Spiderman, Fox can inject freshness and a whole new direction by just making a Gambit film, or a a Cyclops film, or a Collosus or Beast film etc.

I don't know why they're doing dumb things like giving Simon Kinberg a director's chair and continuing to work with the same tired mix of characters, but even if that blows up in their face (as is likely), they have a lot of other options.

 

[Darepool]

If you ask me this franchise has never been where it should be. I love X2, but that was 14 years ago. Understood in context it's great, but Fox has never truly embraced the material beyond the political themes. #retread #newblood