The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 23

[Fallen]

Off topic but Antman is $50M shy of becoming a billion dollar franchise worldwide after only two movies.......and it hasn't opened in China yet! I just think that's amazing! Disney needs to keep Fiege............and Gunn as well.

IKR?

So happy for Paul Rudd! He's a very underrated actor.

 

[Fallen]

But can they do that?

I read somewhere that they couldn't because Holland's Spiderman is part of the MCU, and by using him in other movies Sony would be "expanding" a franchise that isn't theirs. So they could make as much Spiderman movies with Holland as they like, but not use him for other movies.

I hope Marvel was smart enough to get those details right when they made the deal, otherwise Sony will mess up the MCU.

Nobody knows.

But... Kevin Feige is smart enough to lay it out in the contract that Marvel Studios has exclusive rights to Holland's Spidey.
Marvel Studios doesn't really need Sony. Sony needs them more .

 

[Bach]

Off topic but Antman is $50M shy of becoming a billion dollar franchise worldwide after only two movies.......and it hasn't opened in China yet! I just think that's amazing! Disney needs to keep Fiege............and Gunn as well.

That's great! How much has it grossed?

 

[Fallen]

$430M without China, Italy, Japan, etc.

The movie was released in the UK, Ireland and Poland last week (LOL).

 

[Bach]

And people said that it was going to bomb...

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Fox had an even more amazing cast with the X-Men alone. They had another probably equal or maybe greater than the SM rogue with the FF. DC has had their whole portfolio since forever. Even SW is struggling. This CU thing is not easy.
.

No, it’s not easy, which is all the more reason these studios should at least do the basic, obvious things right.

Hey Warner Brothers! Superman is a good guy and everybody knows he’s a good guy and they trust and love him.

Hey Sony, you can’t make a Venom movie without Spider-man.

Those are the simple, obvious, foundational things that they have to get right before attempting the more difficult subtle things.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

My guess is the source is lying to Collider or smokescreening them about what is really going on. Maybe the reshoots aren't a full 3 months, but is it hard to believe they are longer than 2-3 weeks.

Exactly. Studios have a huge motivation to twist things to sound better than they are. So when a studio rep says ‘nothing to see here’, that doesn’t mean there’s nothing to see there.

I was amazed, throughout Fant4stic, how quick some people were to believe and support as fact information that was being presented to them by people whose job it was to put the most positive spin on things.

 

[TheVileOne]

Exactly. Studios have a huge motivation to twist things to sound better than they are. So when a studio rep says ‘nothing to see here’, that doesn’t mean there’s nothing to see there.

I was amazed, throughout Fant4stic, how quick some people were to believe and support as fact information that was being presented to them by people whose job it was to put the most positive spin on things.

That's why Josh Trank's rogue tweet was so interesting. It gave us a peek behind the curtain. We knew it was a troubled production despite the misinformation campaign.

Trank, for all his faults, him tweeting it felt like the first honest thing he ever said about working on the movie. Hell it felt like the first honest thing anyone ever said about the movie without putting some sort of PR spin on it.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

That's why Josh Trank's rogue tweet was so interesting. It gave us a peek behind the curtain. We knew it was a troubled production despite the misinformation campaign.

Trank, for all his faults, him tweeting it felt like the first honest thing he ever said about working on the movie. Hell it felt like the first honest thing anyone ever said about the movie without putting some sort of PR spin on it.

To me, Twitter is very telling. Compare the twitter activity for films like Deadpool2 or Avengers IW in which those involved expressed daily enthusiasm for what they were doing... and Fant4stic or Dark Phoenix in which those involved seem to be taking the advice: "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."

 

[Darkprime]

Why Fox ever thought it was a good idea to hand Dark Phoenix over to Kinberg of all people for his directorial debut no less we may never know. Maybe he was cheap? He wrote Dark Phoenix as well so maybe they got a good deal lol.

 

[Xeno]

To me, Twitter is very telling. Compare the twitter activity for films like Deadpool2 or Avengers IW in which those involved expressed daily enthusiasm for what they were doing... and Fant4stic or Dark Phoenix in which those involved seem to be taking the advice: "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."

@joshuatrank is back on Twitter, by the by. He has an Al Capone biopic starring Tom Hardy in production. One wonders whether Hardy's agent has his best interests in mind between Venom and Fonzo.

 

[Iceman]

Poor Tom

 

[BeserkerHilf]

Can't find the tweet now, but Manabyte on Twitter brought up an interesting ulterior motive: Collider doing damage control for Fox to not ruin chances of an IMAX screening in February.

It wouldn't be a reach if not for their handling of The Mummy review.

 

[Darkprime]

Man the 2005 and 2007 f4 films are guilty pleasures. I love how campy they are.the actor who they got for Doom is so over the top. I love it. "Susan lets not fight, no lets" and silver surfer in 2007 voiced by laurence fishburne how cool is that. I liked what they did with silver surfer and evans as human torch. Theres a lot to like in those movies all tho i think reed and grimm are horribly miscast.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

@joshuatrank is back on Twitter, by the by. He has an Al Capone biopic starring Tom Hardy in production. One wonders whether Hardy's agent has his best interests in mind between Venom and Fonzo.

I know I'm all alone on this, but I've always felt Kinberg was more of the problem with Fant4stic than Trank.

Yeah, Trank wasn't a fan of the FF and he had his own idea and wanted to make his own movie and that was a problem, but I wonder if he had been given the freedom to do it without Kinberg and the studio breathing down his neck if he wouldn't have at least made an interesting film that might have worked (though not as a true FF film).

I really enjoyed Chronicle and I thought it was well-directed, and my gut tells me this Capone film could be pretty good.

... But I don't think Dark Phoenix with Kinberg has a chance to be anything better than bad.

 

[Zarex]

Yeah, the entirety of FFINO was bad, though I found the opening with L'il Benji and L'il Reed actually kinda charming. But it made its bones with everything after the one year time jump, which was as mind boggling awful as a superhero movie can possibly be. And that was 100% pure Kinberg.

 

[kguillou]

Personally I thought the first 20 minutes or so of FFINO was good and showed promise. I liked the comradery between Teller, Jordan and the others. But then the movie steadily torpedoed after that, especially after Reed ran away the from the facility. You could literally feel that something went horribly wrong in post production and editing after the first act.

 

[Dark Raven]

Yeah, the entirety of FFINO was bad, though I found the opening with L'il Benji and L'il Reed actually kinda charming. But it made its bones with everything after the one year time jump, which was as mind boggling awful as a superhero movie can possibly be. And that was 100% pure Kinberg.

I fell asleep at the beginning, awoke to see "one year later" appear on screen and wondered how long I had been watching this movie and why it was still so boring.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Yeah, the entirety of FFINO was bad, though I found the opening with L'il Benji and L'il Reed actually kinda charming. But it made its bones with everything after the one year time jump, which was as mind boggling awful as a superhero movie can possibly be. And that was 100% pure Kinberg.

Personally I thought the first 20 minutes or so of FFINO was good and showed promise. I liked the comradery between Teller, Jordan and the others. But then the movie steadily torpedoed after that, especially after Reed ran away the from the facility. You could literally feel that something went horribly wrong in post production and editing after the first act.

I fell asleep at the beginning, awoke to see "one year later" appear on screen and wondered how long I had been watching this movie and why it was still so boring.

If I had to guess, I'd say Trank's story was:

First Act - introduce characters
Second Act - characters open a portal go through, and explore an alien dimension where they are exposed to an environment that alters their genetic make-up.
Third Act - Characters learn to deal with their 'disabilities' and by the end they have grown and come to terms with what they are.

As Fantastic Four fans, that wouldn't have been right at all, but as a stand-alone sci-fi film, it could have been interesting and intriguing if done right.

But I suspect Kinberg and the studio said: "We can't do this. This isn't a superhero movie. We need a big battle to save the world in the third act."

But they didn't have time to create a new script and hire a new director because they were under the gun to start filming or lose the rights.

So instead of starting over, like they should have or allowing Trank to make his film, Kinberg went to Baton Rouge and started rewriting and rewriting and trying to twist that story into something that had a big battle in the third act, and that's why the third act felt so out of place and disconnected.

And during that process, Trank likely became increasingly frustrated that he wasn't able to make the film he wanted to make and that led him to withdraw and become the mess we heard about.

 

[Fallen]

2019:

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

2019:

That might go over some people's heads, but it's brilliant.

 

[Iceman]

I know I'm all alone on this, but I've always felt Kinberg was more of the problem with Fant4stic than Trank.

Yeah, Trank wasn't a fan of the FF and he had his own idea and wanted to make his own movie and that was a problem, but I wonder if he had been given the freedom to do it without Kinberg and the studio breathing down his neck if he wouldn't have at least made an interesting film that might have worked (though not as a true FF film).

I really enjoyed Chronicle and I thought it was well-directed, and my gut tells me this Capone film could be pretty good.

... But I don't think Dark Phoenix with Kinberg has a chance to be anything better than bad.

Yeah, having Kinberg as your writer is a huge (almost insurmountable) burden.

 

[Smurphftw]

I fell asleep at the beginning, awoke to see "one year later" appear on screen and wondered how long I had been watching this movie and why it was still so boring.

I think the general consensus is that the coma-inducingly dull part of the movie was directed by Trank, and the irredeemably awful part of the movie was directed by Kinberg.

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

Somebody stop him! Call Iger!

 

[WeaponXCII]

2019:

Thank you for this! Did you make it? I’ve tried searching for it but I could never find it.