The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - Part 11

[VenomsMom]

The neighbor took a beautiful Ferrari. And turned it into a Pinto. Now they will try to sell the Pinto back for Ferrari price tag. Or just slap a fresh coat of paint and drive it round the block again. Better analogy.

 

[VenomsMom]

I thought Fox have a licence not an outright ownership.

You know whats worse? Fox found out they can take the tires off that Pinto and put it on another car to drive to extend the lease. Which is my Doom movie analogy. Marvel is still in so much pain from getting screwed.

 

[superion]

Not a single one of these studios until very recently had a division or co. dedicated solely to the production of whatever cb property they have at their disposal.

I would have DC "share" or lease their characters to other studios in a heartbeat.

You are the only DC fan that feels that way. I think DC fans are very happy that there movies can feature all their characters in the same universe. This crap with Fox and SONY just pisses me off so much. Marvel fans will never get to see the Marvel universe reproduced accurately on screen.

I just want to see all of Fox's movies flop but even if they do it won't matter because this Doom movie will probably be a cheapo $50 million or less production made just to keep the rights away from Marvel. I will never understand why Marvel allowed Fox to make Legion and Gifted. Marvel seems to get nothing out of it and Fox just continues to screw them every chance they get.

 

[UltimatePyro9]

I take solace that Fant4stic bombed hard in theaters. If FOX wants to make this Doctor Doom movie, they're gonna have to market it hard so it won't end up like Fant4stic.

 

[Dark Raven]

They need someone to test out the market before it crashes. Like a crash test dummy. Where can we find one of them?

 

[TheVileOne]

Thanks Captain Obvious!

You're welcome Captain Hindsight.

 

[wobbly]

You are the only DC fan that feels that way. I think DC fans are very happy that there movies can feature all their characters in the same universe. This crap with Fox and SONY just pisses me off so much. Marvel fans will never get to see the Marvel universe reproduced accurately on screen.

I just want to see all of Fox's movies flop but even if they do it won't matter because this Doom movie will probably be a cheapo $50 million or less production made just to keep the rights away from Marvel. I will never understand why Marvel allowed Fox to make Legion and Gifted. Marvel seems to get nothing out of it and Fox just continues to screw them every chance they get.

As far as we know they get a cut of the action from the shows, but that's it at the moment.

Which seems like a ###king stupid deal to me.

It does stand to reason that as it was Fox approaching Disney for the TV deal the mouse was in the driving seat for the negotiations (which did go on for some time). Money? They aint hard up which does beg the question: Why give competition they supposedly don't get on too well with a free pass at more cash and expanded control over their IP?

I figure there was more to that deal than we know at this time, but evidently the FF themselves certainly were not on the table.

Other possible bargaining chips would be distribution rights for Star Wars ANH, trades for other characters under Fox's wing that they probably wont ever use, or maybe even re-negotiating the old agreements (or parts of them) to more favourable terms.

If Disney did just let Fox have the shows for some $$$ I'd be both surprised and very disappointed. Very much a wasted opportunity.

 

[TheVileOne]

The reason Marvel made a deal with Fox on the TV shows is that they are probably getting a nice cut of the profits. There's a lot of profits in TV revenue these days. The DC CW shows rake in about $1 billion a year.

Also, Marvel can't make those shows themselves due to Fox's control of the X-Men film franchise. They tried making their own X-Men show years back in Mutant X and Fox sued them. So now they can profit off of the X-Men brand on TV at least. It's probably also low-risk for Marvel, and Fox probably eats up most of the costs and financial risk.

As for why they did it, it's that simple, money. Disney is in no position to make X-Men TV shows anytime soon. They get a piece of the co-production pie and they get money from it. That's good for Marvel/Disney whether anyone here is willing to admit it or not. Once again, Disney had no good position to start making X-Men shows themselves. The Marvel TV shows that ABC and Marvel produce are all based in the MCU. So they can't make MCU shows for the X-Men set in the MCU without risking a potential infringement against Fox's X-Men movie license. It's very simple.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I take solace that Fant4stic bombed hard in theaters. If FOX wants to make this Doctor Doom movie, they're gonna have to market it hard so it won't end up like Fant4stic.

It hasn't even been a full 2 years since that absolute EMBARRASSMENT. Any other studio would have the sense and decency to not remind us of it and rub salt in the wound.

They have no shame when they should be very, very ashamed.

Now I think I finally understand what they did with the Thing. He represents Fox, standing there with no d*** and completely naked for the world to see.

For God's sake, put some pants on and slink away with the shame you so fully deserve, you pathetic losers.

 

[Spiderine]

The reason Marvel made a deal with Fox on the TV shows is that they are probably getting a nice cut of the profits. There's a lot of profits in TV revenue these days. The DC CW shows rake in about $1 billion a year.

Also, Marvel can't make those shows themselves due to Fox's control of the X-Men film franchise. They tried making their own X-Men show years back in Mutant X and Fox sued them. So now they can profit off of the X-Men brand on TV at least. It's probably also low-risk for Marvel, and Fox probably eats up most of the costs and financial risk.

As for why they did it, it's that simple, money. Disney is in no position to make X-Men TV shows anytime soon. They get a piece of the co-production pie and they get money from it. That's good for Marvel/Disney whether anyone here is willing to admit it or not. Once again, Disney had no good position to start making X-Men shows themselves. The Marvel TV shows that ABC and Marvel produce are all based in the MCU. So they can't make MCU shows for the X-Men set in the MCU without risking a potential infringement against Fox's X-Men movie license. It's very simple.

I am starting to believe you are a100 percent right. And I was one of the naysayers. Thought they would get more out of it.
I also believe any talks regarding the FF have been minimal with little progress.

 

[Stark Bauer]

Keep Hope Alive!

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Keep Hope Alive!

That's awesome. Who's the artist?

 

[terry78]

God.

 

[Dark Raven]

It hasn't even been a full 2 years since that absolute EMBARRASSMENT. Any other studio would have the sense and decency to not remind us of it and rub salt in the wound.

They have no shame when they should be very, very ashamed.

Now I think I finally understand what they did with the Thing. He represents Fox, standing there with no d*** and completely naked for the world to see.

For God's sake, put some pants on and slink away with the shame you so fully deserve, you pathetic losers.

They need someone to go round with a bell following them around and shouting "shame!"

[YT]S_EuNmQOpbw[/YT]

 

[ADollarADay]

As far as we know they get a cut of the action from the shows, but that's it at the moment.

Which seems like a ###king stupid deal to me.

It does stand to reason that as it was Fox approaching Disney for the TV deal the mouse was in the driving seat for the negotiations (which did go on for some time). Money? They aint hard up which does beg the question: Why give competition they supposedly don't get on too well with a free pass at more cash and expanded control over their IP?

I figure there was more to that deal than we know at this time, but evidently the FF themselves certainly were not on the table.

Other possible bargaining chips would be distribution rights for Star Wars ANH, trades for other characters under Fox's wing that they probably wont ever use, or maybe even re-negotiating the old agreements (or parts of them) to more favourable terms.

If Disney did just let Fox have the shows for some $$$ I'd be both surprised and very disappointed. Very much a wasted opportunity.

It is pretty obvious that's it. If they did get anything besides participation from the TV shows, it was just certain characters, either from FF or from X-Men (i.e. SS, Galactus, Storm, etc). Or something else as well, i.e. a change in the terms of the contract. Instead of 6 years 11 months to start production on FF, have it be 3 years 9 months like Spiderman and possibly XMen. Instead of getting 2% of the gross for X-Men movies - and possibly FF - get 5% like apparently what they get for Deadpool. Instead of 100,000 extension make it a couple of million of dollars to extend + adjusted for inflation and at certain times (licensees have to pay Marvel a fee after a movie is released to extend the rights to its fullest. X-Men's original fee was 100K to extend (lol). There's no reason to believe that value is any different today).

Those changes above are things I would see that would make sense to Marvel/Disney.

 

[Zarex]

The reason Marvel made a deal with Fox on the TV shows is that they are probably getting a nice cut of the profits. There's a lot of profits in TV revenue these days. The DC CW shows rake in about $1 billion a year.

Also, Marvel can't make those shows themselves due to Fox's control of the X-Men film franchise. They tried making their own X-Men show years back in Mutant X and Fox sued them. So now they can profit off of the X-Men brand on TV at least. It's probably also low-risk for Marvel, and Fox probably eats up most of the costs and financial risk.

As for why they did it, it's that simple, money. Disney is in no position to make X-Men TV shows anytime soon. They get a piece of the co-production pie and they get money from it. That's good for Marvel/Disney whether anyone here is willing to admit it or not. Once again, Disney had no good position to start making X-Men shows themselves. The Marvel TV shows that ABC and Marvel produce are all based in the MCU. So they can't make MCU shows for the X-Men set in the MCU without risking a potential infringement against Fox's X-Men movie license. It's very simple.

If Disney/Marvel cracked open the horribly lopsided 1993 X-Men character licensing agreement and came away with only a piece of a couple of TV shows, that's a terrible, awful deal. As others have said many times before, the Mouse is not exactly hard up for cash, and could make much more from regaining character rights than they could from Legion or Gifted. They were in no rush. Making short sighted deals for quick cash got them into these bad licensing deals in the first place.

And if Disney/Marvel wanted to make money on their X-Men characters they could put them on T shirts, the upcoming Lego and Capcom video games, posters and Halloween costumes rather than cutting them out of all licensing agreements. The FOX TV deal goes against everything Disney has done, or more accurately hasn't done with the characters since they bought out Ike. Maybe you've got it all figured out, but I still find it baffling.

 

[Spiderine]

Its baffling to say the least to us all. I cant believe the terms of this deal has not been disclosed yet. If it were something major you would think it would have been leaked by trades.

Granting Fox these shows puts them in competition aganst Disney own networks. Just for a piece of the action? I still want to believe theres more because makes little sense to me. These FF announcements have flatlined a lot of my hopes. Call it a game of chicken from Fox. I dont buy the Fantastic kids but that Doom movie on the cheap could happen.

 

[Darkraid]

I think Fox is trying to threaten Disney. ''If you don't buy the rights to FF back we will continue to tarnish the FF brand by making crappy movies!''

 

[Stark Bauer]

That's awesome. Who's the artist?

John Gallagher.

This is his Fantastic Four (and Silver Surfer) vs Galactus

 

[Stark Bauer]

Silver Surfer By Gallagher (this would not be out of place in a GOTG movie imho)

Doctor Doom By Gallagher

 

[First Avenger]

These drawings are something else.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

John Gallagher.

This is his Fantastic Four (and Silver Surfer) vs Galactus

Cool! Thanks for sharing. I don't think I've seen any of these.

 

[TheVileOne]

If Disney/Marvel cracked open the horribly lopsided 1993 X-Men character licensing agreement and came away with only a piece of a couple of TV shows, that's a terrible, awful deal. As others have said many times before, the Mouse is not exactly hard up for cash, and could make much more from regaining character rights than they could from Legion or Gifted. They were in no rush. Making short sighted deals for quick cash got them into these bad licensing deals in the first place.

And if Disney/Marvel wanted to make money on their X-Men characters they could put them on T shirts, the upcoming Lego and Capcom video games, posters and Halloween costumes rather than cutting them out of all licensing agreements. The FOX TV deal goes against everything Disney has done, or more accurately hasn't done with the characters since they bought out Ike. Maybe you've got it all figured out, but I still find it baffling.

Marvel handed over Sony full control of the Spider-Man live film rights so they could get all the merchandising rights. That worked out for them in the long run. I don't think it's a terrible, awful deal at all.

They weren't going to regain those X-Men character rights anyway at the time. This was probably they could best deal they could make.

Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's terrible for them.

 

[Zarex]

Marvel handed over Sony full control of the Spider-Man live film rights so they could get all the merchandising rights. That worked out for them in the long run. I don't think it's a terrible, awful deal at all.

They weren't going to regain those X-Men character rights anyway at the time. This was probably they could best deal they could make.

Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's terrible for them.

The Spider-Man deal wasnt terrible awful because Disney got 100% ownership of the valuable merchandise rights and reports at the time of the movie deal was that it played a role in Sony ultimately deciding to partner up. I don't see any such upside in the current X-Men deal. Maybe ill think about it different if the terms leak out.

 

[TheVileOne]

Well we don't really know the full terms of the merchandising rights for X-Men TV or the current state of the X-Men films, do we?

Also, despite what anyone says, X-men merchandise still does get made. It's just based on the comics and not the films or TV shows. Though it seems hot toys collectibles and the like are the exceptions