The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - - Part 12

[InCali]

Everything you described...Gunn has done. Plus it's gonna be Marvel Studios and ITS GONNA HAVE HUMOUR. there's no getting away from that fact of life. My other choice would be Brad Bird, director and creator of The Incredibles.

The only thing wrong with Marvel TV division is Scott Buck. Daredevil is up there with the first Iron Man.

The FF without humor is like a day without bad news from The White House....wullll.....you know wut I mean.

 

[UltimatePyro9]

Considering that Fant4stic was so humorless (along with being dull, visually dark, and an all around mess) maybe some humor wouldn't be a bad idea. Admittedly, Marvel Studios can be hit and miss with its humor (mostly hit in my opinion) its nowhere near what the Tim Story films tried to do.

Though I agree that if (or when) MS has a chance to revitalize the F4, a new director should be in charge instead of Gunn.

 

[Dasher10]

I'm in favor of Nacho Vigalondo handling Hulk and Christopher Nolan or Michael Rymer directing Fantastic Four.

 

[Dark Raven]

No to Nolan doing FF.

 

[jaymes_e06]

On the topic of individual characters in a new film how do you think they should handle the teams powers? For example there are times when IW has had the power to make invisible bubbles in people's stomachs and also put thin forcefields around multiple objects giving her effectively telekinesis. Do you feel like things like that veer into OP or making her more badass?

Not to mention Malice.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

What if Fox hire Scott Buck now to work on the next FF movie and see if he can out-Trank Trank?

Might as well get Ridley Scott.

 

[Crimz]

Everything you described...Gunn has done. Plus it's gonna be Marvel Studios and ITS GONNA HAVE HUMOUR. there's no getting away from that fact of life. My other choice would be Brad Bird, director and creator of The Incredibles.

The only thing wrong with Marvel TV division is Scott Buck. Daredevil is up there with the first Iron Man.

I know it's going to have humor and I want to, but Guardians is a comedy which the FF should not be. I also think that the feel of the movie should be different, the environments the FF explore should almost be another character themselves that's how important they are. The FF should be science and exploring unknown focused, like a hybrid of Star Trek, Star Wars, Doctor Who and Indiana Jones, but with a super-powered family.

I think a different director needs to helm this, but I'm not sure who.

On the topic of individual characters in a new film how do you think they should handle the teams powers? For example there are times when IW has had the power to make invisible bubbles in people's stomachs and also put thin forcefields around multiple objects giving her effectively telekinesis. Do you feel like things like that veer into OP or making her more badass?

Not to mention Malice.

I never liked how the movies did Sue's force-fields. They made them look too much like energy-waves when they should look solid and like glass. I think they should not use her internal powers unless the films decide to go the Malice route or a villain in the story calls for her taking drastic action. Here's how I think they're powers in action should be handled:

Ben - The easiest to do. Have him brawl like most other super-strength heroes. The only difference is that his durability should be emphasized as he can really take a beating. Make people want Hulk vs Thing.

Johnny - More focus on his flying and the speed when he flies. It should be on the level of Spider-Man's web swinging and make the audience go "wow". His fight scenes should usually be with him in the air raining fire down on enemies. He can make fire-constructs, so they should be more varied than a basic fireball and flamethrower. His Nova blast should actually be huge blast that shines like a dying star, not like in the first film where it was a lackluster fire vortex.

Reed - The most difficult to pull off. His powers would not be used as often as the others as he usually relies on his inventions. But that doesn't mean his powers should be shied away from like in Fant4stic. I'd say his powers should usually be for support of the others. But when he fights I'd say take some inspiration from the main character in One Piece and uses his rubber powers to up his damage for example a punch would be stronger if stretches his arm far back and then release it. Shouldn't be afraid to make look gross when contorted as he should look slightly gross.

Sue - She's meant to be the most powerful. Show it. Besides having her block things that could kill the entire team, have her be great offensively too. Her powers are only limited by her imagination so that means she is only limited by the script. She can make her force-fields any shape, size and density. She can smash, crush, explode, suffocate, hurtle, smother, eviscerate, pummel and do much more to enemies without them seeing it coming. For the audiences sake we should see the force-fields like glass, but sometime we shouldn't them at all to make it obvious that they too are invisible. She should be their secret weapon. Also, she too should be able to fly on her force-field shaped like a disc. All that stuff is not even mentioning her invisibility powers!

The team - Their teamwork should be the best in the MCU as they know each other so well and the fights should show that.

Here are some panels from comics to helps show what I mean when they use their powers, mainly of Reed and Sue as they suffered the most power-wise in the films:

Sorry in advance for the amount of images.

 

[Zarex]

Yesterday's news that the James Bond franchise rights are being valued between $2 and $5 billion (With a B!) shows how forward thinking Iger was in buying up Marvel and Lucasfilm when he did. And that he may have dropped the ball by not securing the FF, X-Men and Spidey rights back in 2009, even if it would have been considered an overpay at the time.

Now Bond is different from the Marvel franchises licensed to other studios in that the proposed sale would involve all of the rights (TV, animation, publishing, merchandising), there are multiple potential suitors (Disney/Marvel would benefit more than any other potential bidder by regaining live action rights to their franchises) and none of the Marvel franchises can match James in terms of longevity (especially not 3 time failure the FF). But I can't see FOX selling the X-Men (and all of those characters!) or Sony parting with Spidey for less than $1 Billion, and probably much more than that.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/apple-amazon-join-race-james-bond-film-rights-1035539

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I know it's going to have humor and I want to, but Guardians is a comedy which the FF should not be. I also think that the feel of the movie should be different, the environments the FF explore should almost be another character themselves that's how important they are. The FF should be science and exploring unknown focused, like a hybrid of Star Trek, Star Wars, Doctor Who and Indiana Jones, but with a super-powered family.

I think a different director needs to helm this, but I'm not sure who.



I never liked how the movies did Sue's force-fields. They made them look too much like energy-waves when they should look solid and like glass. I think they should not use her internal powers unless the films decide to go the Malice route or a villain in the story calls for her taking drastic action. Here's how I think they're powers in action should be handled:

Ben - The easiest to do. Have him brawl like most other super-strength heroes. The only difference is that his durability should be emphasized as he can really take a beating. Make people want Hulk vs Thing.

Johnny - More focus on his flying and the speed when he flies. It should be on the level of Spider-Man's web swinging and make the audience go "wow". His fight scenes should usually be with him in the air raining fire down on enemies. He can make fire-constructs, so they should be more varied than a basic fireball and flamethrower. His Nova blast should actually be huge blast that shines like a dying star, not like in the first film where it was a lackluster fire vortex.

Reed - The most difficult to pull off. His powers would not be used as often as the others as he usually relies on his inventions. But that doesn't mean his powers should be shied away from like in Fant4stic. I'd say his powers should usually be for support of the others. But when he fights I'd say take some inspiration from the main character in One Piece and uses his rubber powers to up his damage for example a punch would be stronger if stretches his arm far back and then release it. Shouldn't be afraid to make look gross when contorted as he should look slightly gross.

Sue - She's meant to be the most powerful. Show it. Besides having her block things that could kill the entire team, have her be great offensively too. Her powers are only limited by her imagination so that means she is only limited by the script. She can make her force-fields any shape, size and density. She can smash, crush, explode, suffocate, hurtle, smother, eviscerate, pummel and do much more to enemies without them seeing it coming. For the audiences sake we should see the force-fields like glass, but sometime we shouldn't them at all to make it obvious that they too are invisible. She should be their secret weapon. Also, she too should be able to fly on her force-field shaped like a disc. All that stuff is not even mentioning her invisibility powers!

The team - Their teamwork should be the best in the MCU as they know each other so well and the fights should show that.

Here are some panels from comics to helps show what I mean when they use their powers, mainly of Reed and Sue as they suffered the most power-wise in the films:

Sorry in advance for the amount of images.

I think I would consider limiting Sue's force-fields so they couldn't move, because as it is, she has a huge amount of power and that restriction would just keep her from being TOO powerful.

She could still create "staircases", for example and run up them, but being able to move her force-fields opens up so many possibilities that, while cool, make her too powerful and create too many options (and too much power can lead to story issues - "Why didn't Sue just wrap them all in a force bubble and fly them away?")

I like your point about the visibility of the force-field. In the comics, it was always an "invisible force field" as an obvious tie-in to her invisibility, and in the comics, they often represented them as dotted lines. I think for it to work on film, we should be able to see them in some form. Maybe when they contact something there's a visual 'ripple' that we can see, but as long as nothing's impacting them, we don't see anything.

And I like your comment about Ben's durability. I've always sort of wished they'd talk that up a little more in the comic books. For example, when he battles Hulk, I'd like to see the idea that Hulk is stronger but Thing is tougher. Hulk can punch harder, but he's punching a hard, rocky surface. And even though Hulk's skin is very strong and tough itself, it's still strong flesh, so I'd like to see the Hulk feeling some pain when he hits Ben, and conversely, when Ben punches, he punches with a rocky fist, so even though his punch may not be as hard as the Hulks, the punch should hurt more.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Yesterday's news that the James Bond franchise rights are being valued between $2 and $5 billion (With a B!) shows how forward thinking Iger was in buying up Marvel and Lucasfilm when he did. And that he may have dropped the ball by not securing the FF, X-Men and Spidey rights back in 2009, even if it would have been considered an overpay at the time.

Interesting point. In hindsight, it would have been great if Disney (at the time they were working to buy Marvel) had the foresight to buy the FF rights from Fox. Fox probably would have sold them easier and cheaper in 2009 to a non-Marvel Disney than they would now. But the complication with that is Marvel would have had to be involved and that could have gotten messy if Disney was simultaneously negotiating to buy them.

Spidey and X-Men would have been tougher, but they still probably could have got them for less then than now - even after the Marvel deal.

But many in management were probably already getting nervous with what they were paying just for Marvel (and they didn't know how well it would or would not work), so it would have been a risk to try to buy up all that at once.

 

[Dark Raven]

I wish Disney did acquire the rights to FF. The FF seem like the most Disney-esque of the Marvel heroes. It's sad therefore that we've always gotten a Fox treatment of them. It's like if Fox got their hands on Mickey Mouse and turned him into a dark and gritty character.

 

[Zarex]

And I like your comment about Ben's durability. I've always sort of wished they'd talk that up a little more in the comic books. For example, when he battles Hulk, I'd like to see the idea that Hulk is stronger but Thing is tougher. Hulk can punch harder, but he's punching a hard, rocky surface. And even though Hulk's skin is very strong and tough itself, it's still strong flesh, so I'd like to see the Hulk feeling some pain when he hits Ben, and conversely, when Ben punches, he punches with a rocky fist, so even though his punch may not be as hard as the Hulks, the punch should hurt more.

This one-thousand times. It was tough rooting for Ben in every fight against Old Jade Jaws knowing that he would lose out in the end. But what was even more frustrating was that the battles became more and more lopsided over time. During the Stan and Jack days the Thing could hold his own for a entire comic book. But as the Hulk grew more and more overpowered their battles grew shorter, and Ben needed to rely more on outside "trickeration" to put up a decent fight.

The obvious answer for pre-teen me and the now (ahem) considerably older version was to let the big baby Hulk keep his superior strength but allow Ben to have the advantage in durability. Here's hoping that Feige will right this injustice!

Interesting point. In hindsight, it would have been great if Disney (at the time they were working to buy Marvel) had the foresight to buy the FF rights from Fox. Fox probably would have sold them easier and cheaper in 2009 to a non-Marvel Disney than they would now. But the complication with that is Marvel would have had to be involved and that could have gotten messy if Disney was simultaneously negotiating to buy them.

Spidey and X-Men would have been tougher, but they still probably could have got them for less then than now - even after the Marvel deal.

But many in management were probably already getting nervous with what they were paying just for Marvel (and they didn't know how well it would or would not work), so it would have been a risk to try to buy up all that at once.

I agree that there's no way Iger would have been able to put up another couple of billion to secure X-Men and Spidey rights without watching his stock crumble. Wall Street had enough concerns with the $4 billion he did drop.

But in 2009 Raimi had wrapped up his trilogy and Rothman had enough of the high cost X-Men series and was devoted to solo character spinoffs. There was considerable concern about the long term longevity of both franchises and both FOX and Sony may have looked kindly on a $1 billion or so in a buyout offer. Ah well.

 

[Crimz]

I think I would consider limiting Sue's force-fields so they couldn't move, because as it is, she has a huge amount of power and that restriction would just keep her from being TOO powerful.

She could still create "staircases", for example and run up them, but being able to move her force-fields opens up so many possibilities that, while cool, make her too powerful and create too many options (and too much power can lead to story issues - "Why didn't Sue just wrap them all in a force bubble and fly them away?")

I like your point about the visibility of the force-field. In the comics, it was always an "invisible force field" as an obvious tie-in to her invisibility, and in the comics, they often represented them as dotted lines. I think for it to work on film, we should be able to see them in some form. Maybe when they contact something there's a visual 'ripple' that we can see, but as long as nothing's impacting them, we don't see anything.

And I like your comment about Ben's durability. I've always sort of wished they'd talk that up a little more in the comic books. For example, when he battles Hulk, I'd like to see the idea that Hulk is stronger but Thing is tougher. Hulk can punch harder, but he's punching a hard, rocky surface. And even though Hulk's skin is very strong and tough itself, it's still strong flesh, so I'd like to see the Hulk feeling some pain when he hits Ben, and conversely, when Ben punches, he punches with a rocky fist, so even though his punch may not be as hard as the Hulks, the punch should hurt more.

I don't think she'd be too powerful as the enemies they face would still be great threats to the team. She'd never use the 'force-field inside the body' thing because she's a hero. Also. her weakness of feeling everything that happens to her force-field prevents her from being too OP.

Yeah, Ben needs to be able to put up a great fight with the Hulk. The comics have him lagging behind which is frustrating.

 

[Flint Marko]

Interesting point. In hindsight, it would have been great if Disney (at the time they were working to buy Marvel) had the foresight to buy the FF rights from Fox. Fox probably would have sold them easier and cheaper in 2009 to a non-Marvel Disney than they would now. But the complication with that is Marvel would have had to be involved and that could have gotten messy if Disney was simultaneously negotiating to buy them.

Spidey and X-Men would have been tougher, but they still probably could have got them for less then than now - even after the Marvel deal.

But many in management were probably already getting nervous with what they were paying just for Marvel (and they didn't know how well it would or would not work), so it would have been a risk to try to buy up all that at once.

I remember being surprised that Disney was able to acquire Marvel for just 4 billion. That seemed pretty low to me, even back then.

 

[Spiderine]

Didnt they also pay Paramount for those distribution rights? Did they ever disclose that amount? And they got what they originally wanted from Sony with the merchandising and animation.

Disney may have not been willing to write more checks at the time. Hell they were probaby more interested in Universal themepark rights and Hulk which went nowhere

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Fox announced the FF reboot the day after the Disney/Marvel purchase was announced, so that was almost certainly done as a way of driving up the price (just like the talk of a Doom or FF kids film is designed to drive up the price now).

Marvel probably would have written a reasonable check, but Fox has probably had unreasonable expectations for what they expect to get from 2009 through today.

At some point Fox is going to have to face the fact that they're not going to risk making another film nobody wants, and if they don't offer a fire-sale price, Marvel will just get it for free, and that's when a deal will happen.

 

[Dasher10]

Looks like we'll have to, "keep hope alive" after all the Marvel shows fail to be renewed and Iron Fist: Season 2 is the last one coming. Get these characters back from Netflix!

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Spoiler

I'm most interested in seeing how they'd handle the damsel in distress turning to the most powerful member on film, we still haven't seen that in animation.

 

[Limonade]

I know it's going to have humor and I want to, but Guardians is a comedy which the FF should not be. I also think that the feel of the movie should be different, the environments the FF explore should almost be another character themselves that's how important they are. The FF should be science and exploring unknown focused, like a hybrid of Star Trek, Star Wars, Doctor Who and Indiana Jones, but with a super-powered family.

I think a different director needs to helm this, but I'm not sure who.



I never liked how the movies did Sue's force-fields. They made them look too much like energy-waves when they should look solid and like glass. I think they should not use her internal powers unless the films decide to go the Malice route or a villain in the story calls for her taking drastic action. Here's how I think they're powers in action should be handled:

Ben - The easiest to do. Have him brawl like most other super-strength heroes. The only difference is that his durability should be emphasized as he can really take a beating. Make people want Hulk vs Thing.

Johnny - More focus on his flying and the speed when he flies. It should be on the level of Spider-Man's web swinging and make the audience go "wow". His fight scenes should usually be with him in the air raining fire down on enemies. He can make fire-constructs, so they should be more varied than a basic fireball and flamethrower. His Nova blast should actually be huge blast that shines like a dying star, not like in the first film where it was a lackluster fire vortex.

Reed - The most difficult to pull off. His powers would not be used as often as the others as he usually relies on his inventions. But that doesn't mean his powers should be shied away from like in Fant4stic. I'd say his powers should usually be for support of the others. But when he fights I'd say take some inspiration from the main character in One Piece and uses his rubber powers to up his damage for example a punch would be stronger if stretches his arm far back and then release it. Shouldn't be afraid to make look gross when contorted as he should look slightly gross.

Sue - She's meant to be the most powerful. Show it. Besides having her block things that could kill the entire team, have her be great offensively too. Her powers are only limited by her imagination so that means she is only limited by the script. She can make her force-fields any shape, size and density. She can smash, crush, explode, suffocate, hurtle, smother, eviscerate, pummel and do much more to enemies without them seeing it coming. For the audiences sake we should see the force-fields like glass, but sometime we shouldn't them at all to make it obvious that they too are invisible. She should be their secret weapon. Also, she too should be able to fly on her force-field shaped like a disc. All that stuff is not even mentioning her invisibility powers!

The team - Their teamwork should be the best in the MCU as they know each other so well and the fights should show that.

Here are some panels from comics to helps show what I mean when they use their powers, mainly of Reed and Sue as they suffered the most power-wise in the films:

Sorry in advance for the amount of images.

Oof. Hurts my soul to see a classic comic page opened up like that even if it is F4.

 

[Crimz]

I'm most interested in seeing how they'd handle the damsel in distress turning to the most powerful member on film, we still haven't seen that in animation.

Her growth is one of my favourite things that has happened in comics, I'd love to see that development on screen.

A 60s setting for the first film can actually help achieve that storyline. It can set her up as being held back by the views of women at the time and when they come to the present she can start to show her true potential. It could make the Malice arc and the name change from Invisible Girl to Invisible Woman work.

 

[babykhris]

Interesting point. In hindsight, it would have been great if Disney (at the time they were working to buy Marvel) had the foresight to buy the FF rights from Fox. Fox probably would have sold them easier and cheaper in 2009 to a non-Marvel Disney than they would now. But the complication with that is Marvel would have had to be involved and that could have gotten messy if Disney was simultaneously negotiating to buy them.

Spidey and X-Men would have been tougher, but they still probably could have got them for less then than now - even after the Marvel deal.

But many in management were probably already getting nervous with what they were paying just for Marvel (and they didn't know how well it would or would not work), so it would have been a risk to try to buy up all that at once.

I was around on the forum when Disney purchased Marvel and didn't almost instantly FOX announce they were going to reboot Daredevil Fantastic Four and X-Men. It's obvious FOX don't even want Fantastic Four (every other day there's X-Universe news have we heard one thing regarding the FF??

This just feels like we don't want you to have it especially after Daredevil became a hit.

 

[Stark Bauer]

I think I would consider limiting Sue's force-fields so they couldn't move, because as it is, she has a huge amount of power and that restriction would just keep her from being TOO powerful.

She could still create "staircases", for example and run up them, but being able to move her force-fields opens up so many possibilities that, while cool, make her too powerful and create too many options (and too much power can lead to story issues - "Why didn't Sue just wrap them all in a force bubble and fly them away?")

I like your point about the visibility of the force-field. In the comics, it was always an "invisible force field" as an obvious tie-in to her invisibility, and in the comics, they often represented them as dotted lines. I think for it to work on film, we should be able to see them in some form. Maybe when they contact something there's a visual 'ripple' that we can see, but as long as nothing's impacting them, we don't see anything.

And I like your comment about Ben's durability. I've always sort of wished they'd talk that up a little more in the comic books. For example, when he battles Hulk, I'd like to see the idea that Hulk is stronger but Thing is tougher. Hulk can punch harder, but he's punching a hard, rocky surface. And even though Hulk's skin is very strong and tough itself, it's still strong flesh, so I'd like to see the Hulk feeling some pain when he hits Ben, and conversely, when Ben punches, he punches with a rocky fist, so even though his punch may not be as hard as the Hulks, the punch should hurt more.

I'm hoping that this is the case too. That when Hulk fights Thing, it ends up a draw. Because Hulk is stronger but Thing is tougher. Hulk may be smarter but Thing has more street smarts. Their fights in the MCU should be bigger than anything yet portrayed in the MCU. Neither should be able to easily beat the other, they are evenly matched, Hulk has a slight edge, and it should be stressed that when Hulk wins over Thing, it's by the skin of his teeth. It can easily go in Thing's favour.

As an aside my present fancast for a Marvel Studios FF:
Reed Richards: Patrick Wilson
Susan Storm: Jennifer Lawrence
Johnny Storm: Dylan O'Brien
Ben Grimm: Seth Rogen
Victor Von Doom: Michael Fassbender

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I'm hoping that this is the case too. That when Hulk fights Thing, it ends up a draw. Because Hulk is stronger but Thing is tougher. Hulk may be smarter but Thing has more street smarts. Their fights in the MCU should be bigger than anything yet portrayed in the MCU. Neither should be able to easily beat the other, they are evenly matched, Hulk has a slight edge, and it should be stressed that when Hulk wins over Thing, it's by the skin of his teeth. It can easily go in Thing's favour.

Yeah, if/when they finally do it, I hope it's the most epic battle we've ever seen, and yeah, Hulk has to win, Hulk always wins, but it shouldn't be quick or easy.

And they should show how Ben's smarts and strategy allow him to keep things relatively even. It should be like a fight between a huge, enraged and sort of sloppy brawler vs a smaller, weaker, but skilled and more disciplined boxer.

 

[metaphysician]

My take is, Hulk is stronger. And tougher. He is a step above Ben, when it comes to brickiness. He should win.

What Ben has, though, is skill, cunning, and sheer indomitable will. He can't win against the Hulk. . . but he can keep not-winning against the Hulk for a *long* time, longer than anyone else.

 

[ludovica]

As an aside my present fancast for a Marvel Studios FF:
Reed Richards: Patrick Wilson
Susan Storm: Jennifer Lawrence
Johnny Storm: Dylan O'Brien
Ben Grimm: Seth Rogen
Victor Von Doom: Michael Fassbender

That's almost perfect, I would just pick two actors really close in age for Reed and Sue.