The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - Part 6

[Rorschach2012]

Even if there's a five percent chance, we have to treat it like it's an absolute certainty?

Where do you stand on this topic? Do you want FF to stay at Fox..........?

I don't understand how anyone wouldn't want FF in the MCU....

 

[Smurphftw]

Where do you stand on this topic? Do you want FF to stay at Fox..........?

I don't understand how anyone wouldn't want FF in the MCU....

I initially misread your comment and thought you said "would" and not "wouldn't" lol

 

[Kanon]

More weird stuff on Deadpool and the MCU (adding to the SHIELD helicarrier thing)

Deadpool Deleted Scene Features MCU Connection to The Raft Prison

the scene in question would have depicted main villain Ajax being released from the maximum-security supervillain prison The Raft prior to his involvement in the (present-set) events of the film. The Raft is a prominent location in the Marvel Comics Universe, and also made a (non-deleted) appearance in Captain America: Civil War; where its facilities are used to house Captain America’s anti-registration heroes who are captured by Iron Man’s government-backed team. The connection was not intended to be official, as evidenced by the two versions looking entirely different and no inter-film reference being made.

 

[TheVileOne]

Where do you stand on this topic? Do you want FF to stay at Fox..........?

I don't understand how anyone wouldn't want FF in the MCU....

I kind of want it go back in hibernation for a while and/or Disney to buy back the rights with extreme aggression.

I don't think Fox makes another movie anytime soon, and I hope they don't.

I'm just sort of jaded by reboots though. I think we need some distance with this latest flop before we return to Fantastic Four again.

 

[NotNickFury]

More weird stuff on Deadpool and the MCU (adding to the SHIELD helicarrier thing)

Deadpool Deleted Scene Features MCU Connection to The Raft Prison

"The connection was not intended to be official, as evidenced by the two versions looking entirely different and no inter-film reference being made."

So it sounds coincidental, similar to the Helicarrier. May be one of those things Marvel Studios and Fox had rights to, like with Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

More weird stuff on Deadpool and the MCU (adding to the SHIELD helicarrier thing)

Deadpool Deleted Scene Features MCU Connection to The Raft Prison

"The connection was not intended to be official, as evidenced by the two versions looking entirely different and no inter-film reference being made."

So it sounds coincidental, similar to the Helicarrier. May be one of those things Marvel Studios and Fox had rights to, like with Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver.

I sort of suspect it's a bit of a protest by Tim Miller. I think in Miller's mind, Deadpool is a Marvel character who lives in the Marvel world with all the government agencies, technology etc. that go along with that.

So he's making a film set in that world and going right up to the line the lawyers have drawn while being careful to not go over it.

 

[Spiderine]

Deadpool is also such a unique character anyways who sort of blends the realities of comic films because he'e aware he is a comic book character. They poke fun at the James McAvoy/Stewart Professor X. The Green Lantern/Xmen Origins thing. Its just all fun and games of being Deadpool who is notorious for these things. He even makes fun of the Nick Fury after credit scene in Iron man.

 

[metaphysician]

Where do you stand on this topic? Do you want FF to stay at Fox..........?

I don't understand how anyone wouldn't want FF in the MCU....

That is a question many, many people have asked on the old FF board. To date the only answer even approaching coherency was "To spite Marvel".

 

[Docker2.0]

That is a question many, many people have asked on the old FF board. To date the only answer even approaching coherency was "To spite Marvel".

That's the only reason I can think of as well. Even the response makes no sense. Wanting Disney to buy the rights back or the property to sit for awhile makes no sense, especially when you don't necessarily need the F4 but Doom, Galactus and SS.

 

[Flint Marko]

To date the only answer even approaching coherency was "To spite Marvel".

Yup.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Well FF should at least get a mention at NYCC even if it's not what we're hoping for:

http://www.newyorkcomiccon.com/en/Sessions/31507/MARVEL-50-Years-of-Black-Panther

 

[jaymes_e06]

That is a question many, many people have asked on the old FF board. To date the only answer even approaching coherency was "To spite Marvel".

That's not necessarily true. It's also to keep another company from making a profit off of your property.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

That's not necessarily true. It's also to keep another company from making a profit off of your property.

Isn't that pretty much the same thing? If Marvel makes a profit, it doesn't hurt Fox. The only reason to prevent Marvel making a profit would be pride and spite.

And if Fox truly recognizes the value of the property, why have they chosen to not make films that make them a profit?

I suspect many managers at fox are too foolish arrogant to believe that Marvel could make a profit off FF since, from their perspective, it's a lousy, worthless property that has never justified a decent budget, talented writers and directors or faithfulness to the actual comic book.

 

[jaymes_e06]

How does a company you are competing against for revenue not equate to it effecting Fox? Of course it does don't be silly...

That being said they have completely run this franchise into the ground. Idk how they would ever justify making another film.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

How does a company you are competing against for revenue not equate to it effecting Fox? Of course it does don't be silly...

That being said they have completely run this franchise into the ground. Idk how they would ever justify making another film.

More people going to theaters is good for both studios (often you'll see that when a big movie opens, there's "spillover" and other films do well because people either can't get into their first choice or change their mind or other family members want to see different films).

More people going to super-hero films is good for both studios.

More people going to see Marvel-based characters is good for both studios.

If there was a good superhero film opening every weekend, I'd go to the movies every weekend (and I don't think I'm alone). It's not like I'm going to say: "I'm not going to see the Batman movie this weekend because I saw the Fantastic Four movie last weekend."

When people go to theaters, they see posters and trailers for upcoming films and it gets them in the mood to see those films. They also get familiar with the theaters so it's a comfortable place and a fun thing to do on a weekend. I believe going to films increases, rather than decreases the interest in going to other, future films.

There's a lot of elasticity in the demand for superhero films. It's not like a car where you buy one and then you're set. People can see multiple superhero films in the same year and even in the same day if they choose to.

If they were really smart, they'd join forces with Marvel like Sony did, but even if they don't, I don't believe a big box-office FF film would take one dime out of Fox's pocket. On the contrary, if Marvel actually did make a huge FF film, I think it would directly increase revenue at Fox. Not just by increasing interest in properties like X-Men, the interest in FF from a big film would generate some interest in previous FF films and likely directly lead to increased sales of Fox FF DVD's and Blu-rays and direct revenue in that form.

 

[Flint Marko]

The way I've heard it explained, they don't want to let an IP revert to their biggest competitor who would eventually make a movie and take an opening weekend slot. Holding onto the rights is their way of limiting the Marvel brand, as they know Disney wants it. If Disney gets the property back and makes a ton of money (which, let's face it, they totally would), whoever allowed the rights to slip could have their head on the chopping block.

That being said, the original question posed was "why would anyone not want the FF in the MCU", referring to the users on this message board. I understand why Fox doesn't want the FF in the MCU, but I don't understand why anyone who considers themselves a fan of the genre would want Fox to maintain the rights. I really had trouble understanding why anyone was looking forward to the dumpster fire that was FFINO.

 

[Joe Rockhead]

The way I've heard it explained, they don't want to let an IP revert to their biggest competitor who would eventually make a movie and take an opening weekend slot. Holding onto the rights is their way of limiting the Marvel brand, as they know Disney wants it. If Disney gets the property back and makes a ton of money (which, let's face it, they totally would), whoever allowed the rights to slip could have their head on the chopping block.

That being said, the original question posed was "why would anyone not want the FF in the MCU", referring to the users on this message board. I understand why Fox doesn't want the FF in the MCU, but I don't understand why anyone who considers themselves a fan of the genre would want Fox to maintain the rights. I really had trouble understanding why anyone was looking forward to the dumpster fire that was FFINO.

I would expect at least some heads should have rolled after Rupert Murdoch highlighted FF 2015's weak performance at the box office as affecting their quarterly profits.

That being the case, if he were the one to say 'get the deal done' -- it really wouldn't matter to anyone if Disney were to be able to reap huge rewards from Fantastic Four.

 

[Zarex]

That's not necessarily true. It's also to keep another company from making a profit off of your property.

I doubt that the folks at FOX consider the FF to be "theirs" since the property has been a massive pain in the behind and, unlike the X-Men, hasn't earned them a dime in well over a decade. I would be very surprised if we see any cooperation on the X-Men movie franchise, as the Murdochs are going to hold onto the mutants like grim death.

An interesting (I think) aside: I visited Universal Studios in Hollywood a few weeks back and the new special effects show ended with a tribute to Universal films. Included in that approximately 5 minute tribute was two scenes from 2008's Incredible Hulk. (Fun fact - the Hulk was featured in a show I saw the last time I visited Universal waaaay back when the TV show was on the air). I know many folks are hoping Universal and Disney/Marvel will come to some sort of an agreement on the big green guy's distribution rights, but that may be difficult.

Like FOX and the X-Men, Universal considers Bruce Banner's alter ego to be "theirs". They introduced him to the GP in the TV series, produced the TV movies and his first solo feature and then distributed the 2008 Marvel Studios production. A Hulk themed coaster is a feature attraction at Universal Orlando. It could very well be that Universal is demanding future involvement in any solo Hulk features going forward.

 

[Dark Raven]

The way I've heard it explained, they don't want to let an IP revert to their biggest competitor who would eventually make a movie and take an opening weekend slot. Holding onto the rights is their way of limiting the Marvel brand, as they know Disney wants it. If Disney gets the property back and makes a ton of money (which, let's face it, they totally would), whoever allowed the rights to slip could have their head on the chopping block.

That being said, the original question posed was "why would anyone not want the FF in the MCU", referring to the users on this message board. I understand why Fox doesn't want the FF in the MCU, but I don't understand why anyone who considers themselves a fan of the genre would want Fox to maintain the rights. I really had trouble understanding why anyone was looking forward to the dumpster fire that was FFINO.

Ask Willie Lumpkin. He camped out for several days for the opening weekend of FFINO.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Ask Willie Lumpkin. He camped out for several days for the opening weekend of FFINO.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I doubt that the folks at FOX consider the FF to be "theirs" since the property has been a massive pain in the behind and, unlike the X-Men, hasn't earned them a dime in well over a decade. I would be very surprised if we see any cooperation on the X-Men movie franchise, as the Murdochs are going to hold onto the mutants like grim death.

This is what I don't get. They don't like it and can't make money off it. Why would they think anybody would like it and be able to make money off it? To deny Marvel the opportunity to take a shot would basically be to admit: "Marvel is smarter and better at making movies than us."

Or put another way: Howard the Duck had a 15% on Rotten Tomatoes and there has only been one film. Fant4stic had a 9% plus 2 other bad films which have damaged the property.

Why would Fox reasonably think the FF rights were any more valuable to Marvel than Howard the Duck? Marvel could just as easily make a blockbuster Howard the Duck film as they could FF.

And Howard the Duck is just one of 1000 other similar characters. I'm an FF fan, so I want to see an FF film, but in the grand scheme, FF isn't a golden-egg laying goose that Fox needs to hold on to just to prevent Marvel from having it.

 

[InternetPeople]

I don't drill for oil but if I had property with oil on it that property would still be worth something and I would still hold on to those rights until I got a good deal. Never would I give up my property because I don't know how to drill for oil.

 

[Endeavor]

I don't drill for oil but if I had property with oil on it that property would still be worth something and I would still hold on to those rights until I got a good deal. Never would I give up my property because I don't know how to drill for oil.

This analogy doesn't work, because in it "you" recognize the value in the land, you know it has oil, whereas everything we've seen so far indicates that FOX doesn't recognize the value in the FF IP.

 

[Amadeus Arkham]

A more fitting analogy would be if you leased your land out to someone, who then took a massive dump all over it and burned your house down before sitting in the middle of it wondering why you won't give them the world for it.

 

[Endeavor]

lol