The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion & Speculation Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 105

[gorillanesthsia]

You guys think she gets locked up after she tries to leave Gotham?

Or earlier?

If you think about it, if she runs away and breaks her shady alignment with Bane, the best place for her would be safe hid away in prison...

Discounting the dramatic irony that we know Blackgate is going to get blown up and the prisoners are all going to be released.

 

[BatLobster]

This.

Thats why it sucks that this will most likely be a Batman Returns type of situation, just as TDK was a B89 situation.

I kind of doubt that. Batman Returns was The Penguin's story more than anything. Everything we've heard about TDKR is how it's about finishing Bruce Wayne's story. If anything, I think a more accurate comparison would be Batman Forever. You had two over-the-top villains chewing up scenery, plus the addition of Robin, but it remained Bruce's story.

Wow, I'm not the biggest BF fan, but I have to say that somehow seems like an accomplishment worth commending now that I think about it.

 

[The Batman]

But the dude said Bruce has more to do. Lets not proclaim doom and gloom yet.

Where's the doom coming from? It'll still be a great film, I'm just prepared for all eyes to be on Catwoman, expanded Bruce role be damned.

See? Lol.

 

[pixiesvision]

If Anne as Catwoman is all people talk about after seeing TDKR, then the story will almost be secondary to the performance. That wouldn't be effective storytelling. I know that both Nolans have probably done a good job to balance the characters while making Bruce the core this time around. At least I hope. Plus "threatening" to steal the show is different from assuredly stealing the show...

 

[kthevs]

Then he's lying. While a good deal of what nukethefridge sounds dubious the one part that is true is that Bane was part of the LoS and kicked out by Ra's.

That was confirmed through one of those official fact booklets or whatever.

Have you read the NTF stuff. It's full of stuff that is false. 1- Selina's first scene is not as a maid in the Wayne mansion. 2- He/she says that Talia just disappears. No mention of the truck chase. 3- He/she says Batman fights Bane at the end of the movie in Bane's hideout. False. They fight in city hall.

 

[AnneFan]

I don't see the issue with people thinking other character's 'stole the show'. Batman is a strong character and the centrepiece of it all, even if people think he isn't in a particular film. The entire environment revolves around him. You're only as good as the villains, and Batman has the best. You shouldn't downplay the effectiveness of the villains. Let them be the best they can be.

 

[pixiesvision]

Especially the male categories. Crowded as hell with Oscar favorite actors and more Oscar baity roles from award friendly movies for both the Lead and Supporting! There are more open slots in the actress categories. It's too early to tell though but I'd still say that unless there's another breakout, Anne will get the Best Supporting Actress gold for Fantine.

Definitely. Anne as Fantine will get the spot before Anne as Selina Kyle.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

Where's the doom coming from? It'll still be a great film, I'm just prepared for all eyes to be on Catwoman, expanded Bruce role be damned.



See? Lol.

Bruce is too serious. Too much of a brooder. Perhaps he should be more of a lovable, quippy dbag like Anthony Stark. And his villains utterly bland. Maybe then Batman would steal the show.

 

[kthevs]

Most people who cite Batman and Catwoman's marriage fail to explain that their marriage only existed in an alternate universe which was a pastiche of the Golden Age universe, where Selina was the only credible love interest Batman had. It was safe to marry Earth 2 Batman, he wasn't the "main" Batman anyway.

Also, where did you get the idea that Bruce and Selina were married or close to marriage in the New 52 Verse? If anything, its the opposite. Like you mentioned, Its back to square one where Selina dosent even know Batman's identity, with Bats and Cats being pretty much friends with benefits. Not only that, in another Batbook Bruce was in a relationship with someone else, while flirting with a rich girl in another book.

While Bruce and Selina's relationship has been examined, it always comes down to the fact that Bruce can't trust Selina. Writers like Grant Morrison understand that their relationship is better when its marked with tension. Batman and Catwoman really aren't supposed to end up together, and its good that most creators seem to understand that.

Nolan has already said that he doesn't care what's in the comics. He'll tell the story he wants to tell.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[BestGirl]

Where's the doom coming from? It'll still be a great film, I'm just prepared for all eyes to be on Catwoman, expanded Bruce role be damned.

The imdb reviewer said that Bane's the one who steals the show and that you can't take your eyes off him, so let's not act like Catwoman is the only one stealing Bruce's thunder.

 

[JKMoneyShizzle]

How likely is it that Batman uses his cane, not because of Bane, but because of his fall at the end of TDK?

possible he got shot in the ribs and the fall could have done some major tissue and nerve damage to him.

Don't worry guys, Batman will def. not die.

And Catwoman and him won't be galloping off together forever.

She will be aligned with him and leave him with blue balls after playfully screwing him over once again leading him to smile. They're destined to do this forever.

saddening i kind of want him to die. From the words of Ra's "he can be more than a man he can be a legend or everlasting" even with batman/bruce dead the legacy he left behind will not vanish he will be an everlasting memory for gotham

 

[Deserana]

This is a Bruce comeback film. But that won't work unless its drilled into our heads that the guy he has to beat is tough guy evil menacing badass. We need to cheer him on against a major threat. I think Nolan will have got the balance spot on. Yes a Bruce centric film would be great but we had that with BB and with this he needs a big threat to comeback with. Otherwise it could fall into Iron Man territory which for me had a great protagonist who was really at the centre and a villain that had potential. But in the end you knew he would easily beat the villain and save the day as the villain just wasn't intimidating.

Bane is the definition of intimidation judging by those trailers. He looks like a villain who we want to see go down. Yes I'd love to see Bruce at the centre of it all but not if that means the villain looks like an easy win. I have no idea even when Bruce comes back how his fights with Bane are gonna go. I'd rather have a large focus on the villain with a strong powerful and emotional story for the protagonist only slightly in the background. So when he does come to front you know its gonna be big and challenging and not an easy victory. This Bruce Wayne's story as Nolan keeps saying. He wont be kept on the sidelines.

 

[craigdbfan]

Have you read the NTF stuff. It's full of stuff that is false. 1- Selina's first scene is not as a maid in the Wayne mansion. 2- He/she says that Talia just disappears. No mention of the truck chase. 3- He/she says Batman fights Bane at the end of the movie in Bane's hideout. False. They fight in city hall.

Did you read what I wrote? I said most of the stuff is dubious. I just said the part about Ra's and Bane was right.

 

[The Batman]

I kind of doubt that. Batman Returns was The Penguin's story more than anything. Everything we've heard about TDKR is how it's about finishing Bruce Wayne's story. If anything, I think a more accurate comparison would be Batman Forever. You had two over-the-top villains chewing up scenery, plus the addition of Robin, but it remained Bruce's story.

Wow, I'm not the biggest BF fan, but I have to say that somehow seems like an accomplishment worth commending now that I think about it.

I don't think you understand my comparison. Whether or not its penguin's story (Which I dont really agree with) is somewhat irrelevent. Most people walked out of the theater talking about Michelle's Catwoman. While Batman will have a better role here than he did in BR, and while I think Bane will have just as good a role as Danny's Penguin, Anne will probably walk away with the buzz. God knows I'd love to be wrong on this.

 

[BatLobster]

This is a Bruce comeback film. But that won't work unless its drilled into our heads that the guy he has to beat is tough guy evil menacing badass. We need to cheer him on against a major threat. I think Nolan will have got the balance spot on. Yes a Bruce centric film would be great but we had that with BB and with this he needs a big threat to comeback with. Otherwise it could fall into Iron Man territory which for me had a great protagonist who was really at the centre and a villain that had potential. But in the end you knew he would easily beat the villain and save the day as the villain just wasn't intimidating.

Bane is the definition of intimidation judging by those trailers. He looks like a villain who we want to see go down. Yes I'd love to see Bruce at the centre of it all but not if that means the villain looks like an easy win. I have no idea even when Bruce comes back how his fights with Bane are gonna go. Bruce-centric would be great but I'd rather have a large focus on the villain with a strong powerful and emotional story for the protagonist only slightly in the background. So when he does come to front you know its gonna be big and challenging and not an easy victory.

Spot on. This movie is about Batman rising...

I mean, it doesn't get more epic than that.

 

[pixiesvision]

I don't see the issue with people thinking other character's 'stole the show'. Batman is a strong character and the centrepiece of it all, even if people think he isn't in a particular film. The entire environment revolves around him. You're only as good as the villains, and Batman has the best. You shouldn't downplay the effectiveness of the villains. Let them be the best they can be.

Well, I had issues with previous Batman films (i.e. Burton, Schumacher's) handling of Batman and the villains. I know Nolan has done a better job, and I have no doubt that the audience won't be left without feeling and knowing that Bruce's story is just as important as the excitement that the villains/supporting characters present.

 

[Sharkboy]

Then he's lying. While a good deal of what nukethefridge sounds dubious the one part that is true is that Bane was part of the LoS and kicked out by Ra's.

That was confirmed through one of those official fact booklets or whatever.

Well even fake spoilers have to get some things right, I'm not entirely convinced, but he did have earlier posts fully explaining (maybe a little too much) the relationship between LoS and Ra's.

Oh and...Bane and Catwoman could easily "steal the show" so to speak and Bruce would still be the center of the story. People tend to recognize scene chewing more than the more stoic subtle roles (like batman), so I'm not expecting a majority of reviews to focus too much on Bale's acting if Hardy and Catwoman are chewing it up with their delicious villainous roles.

 

[kthevs]

Batman Beyond would like a word with you.

In that, he does retire, and he ends up alone. Bruce can attain happiness without shacking up with Miranda OR Selina, two untrustworthy women with their own agenda at the end of the day.

Read Bale's quote. To paraphrase, Bruce has missed out on all things that life is worth living for, and he'll have to learn all that stuff later on in life, much later than most people.

You're entitled to your opinion, but for the life of me I can't understand why you would want Bruce to end up as a lonely old hermit and not have any of the normal things everyone else his age has- wife, kids, etc. IMHO, death would be better than such a lonely life. This is not the comics. Nothing is ongoing. This movie will be about finality.

 

[pixiesvision]

This is a Bruce comeback film. But that won't work unless its drilled into our heads that the guy he has to beat is tough guy evil menacing badass. We need to cheer him on against a major threat. I think Nolan will have got the balance spot on. Yes a Bruce centric film would be great but we had that with BB and with this he needs a big threat to comeback with. Otherwise it could fall into Iron Man territory which for me had a great protagonist who was really at the centre and a villain that had potential. But in the end you knew he would easily beat the villain and save the day as the villain just wasn't intimidating.

Bane is the definition of intimidation judging by those trailers. He looks like a villain who we want to see go down. Yes I'd love to see Bruce at the centre of it all but not if that means the villain looks like an easy win. I have no idea even when Bruce comes back how his fights with Bane are gonna go. I'd rather have a large focus on the villain with a strong powerful and emotional story for the protagonist only slightly in the background. So when he does come to front you know its gonna be big and challenging and not an easy victory. This Bruce Wayne's story as Nolan keeps saying. He wont be kept on the sidelines.

Bruce will be the emotional core this time around that's for sure. I guess that in most other superhero films like Iron Man, even Spiderman, the villains really seem secondary which makes the heroes stand out even more.

Not that I want that to happen in TDKR or anything, but a lot of detractors like to say that Batman is almost irrelevant in these films .

 

[Tacit Ronin]

If Anne as Catwoman is all people talk about after seeing TDKR, then the story will almost be secondary to the performance. That wouldn't be effective storytelling. I know that both Nolans have probably done a good job to balance the characters while making Bruce the core this time around. At least I hope. Plus "threatening" to steal the show is different from assuredly stealing the show...

I don't see how one definitely negates the other. Bardem stole the show in NCFOM, does that mean the film didn't have effective storytelling? DDL and Waltz stole TWBB and Inglourious Basterds respectively, did they not tell their stories with effectiveness?

 

[The Joker]

I don't think you understand my comparison. Whether or not its penguin's story (Which I dont really agree with) is somewhat irrelevent. Most people walked out of the theater talking about Michelle's Catwoman. While Batman will have a better role here than he did in BR, and while I think Bane will have just as good a role as Danny's Penguin, Anne will probably walk away with the buzz. God knows I'd love to be wrong on this.

It's a damned if you do and damned if you don't situation. Batman's villains are so in your face and colorful that the only way to do them properly is making them scene stealers because that's their nature. Especially ones like Catwoman and Joker. They have outlandish personalities.

I don't think Ra's or Scarecrow were used to nearly their full potential in Begins, and that's probably why they didn't steal Batman's thunder. They were used to the bare minimum. I think the amount of time Crane spent wearing the Scarecrow mask could be under 2 minutes.

I never ever bought the whole "Joker stole TDK" scenario because to me I think Bale, Eckhart, and Oldman were just as good. Joker was just the most memorable because he was the most outlandish and colorful.

 

[Van Petrol]

t:

 

[BatLobster]

I don't think you understand my comparison. Whether or not its penguin's story (Which I dont really agree with) is somewhat irrelevent. Most people walked out of the theater talking about Michelle's Catwoman. While Batman will have a better role here than he did in BR, and while I think Bane will have just as good a role as Danny's Penguin, Anne will probably walk away with the buzz. God knows I'd love to be wrong on this.

Well...in that case, Batman Begins is the only Batman film out of any of the live-action films where most people were talking about Batman as opposed to the villains. No coincidence that it was the one film that didn't use characters that appeared in the 60s show.

I think this film will have a great balance. Catwoman will definitely garner a lot of buzz, but I think they're setting Bruce up on this amazing journey where we're all going to be rooting so hard for Batman to kick Bane's *ss at the end.

 

[Solidus]

Wait did we get some new news or something?