Why I like the Avengers

[roach]

But they didn't really have any problems with either of them.

Of course i accepted the reasoning that in the first avengers vs ninjas fight they were disadvantaged because of location (ie the hand fight in swarm attacks so if they hit you in an enclosed space they have a big advantage.) and that their biggest present gun (iron man) couldn't cut loose because of that).

you seen that the minute they were in an open space iron man took the ninjas on himself with ease.

and I would believe that...if I never read a Marvel comic before. If I didnt know that Cap has fought hordes of Ninjas(aliens, Nazis and terrorists) by himself....If I didnt know that Spidey is also capable of doing that same feat(hell he beat the Xmen single handedly).

 

[gildea]

and I would believe that...if I never read a Marvel comic before. If I didnt know that Cap has fought hordes of Ninjas(aliens, Nazis and terrorists) by himself....If I didnt know that Spidey is also capable of doing that same feat(hell he beat the Xmen single handedly).

yes in a reasonably open space.
Not in an apartment room where all the space is taken up by the swarming mass of the enemy. In situations like that cap and spidey need room to move. Spidey's brand of acrobatic combat is greatly hampered in that environment. And cap fought nazi armies on the battlefield again an open space.

The location completely changed the shape of that fight. (i'd actually argue as well if only one of the avengers was present they would have faired better also due to not needing to worry about hitting a team mate a la iron man).

 

[bkhedr]

but we havent even seen this in Nu Avengers...unless you call Cage scaring Electro unconscious that

Granted but that's another matter entirely.

Its one thing to comlpain about NA being poorly written (thats I can agree with since it has its ups and downs and it really a matter of opinion) but saying that the team is too underpowered or the concept has been changed, that is what I disagree with.

see if someone says "man i hate Bendis' writing on this book" I can disagree but that's a legitimate opinion

but when someone says "man these guys aren't the Avengers because they arent world shakers" then I can confidently say you are wrong

 

[bkhedr]

and I would believe that...if I never read a Marvel comic before. If I didnt know that Cap has fought hordes of Ninjas(aliens, Nazis and terrorists) by himself....If I didnt know that Spidey is also capable of doing that same feat(hell he beat the Xmen single handedly).

You are absoulutely right, but that does not mean the TEAM is flawed

 

[Chunin]

i love the new avengers, they neded a changeing of the guard. go logan

 

[roach]

it is obvious that were arent gonna see eye to eye on this....If you can read Perez and Busiek's run and see that the concept is the same with Bendis then more power to you.

 

[bkhedr]

That's cool we dont have to agree

but for the record

Busiek/Perez Avengers >>>>>>> Bendis Avengers

 

[roach]

That's cool we dont have to agree

but for the record

Busiek/Perez Avengers >>>>>>> Bendis Avengers

That we agree on......
....I also go to the messageboards at Avengers Assembled and they arent as forgiven of Bendis as we are.

 

[iloveclones]

Here's a list of some of the fearsome villains that the "traditional" Avengers have taken on in the past:

Black Talon
Egghead
Mole Man
Plantman
Ringmaster
Scarecrow
Screaming Mimi
Tiger Shark

And if memory serves, didn't the Runaways just take on Ultron? I didn't see anyone complaining.

 

[Doc Destruction]

Do you really have any idea how powerful Tigershark, Mole Man, and Plantman are, or how smart Egghead is?

Come now.

 

[roach]

Busiek's Run
1-3 Morgan and Mordred....powerful enough to reshape reality
4 New team is formed
5-6 Squadron Supreme and Imus Champion
7 Kree and Supreme Intelligence
8-9 Moses Magnum with powers so enhanced he destroyed an island
10-11 Grim Reaper and zombie Avengers
12 Vs. Thunderbolts
13 AIM and Lord Templar
14 Pagan and Lord Templar
15-18 Wrecking Crew
19-22 Ultron

Yeah those are really "weak" villains

 

[bkhedr]

But it is true that the classic Avengers have fought their share of lames

lets be honest here people. NA isnt great but the Avengers have been both much better and much worse than this throughout the years

 

[roach]

the avengers
...and for those who like to use the excuse that Cap once led a team of himself, Quicksilver, Scarlet Witch and Hawkeye...dont seem to remember that a few issues later Giantman joined...followed by Wasp four issues later....Hercules six issues later...which led to Black Panther and Vision also joining

 

[bkhedr]

nice pic
but how many not so popular or not so powerful members of the team are not in that picture?

heck i dont see Hercules, Wonderman or Hawkeye in those pics

 

[Varient]

good idea since the name champions was found to be rightfully held by a role playin game company

I like your avatar,... Always thought three-D never got enough love,..like SquirrelGirl, the Spot or Scott Lang.


But I hate the ref of "Wannabe Hero."

 

[Alex Summers]

IMO the JLA will beat you with raw power, the Avengers will beat you with heart, teamwork, brains, and bravery


Do you even read JLA comics?

 

[Darthphere]

I hate that we needed Avengers Disassembled to justify this new title. The only good thing to come out Avengers Disassembled is Young Avengers.

 

[bkhedr]

IMO the JLA will beat you with raw power, the Avengers will beat you with heart, teamwork, brains, and bravery


Do you even read JLA comics?

No I dont but that doesnt negate my point about the Avengers

 

[bkhedr]

here's a question

if Mockingbird, Spiderwoman II, and Rage (to name but a few) can be Avengers
then why cant Spiderman, Luke Cake and Spiderwoman be Avengers?

Especially since its a team that retains Cap (the heart and soul) and Ironman (the man who wrote the charter)

 

[TheCorpulent1]

No I dont but that doesnt negate my point about the Avengers

It does when you consider that the JLA has just as much heart, teamwork, brains, and bravery as the Avengers. They're about more than just raw power. The characters who compose their most recognizable roster just happen to have more power than those who compose the Avengers' most recognizable roster.

 

[Sequential76]

Isn't the Sentry crazy or depressed? Maybe that effects his ability to be super duper and knocks him down a knoch. I'm glad thor isn't on the team. I like the way he looks but some writer's really turn me off with the accent.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Why? I don't get why there are such strong objections to reading "thee" and "thou" instead of "you." It's a relatively recent invention, too. Stan and most of Thor's other writers didn't do it. Jurgens and Busiek both did it simultaneously in the late '90s, which is really the most prominent it's been.

 

[iloveclones]

Do you really have any idea how powerful Tigershark, Mole Man, and Plantman are, or how smart Egghead is?

Come now.

I can relate. I've always tried to make the argument, accurately I believe, that the Spot is actually a pretty cool power to have. Worst costume and name ever. But great power!

 

[bkhedr]

It does when you consider that the JLA has just as much heart, teamwork, brains, and bravery as the Avengers. They're about more than just raw power. The characters who compose their most recognizable roster just happen to have more power than those who compose the Avengers' most recognizable roster.

Granted. The point I am trying to make is that the Avengers are not literaly earth's MIGHTIEST heroes and it is not obligatory that the team be comprised of very powerful heroes

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I agree. Really, the Defenders would fit the bill of Earth's Mightiest Heroes better.