Apocalypse X-Men Apocalypse News and Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 29

[jaymes_e06]

Re: Magik
I'm not sure how practical the magical elements would be integrated into the world of the X-men but I adore her. The New Mutants Rahn/ Wolfsbane and Illyana/ Magik are characters I feel could be done so well. Magik has never ventured outside of the comics (Illyana as a child yes but not with her powers). It's a travesty that it hasn't happened yet.

I'd like to add that Illyana's whole story with Belasco can be read as a 'victim of child predator, innocence lost too fast' metaphor. Of course its a heavy topic for a blockbuster but it can be left as subtext which still allows her to bring something different to the pantheon of X women.

Plus im a fan of the complicated and sometimes toxic relationship she has with Colossus. Her damning him to be the Juggernaut was one of the strongest stories for both characters IMO.

But yeah I definitely think she has lead potential for New Mutants. It was her Darkchylde story which drove the momentum of New Mutants all the way up till Inferno after all.

And I have issues with the claim that X women are one note. They are really anything but.

Me too and agreed.

 

[def28]

Having these X-Men films be completely different is the key to their success in an expanding universe. If audiences accepted Deadpool, anything is possible. The supernatural elements of New Mutants will be the big sell.

People questioned Thor's world working with Iron Man's , and Sentinels/time travel working in Singers X-Men. Audiences like this stuff as much as we do. When well done.

 

[Mad Ones]

I'm not sure how they would do New Mutants without the supernatural stuff. That's the draw.

 

[BeholdMe]

Having these X-Men films be completely different is the key to their success in an expanding universe. If audiences accepted Deadpool, anything is possible. The supernatural elements of New Mutants will be the big sell.

People questioned Thor's world working with Iron Man's , and Sentinels/time travel working in Singers X-Men. Audiences like this stuff as much as we do. When well done.

Agreed

 

[def28]

I'm not sure how they would do New Mutants without the supernatural stuff. That's the draw.

They couldn't without taking heavy creative license, which just won't work well.

We are finally to the point in comic films where it's been proven all the crazy stuff us fans liked in the books works with audiences on a very big level.

 

[kevork89]

I really dont think widow acts like she needs a man, infact she usually shows them up... which is exactly why she needs a solo... take her back to russia and place her against red guardian and yelena bolova.

Marvels strongest female right now is probably peggy carter... the girls of shield are great too, but peggy shines pretty bright by herself. For a character who was never all that big in the books.

I love Widow I don't mean she acts like she needs a man but they've written her differently in each movie. One second she's flirting with Cap, one second it seems like she's into Hawkeye next she's into Hulk. It's unnecessary. It seems forced as if she needs to be a romantic interest to level her out a bit because she's so tough and holds her own against the men.

 

[Smilodon]

I think Fox needs to make New Mutants before Marvel makes The Runaways. Boone has shown he can handle something YA and is seemingly very passionate about horror/supernatural related things with his repeated attempts to adapt Stephen King novels. I know Boone is a bit busy at the moment, and the YA genre can be hit or miss, but I think there's a lot of potential for Fox to diversify their X-Men Cinematic Universe and capitalize on the market by making a New Mutants film.

Besides what Deadpool is doing, I would consider New Mutants to have the biggest potential out of all of the potential projects Fox could move forward with. It could be Hunger Games big! (Maybe not, but at least Maze Runner??)

 

[Mad Ones]

I love Widow I don't mean she acts like she needs a man but they've written her differently in each movie. One second she's flirting with Cap, one second it seems like she's into Hawkeye next she's into Hulk. It's unnecessary. It seems forced as if she needs to be a romantic interest to level her out a bit because she's so tough and holds her own against the men.

That's the problem with her being the token girl on the team. Captain Marvel needed to be on the Avengers like yesterday. At least Scarlet Witch is there now.

I'm beyond thrilled that the X-men movies are passed the Wolverine/Jean/Cyclops love triangle. I've spent a decade being frustrated with that in these movies.

 

[jaymes_e06]

Having these X-Men films be completely different is the key to their success in an expanding universe. If audiences accepted Deadpool, anything is possible. The supernatural elements of New Mutants will be the big sell.

People questioned Thor's world working with Iron Man's , and Sentinels/time travel working in Singers X-Men. Audiences like this stuff as much as we do. When well done.

But they had to justify those elements to the piont of everything being more science based and grounded than really going for anything as over the top as Balasco (who's pretty much Marvel's Satan). The absurdity level is a bit higher. I hope they do go that direction but aliens tend to be easier to believe than demonic entities.

 

[def28]

I don't see any proof of that really. X-Men is pretty absurd unto itself tbh and comes with a ton of sci fi as well as fantasy built in. Exploring these new areas and elements of fantasy is part of the fun.

Be it Limbo or the Shi'ar I hope to see all of it. Don't think audiences will be disappointed or questioning such things as long as the films are entertaining and giving us good characters. If they do question them, there are other issues going on. Main thing is entertainment and good storytelling.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Im know I'm in the minority here but I have ZERO interest in seeing a Black Widow solo, she is a very boring supporting character she dosent even have her Russian accent I really think they dropped the ball with her she bores me, I'd rather see Scarlet Witch over Black Widow. As for the women in Marvel selling solos over the years yes She Hulk,Black Widow I agree with but I feel CPT Marvel fails but because they want her as the equivalent of WW in the Marvel Universe they keep pushing her and giving her all these chances when she is just a very boring character yes she has popularity but if they pushed the most popular women in the MU the way they push her they would easily surpass her. I just really think they should give some other characters that push and continuous chances and good promotion. Break them away from the team sometime and develop them solo with great writers.I'd rather see a She Hulk movie over the other two but that's just my opinion.

Personal opinions aside... which have no barrings. The public eats her up

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I'd like to add that Illyana's whole story with Belasco can be read as a 'victim of child predator, innocence lost too fast' metaphor. Of course its a heavy topic for a blockbuster but it can be left as subtext which still allows her to bring something different to the pantheon of X women.

Plus im a fan of the complicated and sometimes toxic relationship she has with Colossus. Her damning him to be the Juggernaut was one of the strongest stories for both characters IMO.

But yeah I definitely think she has lead potential for New Mutants. It was her Darkchylde story which drove the momentum of New Mutants all the way up till Inferno after all.

And I have issues with the claim that X women are one note. They are really anything but.

Theyre one note in the sense that they dont have a whole lot of stories to tell solo. Most only have one villain at best... its sort of hard to go on from there. But they arnt the only ones... widow wasp and antman are similar.

Ant man and wasp after ultron and cross, really only have egg head and whirlwind...

I mean for solos, alot of these characters are slim pickings after their one or two villains without a supporting cast of other heroes to round it out. Thats what i mean by one note... they cant go much further solo than one film. Certainly not a franchise

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I love Widow I don't mean she acts like she needs a man but they've written her differently in each movie. One second she's flirting with Cap, one second it seems like she's into Hawkeye next she's into Hulk. It's unnecessary. It seems forced as if she needs to be a romantic interest to level her out a bit because she's so tough and holds her own against the men.

Widow is a flirt in general she was trained in sex appeal. But the only person shes really flirted with was hulk. There was never any cap connection. Just a mission. I felt that was very clear

 

[spideyboy_1111]

But they had to justify those elements to the piont of everything being more science based and grounded than really going for anything as over the top as Balasco (who's pretty much Marvel's Satan). The absurdity level is a bit higher. I hope they do go that direction but aliens tend to be easier to believe than demonic entities.

But for a magik solo... where do you go after belasco?

Thats my point. Alone they're kinda one note, but as a team, far from it

 

[FilmNerdJamie]

Just not feeling it.

 

[x-er]

speaking of which, i stumbled across Joshua Middleton's art for New Mutants and I really like it's water-color feel. Worth checking out. Here's a Psylocke (not New Mutants), but I really like his Magma and Wolfsbane.

 

[iacobusleo]

Theyre one note in the sense that they dont have a whole lot of stories to tell solo. Most only have one villain at best... its sort of hard to go on from there. But they arnt the only ones... widow wasp and antman are similar.

Ant man and wasp after ultron and cross, really only have egg head and whirlwind...

But for a magik solo... where do you go after belasco?

Thats my point. Alone they're kinda one note, but as a team, far from it

Ah ok I see your point. I don't think one note is an apt description for this problem though. I think it's just that these characters aren't built to be solo characters, because that's the beauty of X-Men, it's a team book where the meat of the story lies in the character interactions and relationships with each other. Take most of them out of the team, you don't get that character interplay that makes them fascinating. And it's not limited to the X-women. The same applies to the men too.

Like honestly, the only X character you can build a solo franchise around would be Wolverine (excluding of course peripheral characters like Deadpool). The closest I think you can get are buddy films. So examples I can think of are:

Rogue + Gambit (sexy romcom heist film, something I would rather see than a solo Gambit film).

Wolverine + Kitty (or Rogue in this film universe) (japanese ninja mentor-pupil coming of age story ala the Kitty Pryde and Wolverine miniseries)

Cyclops + Jean + Cable (time spanning apocalyptic family drama ala the Adventure of Cyclops and Phoenix, akin to Terminator)

So in relation to Magik, I think realistically she is better served as being a part of New Mutants. I honestly can't think of any solo film for the X-franchise that can work (unless Gambit can prove me wrong).

Widow is a flirt in general she was trained in sex appeal. But the only person shes really flirted with was hulk. There was never any cap connection. Just a mission. I felt that was very clear

I agree completely. One of the things I liked most about Winter Soldier.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

speaking of which, i stumbled across Joshua Middleton's art for New Mutants and I really like it's water-color feel. Worth checking out. Here's a Psylocke (not New Mutants), but I really like his Magma and Wolfsbane.

I have those as wallpapers on my computer

 

[def28]

So in relation to Magik, I think realistically she is better served as being a part of New Mutants. I honestly can't think of any solo film for the X-franchise that can work (unless Gambit can prove me wrong).

She is. I agree about New Mutants. This Magik conversation started cause I was referring to a Magik solo comic selling well, not film. Which is why I said written by Jason Aaron. Put good writers with popular X-Men and they tend to sell stronger. Very few can get away with selling high on bad stories.

But I don't think it could't work. Her story line would be interesting as a film even if it wasn't connected to X-Men at all. X-23 could easily have her own film. It's basically the flick Hanna. Same with Emma. The argument these characters will never have anywhere to go isn't really right cause their stories will never end. Be it comic or film somebody will keep adding to their mythology.

Could they work? Definitely. Do they need them with where this franchise is right now? No. It's headache inducing to map with just main X-Men movies. If said solo films were being released with good filmmakers would people see it? Probably, cause unless you are F4 level bad every Marvel or X-Men film makes cash. Nothing to really say otherwise at this point.

 

[kevork89]

Widow is a flirt in general she was trained in sex appeal. But the only person shes really flirted with was hulk. There was never any cap connection. Just a mission. I felt that was very clear

No I know her flirting isn't the issue but I feel that they don't know where they are going sometime. Like the sudden relationship with Hulk it seemed so forced to just put in a relationship that wasn't necessary.

 

[psylockolussus]

Finally?

X1 had 4
X2 had 5
X3 had 7 (8 if you count the Dr Lady)
FC had 4
DOFP had 4 (5 if you count Rogue)

Fact is X-Men has had the most female character representation than any other CBM franchise.

They may not all be depicted the way you like but they're there

Lets not forget

W1- 3 (4 if you Logan's mom)
W2- 4
D1- 3 (4 if you the old lady)

 

[Neno_Kos]

That is why the ending to this movie worries me.

That's why I want Singer gone. Plain and simple.

 

[Frankeh]

So the movie is coming out May 19th in my country t:

 

[GuestStar2004]

The pattern to the last few movies has been to undevelop them and then develop them slowly going foward, like it took 3 movies for xavier to lose his hair for example.

I think people tend to not see that with these movies and just see they are doing it wrong because everyone isnt just handed their comic accurancy

 

[CaptainCanada]

Im know I'm in the minority here but I have ZERO interest in seeing a Black Widow solo, she is a very boring supporting character she dosent even have her Russian accent I really think they dropped the ball with her she bores me, I'd rather see Scarlet Witch over Black Widow.

Minor point, but Black Widow in the comics doesn't have a Russian accent (this is called attention to a number of times). It would not make any sense for Russia's master spy to speak English with a Russian accent.