Apocalypse X-Men Apocalypse News and Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 31

[BeholdMe]

The whole Jean dies and is resurrected is overdone as well. I really dont like it being about how she is so powerful, yet cant handle the power and it drives her insane which is the basis why she goes all Dark Phoenix. Id rather a powerful, strong Jean that is in control of herself and abilities, not one with such a fragile mind.

She doesnt need to have Phoenix power levels to defeat someone like Toad. This isnt 2000. The way these characters are being handled is far different. I mean look at Storm from the trailers compared to the first film. I have more confidence in how these characters are portrayed.

the cartoon was very kid friendly though and they werent about to have her murdered or commit suicide. The films are more adult and handle darker theme. That kumbaya moment with holding hands as they spare a piece of their souls for her wont fly in a film



there needs to be repercussions to her actions. To bring on the Shi'ar implies that you at least want them to stick close to the original story involving her destroying a star, resulting in the destruction of a planet and billions of lives. The only reason the Shi'ar was involved bc her actions had far larger cosmic implications beyond Earth. Anyone that does something like that needs to die and quite honesty was the most poignant and memorable thing about the story. Whats the point of adapting it if you are going to take the key scene out?

It's not overdone it's her namesake that's why it occurs in the comics/cartoons she is the Pheonix and that is the definition of the Pheonix. In the original she wasn't just driven insane for nothing. Wyngarde and the Hellfire Club helped to manipulate and bring out that dark part of her soul also in the comics the life form took the place of Jean and actually her real body was at the bottom of an ocean in which the Avengers found so the real Jean didn't even die she was protected in the ocean. Then when she awoke and the Pheonix decided to make Jean it's host so she was granted that huge power boost. Idc how they bring in the Shiar it's just something I want to see if they can find another way to introduce them then that's cool. As I said even they kill that body they can do as the comics dead and have an after credits scene showing some scuba divers finding a cocoon with the real Jean inside. I'm just saying it could be played so many different ways even how Evolution handled it. She dosent have to be overpowered but as I said I don't want a weak Jean I do want her developed a bit more as Jean, I would mind DPS since its such a rich story and can give her that much more characterization without killing her off

 

[micsin]

On Heroic Insider yesterday, they said the next film is The Dark Phoenix saga.

Olivia Munn and the actor who plays Cyclops said they're signed for two more films; I assume the rest of the new cast are as well. That said, I would expect a Dark Phoenix redo by the third film, but certainly not next.

 

[Havok83]

It's not overdone it's her namesake that's why it occurs in the comics/cartoons she is the Pheonix and that is the definition of the Pheonix. In the original she wasn't just driven insane for nothing. Wyngarde and the Hellfire Club helped to manipulate and bring out that dark part of her soul also in the comics the life form took the place of Jean and actually her real body was at the bottom of an ocean in which the Avengers found so the real Jean didn't even die she was protected in the ocean. Then when she awoke and the Pheonix decided to make Jean it's host so she was granted that huge power boost. Idc how they bring in the Shiar it's just something I want to see if they can find another way to introduce them then that's cool. As I said even they kill that body they can do as the comics dead and have an after credits scene showing some scuba divers finding a cocoon with the real Jean inside. I'm just saying it could be played so many different ways even how Evolution handled it. She dosent have to be overpowered but as I said I don't want a weak Jean I do want her developed a bit more as Jean, I would mind DPS since its such a rich story and can give her that much more characterization without killing her off

It is overdone when different forms of media keep the same thing with her. How it happens is tweaked but ultimately Jean has been "killed" off and brought back so many times in various outlets. Phoenix is her codename in the books; its not her codename here in the films, so they do not need to go there

The whole cocoon thing is a retcon that happened years later. That wasnt thought up when they were writing or thinking of the ramifications of Jean's actions in the original story.

We'll have to agree to disagree bc IMO there is no point in doing a DPS story without including the most important scene and thats Jean's sacrifice or some variation of her dying.

Evolution never did the Dark Phoenix Saga

 

[iacobusleo]

Evolution never did the Dark Phoenix Saga

Evolution planned to adapt the Dark Phoenix Saga in its 5th season, and there was even a flash forwards in the finale which showed Jean transforming into the Phoenix firebird, with Xavier commenting on how some of their most trusted allies will become their most terrible of enemies.

As for whether Dark Phoenix Saga needs to end with Jean dying, I agree that the story is iconic because of Jean's tragic sacrifice. But maybe a similar result can be achieved if the story ends with Jean physically dying, but she ascends into true godhood like how she became the White Phoenix of the Crown. Or maybe she doesn't have to die at all like how it was in the 90s animated series. Or maybe having ascended to godhood as the Phoenix, she willingly chooses to live a mortal life and relinquishes her power.

What is important is Jean needing to make the choice to sacrifice herself for the good of humanity. The outcome after that does not matter if it's executed well.

And while I want there to be more to Jean than the Phoenix, I think it's unrealistic to hope for the movies to establish her as her own character entirely distinct from the Phoenix storyline. Build her up as a developed main character with virtues and flaws, and focus on her romance with Scott sure, but the end result will always be some variation of the Phoenix. After all, even in the comics Jean could never really escape from its shadow. To be honest, take away the Phoenix from Jean and you are taking away a huge part from her character.

 

[marvelrobbins]

after heroic hollywood claimed wolverine would be in new trailer best to ignore
what they say on X-Men.

In new EW Ty Sheriden says he is signed for 2 more films so probally new cast members in apocalypse are all signed for 2 more films.One problem is apparently fox is using one of Alexandra Shipp's 2 remaining films for The New Mutants.

as for doing dark phoenix if they are going to do it justice and if they want to keep ending fox has to officaly say they are ignoring the future ending of DOFP.
That also means the new wolverine film would be out of contunity soon and it
hasn't even started filming yet.Of course this didn't stop them from when the
wolverine was in production from planning to erase events of that film.

it would really be bad if dark phoenix is next full X-Men film after apocalypse because the film after apocalypse when they finally have jean grey with proment role again not just cameo and then kill her off In next film

of course

Spoiler

from what i heard marvel didn't have captain america die at end of civil war so maybe they can do dark phoenix without jean dying

 

[sleekstereo]

I actually think the Dark Phoenix Saga will be a two part film.

 

[Havok83]

Evolution planned to adapt the Dark Phoenix Saga in its 5th season, and there was even a flash forwards in the finale which showed Jean transforming into the Phoenix firebird, with Xavier commenting on how some of their most trusted allies will become their most terrible of enemies.

As for whether Dark Phoenix Saga needs to end with Jean dying, I agree that the story is iconic because of Jean's tragic sacrifice. But maybe a similar result can be achieved if the story ends with Jean physically dying, but she ascends into true godhood like how she became the White Phoenix of the Crown. Or maybe she doesn't have to die at all like how it was in the 90s animated series. Or maybe having ascended to godhood as the Phoenix, she willingly chooses to live a mortal life and relinquishes her power.

What is important is Jean needing to make the choice to sacrifice herself for the good of humanity. The outcome after that does not matter if it's executed well.

And while I want there to be more to Jean than the Phoenix, I think it's unrealistic to hope for the movies to establish her as her own character entirely distinct from the Phoenix storyline. Build her up as a developed main character with virtues and flaws, and focus on her romance with Scott sure, but the end result will always be some variation of the Phoenix. After all, even in the comics Jean could never really escape from its shadow. To be honest, take away the Phoenix from Jean and you are taking away a huge part from her character.

Planning something and actually executing it are two different things. What would have come out of Evolution's story didnt pan out so no one knows. She likely wouldnt have died though bc that was very marketed towards kids like the TAS before it

Id rather they not deal with Phoenix but Id be fine with it. I dont think she needs it but we didnt get to see that in X3 bc not only were the scope of the films limited but also they jumped straight into the Dark Phoenix aspect. I really dont want to see them do a variation of the DPS again. Unfortunately if they even introduce Phoenix, the expectation would be for her to go insane and have the X-men turn on her in order to stop her as a threat. Been there, done that

 

[GuestStar2004]

Olivia Munn and the actor who plays Cyclops said they're signed for two more films; I assume the rest of the new cast are as well

So they signed a 3 film deal then with Apocalypse being film 1

i thought they would have signed them for 4 personally but i guess not

 

[GuestStar2004]

I actually think the Dark Phoenix Saga will be a two part film.

It depends if there is anything worth making it a 2 parter for, i mean if they could deal with jeans phoenix struggle in a movie with a different storyline and then be full phoenix in the next but if apocalypse isn't a 2 parter then i don't see why pheonix would be.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Id rather they not deal with Phoenix but Id be fine with it. I dont think she needs it but we didnt get to see that in X3 bc not only were the scope of the films limited but also they jumped straight into the Dark Phoenix aspect. I really dont want to see them do a variation of the DPS again. Unfortunately if they even introduce Phoenix, the expectation would be for her to go insane and have the X-men turn on her in order to stop her as a threat. Been there, done that

Chances are it will be very different to the comic, they will tell a different story but incorporate bits of the phoenix saga in it.

 

[Havok83]

Chances are it will be very different to the comic

Well it'll have to be. None of the movies are comic accurate to the story they are adapting. X2 came the closest but alot of changes were done with X3 and DOFP. The core concepts and themes were kept in though

 

[GuestStar2004]

 

[GuestStar2004]

Apparently some here in the UK have already seen the quicksilver ad on tv, thats pretty early marketing right there

 

[Havok83]

apparently some here in the UK have already seen the quicksilver ad on tv, thats pretty early marketing right there

the movie comes out in just about a month. I would hope they start marketing it now. It doesn't seem too early

 

[Danbito]

EW has an article on Tye Sheridan to promote X-Men:Apocalypse. They had a new still of a closeup for Jean holding Cyclops head with optic blasts firing. Haven't seen it here, but don't know how to upload it here while on my phone.

 

[GuestStar2004]

ew has an article on tye sheridan to promote x-men:apocalypse. They had a new still of a closeup for jean holding cyclops head with optic blasts firing. Haven't seen it here, but don't know how to upload it here while on my phone.

find a way!

 

[Frankeh]

EW has an article on Tye Sheridan to promote X-Men:Apocalypse. They had a new still of a closeup for Jean holding Cyclops head with optic blasts firing. Haven't seen it here, but don't know how to upload it here while on my phone.

I can't find anything

 

[kineticist]

If the new cast is only signed on for two more films I can understand why they would want to do Phoenix again. But I don't like the idea of Bryan directing two movies then leaving while another director comes in and does the phoenix saga....sounds pretty familiar.

 

[Danbito]

Can't upload it here directly, sorry it crashes every time for some reason.

Managed to upload onto 9gag somehow.
http://9gag.com/gag/aq5p38L?ref=mobile.s.cp

 

[kineticist]

That's so cute haha

 

[GuestStar2004]

Personally i don't see them making just 2 movie with this cast since as i imagine they would more likely round it out with another trilogy rather then just have a trilogy, another trilogy and 2 movies, but who knows how or why the decided on these contracts

 

[sleekstereo]

So they signed a 3 film deal then with Apocalypse being film 1

i thought they would have signed them for 4 personally but i guess not

Actually, it can easily be adapted into two parts.

Part One: Focus on the M'Kraan Crystal, the Shi'Ar Empire, and Jean discovering and trying to control Phoenix entity inside her.

Part Two: Phoenix going dark, reintroduce the Hellfire Club, the Shi'Ar teaming up with the X-Men to save Jean from the Phoenix.

 

[CaptainCanada]

In new EW Ty Sheriden says he is signed for 2 more films so probally new cast members in apocalypse are all signed for 2 more films.One problem is apparently fox is using one of Alexandra Shipp's 2 remaining films for The New Mutants.

They would just negotiate more appearances, I assume (or perhaps they already have, if they're planning that). Hollywood has been moving beyond the notion of approaching these franchises as trilogies, so I doubt FOX will stop using this team after three films if they're successful.

 

[GuestStar2004]

i dunno whether you could have 2 stories Centered around the phoenix without more gimmick to it, i mean it would have to be believed that there is enough cool material for 2 parts to grip people for the first and excite for part 2, and not just for the comic fans.

Its easy to say any 1 movie should been 2 parts, BVS, X-Men Apocalypse ect ect but there is a reason why studios ain't making every movie 2 parters.

 

[CaptainCanada]

i dunno whether you could have 2 stories Centered around the phoenix without more gimmick to it, i mean it would have to be believed that there is enough cool material for 2 parts to grip people for the first and excite for part 2, and not just for the comic fans

The first one isn't really centered around the Phoenix, though. It's a space adventure where the villain would be D'Ken.

I'm still uncertain whether the franchise would get into all the space stuff, but I guess we'll see.