Apocalypse X-Men Apocalypse News and Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 43

[psylockolussus]

The MCU would have to basically rehash the plots of First Class and Days of Future Past to get mutants in there though.

I think the best move would be to make a Secret Wars movie that reboots both continuities. Kind of like what Days of Future Past did. Legion and Doctor Strange can make it happen.

Marvel Studios will never get X-Men though and I just don't see why Marvel with such a neat track record (well minus those tripe ABC shows) would want to drag Fox movies to their universe via alternate realities... They didn't even include Amazing Spider-Man which only had two movies but Fox's x-Men with 10 movies now and counting... No Marvel is not gonna touch it. Even with Legion, you are not seeing the Marvel Studios logo which just shows that they aren't into that show compare to their own movies and shows.

Ultimate Marvel, Marvel Zombies, Miles Morales, Spider Gwen I could see those happening within the MCU via an alternative reality story but Fox's X-Men? Absolute ly not.

 

[Havok83]

The MCU would have to basically rehash the plots of First Class and Days of Future Past to get mutants in there though.

I think the best move would be to make a Secret Wars movie that reboots both continuities. Kind of like what Days of Future Past did. Legion and Doctor Strange can make it happen.

They would do better to just reboot the movies with new continuity as opposed to something overly complicated like Secret Wars, especially since we are reaching the point where many of the original cast members are likely about to move on anyway

 

[DavidHaller]

Fox really does not need a reboot. After "Days of Future Past" and "X-Men Apocalypse" they can basically do whatever they like without paying attention to any former continuity. The X-Men world is a new blank slate and they can do whatever they like.

They have a great new cast and can start with new beginning.

 

[Zarex]

oh come on, Deadpool is such a weak movie that only succeeded because of a great marketing campaign producing the illusion that Deadpool was a heartfelt project of a group of 'authentic' comic book nerds fighting years to get this movie done against evil commercial corporations. It is all marketing without substance.

this movie is so ridiculously overrated. Dumb puberty humor and a very weak script is nothing that should be transfered into the X-Men movie world. I am actually wondering why they haven't cast Jim Carrey as the lead role because Deadpool evokes 1990s Jim Carrey comedies.

I will not "come on". Deadpool is a fun (oh no!), movie with loads of heart and humor. It had great action, costumes and performances. I would have been very interested in Miller's take on X-Force. It's a shame we won't see it.

 

[MadVillainy]

Fox really does not need a reboot. After "Days of Future Past" and "X-Men Apocalypse" they can basically do whatever they like without paying attention to any former continuity. The X-Men world is a new blank slate and they can do whatever they like.

They have a great new cast and can start with new beginning.

But that great new cast not really putting butts in seats

 

[GuestStar2004]

But that great new cast not really putting butts in seats

Hugh jackman didn't really put butts into seats in the wolverine either compared to the butts he had put into seats for X-Men: Origins and compared to the butts Ryan Renolds put into seats for deadpool even though ryan hasn't been a huge box office draw for alot of his other movies

There are many factors to take in here.

 

[Stan Lee]

Marvel Studios will never get X-Men though and I just don't see why Marvel with such a neat track record (well minus those tripe ABC shows) would want to drag Fox movies to their universe via alternate realities... They didn't even include Amazing Spider-Man which only had two movies but Fox's x-Men with 10 movies now and counting... No Marvel is not gonna touch it. Even with Legion, you are not seeing the Marvel Studios logo which just shows that they aren't into that show compare to their own movies and shows.

Ultimate Marvel, Marvel Zombies, Miles Morales, Spider Gwen I could see those happening within the MCU via an alternative reality story but Fox's X-Men? Absolute ly not.

Well, they didn't establish alternate realities when they got their hands on Spider-Man. That and Marvel Studios doesn't have the love for that series like they do the X-Men. Kevin Fiege has got on and on about how he loves the movie version of Magneto.

The reason why I see this happening is for the purpose of money. The X-Men vs Avengers fight akin to the Classic Marvel vs Ultimate Marvel in Secret Wars reeks of highest grossing superhero movie ever.

They would do better to just reboot the movies with new continuity as opposed to something overly complicated like Secret Wars, especially since we are reaching the point where many of the original cast members are likely about to move on anyway

Doesn't have to be as complicated as the original story. Could be a crossover akin to JLA/Avengers with just the title Secret Wars and end in a way similar to Crisis on Infinite Earth.

 

[MadVillainy]

Hugh jackman didn't really put butts into seats in the wolverine either compared to the butts he had put into seats for X-Men: Origins and compared to the butts Ryan Renolds put into seats for deadpool even though ryan hasn't been a huge box office draw for alot of his other movies

There are many factors to take in here.

ok...
I wasn't disputing whether Jackman brought in an audience. I was just pointing out that just making films with the new cast clearly isn't working either. Im not a reboot is the answer either.

 

[psylockolussus]

But that great new cast not really putting butts in seats

It did not even outgross x1 in America.

Why reward the new cast a second chance when they could just hire the more tested cast?

 

[DavidHaller]

There are many factors to take in here.

Exactly! As if it is the fault of young, emerging actors and actresses that the marketing sucks and the movie was mediocre/bad.

The new cast is perfect. Everything else is the bigger problem! Or do we need to cast Brad Pitt with a wig to be Jean Grey?

 

[psylockolussus]

ok...
I wasn't disputing whether Jackman brought in an audience. I was just pointing out that just making films with the new cast clearly isn't working either. Im not a reboot is the answer either.

I agree!

 

[MadVillainy]

Exactly! As if it is the fault of young, emerging actors and actresses that the marketing sucks and the movie was mediocre/bad.

The new cast is perfect. Everything else is the bigger problem! Or do we need to cast Brad Pitt with a wig to be Jean Grey?

I don't know what you're on but ok.
But again the evidence shows audiences aren't taking to the newer cast. Even in the good movies.

It did not even outgross x1 in America.

Why reward the new cast a second chance when they could just hire the more tested cast?

Bringing back the original cast is stupid too.


The fact is there is no easy answer to how to continue making successful (financially and reception wise) X-Men team films. I feel like everytime I come in the thread every side thinks there answer is a guaranteed success and ignore the evidence...shocking

-"Just bring back the old cast." DOFP was successful. Yeah but a) they're losing arguably their biggest draw in the original cast with Jackman as Wolverine. b) Bringing back the old cast is just delaying putting themselves in this same position. How much longer will the old cast return before they get too tired, too old, or the movies just start sucking again? You can't hold onto the crutch of the old cast forever.
-"Just keep the new cast" FC and Apocalypse, domestically and adjusted for inflation, are the lowest grossing team movies. FC even without adjusting or inflation and worldwide only beats the original X-Men in 2000 and is the 2nd lowest grossing team movie. FC was well received by critics, has good audience scores, but still did not make a lot of money. I don't think the audience is really taking to the new cast. Or at least the evidence isn't showing it.
-"Reboot". Obviously FC is a prequel and set in this loose continuity, but when you think about it, it had a lot of elements of a reboot. New look, new feel, new cast, new tone, a lot of newer characters...and as I said before it didn't make much money. And before someone says "Nyah DoFP was a reboot" you know what I mean by reboot I mean Casino Royale, Batman Begins, Dredd, Rise of the Planet of the Apes type reboot that nto only reboots the continuity but uses a new cast, new team, etc.

As I said, there's no easy answer to this that makes me say: "Oh yeah that'll work for sure" like with certain franchises. The one I think is silliest though is bringing back the old cast.

 

[DavidHaller]

or what about adjusting the budget and stop expecting these movies to make 1 billion? Why can the X-Men movies not be a smaller franchise?

I wished the quality would be great again and I'm really annoyed by these constant 'boxoffice' discussions.

 

[Havok83]

Doesn't have to be as complicated as the original story. Could be a crossover akin to JLA/Avengers with just the title Secret Wars and end in a way similar to Crisis on Infinite Earth.

Original story? Im thinking more the recent story from last year. The original would make no sense for what you propose. Meshing up two long established continuities no matter how you slice it is going to be complicated to the general audience . I once thought SW could be a good plot device to incorporate the X-men (one that had nothing to do with Fox's films) into the existing MCU as that simplifies things. But to still go off of Fox's films and then have the end result be reboot both franchises anyway? I dont see the purpose.

It would make more sense to reboot them from the start as a brand new continuity instead of some big mashup that utilizes continuity a combined decades worth of films. What would even be the point of that. Just so they can keep the actors? I dont see these Fox hires being of that much value to Marvel that they would go through the hassle of making an entire film around a way to keep them. Especially with Hugh Jackman gone, none are really that big a draw that it would be necessary

 

[MadVillainy]

or what about adjusting the budget and stop expecting these movies to make 1 billion? Why can the X-Men movies not be a smaller franchise?

where in the world are you getting realistic people thinking these will hit a billion? There are outliers sure but that's a small minority. It isn't like BvS where they reportedly spend 400 mill including marketing on the movie. Im sure a lot hope these make a billion but I don't think it's that expected.

But even if it was, adjusting the budget is easier said and done. Nowadays when you sign on for a franchise, everyone gets a pay bump. Sure you might have some actors who love their role so much they'll take a cut but for a major blockbuster sequel I doubt that would be wide spread. That's the way sequels work now. Audiences expect bigger action or at the least, actors and crew expect better pay for spending half their year working on 1 movie.

EDIT: The box office is what keeps a franchise going so of course we're going to discuss it. We can switch over to the quality if you'd like but:
1) the most recent film Apocalypse wasn't received that well and I'm sure you wouldnt like that topic
2) with something like X-Men I want to box office to be good too so we'll get more

 

[DavidHaller]

where in the world are you getting realistic people thinking these will hit a billion. There are outliers sure but that's a small minority. It isn't like BvS where they reportedly spend 400 mill including marketing on the movie. Im sure a lot hope these make a billion but I don't think it's that expected.

But even if it was, adjusting the budget is easier said and done. Nowadays when you sign on for a franchise, everyone gets a pay bump. Sure you might have some actors who love their role so much they'll take a cut but for a major blockbuster sequel I doubt that would be wide spread. That's the way sequels work now. Audiences expect bigger action or at the least, actors and crew expect better pay for spending half their year working on 1 movie.

X-Men movies are so much more than greedy money machines.

I think the political content of these movies makes it impossible to reach extremely high boxoffice numbers like idiotic mainstream movies like Suicide Squad, Batman vs. Superman or Transformers. As soon as you deconstruct certain gender ideas and diversify your cast you will lose mainstream audiences because they do not want to think watching these movies and remain in their lazy identification patterns.

I am just trying to say that the X-Men franchise maybe does not fit in these mainstream categories to reach 800.000.000 million at the boxoffice.

Maybe adjusting the bugdet and to make smaller, more intimate movies makes more sense when it comes to this particular franchise...

550.000.000 million is still a lot of money. I'm just afraid FOX will follow the Marvel movie formula. If so they will definitely lose my movie ticket.

 

[MadVillainy]

X-Men movies are so much more than greedy money machines.

I think the political content of these movies makes it impossible to reach extremely high boxoffice numbers like idiotic mainstream movies like Suicide Squad, Batman vs. Superman or Transformers. As soon as you deconstruct certain gender ideas and diversify your cast you will lose mainstream audiences because they do not want to think watching these movies and remain in their lazy identification patterns.

I am just trying to say that the X-Men franchise maybe does not fit in these mainstream categories to reach 800.000.000 million at the boxoffice.

Maybe adjusting the bugdet and to make smaller, more intimate movies makes more sense when it comes to this franchise...

550.000.000 million is still a lot of money.

Youre a bit all over the place and ignored the points I made before
You say it's impossible for the X-Men films to reach those numbers but DoFP made big big money. More than SS by a small margin. So the potential is there. Hell if you adjust for inflation I'm sure X2 and The Last Stand are 700 mill grossers (just guessing).
Why do you have to bash audiences and other franchises just to try and prop X-Men up. That's sad.

The whole "audiences don't want smart things blah blah" argument is just so tired, corny, and false. Whatever you thought of these movies, Inception, Interstellar, Skyfall, TDKT are "thinking" blockbusters that deal with "real" things. And it's a kids movie, but Zootopia was a thinly veiled critique on racism and it made over a billion dollars. So don't blame the audience.

And the X-Men are greedy money machines. All these major superheroes are. Within the X-Men verse you can have these smaller stories like Logan, Deadpool, etc. but in todays age you think you can hire 5 or so actors to play superheroes, deliver on spectacle that people expect from a X-Men movie (not just because of past movies but the comics, the TV shows, etc.), and tell a good story and do it on the cheap? Nah.
Especially with you wanting to bring the FC cast and crew back that's going to drive the budget up.

Honestly if you wanna keep the budget down then you should be for a full reboot where they can pay a bunch of up and comers as cast and crew and have the reported budget much lower

 

[Stan Lee]

Original story? Im thinking more the recent story from last year. The original would make no sense for what you propose. Meshing up two long established continuities no matter how you slice it is going to be complicated to the general audience . I once thought SW could be a good plot device to incorporate the X-men (one that had nothing to do with Fox's films) into the existing MCU as that simplifies things. But to still go off of Fox's films and then have the end result be reboot both franchises anyway? I dont see the purpose.

It would make more sense to reboot them from the start as a brand new continuity instead of some big mashup that utilizes continuity a combined decades worth of films. What would even be the point of that. Just so they can keep the actors? I dont see these Fox hires being of that much value to Marvel that they would go through the hassle of making an entire film around a way to keep them. Especially with Hugh Jackman gone, none are really that big a draw that it would be necessary

I am talking about the Secret Wars from last. By "original" I meant the source material.

I'm not saying they should combine continuity but spawn like a fresh new one from that but with some actors like Ryan Reyond's Deadpool(a huge draw). Have Peter Evans as the Whizzer in the continuity.

And normal reboot would probably just feel like First Class Trilogy all over again.

 

[onDgrind]

Watching Xmen Apocalypse now ,it's my 2nd viewing and it's worse than I remember . It's probably the worst of the X men movies .As bad as some parts of X3 was, it still felt like a Xmen movie . Awful ,struggling to sit through the whole thing now ,might just stop it .

 

[psylockolussus]

Its the worst X-Men team movie for me!

 

[onDgrind]

It's just awful ,the quicksilver scene is just dumb,he's really that fast ? Lol. Waited years to see Apocalypse on screen and end up with some goof in makeup. Horrible

 

[psylockolussus]

He was that fast and can grab foods and drink even in the middle of an explosion! Lol!

 

[DavidHaller]

I do not mind "X-Men: Apocalypse" anymore after seeing it a couple of times to be honest. I was SHOCKED and very disappointment after the beautiful movie that was "Days of Future Past".

but nothing is as horrible as X-Men Origins Wolverine and X3. X-Men Apocalpyse is mediocre but never offensively bad in my eyes...and I can appreciate that Singer tried to tie all six movies together. I really like Jean's storyline in relation to all her other appearances throughout the series. It is actually a lot more complex than people want to see.

I think because of "X-Men Apocalypse" you can binge watch now 7 movies in a row and they flow very nicely together as a complete series.

Ottman and Singer created some of the most impressive scenes in a comic book movie this year with (1) Apocalypse taking over Cerebro and (2) Jean's Phoenix moment: These two scenes are impressively edited and make me tear up every time.

 

[onDgrind]

Wolverine origins I don't count as a X men movie . We all have our opinions ,X3 felt more like X men to me.

 

[DavidHaller]

Wolverine origins I don't count as a X men movie . We all have our opinions ,X3 felt more like X men to me.

for sure, X3 definitely felt like an X-Men comic written by Rick "hobo piss" Remender. lol