All Things Superman: An Open Discussion - Part 8

[The Guard]

Yeah, the "edgy" thing isn't really something to worry about. They're just saying Superman will be edgier. Well, yeah. Of course he will. He didn't even punch anyone the last time out. Did they kid even say "dark"?

"Edgy" is kind of a vague word. It generally means tense and bold or unconventional, something new. I can't see this as a bad thing. We already knew that by this point. It means they're placing him in societal context, and giving him some realistic depth.

Yes, Superman is about hope and light. But his world, and he himself, can be VERY dark. He can very quickly become a terrifying entity. I'm glad it sounds like someone's figured that out.

 

[Rust]

Yeah, the "edgy" thing isn't really something to worry about. They're just saying Superman will be edgier. Well, yeah. Of course he will. He didn't even punch anyone the last time out. Did they kid even say "dark"?

"Edgy" is kind of a vague word. It generally means tense and bold or unconventional, something new. I can't see this as a bad thing. We already knew that by this point. It means they're placing him in societal context, and giving him some realistic depth.

Yes, Superman is about hope and light. But his world, and he himself, can be VERY dark. He can very quickly become a terrifying entity. I'm glad it sounds like someone's figured that out.

No, he said "edgy" and "like The Dark Knight". More accurately "a more edgy feel like The Dark Knight but also make it more realistic and emotional so it's not just the all-american superhero that saves everyone".

Dont see the big issue here either. Everybody's a bit late in the game with the reactions to the approach to the film.
The Guard said it.

 

[Showtime]

What do you mean "everybody is late in the game with the reactions to the approach of the film." ?

 

[Rust]

That people are complaining about something they either knew or could see coming. That MOS was going to be more realistic and modern (usually meaning "edgier") and it sounded like we were getting the Batman Begins-treatment with Nolan and Goyer doing the story.

 

[Showtime]

Well nobody actually knows the look or approach of the film until we see some footage or at least some pictures.

 

[Rust]

True, but people are still freaking about something that has been somewhat known for a while regarding the approach.

 

[Showtime]

I think its because it has now been actually said out loud, by one of the actors in the film.

 

[Rust]

Maybe. I just assumed people had an idea where MOS was heading overall.

 

[X Knight]

I hope the teaser trailer will give us an idea of the "tone" of the film.

Although, you can't always judge a film's tone by its trailer(s).

Case in point, Disney's Tangled. I remember watching the 1st teaser and thought the whole thing looked silly and stupid. Rapunzel was portrayed as some creepy/scary princess who stalked people in the shadows with her hair. The whole thing had an action/adventure vibe, as the teaser focused more on the male star, Flynn, instead of Rapunzel.

When I finally convinced myself to watch the film last month, I was shocked. I absolutely loved it, but it was almost an entirely different movie than was portrayed in the teaser.

 

[Rodrigo90]

Yeah. You just get a tiny basic hint of something within the movie, could be anything. Nothing else.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

Agreed. The "dark" and "edgy" descriptions are getting tedious to me. We all knew with Nolan/Goyer we were going to get something similar to their Bat films (albeit with Snyder's visual flare), but I find myself not caring for it when it comes to Superman. I would like a balance between the "lightness" of Supes and the grit of real life. If that makes sense.

Agreed.

But I do sort of get that sense from what we've heard so far. There's been this one comment about it being 'edgy' and 'like The Dark Knight', but when you combine that with all the other info we have you get a better picture of what that really means, and that's it's probably referring to the realistic, relatable, 'our' world setting.

I mean, here's an interview with Snyder:

"I've never had to make a movie that exists or takes place in the real world before," Snyder told Movieline. "Every movie I've made has been some stylized version of reality."

"I said to the studio, when you ask me to make Superman you're asking me to make a realistic movie. They're like, 'What do you mean? It's Superman.' I'm like, no -- for me, that's like a documentary, basically."

"I guess for [Superman] to be credible, he gets more credible by the reality that you can bring to him," he elaborated later to a gathering of press. "Emotionally and visually. So we'll see."

http://www.movieline.com/2011/03/21...tic-superman-for-me-thats-like-a-documentary/

And also like someone pointed out a while back, just looking at what's been said about Cavill is reassuring that it's not Superman himself that's going to be 'edgy'.

I mean, Snyder specifically said that what won Henry the role was his innocence:

But in the end, I think Henry just has this innocence too [in addition to the look and physicality required for the role], he has both, which is tricky," he explained. "Superman needs the teeniest bit of that. Not to be overt, but you like it to be there ever so slightly. I mean, he grew up in Kansas, that's just true, so you need a little of that."

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1660275/henry-cavill-superman.jhtml

And Amy Adams said it was Cavill's humility that was going to make him a compelling Superman:

"There is a humility to Henry and that’s one of the reasons his Superman is going to be so compelling. He has this beautiful face and humble spirit and that’s really a hard combination to come upon.”

http://www.totalfilm.com/news/amy-adams-talks-the-muppets-and-man-of-steel

 

[goth ham]

I am thinking that this movie is going to go in the "real world" direction. I think they are going to try as hard as they can to make the audience believe that there could actually be a Krypton out there and an alien could be flying around. I think they are going to take a lot of time on Superman's backstory to create a realistic view. This is probably the reason for the weird outfits on everyone from Krypton.

Also, I actually think that Superman should have an "edge." He thinks he is the last person from his world that is alive, knows little about his family, and has special powers. If you were a child/teenager and found this stuff out you would be really edgy about it and I think that would be where having a stable, loving family life would come into play. The Kents should be portrayed very closely to the way they have been in the comics (supportive, loving, and able to accept the unacceptable). They should be what gives Superman his direction.

 

[Rockstar]

Agreed. The "dark" and "edgy" descriptions are getting tedious to me. We all knew with Nolan/Goyer we were going to get something similar to their Bat films (albeit with Snyder's visual flare), but I find myself not caring for it when it comes to Superman. I would like a balance between the "lightness" of Supes and the grit of real life. If that makes sense.

The first official photo for Man of Steel that WB released said everything to me about the tone of the film.

This 'dark and edgy' Superman description is apt.

Superman deserves to be portrayed as a badass for the first time onscreen.

The boyscout is out.

 

[X Knight]

The first official photo for Man of Steel that WB released said everything to me about the tone of the film.

This 'dark and edgy' Superman description is apt.

Superman deserves to be portrayed as a badass for the first time onscreen.

The boyscout is out.

why can't Superman be both a bada** and a boyscout?

 

[El Payaso]

why can't Superman be both a bada** and a boyscout?

It's like the same why we can't make him wear trunks and not wear trunks at the same time.

 

[Rockstar]

Since I'm a Batman fan first, I love this approach. I'm sure most of The Dark Knight audience is with me.

That's what WB is banking on.

 

[Lencho01]

They could do something like this...

 

[ElDuderino]

Clark is rescuing people in tattered clothing with a beard looking like a mountain man on steroids. This isn't rescuing some kid hanging off the rails at the Niagara Falls. Add some sex appeal. A more manly Superman. Some serious destruction and fighting. Sharper dialogue. Non-cartoonish colors and outfits.

That's what they mean by "edgy". And we've known all that for a while now.

 

[Lead Cenobite]

The only people who need every character to be a badass are sheep who are incapable of coming up with their own opinions.

 

[SpitCurl]

It'll be interesting to see how they play the world's reaction to him. To me, that'd be the hardest bit to get right with a more realistic approach. I''ve sort of assumed it's why the previous films had that level of camp to them: you really needed it to distance their world from our own, so that makes sense why people don't all collectivley s**t themselves and run panicked into the streets when he shows up.
You buy that, for some reason, it woudn't freak those people out.

But I think you also have to be careful not to spend too much time on it, because honestly that could be the whole movie right there, just exploring the world's reaction to Superman -- fear, distrust, paranoia, gradual acceptance, etc. You wouldn't even need a proper villain in that sense, so I'm looking forward to seeing how they handle his "outing" in this film.

 

[Rodrigo90]

Since I'm a Batman fan first, I love this approach. I'm sure most of The Dark Knight audience is with me.

That's what WB is banking on.

I'm a Batfan first too, but seeing the TDK used a template for a Superman movie isn't something I would have preferred to see.

I like things plausible and serious, that's the essential in making audience not roll their eyes at things that they see

Edgy, however? Especially in Superman?

As I said before, I honestly believe it'll be a different kind of 'edgy' than TDK's. Despite what that kid said.

Look at what makes Batman edgy in the comics, I see it all in BB and TDK. There is an edgy feel in Superman comics in certain storylines. There has to be an edgy feel in a war breaking out on Krypton however, that's a giving.

But I'm saying that it will be edgy when it has to be, less than BB and TDK, I imagine.

To me, Nolan and Goyer get things right about the characters and the world they live in. They know how and when to hit the mark. I honestly doubt they would change so much of Superman and his world in order just to make it feel like TDK. Using elements from it that they've created, but nothing too drastic to alienate all fans of Superman.

 

[Rockstar]

What makes Batman edgy and what could potentially make Superman edgy thanks to Nolan/Goyer is basically the same..

Tragedy, Death, Sacrifice, War, Isolation, Anger...

The first official picture released really lines up with the "Angry God" concept WB wanted for Superman in recent years.

I think they'll make it as gritty and real-world as possible, otherwise Nolan wouldn't put his name on this. All films associated with him seem to be grounded in this manner.


The Donner film was really the complete opposite. More based in camp, romance and fantasy.

 

[8Diagrams(WU)]

People take whatever interpretation they would like on the matter but with a little common sense you can see what they actually mean by edgy and its relation to TDK.

What they are trying to do is put out modernized versions of the characters. In the real modern world. More realistic, suspensful and involving for the audience as opposed to the *sound trumpet* here comes the hero to save the day aura of the 1940s that for some reason still kind of makes it out there and looks super dated. Take the character and source with seriousness to make it epic. Make a movie based on a comic book not a comic book movie(respect to comics as they are not like this at all today).

Superman wont be a street based character like batman. Thats another story. What they mean by edgy is that you will see something far more involving, suspenseful, intense and modern. This is a good and original formula to follow.

 

[Rockstar]

The official logo released was dark and gritty too, at least according to all the news headlines

http://www.imdb.com/news/ni25368846/

http://www.zimbio.com/Movie+News/articles/a-qjNPZrylm/New+Gritty+Superman+Look+Zack+Synder+MAN+STEEL

http://www.badhaven.com/uncategoriz...-shield-for-supes-debuts-very-gritty-isnt-it/

http://www.firstshowing.net/2012/dark-new-superman-logo-revealed-for-zack-snyders-man-of-steel/

http://www.ifc.com/fix/2012/03/man-of-steel-official-banner-superman

etc


Seems to me that all the evidence about the film's tone is starting to align.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

As I said before, I honestly believe it'll be a different kind of 'edgy' than TDK's. Despite what that kid said.

Look at what makes Batman edgy in the comics, I see it all in BB and TDK. There is an edgy feel in Superman comics in certain storylines. There has to be an edgy feel in a war breaking out on Krypton however, that's a giving.

But I'm saying that it will be edgy when it has to be, less than BB and TDK, I imagine.

To me, Nolan and Goyer get things right about the characters and the world they live in. They know how and when to hit the mark. I honestly doubt they would change so much of Superman and his world in order just to make it feel like TDK. Using elements from it that they've created, but nothing too drastic to alienate all fans of Superman.

I agree.

And it's not like he said Superman is going to be edgy like Batman. Saying that MOS will have a similar edginess to TDK doesn't even definitely mean they two films will have the exact same tone. It just means the stories are both sharp, direct, relatable and poigniant IMO.

They will have to make a big effort not to be TOO much like TDK anyway. Or that'll be a complaint from critics. They'll be accused of just rehashing the same themes.

So they will have to make sure there are clear differences. For example, make sure Metropolis isn't the dark and gritty almost distopian world that Gotham was.

Metropolis still has it's problems, but I always thought one of the main differences between them is that Gothams big problems come from below; from mob bosses and underground crime rings (I.e. Falcone) whereas Metropolis' has it's big problems riding around in limos drinking champagne and living in plain sight like they have nothing to hide (I.e. Lex Luthor). And that's part of why Metropolis APPEARS less damaged. When it fact it's just as in need of fixing.

Of course ALL of that can be described as edgy. Which is why I'm not bothered by the use of the word at all.