Arrow Arrow General Discussion Thread - - - - - - - - Part 22

[zenith16]

I think it will be easier for some people to accept difference once/if they give Laurel her own love interest that hits it off. Her only relationship that could rival fans feelings were Tommy and he has been dead for a hot minute now. Even Katie wants L/O to happen again.

I am character first and relationship 2nd, but relationships on this show overshadow the actual show, it is the main thing they love to talk about right now sadly and it who they like to gear majority of their promotional material towards.

agreed the writer are so overly focus on the love relationship and triangles that it come too much & overly focus on and others like family members or friend's like Ray that helped save your relation ship take back seat when you wouldn't have it if they didn't help you.


so you can have your so wanted sex life when they go missing or are supposedly killed (presumed) they make like the character you made some like do a favor when genocide was going down and he was only who can stop it . so you can have it and character like felicity look bad in the end which I hope isn't the case when they come back .

so I hope they address her taking notice of ray 's supposed presumed death before Laural calls them back in the show even if they are in another town. that should be major national news that a billionaire with a company like his and her boss was killed.


but it looks like she may not noticed and wasn't planning a memorial since she was the closet person to him probably next to Cisco(which he's busy with temporal issues) . this is the problem of late with romance of late from writers. it's over takes way more then it should.

I've never been against romance it's important in shows/ drama's like these , But alot of current writers don't know how to do the execution for a romance right . Only a few get it right and that's the case with both comic's and tv.(movie not so much but it's still about execution) only stan Lee(comic's industry side ) and a small few in tv area get it right. Snd they don't do what's done in freaking soap opera's where the character are only overly concerned with who their sleeping with and the other people that should be important in their lives could being hanging on cliff in front of that very moment. lol

they try and write them like human being's lol. They need to stop looking at "the North American day time soap opera's " as inspiration. They are the worst BTW. they're only ones I know that show case that which I notice some certain writers mimic with these kinda of obsession with characters where that's the only thing that's overly important to them.
who they're sleeping with and any else indanger doesn't seem as important to those characters. but they loose their minds the sex partner gone they loose kid yeah they grives but some they make like it's the end of the world if the sex partner gone.

people freak out just as much theu sibling or kid are about to die inthe real world . but soap's it's just hte person your banging ever else can burn according the the character in those shows.

It's a bad habit I wish certain writers would stop looking in that area for idea's.

 

[ThePreface]

I hope DCE makes a deal with HBO or Starz so I don't have to watch soap operas disguised as comic book shows anymore.

 

[Hunter Rider]

Do Oliver and Felicity have chemistry? Of course. But so does Felicity with just about any character that has been on the show. The Felicity that we grew to love in season 1 and 2, it made so much sense for her to end up with Barry or Ray when they both appeared. Sure, the canon isn't preserved, but its still not preserved with her being with Oliver.

When Olicity was first being tossed around as an idea, I never understood it because Oliver was this rich, good looking badass and he was hooking up with another badass in Sara. He even had a one night stand with Isabel in Russia. Felicity feeling jealous was the extent that that arc should have progressed. Because it makes perfect sense for this geeky, awkward girl to have the hots for someone like Oliver, but to put them together, it reeks so much of a fairy tale "She's all That" type of story and that simply doesn't fit with the tone of the show as it was in the first two seasons. Maybe it's the CW interference, but there's no arguing that Olicity as a whole was done for reasons other than to progress the story, and at this point, it's hurting the show as a whole.

There's 2 issues here my friend, firstly you are projecting your personal preferences as facts regarding the show. I personally had very little issue with "Ollicity" last season, my issue was more with the plotting of Ollie vs the LOA that got convoluted and jumbled.

Also your pairings are pretty much the opposite of life, people getting together because they are mirror images of each other with different genitalia. Felicity gives Ollie a light and hope that takes him out of his darkness, being with Sara or Helena would see him remain in that darkness. Barry is gonna get his MJ with Iris as opposed to dating a female version of himself, that way you get character dynamics that offer various obstacles in maintaining a relationship like in real life.

 

[Hunter Rider]

I hope DCE makes a deal with HBO or Starz so I don't have to watch soap operas disguised as comic book shows anymore.

Comic books have always had a lot of soap opera elements.

 

[zenith16]

Comic books have always had a lot of soap opera elements.

hmmm I'm only for the moments stan lee mentioned which he said those what make them exciting for the relation human moments that feel real.

when they do what current day North American soap opera's do where it's more about who your sleeping with and every thing else suffers story wise or you start to despise a character cause you know in the back of you after the execution where the relationship is borderline obsession or slu *ttyness (the other extreme some it) where even porn movies put those shows to shame, Then there's something wrong. cause they come off as caring about others around then just the person they're sleeping with the latter.


the problem is with North American soap opera's is it's two side deal of the come off as overly obsessive or they are people that there to ruin stuff by claiming they care for some ore more but are sleeping around making sure it's the center of attention while doing so and making things worse with that action when other important/ sometime dangerous are happening at that moment.

And they make the porn characters that admit they are Slu *tty more honest cause those people are more up front in those movies. while with the soap opera's the character are just saying they love this person and saying they care, Then they do the very thing to show they don't care or love that person .

the problem is honesty with it among other things . I can't believe event had to bring porn into this lol which makes even more Ludicrous like I said it's only a few that do it right when it comes to romance. Sadly I did see what soap opera's are like cause I had to grow up with 3 women in the house as kid and my youngest sister when she finally saw thingd when she reach high school dropped soap opera's for a good reason it's cause alot of them are insane to degree she watch's prime time drama's


but when someone like my other sister(who still does watch that stuff) tries to pull her back she say's, No. most of them are just on the thread it's the same thing repeatedly story line wise sadly.

the last time from what she saw. I'm sorry for being negative though. it's just there's better story telling with romance and the worst element's are from north American soap opera's which are used from some certain writer's from both the comic industry and tv sometime too often.

the ones that don't use those over used plot's or trope's are the ones that show up in show's like castle and other better shows . and brain cell from the fan base aren't killed.

Don't worry I won't complain about this again . but I hope they don't do this with Olicity but some how I'm bit worried.

Mostly where felicity is involved .

 

[protocida]

I expect Darhk to kill Waller and leave A.R.G.U.S. in the first episode as they've teased. It'd be an effective way to establish his menace, send the aforementioned "ripples" through all characters and remove Waller from prominence due to Suicide Squad.

 

[Gintoki]

I think it will be easier for some people to accept difference once/if they give Laurel her own love interest that hits it off. Her only relationship that could rival fans feelings were Tommy and he has been dead for a hot minute now. Even Katie wants L/O to happen again.

I am character first and relationship 2nd, but relationships on this show overshadow the actual show, it is the main thing they love to talk about right now sadly and it who they like to gear majority of their promotional material towards.

Can you link me to the amanda waller dying rumor source?

 

[Gintoki]

I expect Darhk to kill Waller and leave A.R.G.U.S. in the first episode as they've teased. It'd be an effective way to establish his menace, send the aforementioned "ripples" through all characters and remove Waller from prominence due to Suicide Squad.

That would be a waste of Character. They could so much more with her character, and to kill off her like that? The show writers have gone to ****.

 

[zenith16]

I expect Darhk to kill Waller and leave A.R.G.U.S. in the first episode as they've teased. It'd be an effective way to establish his menace, send the aforementioned "ripples" through all characters and remove Waller from prominence due to Suicide Squad.

yeah well some how I don't think waller will be dead. missing maybe. but dead? ..... I just don't see the need for Lyla to head back to argus ether. there are other Agency's in the DCU that would better fit her and where she will feel she's actually helping the world .

she left for all the right reasons both her kid (whcih she want to see grow up) and the work that's done there is in question too often, the other people in waller position or above her people don't want to work for.

And no her working there she won't be able to turn it around. there's too many of people in power be side's Waller who are corrupt in there.

It's better that she's with a task force from Dc's Spyral or C.B.I. take them down and take over the investigation into H.i.v.e. or just keep Argus around while she works for those rival agency's so they can have Argus as another enemy that they run into often. she really doesn't need to be back there at all. it's not like other agency don't run into bad guy organizations like H.i.v.e.

It feels like the writer's are overly confused on what should we do with this character making them look like a mess onscreen. but we'll see how this goes.

 

[Primal Slayer]

Can you link me to the amanda waller dying rumor source?

It was like a month or so after S3 ended, I for one just took it with a grain of salt.

 

[protocida]

Embargoes are like that.

 

[zenith16]

Embargoes are like that.

yeah well they won't kill her not in the way we think any way.

 

[Jedi Arrow]

Am I the only one who finds Waller completely insufferable? I wouldn't bat an eyelash if she were killed off.

 

[Primal Slayer]

They haven't done anything with the character since they first brought her on screen. She is just brought on to give orders and that is all.

 

[zenith16]

They haven't done anything with the character since they first brought her on screen. She is just brought on to give orders and that is all.

well bark orders and make people burn by drone attack or make people that work for her suffer if they need help from her if it involves people they care about like their family's. some how the animated and comic series pre new 52 Waller had more character and wasn't a sociopath .


she was difficult to be around and talk to , yes. But not a social path that wanted nothing more to watch people (that she wasn't after cause of her work) in citys burn.

Look that the pretty fire.


Oh No one should confuse this with the actress's ability. The actress is fine . it's how the writers portray her.

 

[Herolee10]

Personally, I still wonder if Oliver even deserves to be called a hero after the latter events of Season 3.

I mean, as far as it was established, the dude knowingly murdered a innocent guy while "working" for Ra's (this was when Ra's thought he had forced Oliver to kill "Diggs" back when they were training).

 

[zenith16]

Personally, I still wonder if Oliver even deserves to be called a hero after the latter events of Season 3.

I mean, as far as it was established, the dude knowingly murdered a innocent guy while "working" for Ra's (this was when Ra's thought he had forced Oliver to kill "Diggs" back when they were training).

Here's the sad thing he went under supposed deep cover and there was no way for him to plan to have that man saved cause unlike other deep cover plan's there's more then just him there and he's would have had to have proper knowledge to have it taken care of so he would have had that guy killed . the show as they said it to news out lets about have controversy fall out the problem is unlike shows like the shield where it's talked about I can't believe happened with cop detective Vic Macky from the Shield wow the actor will win an award for playing a corrupt cop.

with this show it won't be talked in the same way cause it's throw away some how. I think the writers see people like fan talk in excitement said o Sh** and award at the end . but some how it's not really registering why the fan's are talking about it like that.

something is lost in translation there.

any way thing's do go wrong in deep cover when your alone and he had no back up it's just he's not reacting to it.

that maybe should have been one of the thing's he could have said to ra's or Malcolm(Especially the latter) when he was ticked at ether of them "you made me go back on my word/ vow of no killing."

He should have said that when had that last moment with in thea's apartment before he gave the league to him saying he won't for give him.

 

[Fincher]

Here's the sad thing he went under supposed deep cover and there was no way for him to plan to have that man saved cause unlike other deep cover plan's there's more then just him there and he's would have had to have proper knowledge to have it taken care of so he would have had that guy killed . the show as they said it to news out lets about have controversy fall out the problem is unlike shows like the shield where it's talked about I can't believe happened with cop detective Vic Macky from the Shield wow the actor will win an award for playing a corrupt cop.

with this show it won't be talked in the same way cause it's throw away some how. I think the writers see people like fan talk in excitement said o Sh** and award at the end . but some how it's not really registering why the fan's are talking about it like that.

something is lost in translation there.

any way thing's do go wrong in deep cover when your alone and he had no back up it's just he's not reacting to it.

that maybe should have been one of the thing's he could have said to ra's or Malcolm(Especially the latter) when he was ticked at ether of them "you made me go back on my word/ vow of no killing."

He should have said that when had that last moment with in thea's apartment before he gave the league to him saying he won't for give him.

Oliver tends to be self-sacrificing, though, as evidenced by his willingness to turn himself over to Slade or to die taking out Ra's. So while he wants to "aim higher", he's less concerned about his own soul than he is about the well-being of others. He wouldn't be much more angry about Malcolm making him kill an innocent than he would be about Malcolm killing an innocent himself, and Malcolm has a lot of blood on his hands. "You made me kill a guy who might have been innocent" doesn't really bear mentioning when compared to The Undertaking, the people Ra's killed and tried to kill in Starling, or mind controlling his own daughter, Oliver's sister, and forcing her to kill one of their friends. In my opinion, bringing it up would have cheapened that moment.

Maybe he could bring it up this season when talking about the choices he made last season, though.

 

[zenith16]

Oliver tends to be self-sacrificing, though, as evidenced by his willingness to turn himself over to Slade or to die taking out Ra's. So while he wants to "aim higher", he's less concerned about his own soul than he is about the well-being of others. He wouldn't be much more angry about Malcolm making him kill an innocent than he would be about Malcolm killing an innocent himself, and Malcolm has a lot of blood on his hands. "You made me kill a guy who might have been innocent" doesn't really bear mentioning when compared to The Undertaking, the people Ra's killed and tried to kill in Starling, or mind controlling his own daughter, Oliver's sister, and forcing her to kill one of their friends. In my opinion, bringing it up would have cheapened that moment.

Maybe he could bring it up this season when talking about the choices he made last season, though.

That's a good point but it's still a list of things that happen that in his(olivers and parts of the fan base) mind he shouldn't have been placed in. But in a way it's almost as much his(Oliver's ) fault for letting Malcolm play him to head to Ra's in the first place the first time and even still listening to him after that.

With that man, of who's name Oliver didn't know, that he saw the image of Diggle and killed. yes it can be brought in this later season but for some of the fan base it'll be to late. it's something for debate. in my opinion the sad truth is that he was in deep cover and he didn't have the proper set up cause he had no real allies in the League at all. Nyssa had her own problems as well And Maeso wasn't in a good mental state since his kid's death.

Oliver was alone the situation was unavoidable with out allies and proper knowledge planning to have the death faked if that is at all possible. (which would be hard if he had allies)
it will be debated by those that feel bothered I guess.
there wasn't a way out at that point.

It's just another death(which is indeed bad) and he already felt bad about the people of which he did know their names .
but it seem's as though it's something that was there and may never be addressed again by the writers.

If it is cool, but some of fan base will go it's too late or it won't be satisfying in any way for a lot of people.

so they'll(the writers) most likely drop it. it's just not gonna be seen in a good light.

It's still Malcolm's fault he's not the only character at fault. But everything came from him as the source.

 

[Primal Slayer]

A lot funnier then yesterdays panel. How Barrowman doesn't have a reality show is beyond me.

Stephen says he likes to get the rough draft of the script and make about 10-15 notes that usually end up in the production script.

As many know they originally were going to make Malcolm into Olivers father (no surprise there, Laurel being in love with 2 brothers, GOLD!) but he wasn't keen on the idea and his husband suggested he be Thea's father and rest is history. And the writers tend to write his lines really poetically but sometimes it just doesn't fit for him so they gave him permission to change things up as long as it conveys the same message.

 

[zenith16]

^^ Well it's cool he has some say in how things go down . That's rare unless the show "is a show" staring you as the main draw(protagnist) and you been on for some year's where you've become a producer your self or they allow you to direct.

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

are we going to see Laurel become "Dinah" isn't that what Oliver calls her in the comic?

 

[Gintoki]

It was like a month or so after S3 ended, I for one just took it with a grain of salt.

I tried googling it, didn't find anything sadly. Would appreciate if you could link me.

 

[Primal Slayer]

are we going to see Laurel become "Dinah" isn't that what Oliver calls her in the comic?

Well she goes by Dinah in general in the comics. But MG has said only if it feels organic which means no.

 

[Lencho01]

What was the reason for not calling her Dinah in the first place?