BvS Ben Affleck IS Batman!! - Part 7

[slumcat]

His physique in BB was result of him being underweight for The Machinist, then overshooting the mark and having to come down a little. I felt he was a little too big in several scenes though, or at least too bloated.

Yeah he was a bit bloated. He was holding water. The definition wasn't good, he looked soft.

 

[slumcat]

These actors are getting paid millions and provided all the necessary resources to get/maintain said shape. While not easy, it's not an excuse.


I don't think anyone is expecting a pixel by pixel translation of what's in the books, anymore than we're expecting leading ladies to have the form of a coke bottle with large busts. In a day and age where getting impressively ripped is par the course (Hemsworth, Evans, Cavill) and someone like Jackman has been doing it multiple times in over a decade, I don't think it's unfair to expect the bar to at least be met.

It just looks worse because Bale is not only an Academy Award winner known for going to bodily extremes for a part, but he's playing an iconic role who is infamous for that type of dedication. Compound that with how Bale has already looked the part in both American Psycho and Equilibrium, you can't blame fans for being disappointed in that wasted potential.

I don't know whose decision it was to not show Bruce as this impressive looking specimen or even why (I hope it's not that rubber suit), but it's the past now. I'm hoping Affleck's height and solid build combined with Snyder's machismo aesthetic will finally see a Batman who is as physically imposing as his demeanor.

Yeah his best shape was definitely American Psycho which would been great for Batman. He was muscled but not overly-so and was shredded.

 

[slumcat]

But Affleck is also taller than Cavill. I think they will probably do something to make them appear to be equal in height on the big screen; I can't imagine a shorter Superman standing next to Batman, quite frankly.

I believe even the military general Harry Lenix towered over Cavill. And he was a normal military command not even on the field.

 

[slumcat]

Yes, because muscle mass has absolutely zero advantages for their career/hobby. You said it yourself; Bruce encompasses everything. Citing runners is just as erroneous as referencing pure bodybuilders. They're only focused on one aspect of physical conditioning.

It's not hard to see what someone like Batman would look in real life. I'm merely a casual MMA watcher, but I've seen dozens of fighters with impressive builds, with the speed and agility to match. To a normal person, they would be shocked at how swift these muscle men can be.

With that said, I do still favor the leaner look. On the condition he is very well defined. Incidentally a good starting off point would be the oft-mentioned Scott Adkins (who I was never supportive of in the role btw):

Spoiler

Great physique, and he's already proven through his career it's the body type which is conducive to fluid and powerful movements. I'd actually be in full support of him being the main stunt actor for Ben. He even has the advantage of resembling Affleck.

Yeah great example. Infact as Boyka, Adkins is very muscular, great size, sick definition yet agile as ****! He looks big and intimidating but moves like a bullet. So good size/definition can definitely be present along with good speed/agility/flexibility.

 

[slumcat]

I love though how people seem to think that Bale was oh so much bigger in TDKR:

When Bale was probably the smallest in that movie. His physique was just shown off better in TDKR.

Whoa! I thought he was bigger in TDKR. He looks very slim here.

 

[Nathan]

Well, he was off the grid for 8 years. Seems kinda natural that he slimmed down.

 

[slumcat]

Is this scene before or after the workout montage?

 

[shauner111]

Bale said they shot him at different weights in TDKR. There were points , whether it was camera trickery or not, in Rises when he looked more filled out than TDK.

 

[shauner111]

Probably mentioned already, but I love the idea in my head of Affleck talking with Kevin Smith and getting recommendations on which Batman stories to read.

I actually don't think that's even necessary since Affleck is supposedly a massive batman comic fan as it is.

Plus I don't think they've been in touch over the last couple of years.

Between Snyder's fanboy knowledge, Goyer's and Ben's, I doubt Affleck will be going to Kevin Smith.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

I wonder how they will compensate for the height difference between Henry and Ben. Apparently they did a good job of hiding the actor playing Bane's actual height.
I don't hate on actors who can't maintain the ripped to shreds look for every movie spanning a decade. I do hope Henry can get atleast 98% of his Superman body back for the sequel especially considering Ben is taller than him and I still want Superman to be bigger than Batman in some way.

 

[TDK elbowstrike]

Imo, Cavill needs to be at least as built as he was in MOS. Maybe even moreso.I think he's capable. But who knows? I must say though, compared to his Immortals physique, he looked massive in MOS. AND, compared to other superheroes in live action, Wolverine, Batman, Cap, Thor; he held his own as far as being powerfully built. I have high hopes

 

[shauner111]

Moreso? Why? He doesn't need to be bigger than he was in MOS.

 

[Nathan]

His MOS size was perfect. I see no need to buff up even further.

 

[Bathead]

But Affleck is also taller than Cavill. I think they will probably do something to make them appear to be equal in height on the big screen; I can't imagine a shorter Superman standing next to Batman, quite frankly.

Reminds me of the animated Superman episode where Supes takes on the Bat-mantle for a bit while looking for the missing Bruce Wayne. After Superman, disguised as Batman, has a meeting with Gordon and Montoya on the GCPD roof, Montoya turns to Gordon and says "Does he look bigger to you?"

 

[terry78]

Haha, I just don't think fanboys want Bats towering over Supes or looking even remotely stronger from a visual standpoint. Affleck and Cavill are both big dudes as it is.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

Haha, I just don't think fanboys want Bats towering over Supes or looking even remotely stronger from a visual standpoint. Affleck and Cavill are both big dudes as it is.

Dat Affleck height advantage tho....

 

[Sun_Down]

LOL the height conversation. Did Tom Hardy look short in TKDR? Come on, manipulating actor's heights is an old, old, old, old, old filming trick. (Although one they didn't use in Fantastic Four. I still LOL when I see Evans towering over Chiklis).

 

[DKDetective]

Yes, because muscle mass has absolutely zero advantages for their career/hobby. You said it yourself; Bruce encompasses everything. Citing runners is just as erroneous as referencing pure bodybuilders. They're only focused on one aspect of physical conditioning.

It's not hard to see what someone like Batman would look in real life. I'm merely a casual MMA watcher, but I've seen dozens of fighters with impressive builds, with the speed and agility to match. To a normal person, they would be shocked at how swift these muscle men can be.

I cited marathon runners and triathletes as an example of the opposite. I never said that Batman should like one. Even at his smallest as Bruce, Bale was much bulkier than a distance runner. The whole point of the post was that strength is not all that Batman needs. He needs a balance. Professional fighters are not actually that good of an example of the combination of traits that Bruce needs because they train months on end to peak for a fight that lasts 30 minutes to an hour maximum. Batman would need to be leaner and lighter because he is active for a longer period of time. He is depicted as running and fighting all night long. It would make sense for him to rely more on endurance, speed, and agility than strength and mass.

There is atleast some co-relation between size and strength if not much. Just like if you want to make your muscles grow, you have to lift more and more. So big muscles atleast indicate that he can displace that much more weight. Big muscles will pack a bigger punch when he is hitting people. It can help. And it of course contributes to intimidation.

All of that is very true. My point was simply in response to a post that seemed to say that "peak physical condition = strength = size." It is true that fast twitch muscle fibers, the ones involved in short, fast feats of strength do grow in size (hypertrophy) to get stronger in contrast to slow twitch endurance fibers. However, true strength is equally about CNS development and people who train for pure strength like Olympic lifters tend to be less bulky than bodybuilders or what have you. I just meant that the bodybuilder physique that Bruce often has in the comics isn't exactly what he would have in real life, even if does look bad ass.

 

[slumcat]

I must say though, compared to his Immortals physique, he looked massive in MOS. AND, compared to other superheroes in live action, Wolverine, Batman, Cap, Thor; he held his own as far as being powerfully built. I have high hopes

Cavill actually did not do any weight lifting for Immortals! He only did dieting and body weight exercises for six months. He said the goal was to not build mass or size but to show the abs and extreme muscle definition.
MOS was straight up heavy duty body-building for getting as big as possible. So yeah he was much bigger, he said about 20-25 pounds bigger in MOS.

Imo, Cavill needs to be at least as built as he was in MOS. Maybe even moreso.I think he's capable.

He's definitely capable. But do you really think he should be bigger than even this?


I think he was the perfect size in MOS and should just try to repeat that.

 

[TheBat812]

Crossfits the way to go imo. Its functional muscle that develops endurance with its high intensity that also looks very impressive. It just makes sense.

 

[BatLobster]

I actually don't think that's even necessary since Affleck is supposedly a massive batman comic fan as it is.

Plus I don't think they've been in touch over the last couple of years.

Between Snyder's fanboy knowledge, Goyer's and Ben's, I doubt Affleck will be going to Kevin Smith.

Yup, if you listen to the latest Fatman on Batman, Smith hasn't even met 2 of Affleck's kids. They're not nearly as close as they used to be. No particular reason for that, it's just life, people get busy. I detect a smidge of hurt in Smith that Affleck is "too good" for him now, but you can tell he still has a LOT of love for the guy.

This assumption that the two of them are all chummy again or that Smith will get anywhere resembling close to this production is completely unfounded. Smith said it himself, he has like 20 podcasts and a big f***in mouth. Nobody is telling him jack and he finds out stuff along with the rest of us.

 

[slumcat]

All of that is very true. My point was simply in response to a post that seemed to say that "peak physical condition = strength = size." It is true that fast twitch muscle fibers, the ones involved in short, fast feats of strength do grow in size (hypertrophy) to get stronger in contrast to slow twitch endurance fibers. However, true strength is equally about CNS development and people who train for pure strength like Olympic lifters tend to be less bulky than bodybuilders or what have you. I just meant that the bodybuilder physique that Bruce often has in the comics isn't exactly what he would have in real life, even if does look bad ass.

That is true but film is a visual medium just like the comics. The actor doesn't actually have to be Batman and do the stuff that Batman does, he just has to look like he can and look badass. In that context I think size can help. It adds great screen presence to the character and visually conveys a sense of power and superior physical ability.

But yes a healthy balance between size and practicality is the best fit.

 

[DKDetective]

He's definitely capable. But do you really think he should be bigger than even this?


I think he was the perfect size in MOS and should just try to repeat that.

According to Mark Twight, Cavill was only 190lbs in Man of Steel. Only 10lbs heavier than Bale was in TDK and lighter than he was in Begins despite being an inch taller than Bale and thus having to fill out his frame more. What makes Cavill look so incredibly impressive is his killer genetics in terms of shape and structure and the functional program Twight put him on. The result is greater emphasis on the big movers like the lats and pecs. Cavill's arms were smaller than Bale's in Begins and probably not much bigger than they were in TDK, but the crazy V-shape of Cavill's torso (aided by his naturally tiny waist and broad shoulders) makes him look like a freight train.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

His MOS size was perfect. I see no need to buff up even further.

I agree he was a virtual monster in MOS and there is no need for him to he bigger, I also think it is highly unlikely especially considering he is shooting a movie now where he is not supposed to be massive.
Are Ben and Matt still close?

 

[DKDetective]

That is true but film is a visual medium just like the comics. The actor doesn't actually have to be Batman and do the stuff that Batman does, he just has to look like he can and look badass. In that context I think size can help. It adds great screen presence to the character and visually conveys a sense of power and superior physical ability.

But yes a healthy balance between size and practicality is the best fit.

Yep, and if you had made that argument originally, I would have agreed with you whole heartedly, but you started talking about peak physical condition and strength.