The Dark Knight Rises Clearing up the ending of TDKR (MUST READ)

[jonnywhc]

GO AWAY IF YOU DONT LIKE SPOILERS...

I read through the other ending thread and many people seem to thing that Blake will become the next Batman. I don't believe so for the following reasons -

Batman ''dying'' by disposing of the bomb at the end of the film made him into a true legend and redeemed Batman/Gordon in the eyes of the public after Bane outed the lie they had created.

Him dying has now inspired a whole city to rebuild itself and even go as far as to make a Batman statue in his honor.

I believe Bruce remade the Bat-signal to show Gordon he was still alive, much like he left Fox the hint with the auto-pilot.

Blake donning the Batsuit would basically render Batman faking his own death pointless..cos then Batman would return weeks later with Blake under the cowl. He may aswell have just passed the suit onto him, if that was the case.

I think Blake will become his own masked vigilante. And I hope its the truth because I really don't want Batman to simply be a baton to be passed along. Also, I think Blake wouldn't want to be Batman, anyway. He hated the lie Bats and Gordon created.

I always thought this film would end with Bruce showing everyone who he really was in the heat of the final battle..thus effectively stopping the war and fixing the problems between the rich and poor. But if he did then perhaps the symbol of Batman would be tainted..

"People need dramatic examples to shake them out of apathy. And I cannot do this as Bruce Wayne. A man is just flesh and blood, and can be ignored or destroyed. But a symbol..as a symbol I can be incorruptible, I can be everlasting...."

All in all..I made this thread because I loved this film alot but (besides afew little issues) I just hated the ending first time I saw it. I think it gives the impression that Batman 4 is on its way with Blake in the suit. People beside me in the cinema thought this. While talking to Rapunzel of these boards she made me realize that Blake wouldn't be a creature of the darkenss, but of the light. He and Bruce are different so he wouldn't be Batman, he would be his own creation. Robin, Nightwing, anything other than Batman.

Go on...hurl your thoughts and abuse at me

 

[DorneyDave]

I never thought Blake would become Batman...I mean, the statue at the end sort of confirmed that. I also thought the "Robin" nod was meant to reinforce that.

He can become something, but not Batman.

 

[MultipleJesuses]

I agree wholeheartedly Jon Bon.

 

[Batman jr.]

He discovers it, but to me that doesn't mean he'll actually become Batman. In typical Nolan fashion, we are left to decide ourselves.

Which is why I don't understand the outcry. And he won't be Robin for sure, it's just his true name.

 

[DigificWriter]

It's not the people who believe Blake will be Batman who are confused about the ending; it's the people who don't. Nolan implies and sets up Blake becoming Batman about as clearly as is possible without showing him donning the suit.

 

[redhawk23]

GO AWAY IF YOU DONT LIKE SPOILERS...

I read through the other ending thread and many people seem to thing that Blake will become the next Batman. I don't believe so for the following reasons -

Batman ''dying'' by disposing of the bomb at the end of the film made him into a true legend and redeemed Batman/Gordon in the eyes of the public after Bane outed the lie they had created.

Him dying has now inspired a whole city to rebuild itself and even go as far as to make a Batman statue in his honor.

I believe Bruce remade the Bat-signal to show Gordon he was still alive, much like he left Fox the hint with the auto-pilot.

Blake donning the Batsuit would basically render Batman faking his own death pointless..cos then Batman would return weeks later with Blake under the cowl. He may aswell have just passed the suit onto him, if that was the case.

I think Blake will become his own masked vigilante. And I hope its the truth because I really don't want Batman to simply be a baton to be passed along. Also, I think Blake wouldn't want to be Batman, anyway. He hated the lie Bats and Gordon created.

I always thought this film would end with Bruce showing everyone who he really was in the heat of the final battle..thus effectively stopping the war and fixing the problems between the rich and poor. But if he did then perhaps the symbol of Batman would be tainted..

"People need dramatic examples to shake them out of apathy. And I cannot do this as Bruce Wayne. A man is just flesh and blood, and can be ignored or destroyed. But a symbol..as a symbol I can be incorruptible, I can be everlasting...."

All in all..I made this thread because I loved this film alot but (besides afew little issues) I just hated the ending first time I saw it. I think it gives the impression that Batman 4 is on its way with Blake in the suit. People beside me in the cinema thought this. While talking to Rapunzel of these boards she made me realize that Blake wouldn't be a creature of the darkenss, but of the light. He and Bruce are different so he wouldn't be Batman, he would be his own creation. Robin, Nightwing, anything other than Batman.

Go on...hurl your thoughts and abuse at me

Did you miss the part where he reconciles with Gordan and says he understands why he did what he did?

 

[BigEggo]

Why would Bruce be talking about "Anyone can be Batman" and why would there be innumerable references to Batman being a symbol/legend, being more than a man, if he was just to be "killed off" at the end of the trilogy? Batman did become a symbol, and anyone deemed worthy enough (Blake) by Bruce to adopt this symbol would be given the necessary information to do so. If Blake was going to become Robin, his real name would be Dick, Jason or Tim, not Robin, because no superhero is stupid enough to call themselves Robin when that name is readily available in public records. Sorry guys, Blake "rising" at the end, the talk of legends and symbols by Bruce, Alfred and Ra's...it all points to him becoming Batman.

 

[DorneyDave]

Why would Bruce be talking about "Anyone can be Batman" and why would there be innumerable references to Batman being a symbol/legend, being more than a man, if he was just to be "killed off" at the end of the trilogy? Batman did become a symbol, and anyone deemed worthy enough (Blake) by Bruce to adopt this symbol would be given the necessary information to do so. If Blake was going to become Robin, his real name would be Dick, Jason or Tim, not Robin, because no superhero is stupid enough to call themselves Robin when that name is readily available in public records. Sorry guys, Blake "rising" at the end, the talk of legends and symbols by Bruce, Alfred and Ra's...it all points to him becoming Batman.

You're taking Bruce's line a bit too literally. Anyone can be Batman means anyone can become a symbol of good and a source of hope.

Doesn't mean that symbol will be the Bat.

Also, you're taking the Robin thing too literally to for this universe. The Robin thing was in there to show that Blake is becoming the next wave of masked hero, not actually the "Robin" we all know. Just a clever way to show what is going to come.

 

[Roose Bolton]

It's interesting that Blake said about not wanting to hide his face and all that and really with his own views on fighting crime I'd think he'd chose the Robin moniker as a way to honor his own identity.

 

[redhawk23]

Yeah except for the part when he says that he's Robin. Let's not ignore that either.

And Robin has Become Batman in comics when Batman died (or sent back in time whatever).

 

[DigificWriter]

If Bruce wasn't intending for Blake to directly replace him, what was the point of willing Gordon a new Batsignal? I honestly think people are being intentionally obtuse when it comes to the film's ending. It's not nearly as complicated as people are making it out to be.

 

[jonnywhc]

Why would Bruce be talking about "Anyone can be Batman" and why would there be innumerable references to Batman being a symbol/legend, being more than a man, if he was just to be "killed off" at the end of the trilogy? Batman did become a symbol, and anyone deemed worthy enough (Blake) by Bruce to adopt this symbol would be given the necessary information to do so. If Blake was going to become Robin, his real name would be Dick, Jason or Tim, not Robin, because no superhero is stupid enough to call themselves Robin when that name is readily available in public records. Sorry guys, Blake "rising" at the end, the talk of legends and symbols by Bruce, Alfred and Ra's...it all points to him becoming Batman.

Then Batman saving the city wouldn't be as legendary and symbolic if he (no matter who's under the cowl) turned up next week. All that talk was because anyone can do what he did - be courageous and fight for whats right, any Gothamite can who loves their city and its people. Not specifically donning the Batsuit.

Did you miss the part where he reconciles with Gordan and says he understands why he did what he did?

Nope. But the fact is that he himself wouldn't do it, because he isn't a dark knight.

It's not the people who believe Blake will be Batman who are confused about the ending; it's the people who don't. Nolan implies and sets up Blake becoming Batman about as clearly as is possible without showing him donning the suit.

Nolan said he is finishing Batman/Bruce Wayne's story. Not blowing up the balloon. Blake is his own thing. If he becomes Batman then it proves Gotham really is a piece of **** city that always needs Batman, a dark protector. I think Blake would work more directly with the police.

 

[redhawk23]

At the end of the film when Alfred & Wayne see each other & you see her with the pearles on. I knew that Wayne would return as Batman. I mean they have the tracking device on them.

Not to mention in the comics it's Robin who get's Wayne to come back & fight crime.

Except the whole significance of the cafe is that seeing Bruce there with a woman, far from Gotham represents moving on with his life.

 

[BigEggo]

You're taking Bruce's line a bit too literally. Anyone can be Batman means anyone can become a symbol of good and a source of hope.

Doesn't mean that symbol will be the Bat.

Also, you're taking the Robin thing too literally to for this universe. The Robin thing was in there to show that Blake is becoming the next wave of masked hero, not actually the "Robin" we all know. Just a clever way to show what is going to come.

Nolan is a very literal film-maker, he isn't coy about what he's doing, hence why most of his films include tonnes of exposition.
I think you're reading to much into what he did, Robin was a dig at fans who wanted Robin in the trilogy, despite Nolan and Bale both hating the idea.
Saying that Blake is going to become some form of new hero, distinct from Batman, is a much bigger leap of faith than saying he's going to take up the mantle. Why would someone create another persona, one without the deep mythology and trust built up over Batman's existence in the 3 films, rather than become Batman, which even if you don't believe Wayne wanted Blake to do, surely became a very very strong possiblity/almost inevitability when he gave him coordinates to the Batcave?

 

[jonnywhc]

^ If Bruce wasn't intending for Blake to directly replace him, what was the point of willing Gordon a new Batsignal. I honestly think people are being intentionally obtuse when it comes to the film's ending.

To show Gordon he was alive and well, just like he showed Fox. Did you read my opening post?

 

[DorneyDave]

Nolan is a very literal film-maker, he isn't coy about what he's doing....

Also, The Prestige and Memento.

 

[BigEggo]

If Bruce wasn't intending for Blake to directly replace him, what was the point of willing Gordon a new Batsignal? I honestly think people are being intentionally obtuse when it comes to the film's ending. It's not nearly as complicated as people are making it out to be.

Very important point, forgot about that. Wayne fixed the batsignal (even rabid fan boys of Bruce have to accept this) AND gave Blake coordinates to the Batcave - he obviously wants Blake to take over. Denying that is simply irrational.

 

[BigEggo]

Also, The Prestige and Memento.

What exactly is subtle about The Prestige or Memento? Those are very clearly closed tales of bizarre situations.

The spinning top in Inception is about Cobb no longer caring whether he's in a dream or not, it's not about reality itself, its about his acceptance.

 

[AnneFan]

And Robin has Become Batman in comics when Batman died (or sent back in time whatever).

Yes, good point. Regardless of what JGL's "Robin" sets out to do, either as Batman or as some other figure, this is not completely out of line with the comics. The mantle of Gotham's protector has been taken on before. It doesn't have to be 'Batman and Robin'. I suppose Bruce could come back and train him (it's something we can imagine) but I think he's happy to live his new life with Selina.

 

[DigificWriter]

One other thing: Gordon and Blake clearly understood what Bruce wanted, because if they hadn't, the world would know that Bruce was Batman. If Blake weren't meant to directly take on the mantle, maintaining the 'symbol' of Batman would be unnecessary.

 

[jonnywhc]

So anyone with an opinion against yours is a "rabid fan boy of Bruce"?

Blake is a totally different person with different beliefs to that of what Batman stands for.

So Batman faking his own death, his memorial statue - and legacy, legendary and inspiring status as the savior of Gotham - means nothing? He ''died'' to inspire the city. Blake will be his own thing.

 

[redhawk23]

So anyone with an opinion against yours is a "rabid fan boy of Bruce"?

Blake is a totally different person with different beliefs to that of what Batman stands for.

So Batman faking his own death, his memorial statue - and legacy, legendary and inspiring status as the savior of Gotham - means nothing? He ''died'' to inspire the city. Blake will be his own thing.

Throughout the film though Blake learns more and more about where Batman and Gordon were coming from though finally recognizing the limits of the law.

Also, again, the bat symbol light.

 

[DigificWriter]

I'll say this again: the only way Nolan could've made things more clear was to have shown Blake donning the Batsuit.

 

[jonnywhc]

Said it twice - the symbol was to show Gordon he was alive. Just like Fox was told through the auto-pilot hint.

 

[BigEggo]

So anyone with an opinion against yours is a "rabid fan boy of Bruce"?

Blake is a totally different person with different beliefs to that of what Batman stands for.

So Batman faking his own death, his memorial statue - and legacy, legendary and inspiring status as the savior of Gotham - means nothing? He ''died'' to inspire the city. Blake will be his own thing.

Well you seem to be acting that way, if you're obtusely refusing to believe what's right in front of you.
Why does Blake rise the exact same way Bruce did earlier, in the final shot of the trilogy, if he is not about to become the Dark Knight? It would a meaningless finale to the trilogy, and Nolan would be letting himself down. The ONLY reason JGL would possibly be the final person we see as an audience, is if he is about to take up the mantle and become the Dark Knight. Bruce was the star of the trilogy, why would it not end on him, as the person we are closest to?
Batman's legacy isn't a closed thing, everyone accepts him as the hero of the city after his sacrifice, but him coming back doesn't tarnish this legacy, it proves he is an invincible and incorruptible symbol of good, that no matter what happens, will always exist in times of need. If you don't get that, I think you need to rewatch Batman Begins and pay more attention.