EVERYTHING Black Panther - Part 3

[Paradox1]

And this would be why I specified that I was talking about *budget*. Because it seems you aren't; your talking about respect. Which implies you buy into the long obsolete mode of thinking that television is a lesser medium.

I do not believe that at all. tv for the most part is better at telling stories. There are quite a few examples of that in recent years that support that such as Breaking Bad, GOT, Dexter and etc. Which I could pit against any movie over that same era.

Budget is a factor (but its an obvious one),they could make a show work .However to do that I think A. because of the budget you move him out of Wakanda and only show it through flashbacks, or B. you go with some cheap CGI greenscreen that always seems to look horrible on tv. I don't think either works in helping craft a BP I think most people want to see.

 

[DrCosmic]

I think Black Panther would be good if it was one of the premium cable shows. That budget could handle it, perhaps not the spectacle, but the story and acting would make up for that. You'd definitely see the game of thrones type of influence. Could be epic.

I don't think that's best though. BP needs the kind of spectacle, the kind of accessibility that being a film brings. I think, in an ideal world BP having a film trilogy and then spinning off into a weekly premium cable series would be POIFECT! But if I had to pick one, it'd be film, hands down. If I had to wait 3 years to see a BP film vs seeing a cable show of equal quality now, I'd wait three years.

 

[Dr. Evil]

I would think that Wakanda would have to be "greenscreened" for the most part although the village scenes could be shot on location somewhere in Africa.

Due to the country's progression in the last 20 years, I would think that South Africa would be perfect for the tribal scenes, but the film could also easily shoot in London, New York or Los Angeles on a soundstage. One of the major issues in shooting in South Africa though is the "big city" aspect of Wakanda. It will be hard to substitute Cape Town, Durban or Johannesburg for a major Wakandan city, so those scenes may be CGI. Sure those are major cities, but population is an issue.

 

[DrCosmic]

I don't think there should be a major Wakandan city, per se, myself. I like the MCU to start with the real world and become Marvelous.

 

[metaphysician]

Eh, if there isn't a city in Wakandan, that means they are going with the "primitive tribesmen with improbable random technology" take on Wakanda, which is a bad, bad idea.

 

[Dr. Evil]

What is the capital of Wakanda and how is it described?

 

[Paradox1]

Wakanda can be the city and state there doesn't have to any other major city but one.

 

[E-Man]

What is the capital of Wakanda and how is it described?

They've never really mentioned it. On the map of Wakanda that was in the pages of Jungle Action it seemed as though Wakanda was a land of a bunch of regions, and where the Panther clan and most citizens lived was just called Central Wakanda. There are other settlments and regions, but not an actual city name was presented. When Priest took over there seemed to be a good amount of expanding on it, but they never really named cities either. I may be off a bit because I have foolishly not read my annual Priest Panther run, so they may have gone further than talking about how there are tribal dwellers and city dwellers. He did bring back the Techno Jungle that was introduced in Black Panther's first appearance, but that's more like T'Challa's own personal playground instead of a city.

In the recent New Avengers run there have been two cities named. The capital is called The Shining City, and where T'Challa reigns as "King of the Dead" is the Necropolis. Sometimes they refer to the Necropolis as the Dead City. The Shining City is basically what you'd expect from the capital. Tons of urbanization with lots of tech. The Necropolis is basically just some ruins where T'Challa has his own secret tech lair where him and the Illuminati plan how to save the world.

 

[DrCosmic]

Eh, if there isn't a city in Wakandan, that means they are going with the "primitive tribesmen with improbable random technology" take on Wakanda, which is a bad, bad idea.

Hmm... that is a bad idea. I want a third option.

 

[Dr. Evil]

They've never really mentioned it. On the map of Wakanda that was in the pages of Jungle Action it seemed as though Wakanda was a land of a bunch of regions, and where the Panther clan and most citizens lived was just called Central Wakanda. There are other settlments and regions, but not an actual city name was presented. When Priest took over there seemed to be a good amount of expanding on it, but they never really named cities either. I may be off a bit because I have foolishly not read my annual Priest Panther run, so they may have gone further than talking about how there are tribal dwellers and city dwellers. He did bring back the Techno Jungle that was introduced in Black Panther's first appearance, but that's more like T'Challa's own personal playground instead of a city.

In the recent New Avengers run there have been two cities named. The capital is called The Shining City, and where T'Challa reigns as "King of the Dead" is the Necropolis. Sometimes they refer to the Necropolis as the Dead City. The Shining City is basically what you'd expect from the capital. Tons of urbanization with lots of tech. The Necropolis is basically just some ruins where T'Challa has his own secret tech lair where him and the Illuminati plan how to save the world.

I could see The Shining City looking like Cape Town or Johannesburg if they go that route. I could see them shooting in South Africa as a result, but since Wakanda is 99.9% Black, it may be hard to do.

 

[E-Man]

One thing I forgot to mention is that Wakanda is pretty small. According to Ross in the Priest series it's about the size of New Jersey with a population of about 6 million people. That was back in 98, so if they want to inflate the population to something around 8-11 million that would make sense too. With Wakanda being that small on screen I'd like for them to mention how their size allows them to be in close proximity to their neighbors, and that's how their sleeper agents are able to move about so easily. T'Chaka mentioned something in, again Priest's series, about how he has sleeper agents all around the world. This was to Cap back in WWII, so that opens up the door to how Wakanda is able to keep themselves hidden while knowing much about the rest of the world.

 

[fixxxer]

Yea, I was thinking of something along the lines of the Singapore of Africa. Kind of a city-sized country. Not sure how comic-accurate that is, but from what E-Man says, it doesn't seem too far off.

 

[Dr. Evil]

Yea, I was thinking of something along the lines of the Singapore of Africa. Kind of a city-sized country. Not sure how comic-accurate that is, but from what E-Man says, it doesn't seem too far off.

And Singapore is considered one of the most advanced cities/countries in the world.

 

[metaphysician]

An oversized city-state is a good model, yes. My own paradigm for the history is "the Japan of Africa," though obviously much smaller in size and population.

I think the two key failure modes they need to avoid are:

1. Primitive Tribesmen in the Jungle. It doesn't matter how much supertech you inexplicably give them, if the general population is living as primitive tribesmen in the jungle, you are going to lose your audience in one of several ways.

2. Mary Sue Coruscant. Conversely, if they are basically this giant city out of science fiction, with vastly superior tech to the world and have had such for centuries, you get a different set of failures.

 

[Chance Jackson]

An oversized city-state is a good model, yes. My own paradigm for the history is "the Japan of Africa," though obviously much smaller in size and population.

I think the two key failure modes they need to avoid are:

1. Primitive Tribesmen in the Jungle. It doesn't matter how much supertech you inexplicably give them, if the general population is living as primitive tribesmen in the jungle, you are going to lose your audience in one of several ways.

2. Mary Sue Coruscant. Conversely, if they are basically this giant city out of science fiction, with vastly superior tech to the world and have had such for centuries, you get a different set of failures.

agreed they really need to avoid both of those

 

[E-Man]

One thing that would make me worry about them being Mary Sueville is that they would have this flawless country that is only referenced rather than seen. We'd hear so much about how Wakanda is amazingly efficient, but we only spend 5 minutes in the country before taking T'Challa away from any ties to the country besides his costume.

They should just make Wakanda's tech matter of fact instead of worrying about how well it will appeal to the masses. It's their universe, so we'll have to believe whatever they tell us as long as they stay consistent to the story. Just don't try to balance not offending people, and things will be okay. Wakanda has a deep history and past. There's plenty to flesh out if they just build it correctly.

 

[metaphysician]

My idea for how to solve that matter is to simply not make Wakanda a supertech utopia. They have the overall tech level of a contemporary modern nation, with a few "extras" mostly related to vibranium. The difference is, they built a first world infrastructure *themselves*, much like Japan did, because they had greater technical and social development earlier on, enough to avoid colonization.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Another thing that would help Wakanda not be a Mary Sue Utopia is if you take the isolationist issue head on. Give the faction of the Wakandan population that wants free movement and contact with the outside world a voice or place in the plot. Show how this is an untenable situation for T'challa to sustain. You could even have the dissident movement be key to smuggling T'challa out of or into the country if you went with a coup type story.

 

[Dr. Evil]

So, which white director will direct this?

 

[metaphysician]

Another thing that would help Wakanda not be a Mary Sue Utopia is if you take the isolationist issue head on. Give the faction of the Wakandan population that wants free movement and contact with the outside world a voice or place in the plot. Show how this is an untenable situation for T'challa to sustain. You could even have the dissident movement be key to smuggling T'challa out of or into the country if you went with a coup type story.

Pretty much. There certainly should be an isolationist movement in Wakanda, balanced by an integrationist/internationalist movement, with T'Challa and his family's ( if I had my way ) traditionally moderate faction caught in the middle. And to throw a further monkey wrench into it, you could have the odd aggressive expansionist, who thinks Wakanda should totally interact with the outside world. . . by conquering a goodly chunk of Africa as a new empire.

I just don't think the isolationist faction should be hardcore luddites. Their goal should be to guard the borders, keep the culture pristine, keep their vibranium and technological breakthroughs to themselves, and have as little to do with the outside world as possible.

 

[Dr. Evil]

I have a good cast for this film that includes Chiwetel Ejiofor as T'Challa, Forrest Whitaker as T'Chaka, Kevin Grevoiux as Killmonger, Dennis Haysbert as Man Ape and Simon Cassell as Klaw (since Viggo Mortensen is my pick as Dr. Strange).

 

[henzINNIT]

So, which white director will direct this?

I laughed.

Spike Lee?

 

[Dr. Evil]

I laughed.

Spike Lee?

Spike Lee would be interesting.

But is Marvel going to hire a Black director for Black Panther? Or even a female director for Ms. Marvel if that gets made?

 

[terry78]

Doubt it. I know some fanboys suggested Steve McQueen but he's got a straight indie mindset and Disney would have to be insanely lenient to let him do what he wanted.

 

[Gamma Goliath]

Hughes brothers?