Game of Thrones - HBO part 2 - Part 6

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Well, it was hardly equal ground, was it? Brienne was fully armoured whilst Jamie wasn't, his hands were tied and he'd been a prisoner for months.

Even so, he is meant to be the best sword fighter in Westeros, he has been well fed, and kept up fitness with all of the walking, Brienne was toying with him toward the end.

I've wondered who Jamie was referring to when he said "only three people can beat me, and you're not one of them." Barristan is definitely one, then I wasn't sure if he was referring to the Hound and the Mountain (both terrifying fighters in their own right), or possibly Lloris. Though I do seem to remember book Jamie acknowledging Lloris' skill, but not thinking he was at the same level as Jamie yet. Though I'm not sure on that.

And Brienne is quite a fearsome fighter. I'm not sure if she would be able to beat Jamie at his full strength, but it would be a hell of a fight even then.

Ah forgot about The Hound and The Mountain, but yeah I was very impressed with Brienne, as I said above she was toying with him toward the end. She has bested Jamie and Lloris now, in the series at least, never read the books personally. I just think Jamie has been a lot of boast but not following it up with real action, I mean, he wasnt as if he was clearly besting Ned Stark during their fight either.

 

[Spidey-Bat]

I've wondered who Jamie was referring to when he said "only three people can beat me, and you're not one of them." Barristan is definitely one, then I wasn't sure if he was referring to the Hound and the Mountain (both terrifying fighters in their own right), or possibly Lloris. Though I do seem to remember book Jamie acknowledging Lloris' skill, but not thinking he was at the same level as Jamie yet. Though I'm not sure on that.

And Brienne is quite a fearsome fighter. I'm not sure if she would be able to beat Jamie at his full strength, but it would be a hell of a fight even then.

I know he thinks Barristan and the Mountain could beat him due to skill and size, respectively. For the 3rd, probably the Hound though I recall him mentioning Jon Umber (may have just been comparing his size to Brienne though).

If you count some deceased men, Arthur Dayne was the best knight who ever lived and Robert Baratheon probably could have defeated him, too.

 

[Bruce Malone]

Hypothetically do you think ned could have beaten him had the fight been fair? Jaimie sure seemed to think so i believe but i wonder if his over-confidence would have gotten the best of him?

 

[Thundercrack85]

I don't get the sense that Loras is such a great fighter. He had to use a rather dirty trick to win against the Mountain. And he lost to Brienne in a fair fight. He's probably decent, but I don't get the sense that he's exceptional.

Jaime's "awesomeness" is an informed trait at this point. He's obviously good, but we (the viewers) have no reason to believe he is some sort of legendary fighter, since we've really only seen him kill one man in combat.

Based on the show, the best would be the Hound, Ned, Selmy, the Mountain, and Brienne.

And Robert in his day, presumably. Also, we don't see him much but Stannis is clearly a badass. Dude had to be dragged off the freaking battlefield by his men.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Hypothetically do you think ned could have beaten him had the fight been fair? Jaimie sure seemed to think so i believe but i wonder if his over-confidence would have gotten the best of him?

I did get the sense that Ned was holding back.

They seemed evenly matched though.

 

[Spidey-Bat]

Hypothetically do you think ned could have beaten him had the fight been fair? Jaimie sure seemed to think so i believe but i wonder if his over-confidence would have gotten the best of him?

No, Ned was only a competent swordsman. His older brother, Brandon, was the best in his family. Ned's talent was being a commander.

I don't get the sense that Loras is such a great fighter. He had to use a rather dirty trick to win against the Mountain. And he lost to Brienne in a fair fight. He's probably decent, but I don't get the sense that he's exceptional.

Jaime's "awesomeness" is an informed trait at this point. He's obviously good, but we (the viewers) have no reason to believe he is some sort of legendary fighter, since we've really only seen him kill one man in combat.

Based on the show, the best would be the Hound, Ned, Selmy, the Mountain, and Brienne.

And Robert in his day, presumably. Also, we don't see him much but Stannis is clearly a badass. Dude had to be dragged off the freaking battlefield by his men.

Loras is a very good swordsman, in the novels he's only 17 so what he does is more impressive. However, he is full of himself (though Jaime is as well).

Robert in his prime was a berserker. He was fearless and immensely strong, Ned couldn't even pick up his warhammer.

Stannis is more in the vein of Ned. Decent swordsman but he excels at being a commander, especially in a navy. He captured Dragonstone during Robert's Rebellion and was responsible for destroying most of the Greyjoy's fleet during their rebellion.

 

[moviedoors]

“Whenever I wanted to make a child with him, he had so many excuses, so many late night war councils. He never wanted to try, except one evening, after he’d had far too much wine to drink, he suggested something… something that sounded very painful and couldn’t possibly have resulted in children.”

If there's a funnier, smarter bit of dialogue on any TV show this year, it'll be one of the great years for the medium. It's still making me laugh.

 

[Infinity9999x]

I don't get the sense that Loras is such a great fighter. He had to use a rather dirty trick to win against the Mountain. And he lost to Brienne in a fair fight. He's probably decent, but I don't get the sense that he's exceptional.

Jaime's "awesomeness" is an informed trait at this point. He's obviously good, but we (the viewers) have no reason to believe he is some sort of legendary fighter, since we've really only seen him kill one man in combat.

Based on the show, the best would be the Hound, Ned, Selmy, the Mountain, and Brienne.

And Robert in his day, presumably. Also, we don't see him much but Stannis is clearly a badass. Dude had to be dragged off the freaking battlefield by his men.

We haven't seen anything in the show that showed Ned as being all that good of a fighter. The only thing you have is his fight with Jamie, and if you're not believing that Jamie is a legendary fighter, then Ned's fight with him doesn't really prove much.

The fight with Ned never actually happened in the books, the show added it for dramatic purposes (and I loved it). But as far as skill goes, Ned wouldn't have been able to beat Jamie. Had Robert stayed in shape, he may have been able to still give Jamie a go. Rhygar Targarian was supposed to be a legendary fighter as well, and Robert slew him in battle. But Robert let himself go very far to seed, so Robert wouldn't have been able to match Jamie while Jamie was in his prime.

Jamie is supposed to be the best swordsman alive since Barristan. And I'm assuming he's putting the Hound and the Mountain in the category of men who could beat him simply because of their enormous size and strength.

However, if we could magically wave a wand and restore all the people we've talked about to their "prime" I've always gotten the sense the Barristan is the man that no one could beat. Heck, the guy joined a joust when he was 10.

 

[Thundercrack85]

We haven't seen anything in the show that showed Ned as being all that good of a fighter. The only thing you have is his fight with Jamie, and if you're not believing that Jamie is a legendary fighter, then Ned's fight with him doesn't really prove much.

The fight with Ned never actually happened in the books, the show added it for dramatic purposes (and I loved it). But as far as skill goes, Ned wouldn't have been able to beat Jamie. Had Robert stayed in shape, he may have been able to still give Jamie a go. Rhygar Targarian was supposed to be a legendary fighter as well, and Robert slew him in battle. But Robert let himself go very far to seed, so Robert wouldn't have been able to match Jamie while Jamie was in his prime.

Jamie is supposed to be the best swordsman alive since Barristan. And I'm assuming he's putting the Hound and the Mountain in the category of men who could beat him simply because of their enormous size and strength.

However, if we could magically wave a wand and restore all the people we've talked about to their "prime" I've always gotten the sense the Barristan is the man that no one could beat. Heck, the guy joined a joust when he was 10.

Considering that Robert and Selmy think highly of him, I'd say that goes a long way. Ned holding his own against Jaime just solidifies it.

But then Ned has other things going on. They emphasize what a good (as in noble) lord he is. All Jaime has is his talent with a sword, but he rarely gets to showcase it. I'm just not feeling this "greatest swordsman of his day", when he almost never gets to show it off. Maybe if they had done like a scene where he kills a **** load of Northerners as he's captured. Or even implied something like that.

Instead he comes off as a poser.

 

[DACrowe]

They said he killed ten Northerners before they took him at the Battle of the Whispering Wood in "Baelor."

He also made quick work of Jory and one of Ned's other men. He has shown himself off to be exceptionally dangerous in the show.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

^As someone who has just watched the show and never read the books, Jamie comes across as someone who is all talk and very little action. He fought Ned and the fight was a standstill as neither seemed to get the better of the other. Then he fought Brienne and yes, while he wasnt at his best, she still ended up toying with him.

This is one of the few shows out there which doesnt employ flashbacks and i do think sometimes that is a mistake. Actually showing the likes of Ned, Jamie, even Barristan as the fearsome fighters they are meant to be woudnt hurt.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Jamie was disappointed when Ned was attacked by another in the middle of their duel. That is all you need to know.

 

[Monsieur Xavier]

Sometimes you don't need to see, knowing is enough.
Look at Boba Fett, the guy did nothing but dieing in a funny scene and was labeled as the badass of the galaxy far far away.

 

[Marvin]

Having finally read the book I'm def getting that TDK vibe, in that the source material does a great deal better job of presenting ideas such as Jamie's true skill and other such things.

The fights in this series need better direction. And I would very much enjoy if some of the internal dialogue somehow made it to the screen some how, especially in Tyrion's case, dear gosh.

 

[FVD]

Great episode. Liked the introduction of Jojen and Meera Reed. Looking forward to where their arc leads. Nice mention of their father Howland Reed too - hope to read about him soon as well in the upcoming books. Stop dicking around GRRM!!

Oh and the foreshadowing with Baelish and Sansa too - damn she's getting tall. Loving Margaery too not to mention Diana Rigg as her grandmother. She was brilliant!

And a shame there's going to be no Strong Belwas. Now bring on Edmure and the Blackfish!

 

[squeekness]

Having finally read the book I'm def getting that TDK vibe, in that the source material does a great deal better job of presenting ideas such as Jamie's true skill and other such things.

The fights in this series need better direction. And I would very much enjoy if some of the internal dialogue somehow made it to the screen some how, especially in Tyrion's case, dear gosh.

This is always the trouble when adapting books for the screen. There are all these nuances that get lost. I will say that so far this show is doing a great job considering how packed and detailed these books are. It could have been a lot worse.

 

[Marvin]

This is always the trouble when adapting books for the screen. There are all these nuances that get lost. I will say that so far this show is doing a great job considering how packed and detailed these books are. It could have been a lot worse.

In cases such as Shawshank Redemption, we get alot of that Narrative style in the form of Freemans narration.

In the case of 300, we get that narrator, but not internal diag.

In the case of Sincity, we get a true adaptation in the case of a narrator and each character's own internal diag.
Half that films appeal is a mystery to most but alot of it lies in the fact that we just don't get that experience that often.

Sucks that most story tellers in hollywood(and critics) think it a weaker from of adaptation. It can really elevate things.

 

[Kaleb]

 

[mr. peasant]

This is always the trouble when adapting books for the screen. There are all these nuances that get lost. I will say that so far this show is doing a great job considering how packed and detailed these books are. It could have been a lot worse.

Sure, you might lose certain nuances in the change from book-to-television. However, a well-made adaptation would replace them with new nuances using tools and devices that would not have been possible in the original book format.

 

[Ramsay Snow]

I've only seen the show, and I thought Ned was being toyed with Jaime. Ned had nothing to lose and was going all out. Jaime was holding off and trying to take him without harming him - after all, Ned had Tyrion captive. He got pissed off when that Lannister soldier speared him.

With the Brienne fight, he was dragged in chains and stuff after being held captive for a long time. Also, he was in handcuffs. Even then, he put up a great fight despite have some disadvantages and despite Brienne trying her best not to harm him.

These things point out to me that he's an exceptional swordsman, even though he may be hyping himself more. I guess that was enough for me, but maybe I'm in the minority I dunno lol

 

[Reek]

I think Jamie knew Ned was a worthy opponent... he wanted to fight him in the hand's tournament for a good fight.

I think it would have said a lot more about Jamie if he had killed the guy who stabbed Ned's leg, rather then just punch him.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I don't know, that's one way to become unpopular with your men (that's never good).

Really I just saw it as Jaime being disappointed, since, he can't now say that he beat Ned in a fair fight. Even though he could, the Lannister soldier wrecked it for him.

I was kind of wondering about those Lannister soldiers. I assume they're Tywin's vassals?

So are they like just buddies with like Jaime, or how does that work exactly?

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I've only seen the show, and I thought Ned was being toyed with Jaime. Ned had nothing to lose and was going all out. Jaime was holding off and trying to take him without harming him - after all, Ned had Tyrion captive. He got pissed off when that Lannister soldier speared him.
With the Brienne fight, he was dragged in chains and stuff after being held captive for a long time. Also, he was in handcuffs. Even then, he put up a great fight despite have some disadvantages and despite Brienne trying her best not to harm him.

These things point out to me that he's an exceptional swordsman, even though he may be hyping himself more. I guess that was enough for me, but maybe I'm in the minority I dunno lol

Thats not true, Jamie tells his father in a later episode when his father asks him that the only reason he didnt kill Ned Stark was because it wouldnt have been honourable or clean after his man had stabbed him. Jamie was trying to kill Ned in that fight. And again, I didnt see Jamie getting any major advantage over Ned in the fight.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I figure Ned was preoccupied.

Probably thinking "What the hell did my wife do this time?"

 

[Roose Bolton]

I wonder if they'll ever address Ser Aurther Dayne in the series?