The "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) thread - Part 8

[MadVillainy]

The dude's made ONE film..... ONE Stop drinking the kool-aid

Pretty sure he was kidding...or at least I hope he was

 

[Docker2.0]

The dude's made ONE film..... ONE Stop drinking the kool-aid

I think it was pretty obvious he was being sarcastic. Normally you pick that up pretty easily but I understand your rage from this film is blinding you. It's delicious.

 

[Eddie]

Uh, yep. That was definitely sarcasm. For goodness sake, I said Josh Trank got stoned because he was making a film about a stone man.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

The dude's made ONE film..... ONE Stop drinking the kool-aid

bwah ha ha!

 

[Dark Raven]

So we've had a teaser trailer for Star Wars today, which is a year away, and nothing for FFINO still, which is less than a year away. Hardly surprising I guess. Maybe Fox hired Edgar Wright to work on a trailer. That will be ready by the time the next 7 years is up.

 

[Eddie]

The only reason we got the synopsis yesterday was someone at Fox looking at the calendar and realized it was as perfect a date as any to send that turkey out to die.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I think it was pretty obvious he was being sarcastic. Normally you pick that up pretty easily but I understand your rage from this film is blinding you. It's delicious.

lol to be quite fair... we've seen posts from people being 100% serious with stuff like that... it's sad lol

 

[justanotherguy]

posted in other thread but more tidbits about Trank http://www.tigerdroppings.com/rant/display.aspx?p=53956399&sp=54044558&s=2#54044558

 

[Marathon]

How likely are we looking at a Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance - type of situation? Even though Sony could market that movie as a Crank movie in "spirit" (sorry for the pun, haha), it didn't help it in the end.

Kind of similarly, Fox can market their FF as a Chronicle movie, but will it be enough? How big is the Chronicle fanbase? Will they flock to this movie and lift its box office prospects?

 

[Doc Ock]

I was a movie store the other day, and two other guys were talking about Chronicle and their interest in a sequel. I was thinking in my head the whole time "I really hope the people who liked Chronicle don't make FF a big hit."

 

[Boom]

FOX should scrap the movie and just release a "making of" documentary.

Guaranteed to be the highest grossing comedy of the year.

 

[Doc Ock]

FOX should scrap the movie and just release a "making of" documentary.

Guaranteed to be the highest grossing comedy of the year.

I'd watch it.

 

[james-in-cali]

Is anyone here old enough to really remember the production of the 1994 fantastic four? This production is eerily similar. I am sticking to my theory that this film will never get released.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Is anyone here old enough to really remember the production of the 1994 fantastic four? This production is eerily similar. I am sticking to my theory that this film will never get released.

I do remember it, but I actually think it sounded a little more promising. I remember reading articles and seeing photos in magazines like Comics2Film. I wasn't thrilled by the look of the film, but the Thing looked good, and at the time (when the only decent Superhero films were Superman and Tim Burton's Batman and Marvel didn't have anything but the TV Spiderman, Hulk, Daredevil etc. - and a couple awful Captain America efforts) I was excited and hoping it could outperform it's low budget.

But yeah, then as now, it felt clear they weren't really investing what the needed to make a great movie.

 

[Spiderdevil]

I too am getting the feeling that this isn't getting released, Trank and the cast probably realized that mid-production which is why they seem so pessimistic

 

[Dark Raven]

Well I'd say most of the cast realised that. Trank probably still believes it's going to be the biggest movie of 2015, outgrossing Avengers 2, and MBJ just thinks people are going to see it anyway.

 

[Avid Avenger]

So if it never gets released why are they allowed to keep the rights?

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

So if it never gets released why are they allowed to keep the rights?

If they don't release it, the rights will revert to Marvel. It's possible at this point that they're stalling and/or still negotiating in some form with Marvel.

From some statements we've heard, it also seems that a very minimal release will still allow them to retain the rights. So they could be doing a Corman with the intent of actually putting it in a few theaters (presumably if Marvel hadn't stepped in, the Corman version would have had an actual release).

There are many possible ways this could go. I think just about the only thing we can be certain about is that we won't be getting a real Fantastic Four film in August.

 

[wobbly]

So if it never gets released why are they allowed to keep the rights?

They are not. After the Corman effort exposed that possible exploit the contracts since have a timer on a theatrical release date as well as shooting, precisely so they can't film any old thing then can it to keep the rights. If they don't release this film they lose the FF, simple as that.

Like it or not, this will be released (imo). If we are correct in assuming Fox have low-balled the budget they can get away with a mediocre return and still turn a profit (even if somewhat meagre) and will keep the rights for another 7/8 years.

 

[Dark Raven]

Even if this film flops, and Fox retains the rights for another 7 years, I still see them trying to pull this trick again when the time comes to revert. This has been the history of the Fantastic Four movies on film. Always underlying it is the primary driving force of preventing the rights from reverting instead of actually making a good FF movie. Since that is the priority, no wonder it always turns out this way. And why would we expect Fox to do any differently in 7 years time or to even hand over the rights to Marvel after FFINO flops?

 

[wobbly]

If they don't release it, the rights will revert to Marvel. It's possible at this point that they're stalling and/or still negotiating in some form with Marvel.

From some statements we've heard, it also seems that a very minimal release will still allow them to retain the rights. So they could be doing a Corman with the intent of actually putting it in a few theaters (presumably if Marvel hadn't stepped in, the Corman version would have had an actual release).

There are many possible ways this could go. I think just about the only thing we can be certain about is that we won't be getting a real Fantastic Four film in August.

I'm pretty sure I read that after the Corman fiasco the contracts stipulate Sony/Fox do have to give their films a proper release, so they can't get away with giving it a showing in a few back alley theatres to get around that clause. Now how big a release is open for debate, but I'm pretty sure it still has to be a significant effort.

As far as them maybe negotiating still...Well, stranger things have happened, but I'd be surprised at this stage if that is the case. I think Fox are playing 'Dog in a Manger' big time here.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I too am getting the feeling that this isn't getting released, Trank and the cast probably realized that mid-production which is why they seem so pessimistic

At this point, I imagine they're hoping it won't be released. If I were Jamie Bell, I'd rather this thing never saw the light of day than to be stuck starring in an awful film.

There could also be an element of that behind some of the Trank rumors. Once Trank realized the studio wasn't going to take his film seriously or give him what he needed to do it right, he might have rebelled.

And while some have speculated that the reason this is so quiet is they're intentionally keeping things under-wraps, we have had several interviews with stars that occurred after the wrap in which they did mention details . . . but refrained from expressing any genuine enthusiasm for the film

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I'm pretty sure I read that after the Corman fiasco the contracts stipulate Sony/Fox do have to give their films a proper release, so they can't get away with giving it a showing in a few back alley theatres to get around that clause. Now how big a release is open for debate, but I'm pretty sure it still has to be a significant effort.

I hope so, and I hope that's defined clearly enough to prevent them from skirting it.

I'd like to think there's something (we had discussed 'quality clauses' in the past) that forces them to either do a serious film or nothing. My biggest fear is this really will be a modern day Corman that will actually be in theaters (and extend Fox's rights another 7 years - everybody be extra careful handling mirrors over the coming months, we don't need an extra 7 years of bad luck ).

Unfortunately any 'quality clauses' that do exist didn't prevent Ghost Rider II, for example. I have a feeling that's what we're going to be getting - a film that is just serious enough to be considered an actual film without having anything worth watching.

 

[wobbly]

I hope so, and I hope that's defined clearly enough to prevent them from skirting it.

I'd like to think there's something (we had discussed 'quality clauses' in the past) that forces them to either do a serious film or nothing. My biggest fear is this really will be a modern day Corman that will actually be in theaters (and extend Fox's rights another 7 years - everybody be extra careful handling mirrors over the coming months, we don't need an extra 7 years of bad luck ).

Unfortunately any 'quality clauses' that do exist didn't prevent Ghost Rider II, for example. I have a feeling that's what we're going to be getting - a film that is just serious enough to be considered an actual film without having anything worth watching.

GR2, Elektra and the Blade flicks have been the cheapest Marvel brand flicks I can think of (between $40 and $60mil I think) so far. Something in that region may the base level they can get away with as far as their investment goes (I would think the various t&c's likely make sure the studio cannot get away with doing something overwhelmingly cheap, ala Corman and the $1mil spent there).

Obviously, these days anything less than £100mil for a supposedly 'big' CBM doesn't look good, though money is no guarantee of quality either (Green Lantern...).

As far as quality goes it doesn't look like Marvel get to sign off much on that score going by some past efforts. They likely have someone on board to make sure the studios are at least sticking the t&c's of the contracts, but beyond that there doesn't seem to be any influence.

 

[SpideyFan866]

I've maintained for months that Fox wants nothing to do with FF and is only releasing this film to hold on to the rights, and have the leverage they didn't have for negotiations prior to production.

That said, I'm gonna throw out this theory:

I think Fox is willing to give back the F4 rights, no fuss........ but in exchange for merchandising for the X-Men films, and live action TV rights. Whether Marvel will agree to it or not is another story. But with it unlikely that they'll get the X-Men film rights any time soon....... they just might, if they haven't already.

But at the moment, Marvel is in position to reacquire Spider-Man AND F4 (near simultaneously), and would be foolish to turn down such an offer.

Sony is in disarray and will either cut a deal with Marvel to share/co-produce Spidey films, or flat out relinquish the rights if they can't get their house in order, which is looking more and more unlikely in the aftermath of ASM2, and with their plans for S6 and spinoffs looking less likely with each day. And the recent hack that crippled their entire company (film division included) doesn't help.

And in the case of F4, we already know how unlikely this franchise is to have a future under Fox, and how much Marvel would love to have it back. And if getting the latter back meant sacrificing even more control over the X-franchise (which as mentioned before, is unlikely to ever come back to Marvel), then I think they would.

Plus...... of those Big 3 franchises that are still licensed by other studios, X-Men is the franchise they need the LEAST in regards to the MCU, whereas Fantastic Four is what they need the MOST moving forward.