The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - - Part 12

[Dasher10]

Marvel made deals with Fox and Sony originally from a position of weakness.

Disney/Marvel Studious made their deals with Netflix from a position of strength.

I don't see Disney giving anyone anything that would lock them out for any significant time that they know they can make money from.

Except the Netflix deal happened before Disney decided to create their own streaming platform. Disney may have creative control over the Defenders but they aren't going to aid a direct competitor.

 

[wobbly]

I mean what if Netflix has a clause which prevents Marvel from relocating the shows elsewhere? If Disney can't migrate the shows, then Disney can put a freeze on anything related to the characters. Fans won't be happy but I can see this happening over DVD rights and access to earlier seasons.

And this begs the question of why I should watch Punisher next week if it won't be renewed?

I'd be willing to bet the Netflix deals are more likely on a season to season basis. I'd be surprised if Disney repeated the same mistakes the Marvel of old made.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

https://mcuexchange.com/disney-fox-netflix/

This deal could still happen, but it is only a possibility, not a probability. More specifically talks have “have stalled, and it is unclear whether they will restart, let alone result in a deal, according to people close to the discussions.” This isn’t hopeful, but it also isn’t definitely “dead.” Unclear about restarting is better than “won’t restart.”




The deal would DEFINITELY include X-Men and the Fantastic Four. A few individuals on social media have suggested this deal wouldn’t include the rights to the Fox Marvel properties. The WSJ article confirms that these rights are most certainly part of the deal, should it happen.

 

[Big Bang]

Except the Netflix deal happened before Disney decided to create their own streaming platform. Disney may have creative control over the Defenders but they aren't going to aid a direct competitor.

Isn't Netflix just acting as financer/distributor? I'm pretty sure the various series themselves are co-produced by Marvel Television & ABC Studios.

 

[Web-Head]

https://mcuexchange.com/disney-fox-netflix/

This deal could still happen, but it is only a possibility, not a probability. More specifically talks have “have stalled, and it is unclear whether they will restart, let alone result in a deal, according to people close to the discussions.” This isn’t hopeful, but it also isn’t definitely “dead.” Unclear about restarting is better than “won’t restart.”




The deal would DEFINITELY include X-Men and the Fantastic Four. A few individuals on social media have suggested this deal wouldn’t include the rights to the Fox Marvel properties. The WSJ article confirms that these rights are most certainly part of the deal, should it happen.

 

[Big Bang]

https://mcuexchange.com/disney-fox-netflix/

This deal could still happen, but it is only a possibility, not a probability. More specifically talks have “have stalled, and it is unclear whether they will restart, let alone result in a deal, according to people close to the discussions.” This isn’t hopeful, but it also isn’t definitely “dead.” Unclear about restarting is better than “won’t restart.”




The deal would DEFINITELY include X-Men and the Fantastic Four. A few individuals on social media have suggested this deal wouldn’t include the rights to the Fox Marvel properties. The WSJ article confirms that these rights are most certainly part of the deal, should it happen.

On one hand, the sale of Prince Alwaleed's shares could be a boon, in that the buyer could put pressure on the Murdoch's to be more flexible on a final price, if Rupert was the one who ultimately rejected the bid (as some have reported). Not knowing who the buyer is certainly adds to the intrigue.

 

[Crimz]

We're so tantalizingly close!

 

[Tymminator]

Except the Netflix deal happened before Disney decided to create their own streaming platform. Disney may have creative control over the Defenders but they aren't going to aid a direct competitor.

We actually don't know when they decided to make their platform, in fact, I would not be at all surprised they did the Netflix deal as a pilot to see how stuff like the streaming process goes. Because you are just now hearing of it doesn't mean they were not working on it for awhile. Many situations by the time the public hears about deals, a ton of stuff has already been done behind the scenes.

Besides the fact, its Disney. They are just not going to tie their own hands like that, they are used to approaching deals as if it's them doing you the favor. If there are any restrictions agreed upon for Disney to uphold, they will not be anything for a long time. They would not agree to it and Netflix would not even try to strong-arm them into it. If anyone is going to strong arm anyone in that relationship, it will be Disney strong-arming Netflix

 

[Big Bang]

We're so tantalizingly close!

Knowing that we could be looking at a complete MCU in the near(er) future is giving me goosebumps.

 

[Tymminator]

https://mcuexchange.com/disney-fox-netflix/

This deal could still happen, but it is only a possibility, not a probability. More specifically talks have “have stalled, and it is unclear whether they will restart, let alone result in a deal, according to people close to the discussions.” This isn’t hopeful, but it also isn’t definitely “dead.” Unclear about restarting is better than “won’t restart.”




The deal would DEFINITELY include X-Men and the Fantastic Four. A few individuals on social media have suggested this deal wouldn’t include the rights to the Fox Marvel properties. The WSJ article confirms that these rights are most certainly part of the deal, should it happen.

I will go out on a limb and say its actually probable, not just possible.

Fox really wants to unload a lot of stuff and the only reason things have "stalled" is that both sides probably went back to mull over the current deals on their plates.

I'm sure Fox wants more than what Disney offered, and it may go back and forth a bit, but that said I don't think this will take years, I think this will go down fast (relatively).

If I'm wrong, whatever. I can live with that. I am no "scooper" or "insider'.

That said, I think its going to go down, and it will go down fairly fast (although too slow for most fanboys/fangirls).

I'm just going to revisit this by the end of this year, if we don't hear anything by then, one way or the other, I will seriously be surprised.

 

[Web-Head]

Fan4stic is starting on FXX in case anyone's interested

 

[Tymminator]

Fan4stic is starting on FXX in case anyone's interested

I promised myself the only time I will watch it is after Marvel Studios was officially announced to have the rights back.

THEN I would set a date, and for that day I would grab a few cases of beer, invite some friends over, stream/rent/whatever it and then my friends and I would MST3000 the hell out of that movie and have a great time.

 

[Big Bang]

I will go out on a limb and say its actually probable, not just possible.

If the reaction by the market is anything to go by, then I agree with you. Though I'll remain cautiously optimistic.

Either way, the cat is out of the bag. Everyone knows that Disney wants to bulk up on properties for its forthcoming streaming service, and of the remaining studios that they could purchase, Fox offers the best options. Fox (and by extension the Murdoch's) know that there will be other potential suitors now that it is public knowledge they were entertaining a sale, hence the stalling of talks to coax more money out of Disney.

One way or another there is going to be consolidation of the entertainment industry. It already started when Comcast bought NBC-Universal, and then was followed up by AT&T's bid for Time Warner. Disney has to make a move at some point with respect to Fox, otherwise someone else will. All that remains otherwise is Sony and Paramount of the "Big 6", and compared to Fox neither of those have anything close to the Television content that Fox has. Which other than the Marvel movie rights is what Disney seemingly wants most.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

On one hand, the sale of Prince Alwaleed's shares could be a boon, in that the buyer could put pressure on the Murdoch's to be more flexible on a final price, if Rupert was the one who ultimately rejected the bid (as some have reported). Not knowing who the buyer is certainly adds to the intrigue.

Murdoch's starting to sound somewhat defensive:

"Let me be very clear — Fox does have the required scale to continue to both execute on our growth strategy and deliver increased returns to shareholders," Murdoch said at the start of a call with Wall Street analysts on the company's strong fiscal first-quarter earnings. "Our businesses and brands are stronger than ever."

http://beta.latimes.com/business/hollywood/la-fi-ct-fox-earnings-20171108-story.html

He may not have been happy with Marvel's offer, but now that the concept is out there and people are saying: "Yeah, this is a pretty great idea." Murdoch will be getting pressure from shareholders and he may have to reconsider an offer he originally thought wasn't enough.

... and if he doesn't, he damn well better have more than just assurances that they can still be competitive going forward.

 

[ADollarADay]

Fox wussied out and didn't wanna answer any questions.

https://edge.media-server.com/m6/p/z6bchm36

Let me be very clear upfront that we have a longstanding policy of not commentating, commenting, on speculation around corporate activity or transactions we will continue to adhere to that policy meaning that we will not be responding at all to questions or comments regarding recent press speculation

As Lachlan pointed out, we can't comment on market speculation

That pretty much confirms talk took place and may still be taking place. If Disney says the same tomorrow I'll be inclined to say the "on again off again" that was thought to be "off" two days ago is back to "on" now.

 

[Big Bang]

Murdoch's starting to sound somewhat defensive:

"Let me be very clear — Fox does have the required scale to continue to both execute on our growth strategy and deliver increased returns to shareholders," Murdoch said at the start of a call with Wall Street analysts on the company's strong fiscal first-quarter earnings. "Our businesses and brands are stronger than ever."

http://beta.latimes.com/business/hollywood/la-fi-ct-fox-earnings-20171108-story.html

He may not have been happy with Marvel's offer, but now that the concept is out there and people are saying: "Yeah, this is a pretty great idea." Murdoch will be getting pressure from shareholders and he may have to reconsider an offer he originally thought wasn't enough.

... and if he doesn't, he damn well better have more than just assurances that they can still be competitive going forward.

and that's where the part of Prince Alwaleed's shares becomes that much more tantalizing. That is a major blow to the Murdochs.

 

[TheVileOne]

Rupert Murdoch, DO IT!

[YT]BkIJsnLBA4c[/YT]

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I will go out on a limb and say its actually probable, not just possible.

Fox really wants to unload a lot of stuff and the only reason things have "stalled" is that both sides probably went back to mull over the current deals on their plates.

I'm sure Fox wants more than what Disney offered, and it may go back and forth a bit, but that said I don't think this will take years, I think this will go down fast (relatively).

If I'm wrong, whatever. I can live with that. I am no "scooper" or "insider'.

That said, I think its going to go down, and it will go down fairly fast (although too slow for most fanboys/fangirls).

I'm just going to revisit this by the end of this year, if we don't hear anything by then, one way or the other, I will seriously be surprised.

I'm trying not to let what I want influence what I believe is likely, but I do think that the dynamic has changed since the leak.

It may very well be that talks had stalled and a deal didn't seem likely a week ago, but now that people are talking about it and the stock has spiked (and it will certainly drop again if investors decide the deal is really dead) there's far more pressure on Murdoch than there was prior to the report.

And even if these talks fall apart completrely, a by-product could be the thing we were all hoping for a week ago - a much smaller deal for the Marvel characters only.

 

[Big Bang]

... and if he doesn't, he damn well better have more than just assurances that they can still be competitive going forward.

I just thought of something. Time Warner was saying the same thing when Fox was trying to buy them for $80B, especially when it came to scale yadayadayada, and how the offer significantly undervalued them.

Not too long later they agreed to sell themselves to AT&T for $85B.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Rupert Murdoch, DO IT!

[YT]BkIJsnLBA4c[/YT]

 

[Tymminator]

I'm trying not to let what I want influence what is likely, but I do think that the dynamic has changed since the leak.

It may very well be that talks had stalled and a deal didn't seem likely a week ago, but now that people are talking about it and the stock has spiked (and it will certainly drop again if investors decide the deal is really dead) there's far more pressure on Murdoch than there was prior to the report.

And even if these talks fall apart completrely, a by-product could be the thing we were all hoping for a week ago - a much smaller deal for the Marvel characters only.

I understand what your saying.

BTW I think it was FOX that leaked that.


That said I’m also saying what I think is going to happen, not just what I would want, and I believe it for more reasons then simply getting FF and the X-Peeps back. Sure it can fall apart, but even if that did happen, I have ideas how that would roll out too.

No matter what, it’s overall pretty interesting to me, one way or the other what will happen will happen.

 

[Crimz]

Knowing that we could be looking at a complete MCU in the near(er) future is giving me goosebumps.

I would be fine with the FF being given the treatment they deserve again.

But the X-Men too is the icing on the cake.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I understand what your saying.

BTW I think it was FOX that leaked that.


That said I’m also saying what I think is going to happen, not just what I would want, and I believe it for more reasons then simply getting FF and the X-Peeps back. Sure it can fall apart, but even if that did happen, I have ideas how that would roll out too.

No matter what, it’s overall pretty interesting to me, one way or the other what will happen will happen.

Another interesting detail is the whole Hulu thing. Fox could argue that Hulu gives them the streaming position they need to be competitive in a world that is going that direction... but their partner in Hulu, Disney, is going their own way and Hulu could be under crushing competitive pressure soon - leaving Fox with a very weak position regarding streaming.

I have a feeling that what Murdoch is saying (publicly to us and privately to Disney) may be very different than what he really believes. He may be FAR more motivated to make a deal than he will admit to anybody, but he's trying to play it cool and get as much as he can.

 

[Tymminator]

Another interesting detail is the whole Hulu thing. Fox could argue that Hulu gives them the streaming position they need to be competitive in a world that is going that direction... but their partner in Hulu, Disney, is going their own way and Hulu could be under crushing competitive pressure soon - leaving Fox with a very weak position regarding streaming.

I have a feeling that what Murdoch is saying (publicly to us and privately to Disney) may be very different than what he really believes. He may be FAR more motivated to make a deal than he will admit to anybody, but he's trying to play it cool and get as much as he can.

I agree and I think so as well.

 

[Big Bang]

Another interesting detail is the whole Hulu thing. Fox could argue that Hulu gives them the streaming position they need to be competitive in a world that is going that direction... but their partner in Hulu, Disney, is going their own way and Hulu could be under crushing competitive pressure soon - leaving Fox with a very weak position regarding streaming.

I have a feeling that what Murdoch is saying (publicly and privately to Disney) may be very different than what he really believes. He may be FAR more motivated to make a deal than he will admit to anybody, but he's trying to play it cool and get as much as he can.

Any half decent corporate governance has to play it cool. Then again, company scale is something that a lot of analysts have been openly talking about with Fox for some time now when compared to its biggest competitors. Disney is Disney, NBA/Universal has much bigger scale as a part of Comcast and Time Warner will get the same treatment as part of AT&T. Holding onto its Entertainment assets essentially makes Fox a take over target. Something the Murdoch's would obviously want to avoid.

You're certainly right about Hulu.