The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - Part 4

[Dark Raven]

I don't know about Kinberg's plans for having the same cast for FFINO. Michael B Jordan just joined the Black Panther cast, so he's obviously jumped ship.

And anyone who ever wanted FFINO's cast to be integrated into the MCU - well, apart from the fact that it was never going to happen under Marvel, Jordan in Black Panther is the final nail in the coffin.

Jordan isn't going to want to go back to making another FF movie, especially not after the chance to join the MCU in another way.

So if he's not in FFINO2, then do they recast (if there were even a sequel)? And if they recast with a white guy this time round, then it would have all these accusations that they are now whitewashing an originally white guy who was made black last time round.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Kinberg can like to make a sequel all he wants. Studios don't greenlight sequels to Razzie Award winning, critically slammed, financial catastrophes.

 

[Zarex]

In regards to the "X-Men TV rights rights for the FF movie rights" trade, I believe I read somewhere that since Marvel's TV and Film divisions are separate, you can't simply trade for one to have the other. Fox's TV side worked out a deal with Marvel's TV side to do X-Men TV shows. Marvel is sure to get a cut of the money from it in exchange. Trust me, if Marvel Studios somehow got the rights back to the FF, we would have heard about it. Feige would have made a point to bring it up in the press run for Civil War.

Marvel Studios and Marvel TV are part of the same company. If Bob Iger signs off on TV rights in exchange for film rights, that's the deal that will get done. And if you think Mr. Iger would give away Disney IP rights in exchange for a minority stake in Legion and Hellfire, you haven't been paying attention to the guy that bought Pixar, Marvel and Star Wars.

And as much as I would like to trust you, why would Feige be discussing potential Phase 4 films during the CW press tour? That makes no sense.

As for Kimberg's comments, he is probably been instructed by execs at Fox that if anyone questions about an FF sequel or another reboot, to go ahead and publicly say that they would do it again and it would be great. For one, if they say they aren't doing it, everyone will assume they gave up the rights back to it's biggest rival: Marvel. That wouldn't look good. Second, I believe Fox still wants to try again to make a FF movie. Remember, they have the rights until 2021 and would have to have a film in production by 2020 if I'm not mistaken in order to retain the rights. That gives them 4 years to get another one going and as much as I hate it, they will try again. Maybe they want to try it again to try to make a franchise or maybe they want to try again so Marvel can't get their hands on on it knowing full well that Marvel Studios would make it work and be profitable.

A competently made FF film is going to cost a minimum of $175M. Add $50M in marketing and you're up to $225M. If FOX doubles the BO from FFINO - an absolutely best case scenario - it will gross $340M WW. That leaves a net, not including the Mouse's cut, of about $170M.

In a best case scenario FOX eats a $55M loss. Even if FOX may really, really wanted to make another FF film, and there's absolutely no evidence that they do, the numbers don't work.

The FF movie rights include a lot more than just the principal four characters. Fox also have Dr. Doom, most would say is Marvel's greatest super villain. As well as Silver Surfer, Galactus, and bunch of other cosmic characters. With the right person, Fox could take that and X-Men's cosmic characters, like the Phoenix and the Sh'iar, and make something that can compete directly with Marvel's cosmic side. If they could get that right person to spearhead it like Marvel has with Feige, I would be all ears.

There is zero evidence FOX can combine their two separate licensing agreements without the Mouse's approval.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

In regards to the "X-Men TV rights rights for the FF movie rights" trade, I believe I read somewhere that since Marvel's TV and Film divisions are separate, you can't simply trade for one to have the other. Fox's TV side worked out a deal with Marvel's TV side to do X-Men TV shows.

I've seen people suggesting this, and there's no truth to it.

The management of the TV divisions and film divisions report to higher level management and that higher level management has the final say in the purchasing or selling of assets.

If (just as a crazy example) Disney was considering selling their Animal Kingdom theme park to Universal, it wouldn't be the Animal Kingdom manager who could decide to sell or not. That would be a decision made much higher up the chain.

You wouldn't have low-level people who have a stake in one asset but not the other making a decision like that.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

For those of you who didn't follow the production closely and don't understand just how dirt-dumb Simon Kinberg is, let me give you a quick example.

Those of you who know the FF know that Ben Grimm had a brother, Daniel, who was involved in the Yancy Street Gang. Daniel was killed in a knife fight with a rival gang and his death greatly affected Ben. Ben took Daniel's place in the gang before eventually straightening out his life, getting a football scholarship and becoming a test-pilot.

Simon Kinberg, in explaining why they cast Jamie Bell instead of a larger actor said he didn't think the comic-book story was "interesting enough" and they wanted to "improve it" by making Ben small and a victim of abuse at the hands of his brother (who said "It's clobbering time" when he did it).

THAT'S the kind of idiot Simon Kinberg is, and THAT's why just typing his name pisses me off no end.

 

[Spiderine]

There will never be a Fantastic Bomb part 2. The only way FOX would ever make another FF film is if it is rebooted into the MCU and Marvel is given full creative control while FOX maintain production rights. And it would give Marvel access to all FF supporting players. That would be the Sony deal by the way. I would totally understand FOX wanting this deal.

The real question to ask yourself is would FOX ever be given the Sony deal? Marvel would have to be serious about setting up its phase 4 slate with the next major baddie from the FF property. Or is Marvel just gonna wait this out? Other than that........FOX is not stupid enough to make another film unless wasting money is good business practice.

 

[Dark Raven]

For those of you who didn't follow the production closely and don't understand just how dirt-dumb Simon Kinberg is, let me give you a quick example.

Those of you who know the FF know that Ben Grimm had a brother, Daniel, who was involved in the Yancy Street Gang. Daniel was killed in a knife fight with a rival gang and his death greatly affected Ben. Ben took Daniel's place in the gang before eventually straightening out his life, getting a football scholarship and becoming a test-pilot.

Simon Kinberg, in explaining why they cast Jamie Bell instead of a larger actor said he didn't think the comic-book story was "interesting enough" and they wanted to "improve it" bay making Ben small and a victim of abuse at the hands of his brother (who shouted "It's clobbering time when he did it).

THAT'S the kind of idiot Simon Kinberg is, and THAT's why just typing his name pisses me off no end.

What if your computer and phone gets hacked, and instead of being able to type any posts now (or even send texts), it will immediately autocorrect and type Simon Kinberg instead?

Maybe if you're writing one of your books, it will be autocorrected as "Land of Kinberg" by Simon Kinberg.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

What if your computer and phone gets hacked, and instead of being able to type any posts now (or even send texts), it will immediately autocorrect and type Simon Kinberg instead?

Maybe if you're writing one of your books, it will be autocorrected as "Land of Kinberg" by Simon Kinberg.

I can only hope right now that you're not some kind of computer-hacking genius.

 

[Dark Raven]

I can only hope right now that you're not some kind of computer-hacking genius.

No, but Domashev is, and he might try it.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Simon Kinberg is awesome.

 

[Hero_of_Time98]

There will never be a Fantastic Bomb part 2. The only way FOX would ever make another FF film is if it is rebooted into the MCU and Marvel is given full creative control while FOX maintain production rights. And it would give Marvel access to all FF supporting players. That would be the Sony deal by the way. I would totally understand FOX wanting this deal.

The real question to ask yourself is would FOX ever be given the Sony deal? Marvel would have to be serious about setting up its phase 4 slate with the next major baddie from the FF property. Or is Marvel just gonna wait this out? Other than that........FOX is not stupid enough to make another film unless wasting money is good business practice.

To answer your question, no I don't think Marvel is going to Fox asking to work a deal for the Fantastic Four. Even if they did, Fox would turn them down I believe. Fox and Marvel, or even more importantly Fox and Disney, do not have a good relationship. Rumors are abound that the two companies flat out hate each other. One of the things that always comes to my mind is how Fox is probably pissed that Disney got Star Wars and they didn't. I just don't believe these two companies would ever get along. The only way I see Marvel getting FF back is if the rights revert. That's going to take Fox from completely giving up and I don't think the egos at Fox are willing to do that. They have 4 years to come up with a new plan on the FF and I bet they will figure out a way. They probably know that Marvel would make it work and are not wanting their biggest competitor to get a chance at it. I hope I'm wrong but Fox is too pigheaded to let the rights revert.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Curse you Dark Raven!

 

[Dark Raven]

Curse you Simon Kinberg

Fixed.

 

[Zarex]

There will never be a Fantastic Bomb part 2. The only way FOX would ever make another FF film is if it is rebooted into the MCU and Marvel is given full creative control while FOX maintain production rights. And it would give Marvel access to all FF supporting players. That would be the Sony deal by the way. I would totally understand FOX wanting this deal.

The real question to ask yourself is would FOX ever be given the Sony deal? Marvel would have to be serious about setting up its phase 4 slate with the next major baddie from the FF property. Or is Marvel just gonna wait this out? Other than that........FOX is not stupid enough to make another film unless wasting money is good business practice.

I don't think a Sony deal would work for the FF. Spidey moves over $1billion in merchandise annually, so Marvel was motivated to keep Peter as the world's most popular superhero. And even with his recent BO struggles, Spidey is still a cinematic A lister. His presence in Marvel films helps the BO.

I love the FF, but they have been driven into the ground by FOX. The characters don't move merchandise, and given their cinematic history cross pollination won't necessarily boost the MCU BO.

Marvel would be much better off putting Inhumans, Runaways, Young Avengers, Thunderbolts or Great Lakes Avengers on the release schedule than the FF if FOX is still sharing in the profits.

 

[Dark Raven]

I wouldn't worry about the hot air Kinberg is saying anyway, because as I mentioned above, even if Fox want to try again, they've already lost MBJ, who has won a role in Black Panther.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

For those of you who didn't follow the production closely and don't understand just how dirt-dumb Simon Kinberg is, let me give you a quick example.

Those of you who know the FF know that Ben Grimm had a brother, Daniel, who was involved in the Yancy Street Gang. Daniel was killed in a knife fight with a rival gang and his death greatly affected Ben. Ben took Daniel's place in the gang before eventually straightening out his life, getting a football scholarship and becoming a test-pilot.

Simon Kinberg, in explaining why they cast Jamie Bell instead of a larger actor said he didn't think the comic-book story was "interesting enough" and they wanted to "improve it" bay making Ben small and a victim of abuse at the hands of his brother (who shouted "It's clobbering time when he did it).

THAT'S the kind of idiot Simon Kinberg is, and THAT's why just typing his name pisses me off no end.

wow, he enjoys the source material as much as Zack Snyder does!

 

[Zarex]

To answer your question, no I don't think Marvel is going to Fox asking to work a deal for the Fantastic Four. Even if they did, Fox would turn them down I believe. Fox and Marvel, or even more importantly Fox and Disney, do not have a good relationship. Rumors are abound that the two companies flat out hate each other. One of the things that always comes to my mind is how Fox is probably pissed that Disney got Star Wars and they didn't. I just don't believe these two companies would ever get along. The only way I see Marvel getting FF back is if the rights revert. That's going to take Fox from completely giving up and I don't think the egos at Fox are willing to do that. They have 4 years to come up with a new plan on the FF and I bet they will figure out a way. They probably know that Marvel would make it work and are not wanting their biggest competitor to get a chance at it. I hope I'm wrong but Fox is too pigheaded to let the rights revert.

FOX and Disney are working together on X-Men TV shows and are partnering on a HULU skinny bundle. Whatever problems the two companies had in the past appear to be over.

http://deadline.com/2016/05/disney-fox-hulu-streaming-service-fight-cable-1201747498/

 

[wobbly]

To answer your question, no I don't think Marvel is going to Fox asking to work a deal for the Fantastic Four. Even if they did, Fox would turn them down I believe. Fox and Marvel, or even more importantly Fox and Disney, do not have a good relationship. Rumors are abound that the two companies flat out hate each other. One of the things that always comes to my mind is how Fox is probably pissed that Disney got Star Wars and they didn't. I just don't believe these two companies would ever get along. The only way I see Marvel getting FF back is if the rights revert.That's going to take Fox from completely giving up and I don't think the egos at Fox are willing to do that. They have 4 years to come up with a new plan on the FF and I bet they will figure out a way. They probably know that Marvel would make it work and are not wanting their biggest competitor to get a chance at it. I hope I'm wrong but Fox is too pigheaded to let the rights revert.

That kind of thinking is exactly how Fox p#ssed away a ton on money on the last attempt. Fox's shareholders would take a dim view of them clearly wasting money just to play keepaway.

And the signs are Fox & Disney are getting on far better now that Ike Perlmutter has been removed from the negotiating table.

If a deal has not already been done (and if one were I doubt Hackberg would even be privy to it) I do think one could be. Fox can wrangle further x-verse expansion into TV (Hellfire & Legion is potentially the beginning of more shows) and possibly get merch support re-introduced for their X-Men efforts, and all they have to do is give up a money losing franchise they have fubared big time, with little to no hope of restoring whilst it is in their own hands (...and Simple Simon's).

 

[wobbly]

Simon Kinberg is awesome.

Why, hello Simon. Figures a hack would know how to hack t:

Now free Willie. And no, that is not an advertisement

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Why, hello Simon. Figures a hack would know how to hack t:

Now free Willie. And no, that is not an advertisement

 

[Dark Raven]

Free Willie. Something that Jamie Bell's Thing wishes he had. Even a paid-for one would do.

 

[Owl]

When you get back to the forum after being away for a long time and realize that some asshat from Fox brought up Fan4stic and thought it would be ok.

https://youtu.be/zMnKNHNfznE

 

[Aztec]

Okay I need to vent. I was trying to be nice but Simon Kinberg just shoved me over the edge. I'm glad Apocalypse is getting slammed. I hope it tanks. I'll never see it so I won't know but man I hope it's as bad and redundant as everyone seems to say that it is.

And Simon Kinberg what a freaking clown! What a clown! He makes Hack Snyder look like a respectable film maker. Seriously? You want to make a FF sequel? You "love the FF almost as much as the X-Men"? I'd hate to see what you do to characters that you DON'T LIKE!!!

And what is Fox's genius solution to their completely continuity F**ked X-Men? Make the next film set in the 1990s! That's right folks haven't you wanted to see this dialogue in an X-Men film?

(Beast enters the room wearing a flannel shirt. Nirvana's "Smells Like Teen Spirit" playing in the background)
"Man, I'm so glad the Soviet Union just collapsed. Now if you'll excuse me I have to run, Saved by the Bell is coming on!" How witty! I can't wait until Singer makes a X film set in the Noughties!!! Yowza...Or maybe time travel back to the '50s for a fun Chuck Berry cameo.

And anyone find it odd that the "new cast" have been active since 1962 and in the 4th film it will be 30 years later...and they've all aged about 5 years??????

Bite me Fox. Bite me.

 

[Endeavor]

lol thank you guys for bringing some levity into this revoltin development

 

[Endeavor]

... And dropping this again, because I refuse to let Simple Simon crush my hopes:
https://fncd.net/v?id=rTHR-PD