The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - Part 7

[Wise]

Just seeing that one executive even suggest making a sequel in the FOX boardroom would be worth the price of admission alone.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Just seeing that one executive even suggest making a sequel in the FOX boardroom would be worth the price of admission alone.

This is the thing that makes it completely impossible fro them to make another film. It's not like Fox is run by Ahab - so intent on getting the Marvel White Whale that he will stop at nothing just to hurt Marvel.

There are real people who have to make real decisions and actually be accountable for those decisions.

The way I see it, there are two primary groups of managers at Fox:

1. Those who pushed for Fant4stic and were spectacularly wrong.

2. Those who argued against it and were able to smugly say: "I told you so."

How can anybody in either of those groups push for a new film? The ones in group 1 will want to keep their heads down, and the ones in group 2 knew better last time and will be, if anything, more opposed to another film now that Fant4stic has weakened the property further.

It's just a matter of time now until the rights go back one way or another. There's no logical, reasonable path that leads to Fox green-lighting another film.

 

[Dark Raven]

This is the thing that makes it completely impossible fro them to make another film. It's not like Fox is run by Ahab - so intent on getting the Marvel White Whale that he will stop at nothing just to hurt Marvel.

There are real people who have to make real decisions and actually be accountable for those decisions.

The way I see it, there are two primary groups of managers at Fox:

1. Those who pushed for Fant4stic and were spectacularly wrong.

2. Those who argued against it and were able to smugly say: "I told you so."

How can anybody in either of those groups push for a new film? The ones in group 1 will want to keep their heads down, and the ones in group 2 knew better last time and will be, if anything, more opposed to another film now that Fant4stic has weakened the property further.

It's just a matter of time now until the rights go back one way or another. There's no logical, reasonable path that leads to Fox green-lighting another film.

I beg to differ. Sony have Avi Arad intent on making a Venom movie and Fox have his twin brother Avi Ahab intent on making an FF movie.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Another point about Fox's narrow window that I was talking about yesterday:

Josh Trank was announced as director just about 5 years after the release of Rise of The Silver Surfer.

If Fox follows a similar schedule (and last time they were pushing just to meet their deadlines, so if anything, they should start sooner), they'll need to have a director in place by summer of 2020 or about 3.5 years from now.

This thread has been going for 4 years. So in those terms, this thread has already passed the half-way point. t:

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I beg to differ. Sony have Avi Arad intent on making a Venom movie and Fox have his twin brother Avi Ahab intent on making an FF movie.

 

[Nick Morton]

Part of me hopes fox tries again if only because the internet will likely actually burn to the ground with the fan reactions

 

[Zant]

Is a Latveria movie possible? Knowing Fox, they are probably exploring any random potential spin offs.

 

[Dark Raven]

Is a Latveria movie possible? Knowing Fox, they are probably exploring any random potential spin offs.

Not if they're exploring the possibility of trash bag Domashev sitting in his mother's basement in Latveria hacking the rest of the world only for his mother to venture down there every so often to tell him to get a proper job.

 

[Nick Morton]

Not if they're exploring the possibility of trash bag Domashev sitting in his mother's basement in Latveria hacking the rest of the world only for his mother to venture down there every so often to tell him to get a proper job.

Hey now if hes gonna do any hacking all hes gotta do is play Fallout 4 since thats what CNN tells people t:

 

[Zant]

Not if they're exploring the possibility of trash bag Domashev sitting in his mother's basement in Latveria hacking the rest of the world only for his mother to venture down there every so often to tell him to get a proper job.

LOOOOL. I miss that Superhero Squad Show. Fox may see potential in the European equivalent to Wakanda.

 

[2kt09]

RIP Super Hero Squad

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Is a Latveria movie possible? Knowing Fox, they are probably exploring any random potential spin offs.

I believe it might be technically possible to extend the rights with a Doom or Silver surfer film, but while that might extend the rights, I can't see anything like that happening.

Compared to the FF, those films would be much riskier with much less of a built in audience. The whole point of doing a property like FF (as opposed to a lesser-known property - Like Savage Dragon as a quick example), is you can count on a certain built-in audience that already know the characters and want to see the film.

Doom or SS might interest people like us... but people like us already hate Fox and aren't going to be lining up to see a Doom or SS film. And the general movie audience isn't going to be excited about those characters without a lot of marketing to get them on board.

And then there are the specifics. Fox has already destroyed Doom with their previous films, so that hurts his value in a stand-alone film. And as a villain, he already has questionable value in a stand alone film.

With Silver Surfer, you have to go cosmic. There's no way of getting around that, but Fox seems unwilling/unable to go cosmic with their comic book characters. If they had actually done that with FF, it might have worked, but they're much more interested in 'real' heroes who don't wear colorful costumes and are more "grounded and gritty". Silver Surfer is anything but grounded and gritty. And then there's the cost. Doing a SS film would require the entire thing to take place in space and/or on another planet, so that requires a lot of CGI, exotic sets, exotic costumes etc. All that costs money and that just adds to the risk.

Based on Fox's history, I can't imagine them going the very risky route of doing either a Doom or SS film.

While people like us can imagine cool Doom or SS films, it's almost impossible to point to any other films like that which have worked. And that's the bottom line for a company like Fox. Unless they have a clear model that they know will work, they aren't likely to do it.

 

[wobbly]

Another point about Fox's narrow window that I was talking about yesterday:

Josh Trank was announced as director just about 5 years after the release of Rise of The Silver Surfer.

If Fox follows a similar schedule (and last time they were pushing just to meet their deadlines, so if anything, they should start sooner), they'll need to have a director in place by summer of 2020 or about 3.5 years from now.

This thread has been going for 4 years. So in those terms, this thread has already passed the half-way point. t:

Iirc the time scale post ROTSS (2007) was:

1) 2009 - Announced they were gonna reboot, a darker, gritter take since TDK had just come out and was all the rage

2) 2012 - Trank, on the back of his success with Chronicle was signed on as Director.

3) Late 2013 - one casting confirmation (MBJ) and production locations/extras being secured.

4) Early to Spring 2014 - Casting sorted and started filming.

5) Summer 2015 - Released.


If they follow the same pattern they'd announce a reboot this year, sign a director in 2020, and start filming in 2022 for a release in 2023.

If they are gonna be stupid and go last minute again they might not announce anything for a good while yet (and it's in their interests not to...), but they will have to have something solid in the works by 2020/2021 at the latest.

Hopefully will be a moot point by then.

 

[wobbly]

Is a Latveria movie possible? Knowing Fox, they are probably exploring any random potential spin offs.

Hard to say for sure. I would have thought Marvel would have to give approval for a non FF centric spin-off, but the t&c's might well allow for it.

It does seem likely that such a spin-off would indeed extend the rights: Daredevil was released in 2003 but did not revert until late 2012 (over 9 years later), probably because of Elektra in 2005.

That'd put the reversion time-table in the 7/8 year range (from release of last film to cameras rolling on the next). I think it was 7 years and 9 months to be more precise with the DD reversion post Elektra.

 

[Zarex]

Is a Latveria movie possible? Knowing Fox, they are probably exploring any random potential spin offs.

When has a movie studio ever explored spinning off a dead property?

 

[Flint Marko]

Hard to say for sure. I would have thought Marvel would have to give approval for a non FF centric spin-off, but the t&c's might well allow for it.

It does seem likely that such a spin-off would indeed extend the rights: Daredevil was released in 2003 but did not revert until late 2012 (over 9 years later), probably because of Elektra in 2005.

That'd put the reversion time-table in the 7/8 year range (from release of last film to cameras rolling on the next). I think it was 7 years and 9 months to be more precise with the DD reversion post Elektra.

Oh dang, didn't realize that. Something tells me that Fox won't bother touching this property again any time soon though. They don't have to capability to not fox it up.

 

[wobbly]

When has a movie studio ever explored spinning off a dead property?

Catwoman....The first CBM I know of that the 'INO' term was invoked.

 

[Zarex]

Good one. I wonder if they can work that into the pitch.

"Mr. Murdoch, I know you have been told countless times that the FF franchise is dead. But come back with me to 2004, and let me tell you the story of a cat themed superhero who captured America's hearts!"

 

[wobbly]

Good one. I wonder if they can work that into the pitch.

"Mr. Murdoch, I know you have been told countless times that the FF franchise is dead. But come back with me to 2004, and let me tell you the story of a cat themed superhero who captured America's hearts!"

Lol t: Exactly. That absurdity is a prime example of why it is not a great idea to flog an obviously deceased horse.

 

[GoblinScrier]

Is a Latveria movie possible? Knowing Fox, they are probably exploring any random potential spin offs.

Latveria movie/Doom solo is the ultimate dream project for me (other than adapting Secret Wars as a movie) and could easily trump my all-time favorite movie of John Carpenter's Halloween as the new greatest movie...it has to be made by Marvel, it has to be soooo close to the comics including Doom's appearance, background, accent, great actor to play him, and more...his hatred of Richards, his universal dominion quests, his quest to save his mother, in other words, Doom should get the royal treatment at Marvel and be given any and all things to make him the most memorable villain in a comic book film....hey I can dream

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Hard to say for sure. I would have thought Marvel would have to give approval for a non FF centric spin-off, but the t&c's might well allow for it.

It does seem likely that such a spin-off would indeed extend the rights: Daredevil was released in 2003 but did not revert until late 2012 (over 9 years later), probably because of Elektra in 2005.

That'd put the reversion time-table in the 7/8 year range (from release of last film to cameras rolling on the next). I think it was 7 years and 9 months to be more precise with the DD reversion post Elektra.

I'm sure you recall that in 2007 they were talking about doing a Silver Surfer/Galactus film, and I very specifically remember a mention from somebody at Fox that it would count as an FF film and extend the rights.

While that may not be the final word and Marvel lawyers could potentially dispute that, it does fit other things we know and I would go with the assumption that it is possible in the absence of anything more convincing.

BUT in addition to the points I made above, it would likely be the first time such a poorly received property would get a spin-off.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Latveria movie/Doom solo is the ultimate dream project for me (other than adapting Secret Wars as a movie) and could easily trump my all-time favorite movie of John Carpenter's Halloween as the new greatest movie...it has to be made by Marvel, it has to be soooo close to the comics including Doom's appearance, background, accent, great actor to play him, and more...his hatred of Richards, his universal dominion quests, his quest to save his mother, in other words, Doom should get the royal treatment at Marvel and be given any and all things to make him the most memorable villain in a comic book film....hey I can dream

While a Doom movie done right could be awesome, Fox has made not one, not two, but THREE films with a Doom character that was as wrong as wrong could be.

The idea that they would suddenly decide they wanted to make a real Doom film and be able to make a real Doom film at this point would go against everything we already know about them.

 

[wobbly]

Doing some math based on the Daredevil time table (assuming the 7 years and 9 months applies to the FF too) Fox would need to have camera's rolling for another attempt sometime around May 9th to 16th 2023 at the latest.

That may seem like a long time, but bear in mind scripts have to be written and pre production would have to be started at least a year or more before.

However, the FF time table might be less given how hastily they pushed FFINO into production after sitting on their plans for 5 years: That crap officially started principle photography on May 5, 2014, a little under 7 years after FF2: ROTTS (June 15, 2007).

Now given that they knew the film was a hot mess in theory they could have sufficient time to do better reshoots and delay release (if they were on the same time table as DD). But as I understand it there are set deadlines once filming has started: Once they start filming there is a window after that to release the film or they fail to fulfil the contract. This is to prevent a studio from starting filming to keep the rights, then just leaving it canned and sitting on it for ages.

 

[Dark Raven]

While a Doom movie done right could be awesome, Fox has made not one, not two, but THREE films with a Doom character that was as wrong as wrong could be.

The idea that they would suddenly decide they wanted to make a real Doom film and be able to make a real Doom film at this point would go against everything we already know about them.

What do you have against Domashev hacker Doom who wears a trashbag and tin foil and gets drunk with the other 3 members of the FF?

 

[Dark Raven]

Doing some math based on the Daredevil time table (assuming the 7 years and 9 months applies to the FF too) Fox would need to have camera's rolling for another attempt sometime around May 9th to 16th 2023 at the latest.

That may seem like a long time, but bear in mind scripts have to be written and pre production would have to be started at least a year or more before.

However, the FF time table might be less given how hastily they pushed FFINO into production after sitting on their plans for 5 years: That crap officially started principle photography on May 5, 2014, a little under 7 years after FF2: ROTTS (June 15, 2007).

Now given that they knew the film was a hot mess in theory they could have sufficient time to do better reshoots and delay release (if they were on the same time table as DD). But as I understand it there are set deadlines once filming has started: Once they start filming there is a window after that to release the film or they fail to fulfil the contract. This is to prevent a studio from starting filming to keep the rights, then just leaving it canned and sitting on it for ages.

No-one thought Fox would be crazy enough to actually move forward with FFINO with such a short window and with things so close to the deadline. But they did.

Instead of the 20th Century Fox fanfare at the start of their movies, Fox should adopt this theme tune in its place, with the tagline intro "What could possibly happen?"

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