The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion Thread - Part 130 (NO SPOILERS)

[Naked Shia]

Really, I can't grasp it? So Bruce retires continuously, in all of his stories all the time ever? Or was I just explaining what a critic was talking about for the 1000th time?

Bruce retiring has been done. But I agree, it's not the most common scenario when it comes to Batman. whatever happened to the caped crusader is a great story, and illustrates fairly well how retirement wouldn't be an option for Batman.

but in the meantime, I appreciate Nolan's work because it's bold and ambitious, and it certainly seems TDKR won't be different in that regard, which is why, IMO, it won't be loved by some people.

and that's fine by me. I do think Batman is malleable enough to allow the artists to try differents stuffs with his story.

 

[Naked Shia]

I wouldn't go as far as to call him "a hired gun", but my cynical nature prevents me from not thinking there is a bit of bitterness involved as well. Again, I'm not dissing on Conroy, I just think that human nature is an important factor to consider in this scenario.



Yep, and I for one think it's a really interesting and fresh idea to go with, especially considering that in the comics Bruce has been going on for practically forever. And it was nice to see that he still missed being Batman, which is an aspect TDKR has seemingly touched upon as well. It's one of the reasons I liked Batman Beyond and I have a felling it's going to be one of the reasons I'll like TDKR as well.

Agreed, but I don't think he misses being batman for the same reasons in TDKR. Clearly, he sees himself as a failure, and deep inside, he still wants to try to save his city, but he also feels guilty. He's retired, but he can't really stop being Batman, because it's still a part of him, and he didn't make peace with his past. Even in the comics, some writers have shown how Bruce needs to be at peace with his parents death, even if he's still Batman.

In this movie, it seems he needs to grow as a character, by understanding how what he did was his destiny, even if it lead to some tragedies. Because what he created is bigger than him.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

Chris Stuckmann's review(spoiler-free).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4oIP9iwV4w

 

[J.Howlett]

Look at this: http://insidemovies.ew.com/2012/07/...key-scene-at-the-heart-of-the-batman-trilogy/

Wonderful article.

 

[TheSmoothKnight]

I wonder when the Spill.com guys going to post their review.

 

[TheNextNolan22]

I wonder when the Spill.com guys going to post their review.

Tomorrow or the day after.

 

[Stillsberry]

Where is everyone?

 

[ImAlwaysAngry]

Harry Knowles review, was the only review that said that Nolan doesn't care about the character of Batman. I laughed so hard at his ignorance i nearly peed myself a little, then i felt sorry for him and anyone else who felt the same way, because it's like being blind or having some sort of mental defect, because no matter how hard you may try, you'll never be able to understand or get what everyone else gets and sees....Nolan cares and knows about the character of Bruce Wayne, more than anyone else.

That's ... Hyperbolic, to say the least.

 

[Stillsberry]

That's ... Hyperbolic, to say the least.

If you visit AICN then there is a much more evenly balanced review on there now from Nordling. It's mixed, but he states better reasons for his disappointment.

 

[Street Vendor]

Looks like a lot of geeks are giving this worse reviews than the mainstream press. Interesting...

 

[batman1115]

We all need to remember that Harry Knowels LOVED Indy 4 and the Star Wars prequels. How he can say that Indy 4 wasn't blasphemous, but has issues with character stuff with Nolan's Batman is just mental.

 

[Micromind]

Looks like a lot of geeks are giving this worse reviews than the mainstream press.

Why ?

 

[Street Vendor]

I like reading Harry Knowles, and love his enthusiasm. He's really just a big kid who never grew up, and that's fine. But I do think he has a certain bias towards favoring the films where he gets chummy with the filmmakers and actors; Nolan never let AICN into his world, and I think Harry resents that.
I'm not saying he would love TDKR(or INCEPTION) if Nolan or Pfister was his buddy, but he'd find good things to say, just like he does for films that are horrendous in comparision to anything Nolan has made. So I take his opinion with a very large grain of salt.

 

[Street Vendor]

Why ?

Who knows? Probably because the regular critics are judging it on its merits as a film, while the fans have a certain expectation of what the characters should and shouldn't do based on their knowledge of the source material.

 

[Micromind]

I like reading Harry Knowles, and love his enthusiasm. He's really just a big kid who never grew up, and that's fine. But I do think he has a certain bias towards favoring the films where he gets chummy with the filmmakers and actors; Nolan never let AICN into his world, and I think Harry resents that.
I'm not saying he would love TDKR(or INCEPTION) if Nolan or Pfister was his buddy, but he'd find good things to say, just like he does for films that are horrendous in comparision to anything Nolan has made. So I take his opinion with a very large grain of salt.

That still doesn't explain why other online geek reviewers are giving this movie negative reviews.

Edit : You did explain your reasoning, never mind the question was not directed towards you but in general.

 

[ImAlwaysAngry]

Batman stopping crime fighting for eight years is like Dexter not murdering people for a decade.

It's a dark compulsion he has to make peace with and overcome.

I'd buy it if the movie said he'd been gradually less active due to wear and year, but to make the Dent fiasco a full stop is just totally out of character - not just in the comics- in Nolan's Batverse.

The kid in a prison halfway across the world for "practice"- that's the first Bruce we meet for a reason.

I'll accept it, cause I've gotta. And I may like the movie in spite of it. But the complaint isn't as simple as "Why it no like comicz?"

It's "it really better earn violating its own establishment of the character."

 

[J.Howlett]

I like reading Harry Knowles, and love his enthusiasm. He's really just a big kid who never grew up, and that's fine. But I do think he has a certain bias towards favoring the films where he gets chummy with the filmmakers and actors; Nolan never let AICN into his world, and I think Harry resents that.
I'm not saying he would love TDKR(or INCEPTION) if Nolan or Pfister was his buddy, but he'd find good things to say, just like he does for films that are horrendous in comparision to anything Nolan has made. So I take his opinion with a very large grain of salt.

Completely agree. I'll never discount Harry because he absolutely wants every film to be great. He never wants to see a bad film. But, his bias' do hurt his review more often than not. He can't separate from his experience with certain properties to what the filmmakers are trying to say with said properties.

This notion that Batman would never do that automatically disqualifies any review this film. There are so many interpretations of the character, how do we know Batman wouldn't do that?

 

[Stillsberry]

Who knows? Probably because the regular critics are judging it on its merits as a film, while the fans have a certain expectation of what the characters should and shouldn't do based on their knowledge of the source material.

What nerds outside of Devin and Harry don't like it? If they're the only ones then I'm not worried. Harry more than Devin had strong bias against Nolan and the graphic novel style before he even watched it.

 

[Naked Shia]

Some hard core geeks (I won't say fans obviously) are very close minded when it comes to try some stuffs on Batman. Which is sad, because trying to create bold and different stories is great IMO.

 

[Sharkboy]

That's ... Hyperbolic, to say the least.

Maybe not more than everyone else, but he certainly understands and respects the character a hell of a lot more than some people think. It's a huge misconception that he doesn't.

 

[Street Vendor]

That still doesn't explain why other online geek reviewers are giving this movie negative reviews.

Edit : You did explain your reasoning, never mind the question was not directed towards you but in general.

Overall, though, geeks seem to be giving it high marks too. Just a few standouts(I never expected Devin to like it, and Harry projected his feelings several times in the past).

 

[Naked Shia]

Batman stopping crime fighting for eight years is like Dexter not murdering people for a decade.

It's a dark compulsion he has to make peace with and overcome.

I'd buy it if the movie said he'd been gradually less active due to wear and year, but to make the Dent fiasco a full stop is just totally out of character - not just in the comics- in Nolan's Batverse.

The kid in a prison halfway across the world for "practice"- that's the first Bruce we meet for a reason.

I'll accept it, cause I've gotta. And I may like the movie in spite of it. But the complaint isn't as simple as "Why it no like comicz?"

It's "it really better earn violating its own establishment of the character."

Bruce's goal is to protect people, and to make sure nobody will suffer the loss he knew as a kid. If he thinks his existence is causing suffering and death, he would stop, because it would go against his beliefs and his goal. Which is why it's totally in character for him to be inactive.

But still, he's dying to be Batman again, because deep inside, he didn't make peace with his past, which is why he's a recluse when the story begins.

 

[Micromind]

Who knows? Probably because the regular critics are judging it on its merits as a film, while the fans have a certain expectation of what the characters should and shouldn't do based on their knowledge of the source material.

This trilogy is Nolan's take on the character just as there was a Burton's take on Batman, Schumacher's take on Batman and similarly, Donner's take on Superman.

All are valid interpretations of the character, no movie follows the exact translation of the source material (except maybe Watchmen but that was not exact either.)

 

[Street Vendor]

What nerds outside of Devin and Harry don't like it? If they're the only ones then I'm not worried. Harry more than Devin had strong bias against Nolan and the graphic novel style before he even watched it.

That one guy(forget his name) who has a blog gushing about TDK and said that TDKR is on the same level as BATMAN FOREVER and SPIDER-MAN 3 is another. The negativity of his review floored me.

 

[Street Vendor]

This trilogy is Nolan's take on the character just ass there was a Burton's take on Batman, Schumacher's take on Batman and similarly, Donner's take on Superman.

All are valid interpretations of the character, no movie follows the exact translation of the source material (except maybe Watchmen but that was not exact either.)

I agree, and I think I'm personally gonna love TDKR.