Apocalypse X-Men Apocalypse News and Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 43

[GuestStar2004]

of course we want good action scenes. These are action sci fi movies afterall. "X-Men Days of Future Past" had beautifully crafted action scenes

Beautiful crafted deaths for the most part, excluding quicksilver.

 

[DavidHaller]

Beautiful crafted deaths for the most part, excluding quicksilver.

what Singer did with the future fighting scenes in Days of Future Past ****s on every action scene in Marvel's Civil War in my eyes. Blink's "portal work" was so much joy to see. And yes, they all got killed. Something that was very much necessary to letigimize to audiences why the X-Men decided to go back in time and eliminate an entire timeline from existence.

Singer does action super well (Nightcrawler at the White house, Quicksilver's first scene, Logan's fight scenes in X2 etc. etc.), no idea why he failed so miserably in X-Men Apocalypse...

 

[GuestStar2004]

Singer does action super well (Nightcrawler at the White house, Quicksilver's first scene, Logan's fight scenes in X2 etc. etc.), no idea why he failed so miserably in X-Men Apocalypse...

Whether you personally like it or not the quicksilver sequence was probably among singers best action scenes when you think of how much is going on in that sequence

The weapon X could be seen as about the same as wolverines mansion fight in X2, there was apparently a cut moment where he is hiding above the door and jumps down and attacks the guards

 

[DavidHaller]

Whether you personally like it or not the quicksilver sequence was probably among singers best action scenes when you think of how much is going on in that sequence

The weapon X could be seen as about the same as wolverines mansion fight in X2, there was apparently a cut moment where he is hiding above the door and jumps down and attacks the guards

hell no, I found the entire weapon X scene very awkward looking to be honest. Nothing to get excited about. 5 seconds of Weapon X flashbacks in X2 have been so much better than this television action scene with bad choreography. They obviously had Jackman only for a view hours and he did not invested time to prepare the scene.

Quicksilver's scene was maybe good "craftsmenship" but evertyhing else about it was HORRIBLE. It was shot like an isolated music video that tonally ruptured the entire movie. I cannot enjoy this because in the end Singer was supposed to direct a movie. It did not worked at all. It was a mess. It was redundant, action for action's sake and failed miserably.

 

[X-Maniac]

Well i dunno about that as i am sure there was alot of hype behind the idea that there was gonna be a huge battle in DOFP between mutants and the sentinels which ended up abit less climactic then people hoped and i am sure if the fight in X-MEN: Apocalypse was to the same degree as the airport fight in civil war there would be alot of happy people.

Lets be honest you may say you don't want whizz-bang explosions and action scenes but when you don't get it you are are left a little disappointed.

Well, yes, action is important... DoFP lacked an action scene in the middle and viewers got bored, and the climax was shortened (from what we saw in the storyboards). XM:A lacked action until near the end.

 

[magneto23]

I think if she never showed up in Apocalypse, it wouldnt have had a significant impact on the film or her character arc. I dont feel like she really added much and she wasnt properly utilized. She seemed to just be there and her character kind of felt wasted in a way. She didnt feel as if she needed to be there, whereas she was obviously vital to DOFP and FC

They wrote nothing with any emotional impact for her character. They dropped the Nightcrawler connection. They didn't pick up the Beast romantic plot line. They didn't seem to even play at her Xavier connection all that much either. Poorly written.

 

[GuestStar2004]

XM:A lacked action until near the end.

Well you had quicksilver sequence and weapon X in the middle

 

[Legion]

hell no, I found the entire weapon X scene very awkward looking to be honest. Nothing to get excited about. 5 seconds of Weapon X flashbacks in X2 have been so much better than this television action scene with bad choreography. They obviously had Jackman only for a view hours and he did not invested time to prepare the scene.

Quicksilver's scene was maybe good "craftsmenship" but evertyhing else about it was HORRIBLE. It was shot like an isolated music video that tonally ruptured the entire movie. I cannot enjoy this because in the end Singer was supposed to direct a movie. It did not worked at all. It was a mess. It was redundant, action for action's sake and failed miserably.

I agree with the Weapon X stuff at least. It was very awkward and Wolverine never moved like that in the entire series. It also contradicted the X2 scenes which is also what people hated about the first Wolverine film.

 

[Legion]

what Singer did with the future fighting scenes in Days of Future Past ****s on every action scene in Marvel's Civil War in my eyes. Blink's "portal work" was so much joy to see. And yes, they all got killed. Something that was very much necessary to letigimize to audiences why the X-Men decided to go back in time and eliminate an entire timeline from existence.

Singer does action super well (Nightcrawler at the White house, Quicksilver's first scene, Logan's fight scenes in X2 etc. etc.), no idea why he failed so miserably in X-Men Apocalypse...

Yes the future fighting scenes were great in Dofp. They had this gritty sci-fi look but also had a nice polish. I would have loved a few more minutes of action in the future.

 

[GuestStar2004]

I agree with the Weapon X stuff at least. It was very awkward and Wolverine never moved like that in the entire series. It also contradicted the X2 scenes which is also what people hated about the first Wolverine film.

I think the difference between the first wolverine movie and apocalypse is that they likely knew it was contradicting X2 to a certain degree in apocalypse which as likely the point of it, while origins was mean to explain the X2 events.

 

[CB Fan]

The action scenes in DoFP were bland with the only highlights being Blink and Storm/Magnetos tag team act. Everything else was very lazy which really was to be expected given who was directing. I actually liked apocalypse's action scenes more but they too were a bit uninspired.

 

[DACrowe]

Beautiful crafted deaths for the most part, excluding quicksilver.

I will say the third act has a stunning sense of stakes and drama. Quite unusual when compared to Marvel Studios or DCEU. However, it is also ironic considering how limp the third act of Apocalypse felt before the fire bird showed up near the end.

 

[DACrowe]

I think if she never showed up in Apocalypse, it wouldnt have had a significant impact on the film or her character arc. I dont feel like she really added much and she wasnt properly utilized. She seemed to just be there and her character kind of felt wasted in a way. She didnt feel as if she needed to be there, whereas she was obviously vital to DOFP and FC

I thought a big thing was about finishing her arc with "all you have to do is come home" and "we'll all be together one day, I really believe that Hank." She had to be her own woman and make amends with Charles.

That was fumbled in terms of storytelling. However, JLaw phoned it in which was a bit of a surprise. I really like her as an actress and that was such a half-hearted performance it verged on unprofessional. She wasn't exactly at 100 in DOFP either, but she was still good (other than the airport scene) and helped give that movie some gravitas.

So again, Johansson has started phoning it in more and more--so does Jackson, to be fair--but neither are made a central character, hence why they might phone it in and why they can get away with it. Lawrence did not have that luxury.

 

[def28]

what Singer did with the future fighting scenes in Days of Future Past ****s on every action scene in Marvel's Civil War in my eyes. Blink's "portal work" was so much joy to see. And yes, they all got killed. Something that was very much necessary to letigimize to audiences why the X-Men decided to go back in time and eliminate an entire timeline from existence.

The issue with the action scenes in DOFP is that they lack character. This is why Quicksilvers stands out so much more. We don't know much of anything about Colossus, Blink, Warpath, Sunspot or Bishop even from a personality stand point so why should we or the audience care? Just cause they are X-Men? They are visual fodder and thats it. And aside from Blink and a solid combo from Storm/Mags the fighting is dull and confined. Sunspot just stands there. Bishop does next to nothing, Iceman finally Iceslides so I guess that's cool? But after over a decade of waiting that's all they could do with it? The X2 scenes are far more affective and well choreographed, especially for their time.

Just that little moment in DOFP where Bobby looks at Kitty says so much because we know their past relationship. We need those connections and moments of honest empathy to care more about these guys. If it was Pyro, Quicksilver and Beast getting slaughterd in those last scenes it would have meant more then characters like Bishop, Sunspot etc. I'll never get adding X-Men for the sake of murdering them.

The airport scene in Civil War while not the most tension filled showcases characters in ways never seen through interactions as well as grand spectacle. The ending battle between Stark, Bucky and Cap is personal and flat out brutal. There's build up, betrayal and choreography to match the former. It had all the ingredients for the audience to be invested and there's just far more regarding action and actual character, which is why that series is still on top.

 

[DavidHaller]

The issue with the action scenes in DOFP is that they lack character. This is why Quicksilvers stands out so much more. We don't know much of anything about Colossus, Blink, Warpath, Sunspot or Bishop even from a personality stand point so why should we or the audience care? Just cause they are X-Men? They are visual fodder and thats it. And aside from Blink and a solid combo from Storm/Mags the fighting is dull and confined. Sunspot just stands there. Bishop does next to nothing, Iceman finally Iceslides so I guess that's cool? But after over a decade of waiting that's all they could do with it? The X2 scenes are far more affective and well choreographed, especially for their time.

Just that little moment in DOFP where Bobby looks at Kitty says so much because we know their past relationship. We need those connections and moments of honest empathy to care more about these guys. If it was Pyro, Quicksilver and Beast getting slaughterd in those last scenes it would have meant more then characters like Bishop, Sunspot etc. I'll never get adding X-Men for the sake of murdering them.

The airport scene in Civil War while not the most tension filled showcases characters in ways never seen through interactions as well as grand spectacle. The ending battle between Stark, Bucky and Cap is personal and flat out brutal. There's build up, betrayal and choreography to match the former. It had all the ingredients for the audience to be invested and there's just far more regarding action and actual character, which is why that series is still on top.

I am sorry, I am not convinced with your argument. Telling me that "Days of Future Past" had less emotional impact than Civil War's airport scene is quite frankly ridiculous! Civil War's airport scene felt like a little tussle between friends on the playcourt without any stakes where everyone "pulled their punches".

Captain America vs. Tony Stark was brutal? No, for me it was way too artifically contstructed drama for drama's sake that I did not buy into. The main villain of the movie just explained to the characters five seconds before that he manipulated the situation so Iron Man will be trying to kill Bucky and what is Iron man doing? He is tryin to kill him because "He killed my mommy". Daddy or mommy issues is the laziest 'drama formula' North American mainstream cinema has to offer! It is a cliché.

We are not invested in the characters in "Days of Future Past"? We are very much invested in Kitty, Iceman, Xavier, Magneto and Storm because we know them for many years and followed their stories. What about Magneto's and Xavier's interaction before the Sentinels breaking through? "All those days wasted fighting each other Charles?" That is really emotionally brutal! Storm's death is equally devastating and shows the hopelessness of the situation. Blink's portal work is spectacular and the Sentinel's design is just creepy and menancing. We need the framework of all these deaths outside, so we can feel the emotional impact on the coregroup of X-Men inside the monastery.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Civil War for what it was but to belief that it is emotional comparable to a movie like "Days of Future Past"'s theme is ridiculous in my eyes. Convincing Mystique not to give in to her anger and pain and to start hoping again in humanity after years of marginalization and hate, while we see at the same time the darkness that the future can possibly bring: That is emotionally powerful! not some lame 'daddy issues' and artifically constructed drama for drama's sake...because we need the heroes to punch their faces. Why? because!

 

[Iceman]

Iceman and Storm are fine but the audience is not invested in them like comic fans are in those characters from the pages. The comic versions are 2 of my favourite characters but as film characters they are on a par with a supporting character in any half decent film, no more memorable than that. Xavier and Magneto on the other hand sure. If it had been one of their legitimate death scenes rather than the X3 fakeout that would have had impact with the majority who watch the film.

 

[DavidHaller]

I think there is nothing wrong with Bobby and Storm in the first trilogy when it comes to screen time. They had their fair share of screentime. Maybe they are different characters like their comic book versions but they are still characters people can get invested in.

Only because they are not the main players, does not mean that they did not have their solid fanbase. Especially Storm is a very prominent character in the first trilogy. It also helps that Halle Berry is one of the best known stars on the planet...

 

[X-Maniac]

Well you had quicksilver sequence and weapon X in the middle

Quicksilver was like a music video that showed off special FX and was done for an oddly out-of-place comedy.

Weapon X seemed badly choreographed. It seemed poorly constructed for a Singer movie, no real 'wow' to it at all.

We needed a better fight scene.

 

[Havok83]

Quicksilver was like a music video that showed off special FX and was done for an oddly out-of-place comedy.

Weapon X seemed badly choreographed. It seemed poorly constructed for a Singer movie, no real 'wow' to it at all.

We needed a better fight scene.

Yeah Id hardly consider those two action sequences. The only real fight of consequence was the big battle at the end. Other than that, I guess one could technically count Angel vs Nightcrawler but that was pretty minor. Bc of the back and forth, DOFP definitely hit a better balance with giving us action/fight sequences.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Yeah Id hardly consider those two action sequences..

Technically they were action sequences, whether they were to the degree you would want your action sequence is one thing they are action sequences.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Quicksilver was like a music video that showed off special FX and was done for an oddly out-of-place comedy.

its still an action sequence even if it is a different type of one, comedy and music doesn't turn something with quicksilver jumping out of window riding a desk as the mansion explodes behind him as anything less than an action sequence.

Weapon X seemed badly choreographed. It seemed poorly constructed for a Singer movie, no real 'wow' to it at all.

That doesn't make it any less of an action sequence

 

[X-Maniac]

Action or whatever, I didn't really like them.

No stakes, no tension.

The end battle had stakes and tension, that's when the film started to get going. Before then it seemed a bit saggy.

 

[Havok83]

Action or whatever, I didn't really like them.

No stakes, no tension.

The end battle had stakes and tension, that's when the film started to get going. Before then it seemed a bit saggy.

and it didnt involve the X-men fighting. Just some cameo rampaging through as they reacted to the carnage

 

[DavidHaller]

why Singer why? honestly how could he belief this ****** movie could work with dumb, unneccessary scenes like this Wolverine cameo?

THIS was a good Weapon X scene:

 

[2kt09]

why Singer why? honestly how could he belief this ****** movie could work with dumb, unnecessary scenes like this Wolverine cameo?

THIS was a good Weapon X scene:

Did the standards change for PG-13 approval?
They were definitely going for a broader appeal with this movie.