BvS All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - Part 18

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Surely The Rock could pull off Darkseid?

I could see that too. I'm just not down for the whole Rock as Lobo or Black Adam thing for BvS and solo films. It seems to me if youre gonna cast him it would be for a major part like Lex, Metallo, Doomsday, Darkseid or a hero , i.e. someone that the GA might actually care about to see , as opposed to die hard comic fan favorites. I mean , he could pull off Lobo and Black Adam but I have a feeling those solo films would go the way of Jonah Hex.
 
I could see that too. I'm just not down for the whole Rock as Lobo or Black Adam thing for BvS and solo films. It seems to me if youre gonna cast him it would be for a major part like Lex, Metallo, Doomsday, Darkseid or a hero , i.e. someone that the GA might actually care about to see , as opposed to die hard comic fan favorites. I mean , he could pull off Lobo and Black Adam but I have a feeling those solo films would go the way of Jonah Hex.
Who says Black Adam or Lobo will be in solo films, and not villain(s) in MOS 2?
 
Who says Black Adam or Lobo will be in solo films, and not villain(s) in MOS 2?

I never said they would or wouldn't . I said that I would doubt that WB would hire the Rock to play them because they're die hard fan favorites as opposed to bigger name villains. I doubt Lobo and Black Adam are gonna be the villains in BvS anyway.

Do I know? But if we're going by the anything is possible standard , I could argue he's playing the Joker or Mr.Freeze. I don't think its likely at all but i for all I know WB could do that.
 
I'm kinda glad that wb is cracking down on the leaks, but we're part of the problem. in a posters endless search for answers you uncover or read something about the movie that sounds awesome, but when you see it in the movie it's like "oh that sucked. I already knew about it" and it ruins the movie for you.

sure someone will take this personally and say they read the script and it didn't ruin anything, but didn't it? you already know what's coming. what happened to being surprised watching the movie? we ruin it for ourselves then act like it's not ruined then you see a ton of posts after it's released about how predictable it was...
 
I'm kinda glad that wb is cracking down on the leaks, but we're part of the problem. in a posters endless search for answers you uncover or read something about the movie that sounds awesome, but when you see it in the movie it's like "oh that sucked. I already knew about it" and it ruins the movie for you.

sure someone will take this personally and say they read the script and it didn't ruin anything, but didn't it? you already know what's coming. what happened to being surprised watching the movie? we ruin it for ourselves then act like it's not ruined then you see a ton of posts after it's released about how predictable it was...

to be honest I do kind of miss the old days where people would let a film maker make a movie and judge it by watching the film...or not having every detail spoiled. I remember how blown away I was watching ESB in the theater and watching the reveal unfold.

I tend to leave threads once production starts to keep from being spoiled...this movie will be hard to stop following...i may after I see what Batman, WW and the villain.
 
to be honest I do kind of miss the old days where people would let a film maker make a movie and judge it by watching the film...or not having every detail spoiled. I remember how blown away I was watching ESB in the theater and watching the reveal unfold.

I tend to leave threads once production starts to keep from being spoiled...this movie will be hard to stop following...i may after I see what Batman, WW and the villain.

smart. I can't do it anymore. every rumor is apparently truth to someone and it's just too ridiculous now. goodbye for now, shh (good riddance ,right?) ;)
 
to be honest I do kind of miss the old days where people would let a film maker make a movie and judge it by watching the film...or not having every detail spoiled. I remember how blown away I was watching ESB in the theater and watching the reveal unfold.

I tend to leave threads once production starts to keep from being spoiled...this movie will be hard to stop following...i may after I see what Batman, WW and the villain.
Times are different. There wasn't the internet, cell phones, or someone with some form of camera or recording device. I also don't think there was the same anticipation for movies like there is today. Marketing and whatnot turns these things into global events. Big movies like this mirror the craziness surrounding the release of a new iPad or XBOX. It's a two-fold effect. The studios have pushed the consumption and the consumer responds now and days by wanting more and more.

I am VERY glad I didn't spoil myself for MOS and I didn't even see it in theaters. I avoided everything until it was released on Blu-ray/DVD. I plan on taking off from the Hype about six months before the release of this film, and I'm not going to read too many spoiler-y things, but I think this time I might see it in theaters. We'll see.
 
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I totally spoiled MOS for myself but i really enjoyed the movie anyway. Just think, that we have a whole year to speculate now! :yay:
 
I read your arguments, and I’m still a little vague on this. Exactly what point did they miss, or are you afraid that they will miss in the sequel?
You address the points I feel were "missed" below, so I'll respond individually.

I don’t think what happens on the Kent farm is that weird, in context.
If you feel that Superman, enraged over the threat to his mother, would be careless enough as a result to plow Zod into Smallville, I can't really argue that point except to say I disagree.

And I wouldn’t begin to call what he does aboard the fortress casual.
I think it's presented that way, though certainly not intentionally.

I don’t think the first part of that is accurate. While it may be a theme of the franchise, and is an accepted part of the mythology, this movie is not about the world trusting Superman. The movie is almost the opposite. It is about the issues that would arise if someone like Superman existed. That’s made quite plain. A few people come to trust him, but the rest of the world is supposed to be more leery. And understandably so.

It’s a little unrealistic that, even if he hadn’t been associated with the Kryptonians and the disaster, that people would trust someone like Superman entirely. So in that respect, the film does exactly what it set out to do.
The end of the film, though, pretty much shows every person of note in the film choosing to trust him--tentatively, if not absolutely.

That's why I'm making the argument that this is very much intended to be the story of how the world came to trust Superman, and thus, my problem.

Zod makes the argument he does to Superman because Zod is of one mind, and expects Superman to feel the same way he does about humanity. It’s the “join us” offer. That makes Zod close minded, to be sure, and maybe that’s a stupid way to think, but actually stupid? No. Just flawed. And we already know Zod is flawed. He’s pretty much a single minded, blunt instrument.

And keep in mind, the interaction takes place in the mind. Zod has Superman contained already; it’s not like he’s facing down a free, powered Superman. For all he knows, he’s already won. Superman escapes later on.

Keywords: His father’s hope for integration.

Superman is never really about bringing Krypton back. Earth is his adopted world.

Jor-El recognizes the mistakes of the past, and it’s only with Zod, who has the means to bring Krypton back, that he pleads for integration with. It’s really more an aspect of Jor-El’s character than Superman’s in this film.

And the film shows Jor-El and Zod having the integration debate. So it’s not like they didn’t address that concept. They just gave that element to Jor-El. And I’m glad, because otherwise, construct Jor-El feels a lot less like a character extension and more like an absolute plot device.

Superman doesn’t actually obliterate his own people. They were already obliterated when Krypton was destroyed.

Superman destroys the fortress, preventing Kryptonians from coming back in that respect.

But he does so in order to stop Zod, who is using the Fortress as an attack vehicle. It’s not just a scene about destroying Krypton’s chance for rebirth. It’s a scene about potentially destroying Krypton’s chance for rebirth to save another species. How does that hurt his characterization, exactly?
My issue isn't with his choice, it's with the presentation. Same situation as Zod's killing--it doesn't bother me that he made either choice; it bothers me that these choices were not presented to my satisfaction. Because Superman does not even attempt to make an appeal to Zod during their discussion, it appears he doesn't recognize or care that this is not a binary problem (that is to say the options are not "destroy all humans" or "destroy Krypton's future"), and the rather frustrating line that "Krypton had it's chance" only exacerbates the problem. Again, I understand they did not intend for this to appear a casual or careless decision, but that is how I read it as a result of the way it was presented.


That’s not a bad idea, but within this film it does sort of lessen the impact of him making that choice in the first place. ("Phew, it’s damaged, but not TOO damaged!").
Perhaps, but since the pace of the film didn't allow for the impact of said decision to really be a part of the film, I don't consider this a heavy loss.

I don’t think we’ve seen the last of the codex and the hope of Krypton. I suspect we’ll see some sort of Kandor/hope of Krypton aspect come in when Braniac does. A second chance for Kal-El.
Yeah, I can see that happening.

Oh, come on, he smiled.

Sure, he just didn't smile enough.
 
I tend to leave threads once production starts to keep from being spoiled...this movie will be hard to stop following...i may after I see what Batman, WW and the villain.

This is definitely going to be a tough film to stop following. It's going to be a hell of a ride I know that for sure. :woot:
 
I totally spoiled MOS for myself but i really enjoyed the movie anyway. Just think, that we have a whole year to speculate now! :yay:

eli.gif


This thread ain't gonna make it for that much longer.
 
This is definitely going to be a tough film to stop following. It's going to be a hell of a ride I know that for sure. :woot:
lol...It's much easier for me because I have the experience of SR in my mind. I spoiled myself like crazy for that movie. In fact spoilers were why I joined the Hype in the first place. I read the novelization and poured over every piece of information and then I hated that movie; yet, there is still a part of me that wonders if I would have felt that way if I wasn't so spoiled. So for MOS, I was determined to view as objectively as I could. I didn't want to have any doubt over completely loving it or hating, and I wanted to give it a fair chance.

It'll will be easy to do the same with this movie when this time arrives.
 
Damn, El Miyambe is teasing people again ... with no story or reason for his tweet ...

elmayimbe ‏@elmayimbe CYBORG! pic.***********/AJXx818m72


I think he did something similar with 'Metallo' and people all thought it was breaking news and then he said he was just joking.

Oh well ... less than 2 months til production starts ... we have to hear something soon.
 
eli.gif


This thread ain't gonna make it for that much longer.

If we get an official announcement of who the villain is and who is playing said villain.....yeah it won't last much longer. Then, when we get the first official pics of either Gal Gadot as Wonder Woman, Ben Affleck as Batman, or Cav-El and BatFleck in costume facing each other....
7371%20-%20Abandon_thread%20Dean_Ambrose%20Raw%20Roman_Reigns%20Seth_Rollins%20The_Shield%20autoplay_gif%20cm_punk%20gif%20macro%20running%20wwe.gif
 
Damn, El Miyambe is teasing people again ... with no story or reason for his tweet ...

elmayimbe ‏@elmayimbe CYBORG! pic.***********/AJXx818m72


I think he did something similar with 'Metallo' and people all thought it was breaking news and then he said he was just joking.

Oh well ... less than 2 months til production starts ... we have to hear something soon.


He'd be an interesng choice for Cyborg but I'd be surprised to even see cyborg on any big screen. The DC movie universe doesn't feel like it can go that deep heroe wise given there is only one film currently being made.
 
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He'd be an interesng choice for Cyborg but I'd be surprised to even see cyborg on any big screen. The DC universe movie wise doesn't feel like it can go that deep heroe wise given there is only one film currently being made.
I figured Cyborg was going to be one of the Justice League members at some point ... they seem to like to promote the character in the new 52.
 
If we get an official announcement of who the villain is and who is playing said villain.....yeah it won't last much longer. Then, when we get the first official pics of either Gal Gadot as Wonder Woman, Ben Affleck as Batman, or Cav-El and BatFleck in costume facing each other....
7371%20-%20Abandon_thread%20Dean_Ambrose%20Raw%20Roman_Reigns%20Seth_Rollins%20The_Shield%20autoplay_gif%20cm_punk%20gif%20macro%20running%20wwe.gif

This place is going down like the Titanic. :funny:
 
Damn, El Miyambe is teasing people again ... with no story or reason for his tweet ...

elmayimbe ‏@elmayimbe CYBORG! pic.***********/AJXx818m72


I think he did something similar with 'Metallo' and people all thought it was breaking news and then he said he was just joking.

Oh well ... less than 2 months til production starts ... we have to hear something soon.

Not this dude again. If you've got something to say just come out with it instead of spreading rumours hoping one sticks.
 
How could Superman think of integration when Zod wanted to take over and change Earth by force?

Because that's what Superman does: he pursues peace. I don't mean that, as Zod was flying his ship through Metropolis zapping humans, Superman should have proposed an academic debate. What I'm talking about is including, somewhere, a scene recognizing that Superman considered alternatives. His conversation with Zod would have been perfect; Superman suggests alternatives to mass extinction, Zod rebukes him, and we're done.

As for terraforming another planet, that does not work that easily.

Even Kal-El knows that Krypton has terraformed other planets. The difficulty, and feasibility are unknown to him, and thus irrelevant. As such, the very first thing out of his mouth should be "Wait, why don't you just do this on one of those planets?" If it's not a feasible solution (which is possible since those colonies didn't survive, though the film isn't explicit about why), that's fine, and it's also fine if Zod dismisses it purely on the grounds of being a jerk--the important thing is that Superman at least make the appeal that extinction is not the only way.

Having said that, that too would also hurt integration by virtue of being far away from each other. Plus, if Krypton has their own planet to colonize, then why would there be any incentive for Kryptonians to integrate?
So? Jor-El wanted integration. What I'm talking about isn't Jor-El's plans, it's Superman considering whatever possibilities allow both species to survive, even if he eventually realized they are ultimately untenable.

At this point, I'm getting a bit confused with your argument. You're missing the point of Jor-El's words. Superman isn't supposed to be some key dictator figure spearheading the reviving Krypton referendum (I'm not saying you're saying that ad verbatim, rather, that's what my impressions are from reading your argument)
Er... we've definitely had a misunderstanding. I'm not sure exactly how to clarify this matter because I actually don't understand how you got this impression. I think my posts are reasonably clear so all I can suggest is that you read them again.
 
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