BvS All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - Part 2

[Smallville13]

Almost nobody on the street knew about the Avengers years ago and now it's license to print money if it has the name "Avengers" on it. It's almost irrelevant on what to call it. What matters is the product.

But it turned out they did know what it was when they all just realized that it was all these characters they'd seen in the movies recently put together. WB would not have that with Justice League, plus it would look like a huge 'me too'. Superman/Batman is something they can do that is unique and just as big if not bigger than Avengers.

I don't think WB is as gun-ho towards JL as we think here. Even for 2017 it's a massive undertaking. So many characters to introduce and story to juggle. Just so many ways to **** up. Superman/Batman makes so much more financial sense to WB. They're left to just getting Batman right (and most likely Luthor). It's far less risk, but same reward as Superman/Batman really is just as big as the entire Avengers. On top of that it's using Superman as a platform for Batman to get rebooted and get more movies out of as quickly as possible, limiting the gap and money lost between TDKR. Batman is their surething $$$. Plus the hiring of Affleck who is an actor/director is like a double-hire for the Batman spin-off.

There is alot of forward-thinking going on at WB, but I'm not necessarily sure it's towards a JL film just yet. I would guess that a solo Batman film will come in 2017. And perhaps another Superman film in 2018 (I do wonder though how many films people such as Amy Adams and Diane Lane are willing to commit too..).

WB seems to be saying that they've got big plans for their other DC properties to find a life on the small-screen. And we're going to already start seeing that with Flash on Arrow. Perhaps they'll use TV to test the water with the characters and introduce the mainstream to them before attempting to tackle JL. I just wish they'd work with HBO or AMC instead of the CW network...

 

[Herolee10]

Like I've mentioned in past posts, I think which ever hero between Superman and Batman is being prepped towards becoming the sole leader of the Justice League, will be the one to get the biggest boost from this film.

I'm actually hoping that at the end of the day, that Superman's actions from MOS, by having revealed himself to the world will have started a chain events that help bring out the other heroes (but for their own reasons of course) in revealing themselves to the world.

 

[ЯɘvlveR]

The two of them joining the DCU would generate so much buzz. I wouldn't mind Giancarlo Esposito as Martian Manhunter. Or Dean Norris as Bullock.

I'm excited about the Flash series, it's a chance for us to see a bunch of live action Flash villains, that's enough for me.

or harvey dent.

 

[ЯɘvlveR]

Like I've mentioned in past posts, I think which ever hero between Superman and Batman is being prepped towards becoming the sole leader of the Justice League, will be the one to get the biggest boost from this film.

I'm actually hoping that at the end of the day, that Superman's actions from MOS, by having revealed himself to the world will have started a chain events that help bring out the other heroes (but for their own reasons of course) in revealing themselves to the world.

when you say that, i can't help but think that an abin sur cameo would be appropriate.

 

[Herolee10]

when you say that, i can't help but think that an abin sur cameo would be appropriate.

How so?

Honestly, given the fact that Jor-el had this whole monologue about how Clark will one day lead humanity to greater heights, along with how Snyder has gone on the record of saying that he feels that Superman should be the leader of the group makes me think that he might very well will be when the film comes.

I'm still wondering though on how to view all of this since should some have mentioned on how rather than looking at this from the start as a Superman trilogy, maybe the intention was to make this into a Justice League trilogy; where we start with Superman, go to his team up with Batman, and eventually, conclude with the whole group.

 

[ЯɘvlveR]

How so?

Honestly, given the fact that Jor-el had this whole monologue about how Clark will one day lead humanity to greater heights, along with how Snyder has gone on the record of saying that he feels that Superman should be the leader of the group makes me think that he might very well will be when the film comes.

I'm still wondering though on how to view all of this since should some have mentioned on how rather than looking at this from the start as a Superman trilogy, maybe the intention was to make this into a Justice League trilogy; where we start with Superman, go to his team up with Batman, and eventually, conclude with the whole group.

well, while not necessarily for the same reason that we can assume that batman is coming to metropolis in Vs, i'd imagine that the events of mos would be of importance to the corps, and as lantern of its sector, abin sur.

 

[CharlieS]

well, while not necessarily for the same reason that we can assume that batman is coming to metropolis in Vs, i'd imagine that the events of mos would be of importance to the corps, and as lantern of its sector, abin sur.

You're holding something there.

 

[shauner111]

They're a little too goofy for me.

 

[slumcat]

Now Tarantino ****s on Batman! Its **** on Batman season in Hollywood right now.

Here is what he had to say about the shocking casting of Affleck as Batman.
I have to admit that I don't really have an opinion. Why? Because Batman is not a very interesting character. For any actor. There is simply not much to play. I think Michael Keaton did it the best, and I wish good luck to Ben Affleck. But, you know who would have made a great Batman? Alec Baldwin in the '80s.

I share his opinion.
Keaton >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bale

 

[Dk1201]

Affleck might be the next Keaton

 

[X Knight]

aside from the more physical role Batman had in the Nolan trilogy, I actually liked Keaton's Wayne better........as well as Burton's Gotham.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Affleck might be the next Keaton

Except that he'll more closely resemble Bruce Wayne facially, he'll bulk up considerably for the role, and he'll probably actually look like he's mastered more than rudimentary fighting skills.

I love Keaton, but it's true.

 

[slumcat]

Burton atleast HAD a Gotham. Nolan just had a modern city, first obviously Chicago and then obviously NY. A design fail as well as a continuity fail of the Nolan films (amongst others).

 

[BatLobster]

What I want to know is how Batman is any less interesting than the onslaught of generic action protagonists Hollywood throws at us on a yearly basis. Batman/Bruce Wayne is so popular because he is interesting, layered and it's open enough for different actors to put their own stamp on it.

Let's not forget that Bale wonderfully played 3 very different, distinct sides to the role too. He had plenty to chew on. Was it his most "interesting" role? Well, not in the pretentious sense, no. But he made it a three-dimensional character, as did Keaton.

It's always a bummer when people I admire and respect go and make snobby comments like that.

Also, the Nolan/Bale-bashing on this site is starting to reach critical mass. It's almost become the norm at this point, kinda sad.

 

[slumcat]

On the contrary I think all over the Internet there is such foaming-at-the-mouth fervent hysteria around Nolan that it makes my head spin.

I kinda find it as confounding as Michael Bay's popularity.

 

[Wheels]

Yes those two streets in Burton's Gotham looked great lol. Seriously though, I love the look of Burton's Gotham but it doesn't feel big enough.

 

[DChero]

So after reading the Justice League: Mortal script yesterday, I'd really like to see what Snyder can do with those characters. There were some really nice moments.

I think that Talia would be a great fit for this movie because she doesn't need much back story (TDKR) and it opens up Bruce's world without needed to show it.

 

[BatLobster]

On the contrary I think all over the Internet there is such foaming-at-the-mouth fervent hysteria around Nolan that it makes my head spin.

I kinda find it as confounding as Michael Bay's popularity.

Maybe circa 2007-2010. These days you have more reactionaries against Nolan hype who go too far in their attempt to balance the scales against someone they believe is overrated. I guess we just focus on the negative and only see the things that tick us off in that sense.

Nolan's one of the best filmmakers of his generation, imo. You don't have to even like him to acknowledge the impact he's had and the respect he's commanded from everyone who's ever worked with him, his peers and the majority of the audience. There's a reason two of the biggest studios in Hollywood are coming together to produce Interstellar.

I mean, Steven Spielberg himself recently called the Nolan Bat-trilogy "beautiful art films". I can go down the line of all the great filmmakers who've praised his work, but the point is you can't just characterize his hype as a bunch of internet fanboys. His acclaim isn't just some web phenomenon. There's nothing wrong with having a minority opinion, but I think some of Nolan's haters need to kind of chill and accept the reality that he's pretty much 'the guy' right now for this generation. He won't be at the top forever, but this is his time.

 

[slumcat]

Sure he's successful. No doubt about that. And he's kinda a big deal, Hollywood power wise. But jeez I find his films so mediocre. Maybe that's why I find his hype confounding. Like I cannot see past the bad film-making and really understand what people see in his films. I have tried people telling me what is great about Nolan and what they essentially said was his popularity!

I personally wouldn't rank him within a Top 100 of the best film-makers working today.

 

[BatLobster]

Haha dude, trust me I could go on for days about what makes him great, I've been a fan since the Memento/Insomnia days, but this is not the thread for it, nor do I even want to change your mind. You're more than entitled to your opinion and you're not the only one to have it.

I'm just saying...there are filmmakers/musicians/etc out there who personally leave me cold, yet I can still recognize that there's something quality and distinct about their work, and recognize that the acclaim probably isn't for no reason. You don't always have to truly get the hype in order to get the hype, so to speak.

Somewhat back on topic- Affleck and Snyder are fans of the Nolan trilogy, so that's nice to know, especially since they'll respect it enough not to simply mimic it.

 

[SpideyFan866]

As far as the look of Gotham goes, I don't really want it too stylized, but I don't want it completely devoid of any recognizable architecture from the comics.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Yes those two streets in Burton's Gotham looked great lol. Seriously though, I love the look of Burton's Gotham but it doesn't feel big enough.

I like Burton's style, but his films all have an obvious "set" feel to them. It's almost like watching a really expensive stage production. It takes me out of the movie a bit because even though it looks cool, I know what I'm looking at isn't real and makes action sequences feel less impactful than they should.

 

[shauner111]

Now Tarantino ****s on Batman! Its **** on Batman season in Hollywood right now.

Here is what he had to say about the shocking casting of Affleck as Batman.
I have to admit that I don't really have an opinion. Why? Because Batman is not a very interesting character. For any actor. There is simply not much to play. I think Michael Keaton did it the best, and I wish good luck to Ben Affleck. But, you know who would have made a great Batman? Alec Baldwin in the '80s.

I share his opinion.
Keaton >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bale

Tarantino may be my favorite director of all time. I love Quentin. But this is a man who has Kick-Ass 2 and Lone Ranger on his "favorite films of 2013" list. A man who doesn't enjoy the Daniel Craig Bond films and feels Skyfall was just an action movie, not a Bond movie. Which is b.s. So it's safe to say that he enjoys the hokey Bond movies of the past like with Brosnan or Moore. Whats my point? Like with Bond, he doesn't really know these characters it seems.

QT is also dyslexic so my guess is he wasn't a comic book reader and just goes by what he sees in Batman movies...meaning he doesn't have a clue on the character of Batman. Why? Because ive heard dyslexics have an incredibly hard time reading comics (wasn't this the case for Tim Burton too?).

Alec Baldwin would have made an amazing Bruce Wayne in the 80s but a horrible batman. So again, he thinks the character is limited. Just like how Keaton was a fantastic batman for the suit and visuals they were going for back in the late 80s, early 90s. But Bruce Wayne? He was entertaining in that typical quirky Keaton kind of humorous way, but he wasn't a very good Bruce. Kilmer and Bale were better with that character. Look-wise as well.

It's not interesting for any actor? Hmm. Tell that to Christian Bale who is one of the greatest actors of the last 15 years. Im positive he would disagree. After all the actor has to play 3 different distinct roles. 2 of which are the polar opposites of each other.

 

[Rowsdower!]

I generally feel like people who don't think Batman is an interesting character don't know much about the character.

 

[shauner111]

I generally feel like people who don't think Batman is an interesting character don't know much about the character.

Exactly. So far ive heard this from Matt Damon and now Quentin Tarantino. Also to expand on what I said in my previous post, QT is known to be biased with a lot of things. He'll insult the new Bond movies with Daniel Craig because he was in line to do Casino Royale originally and wanted a bloodier movie with Pierce Brosnan. Or the fact that he's worked with Michael Keaton, probably factors into his "opinion".

If he's not interesting then actors wouldn't care about doing it, we would have just had actors who want to do it for the paycheck only. Bale is proof of that. There's so many different interpretations because he's so interesting.