Maybe he's dead, just not as dead as Tommy.
Yeah, I guess you could say Tommy is stone dead
Arrow Arrow General Discussion Thread - Part 5
- Thread starter Thread Manager
- Start date
- Status
Yeah, I guess you could say Tommy is stone dead
Superhero 101
DESI
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2007
- Messages
- 9,532
- Reaction score
- 575
- Points
- 73
Lol I saw the finale right now great episode but I kinda wish they would have had a greater cliffhanger
KingMadness
Civilian
- Joined
- Sep 2, 2011
- Messages
- 567
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 11
This is the best superhero show of all time.
DarkSovereignty
Ooga Chakka
- Joined
- Sep 5, 2006
- Messages
- 14,976
- Reaction score
- 30
- Points
- 58
Diggle, his long lost son [YT]a1Y73sPHKxw[/YT]
Sawyer
17 and AFRAID of Sabrina Carpenter
- Joined
- Apr 4, 2004
- Messages
- 114,196
- Reaction score
- 27,637
- Points
- 203
BH/HHH
You Are My World
- Joined
- Apr 7, 2004
- Messages
- 30,113
- Reaction score
- 916
- Points
- 78
This
the show is fantastic, it's gotten so much right and when it hasn't been quite right they've quickly fixed it. Definitely the best love action superhero show of them all so far.
DarkSovereignty
Ooga Chakka
- Joined
- Sep 5, 2006
- Messages
- 14,976
- Reaction score
- 30
- Points
- 58
He's only nearly dead
carrrnuttt
Sidekick
- Joined
- May 1, 2007
- Messages
- 3,130
- Reaction score
- 258
- Points
- 73
I posted this in the Tommy thread, but it should be in here as well. It's a great interview that covers why it had to be Tommy, as well as the possibilities for S2:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/16/arrow-finale-season-2-plans_n_3287672.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/16/arrow-finale-season-2-plans_n_3287672.html
Oliver told Tommy that he didn't kill Malcolm (John Barrowman) -- was that an act of mercy in his final moments, telling him what he wanted to hear, or is Malcolm actually still around? Because he looked pretty down for the count.
That was 100 percent an act of mercy, that was him telling him what he wanted to hear, knowing that Tommy was gonna die. He definitely had to get some comeuppance for all the chaos he had wrought.
That was 100 percent an act of mercy, that was him telling him what he wanted to hear, knowing that Tommy was gonna die. He definitely had to get some comeuppance for all the chaos he had wrought.
carrrnuttt
Sidekick
- Joined
- May 1, 2007
- Messages
- 3,130
- Reaction score
- 258
- Points
- 73
Oliver told Tommy that he didn't kill Malcolm (John Barrowman) -- was that an act of mercy in his final moments, telling him what he wanted to hear, or is Malcolm actually still around? Because he looked pretty down for the count.
That was 100 percent an act of mercy, that was him telling him what he wanted to hear, knowing that Tommy was gonna die. He definitely had to get some comeuppance for all the chaos he had wrought.
There's a chance he thought Malcolm was dead *when* he left.
He also left right after Malcolm collapsed, so Oliver wasn't really there for an actual "diagnosis."
Human Torch
Avenger
- Joined
- Aug 27, 2012
- Messages
- 10,850
- Reaction score
- 2
- Points
- 31
Anyone else think Walter will come back to Moira in her present difficulties next season?The show runners let him live for a reason.I wonder what they have planned....
He might. They've pretty much confirmed that Moira will be in the show still, mentioning her dealing with responsibility of Tommy's death.
Colin Salmon is a Hollywood actor and he's really busy so he'd probably only be a guest star, but I doubt he'd turn down work. He said he really enjoyed going over to Canada to film it, so he's there if they want him I guess.
Oliver and Thea are going to be living in that huge house on their own, so maybe he comes back to help look after Thea and Moira did confess and get the Glades mostly evacuated so she's not beyond redemption. I'd take her back, she's hot for her age
Side note : Anyone else think they're going to turn the Glades into a memorial forest? Pretty sure there was a huge forest in Star city, and "the glades" sounds more like a forest than a housing estate.
Last edited:
Dark Raven
It's not about what you deserve...
- Joined
- Apr 2, 2010
- Messages
- 62,002
- Reaction score
- 9,675
- Points
- 103
He might. They've pretty much confirmed that Moira will be in the show still, mentioning her dealing with responsibility of Tommy's death.
Colin Salmon is a Hollywood actor and he's really busy so he'd probably only be a guest star, but I doubt he'd turn down work. He said he really enjoyed going over to Canada to film it, so he's there if they want him I guess.
Oliver and Thea are going to be living in that huge house on their own, so maybe he comes back to help look after Thea and Moira did confess and get the Glades mostly evacuated so she's not beyond redemption. I'd take her back, she's hot for her age
She shared an onscreen kiss with Terry Farrell in Deep Space Nine back in the day and was one of the first televised girl-girl kisses. They cut that bit out of the version I saw.
Maybe I need to look that up lol.
Rule of thumb, when a woman looks as classy and as great as she does at her age, she was super hot when she was 20
Last edited:
Everyone assumed that you would have Tommy eventually become the Dark Archer. Why did you decide to kill him off instead?
Marc Guggenheim: It really had nothing to do with his trajectory as the Dark Archer. It really had to do with the fact that we wanted Oliver to suffer a loss at the end of the season. When we thought about the characters that he could lose who would have the biggest impact not just on Oliver, but on the show, Tommy was the name that rose to the top very quickly. Tommy's death impacts pretty much every member of our cast. Obviously his death impacts Oliver and Laurel (Katie Cassidy), but there's a closeness between Thea (Willa Holland) and Tommy that we've established on the show, Lance, obviously because of the connection that Laurel has with Tommy and Moira (Susanna Thompson) because of her responsibility with Tommy. He's the one character whose death would have the biggest impact.
Will Laurel feel a sense of guilt over her role in Tommy's death and possibly second-guess her decision to choose Oliver over Tommy?
Gugggenheim: Definitely she's going to feel some fairly overwhelming guilt because people, particularly like Ross and Rachel, can argue whether or not [Laurel and] Tommy were on a break when Laurel slept with Oliver in the penultimate episode. The thing that's pretty much indisputable is the fact that Laurel, by sleeping with Oliver, chose Oliver over Tommy and yet it was Tommy who came to save her. She feels an enormous amount of guilt over, "Did I pick the wrong guy?" These will all be things we're exploring in Season 2. The reason we did it wasn't just to end the season on an impactful note. It really was to create all sorts of different stories and dramatic conflicts in Season 2.
Do you think this could be a catalyst for Laurel to maybe put on a pair of fishnets?
Guggenheim: [Laughs] It's a catalyst for her to do a variety of different things. It's going to drive a lot of what Laurel does in Season 2, both good and bad. Tommy's death will reverberate through the cast of characters and will affect the changes and choices that Oliver makes and that Thea makes. It's going to affect everybody. It's not like you'll never hear Tommy's name never uttered again. If anything, Tommy is a larger presence in death than he was in life.
Is Malcolm Merlyn actually dead? It seemed like his fate was left up in the air. Was that on purpose or do you want to set the record straight?
Guggenheim: I never want to set the record straight. We have a moment in mind for the Season 2 premiere that should give you an answer to that question, but the thing that I always do say and I said this to John Barrowman and to Colin Donnell this is a show that does flashbacks. So just because a character is dead doesn't mean we've necessarily seen the last of them on this show.
Oliver thought that defeating Malcolm's plan was his way out from being the Hood. What galvanizes him now to continue to be this vigilante?
Guggenheim: I want to answer this question without spoiling our plans for Season 2, so the best way to answer it and this will be one of those things where you'll go back to this interview after you watch the season premiere to see what I mean is that I think he's pretty much done being the vigilante. The question is: What happens now? Come October, that statement will make a lot of sense.
How does Starling City start picking up the pieces after The Glades was destroyed? Will there be a time jump to skip the initial aftermath?
Guggenheim: There will be a time jump, not really to skip over anything, but rather it's just consistent with the choice we made early on with the show. We always try to pass time naturally. For example, there was a six week break between Episodes 9 and 10 and we wrote that break into the show. That said, The Glades and the Undertaking was a big piece of our engine that drives us forward in Season 2. If the story engine of Season 1 was this notebook of names, I think the story engine of Season 2 is the destruction of The Glades and the impact not just on The Glades, but all of Starling City. You've got Merlyn Global and Queen Consolidated both not in The Glades, but the two biggest employers of people in Starling City and those companies are in some dire straits. We're going to see in Season 2 that the economy in Starling City is pretty decimated.
The other thing I will say is that we're going to continue to publish the Arrow digital comic for the next few weeks into June. I wrote a two-parter that closes out the finale. It's really meant as a companion piece for the season finale. It takes place during the finale and in the week following the finale. You'll actually get a chance to see some things that happened in Starling City after the events of the finale exclusively in the comic book.
Since such a dark thing has happened with at least half The Glades being leveled, does the city need someone like The Hood now?
Guggenheim: That's one of the themes that we're exploring for sure in Season 2. There are some people who feel that before there was this hooded guy in the city, there weren't earthquake devices either. There are other people who feel that if the police aren't going to step up to the plate, someone needs to. There will be a variety of different points of view held by not just the citizens of Starling City, but our characters as well, which is where we'll get a lot of interesting debate and conflict.
Will we see Moira on trial next season for her role in the Undertaking?
Guggenheim: All I'll say is that I'm an attorney and the easiest thing to write for me are courtroom scenes. I think I deserve at least one episode where it's an easy thing to write.
Roy and Thea both showed very heroic sides in the finale. Is that a sign of things to come?
Guggenheim: Yes. Thea's line about, "I have wicked aim" was meant to be a little foreshadowing and certainly, Roy's heroics in the alleyway with his red hood is similar. Our game plan with respect to Thea and Roy pretty much remains unchanged. We're going to keep pushing them both in the directions that destiny is drawing them. The nice thing for us in Season 2 is Colton Haynes becomes a series regular so it'll allow us to tell a lot more Roy stories, which we're really eager to do.
What are the consequences of Detective Lance working with the vigilante next season?
Guggenheim: He probably went through the biggest change of anyone except for Tommy who went from alive to dead. We're really excited about where we're taking him in Season 2. Season 2 begins with him under very different circumstances both personally and professionally. It's a fun thing for us to play with the real world consequences of all the choices that he made in the season finale. People will be surprised what Lance is doing the next time we see him.
Will he continue to be Oliver's inside man in the police department?
Guggenheim: Our long-term goal with Lance has always been to make him the show's Commissioner Gordon, but do it in our version of Commissioner Gordon. In the Batman mythologies, Batman and Commissioner Gordon are partners fighting crime. Obviously we went a different way with Lance starting out hating The Hood and now begrudgingly accepting that The Hood has a real role to play. We'll be both continuing that trajectory for him in Season 2, as well as dealing with the real world consequences to making that choice. In the Batman mythos, rarely do they ever call Commissioner Gordon out on the fact that he's working side-by-side with this vigilante. We'll take a different kind of approach and a slightly more realistic one to the realities of what Lance has elected to do and is going to continue to do.
What will the flashbacks to the island look like next season?
Guggenheim: Things will at first appear to proceed the way you're expecting, but then in pretty short order, we're going to reveal that things are a little bit more complicated than what you're expecting.
I can't imagine that Slade (Manu Bennett) is happy that Oliver chose Shado (Celina Jade) over a way off the island.
Guggenheim: That is certainly something that we're going to be exploring in the second season premiere.
Marc Guggenheim: It really had nothing to do with his trajectory as the Dark Archer. It really had to do with the fact that we wanted Oliver to suffer a loss at the end of the season. When we thought about the characters that he could lose who would have the biggest impact not just on Oliver, but on the show, Tommy was the name that rose to the top very quickly. Tommy's death impacts pretty much every member of our cast. Obviously his death impacts Oliver and Laurel (Katie Cassidy), but there's a closeness between Thea (Willa Holland) and Tommy that we've established on the show, Lance, obviously because of the connection that Laurel has with Tommy and Moira (Susanna Thompson) because of her responsibility with Tommy. He's the one character whose death would have the biggest impact.
Will Laurel feel a sense of guilt over her role in Tommy's death and possibly second-guess her decision to choose Oliver over Tommy?
Gugggenheim: Definitely she's going to feel some fairly overwhelming guilt because people, particularly like Ross and Rachel, can argue whether or not [Laurel and] Tommy were on a break when Laurel slept with Oliver in the penultimate episode. The thing that's pretty much indisputable is the fact that Laurel, by sleeping with Oliver, chose Oliver over Tommy and yet it was Tommy who came to save her. She feels an enormous amount of guilt over, "Did I pick the wrong guy?" These will all be things we're exploring in Season 2. The reason we did it wasn't just to end the season on an impactful note. It really was to create all sorts of different stories and dramatic conflicts in Season 2.
Do you think this could be a catalyst for Laurel to maybe put on a pair of fishnets?
Guggenheim: [Laughs] It's a catalyst for her to do a variety of different things. It's going to drive a lot of what Laurel does in Season 2, both good and bad. Tommy's death will reverberate through the cast of characters and will affect the changes and choices that Oliver makes and that Thea makes. It's going to affect everybody. It's not like you'll never hear Tommy's name never uttered again. If anything, Tommy is a larger presence in death than he was in life.
Is Malcolm Merlyn actually dead? It seemed like his fate was left up in the air. Was that on purpose or do you want to set the record straight?
Guggenheim: I never want to set the record straight. We have a moment in mind for the Season 2 premiere that should give you an answer to that question, but the thing that I always do say and I said this to John Barrowman and to Colin Donnell this is a show that does flashbacks. So just because a character is dead doesn't mean we've necessarily seen the last of them on this show.
Oliver thought that defeating Malcolm's plan was his way out from being the Hood. What galvanizes him now to continue to be this vigilante?
Guggenheim: I want to answer this question without spoiling our plans for Season 2, so the best way to answer it and this will be one of those things where you'll go back to this interview after you watch the season premiere to see what I mean is that I think he's pretty much done being the vigilante. The question is: What happens now? Come October, that statement will make a lot of sense.
How does Starling City start picking up the pieces after The Glades was destroyed? Will there be a time jump to skip the initial aftermath?
Guggenheim: There will be a time jump, not really to skip over anything, but rather it's just consistent with the choice we made early on with the show. We always try to pass time naturally. For example, there was a six week break between Episodes 9 and 10 and we wrote that break into the show. That said, The Glades and the Undertaking was a big piece of our engine that drives us forward in Season 2. If the story engine of Season 1 was this notebook of names, I think the story engine of Season 2 is the destruction of The Glades and the impact not just on The Glades, but all of Starling City. You've got Merlyn Global and Queen Consolidated both not in The Glades, but the two biggest employers of people in Starling City and those companies are in some dire straits. We're going to see in Season 2 that the economy in Starling City is pretty decimated.
The other thing I will say is that we're going to continue to publish the Arrow digital comic for the next few weeks into June. I wrote a two-parter that closes out the finale. It's really meant as a companion piece for the season finale. It takes place during the finale and in the week following the finale. You'll actually get a chance to see some things that happened in Starling City after the events of the finale exclusively in the comic book.
Since such a dark thing has happened with at least half The Glades being leveled, does the city need someone like The Hood now?
Guggenheim: That's one of the themes that we're exploring for sure in Season 2. There are some people who feel that before there was this hooded guy in the city, there weren't earthquake devices either. There are other people who feel that if the police aren't going to step up to the plate, someone needs to. There will be a variety of different points of view held by not just the citizens of Starling City, but our characters as well, which is where we'll get a lot of interesting debate and conflict.
Will we see Moira on trial next season for her role in the Undertaking?
Guggenheim: All I'll say is that I'm an attorney and the easiest thing to write for me are courtroom scenes. I think I deserve at least one episode where it's an easy thing to write.
Roy and Thea both showed very heroic sides in the finale. Is that a sign of things to come?
Guggenheim: Yes. Thea's line about, "I have wicked aim" was meant to be a little foreshadowing and certainly, Roy's heroics in the alleyway with his red hood is similar. Our game plan with respect to Thea and Roy pretty much remains unchanged. We're going to keep pushing them both in the directions that destiny is drawing them. The nice thing for us in Season 2 is Colton Haynes becomes a series regular so it'll allow us to tell a lot more Roy stories, which we're really eager to do.
What are the consequences of Detective Lance working with the vigilante next season?
Guggenheim: He probably went through the biggest change of anyone except for Tommy who went from alive to dead. We're really excited about where we're taking him in Season 2. Season 2 begins with him under very different circumstances both personally and professionally. It's a fun thing for us to play with the real world consequences of all the choices that he made in the season finale. People will be surprised what Lance is doing the next time we see him.
Will he continue to be Oliver's inside man in the police department?
Guggenheim: Our long-term goal with Lance has always been to make him the show's Commissioner Gordon, but do it in our version of Commissioner Gordon. In the Batman mythologies, Batman and Commissioner Gordon are partners fighting crime. Obviously we went a different way with Lance starting out hating The Hood and now begrudgingly accepting that The Hood has a real role to play. We'll be both continuing that trajectory for him in Season 2, as well as dealing with the real world consequences to making that choice. In the Batman mythos, rarely do they ever call Commissioner Gordon out on the fact that he's working side-by-side with this vigilante. We'll take a different kind of approach and a slightly more realistic one to the realities of what Lance has elected to do and is going to continue to do.
What will the flashbacks to the island look like next season?
Guggenheim: Things will at first appear to proceed the way you're expecting, but then in pretty short order, we're going to reveal that things are a little bit more complicated than what you're expecting.
I can't imagine that Slade (Manu Bennett) is happy that Oliver chose Shado (Celina Jade) over a way off the island.
Guggenheim: That is certainly something that we're going to be exploring in the second season premiere.
Dark Raven
It's not about what you deserve...
- Joined
- Apr 2, 2010
- Messages
- 62,002
- Reaction score
- 9,675
- Points
- 103
Interesting interview.
I would rather have Malcolm Merlin alive and have to live with the consequences of his actions that, although he managed to get revenge for the death of his wife, he was ultimately responsible (even indirectly) for the death of his own son.
I would rather have Malcolm Merlin alive and have to live with the consequences of his actions that, although he managed to get revenge for the death of his wife, he was ultimately responsible (even indirectly) for the death of his own son.
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2004
- Messages
- 162,705
- Reaction score
- 12,114
- Points
- 203
I think we'll see flashbacks of Malcolm being trained and whoever trained him will be a big threat next season, my guess being that he was trained by Slade.
That line and Roy's choice to save the people on thus bus made me think they'd definitely be heading this way next season. I think in the aftermath they'll become a crime fighting duo that eventually Ollie takes into the team.
So this is where the Ollie/Slade feud will start.
Nathan
Avenger
- Joined
- May 6, 2003
- Messages
- 49,925
- Reaction score
- 321
- Points
- 73
Didn't they drop hints that Malcolm was trained by Ra's Al Ghul? For example, when he mentioned that he went to Nanda Parbat. Would make sense if Ra's was the one that inspired him to take such radical actions with the Glades. Plus, wasn't Malcolm a member of the League of Assassins in the comics? So I really doubt Slade trained him.
Even though I was hoping Thea doesn't become a crime fighter, I can actually see that being a possibility.
Human Torch
Avenger
- Joined
- Aug 27, 2012
- Messages
- 10,850
- Reaction score
- 2
- Points
- 31
I don't think they can use Ra's.And even if they could,I'd prefer a different villain.
Dark Raven
It's not about what you deserve...
- Joined
- Apr 2, 2010
- Messages
- 62,002
- Reaction score
- 9,675
- Points
- 103
Depends when Malcolm was trained. If it was in the last 5 years, then obviously it can't be Slade, since he was on the island with Oliver, unless he somehow got off there early.
Nathan
Avenger
- Joined
- May 6, 2003
- Messages
- 49,925
- Reaction score
- 321
- Points
- 73
Didn't he disappear shortly after his wife died? I think that was at least over 10 years ago, when Tommy was still a kid. And Slade, during the 5 years, was still a member of Australian Intelligence. I doubt before the island, he spent his spare time in Nanda Parbat, training Millionaires, and teaching them how to punish the wicked.
- Status
Similar threads
- Sticky
- Locked
- Locked
