BvS Ben Affleck IS Batman!! - Part 5

[sepharih]

The point of bringing up Jonah Hex is that it points out the fanboy double standard. They are okay with certain actors who have mediocre or bad comic book movies in their resume (Brolin, Bentley, Fassbender) but not with others (Affleck).

Well again, I haven't seen Jonah Hex so It's difficult for me to comment on it, but once again there's a distinction which can be made between a bad performance and a bad movie...and I don't think that's a hard concept to understand.
Hell, Ben Affleck's best performance by far *is* in an otherwise bad or, at best, mediocre film.
Edit: Also, this is pure hearsay since I haven't seen it, but while I've never heard anything positive or negative about Bentley or Brolin, I did hear Fassbender was good whenever he was onscreen....for what it's worth.

Also, once again, we're talking about Daredevil the most since it's the most relevant example but it's not like Daredevil was an anomaly of film in an otherwise dignified acting career. It was just one role in one movie in a long drawn out series of terrible performances and bad movies from Affleck. Every actor does a bad movie, and plenty of them have turned in a bad performance every once in a while...but as an Actor Ben Affleck is more like a bad actor who turns up a good movie every once in a while....which is happening more often now since he's directing really great movies.

 

[slumcat]

Henry Cavill's reaction after reading the finished Man Of Steel 2 script when he sees he has even less footage than Man Of Steel.

 

[Keyser Soze]

But, in the case we are talking about....it's a lot harder to find anyone who actually likes Jonah Hex....while there are many that do like DareDevil. So you have on one hand a bad movie that no one knows about....and on the other hand an OK movie that got bad press.

I've never seen Jonah Hex, but it breaks my heart to hear how bad that turned out. I remember reading the script for it back when it first leaked, and it was brilliant! Written (and to be directed) by Mark Neveldine and Brian Taylor of Crank fame, it played like a brutal, hard-R Western grindhouse, and was glorious. But then they replaced those guys with the Horton Hears a Who director and made a de-balled PG 13 stinker.

 

[sepharih]

which of Cameron's movies are you referencing?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082910/

 

[smashmode]

Here would be a fun exercise, list movies that had great acting performances, even though the direction and script were crap.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Well again, I haven't seen Jonah Hex so It's difficult for me to comment on it, but once again there's a distinction which can be made between a bad performance and a bad movie...and I don't think that's a hard concept to understand.
Hell, Ben Affleck's best performance by far *is* in an otherwise bad or, at best, mediocre film.
Edit: Also, this is pure hearsay since I haven't seen it, but while I've never heard anything positive or negative about Bentley or Brolin, I did hear Fassbender was good whenever he was onscreen....for what it's worth.

Also, once again, we're talking about Daredevil the most since it's the most relevant example but it's not like Daredevil was an anomaly of film in an otherwise dignified acting career. It was just one role in one movie in a long drawn out series of terrible performances and bad movies from Affleck. Every actor does a bad movie, and plenty of them have turned in a bad performance every once in a while...but as an Actor Ben Affleck is more like a bad actor who turns up a good movie every once in a while....which is happening more often now since he's directing really great movies.

Not really. He appeared in good films at the start of his career, and has acted in good (and even a couple of great) films pretty consistently for the past several years. His problem is that the bad films he did largely came in quick succession over the period of a couple of years, and they were VERY high-profile bad films.

 

[NickNitro]

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0082910/

lol dear God I had no idea he directed those movies

 

[C. Lee]

The point of bringing up Jonah Hex is that it points out the fanboy double standard. They are okay with certain actors who have mediocre or bad comic book movies in their resume (Brolin, Bentley, Fassbender) but not with others (Affleck).

As I have said before....the Affleck hate stemmed from "BENNIFER" crap started by the press. The press run it and the story into the ground, and there became a backlash against him....then it became the "thing to do" on the internet to bash him. Many of the people on the net today bashing him have grown up reading bashing on the net....they don't actually know what started it or why and most haven't even really watched any of the things they are complaining about.

And also....speaking as someone who has been around for a few years longer than most around here....sometimes perceptions change. Liking or not liking something ten years ago....can change over time. That's why when I express my opinion about a movie, book, or show.....I will say if it's been more than a decade since I saw it, because I know that my perception could have changed about it over time.

 

[slumcat]

Here would be a fun exercise, list movies that had great acting performances, even though the direction and script were crap.

Sharlto Copley in District 9.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Sharlto Copley in District 9.

Yeah, okay...

 

[Keyser Soze]

As I have said before....the Affleck hate stemmed from "BENNIFER" crap started by the press. The press run it and the story into the ground, and there became a backlash against him....then it became the "thing to do" on the internet to bash him. Many of the people on the net today bashing him have grown up reading bashing on the net....they don't actually know what started it or why and most haven't even really watched any of the things they are complaining about.

And also....speaking as someone who has been around for a few years longer than most around here....sometimes perceptions change. Liking or not liking something ten years ago....can change over time. That's why when I express my opinion about a movie, book, or show.....I will say if it's been more than a decade since I saw it, because I know that my perception could have changed about it over time.

On the subject of BENNIFER, can I also just say... Jersey Girl absolutely does not deserve the turkey status history seems to have labelled it with. It's a sweet film, admittedly lightweight fare but not without charm. But because it stars Ben Affleck and Jennifer Lopez, and came out mere months after Gigli, it kinda got caught up in that hate zeitgeist.

 

[JangoNate]

No, you're not. The theatrical cut was flawed but enjoyable...the Director's cut was great....and Affleck did a darn fine job in the role. That is my opinion, I don't expect everyone to agree with it...but I don't act most of the people who didn't like it and claim that my opinion is fact.

My sentiments exactly. I actually thoroughly enjoyed the DD: DC and as soon as I heard the announcement for Batman, I've pulled it off the shelf and I'm looking to introduce it to my wife.

 

[smashmode]

Sharlto Copley in District 9.

Well I mean generally regarded as terrible. Does District 9 fall in that camp? (Direction/story terrible, movie made good/great by the actor?)

 

[newwaveboy87]

Here would be a fun exercise, list movies that had great acting performances, even though the direction and script were crap.

Charlize Theron in Monster immediately jumped to my mind

 

[Bathead]

No, you're not. The theatrical cut was flawed but enjoyable...the Director's cut was great....and Affleck did a darn fine job in the role. That is my opinion, I don't expect everyone to agree with it...but I don't act most of the people who didn't like it and claim that my opinion is fact.

That's exactly how I feel about DD (I haven't seen the director's cut yet, though) IMO, it surely wasn't as horrible as some seem to think, and it doesn't seem logical to use it as an example of how Affleck is unsuitable to play Batman, besides being a decade old and hardly an indicator of how he is now, especially considering the praise he's gotten lately for his acting as well as his directing. I get the impression (some) people are just looking for excuses not to like his casting as Batman.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Not really. He appeared in good films at the start of his career, and has acted in good (and even a couple of great) films pretty consistently for the past several years. His problem is that the bad films he did largely came in quick succession over the period of a couple of years, and they were VERY high-profile bad films.

Right on!

I think the sad part is people are remembering his work from a decade ago, and basing their opinion of him on that. At least the person who says he isn't a fan of his acting in more recent roles has a leg to stand on.

 

[slumcat]

Well I mean generally regarded as terrible. Does District 9 fall in that camp? (Direction/story terrible, movie made good/great by the actor?)

I didn't know you meant a general opinion, I thought you meant a personal opinion. Copley jumped the first thing in my mind, loved his performance but found the film absolutely horrible.

 

[C. Lee]

I've never seen Jonah Hex, but it breaks my heart to hear how bad that turned out. I remember reading the script for it back when it first leaked, and it was brilliant! Written (and to be directed) by Mark Neveldine and Brian Taylor of Crank fame, it played like a brutal, hard-R Western grindhouse, and was glorious. But then they replaced those guys with the Horton Hears a Who director and made a de-balled PG 13 stinker.

I first read Hex back in the 70's....I have no idea what they may have done with him in the comics in recent years....the comics were brutal rough seriousness.....but when he started having conversations with dead people in the movie....I said this isn't the comic book character I remember....then every time Wil Arnett appeared, I was waiting for some outlandish joke to happen. The movie was a big disappointment for me.

 

[tdeverea]

I watched Batman TAS series this morning on The Hub. THAT characterization is the definitive Batman for me.

I am extremely confident that Zack Snyder, David Goyer, and Ben Affleck will give audiences a Batman that will at least match that.

I loved Man of Steel and I truly enjoyed what Snyder attempted with Watchmen. 300 was exceptional. Sucker Punch was visually dynamic but missed the mark with its ending.

Besides, no actor has ever botched Bruce Wayne/Batman on the big screen. I don't expect that to change now, even though I'm not the biggest fan of Affleck. He's gonna kill it.

Zero worries from me.

Edit: P.S. I hated Daredevil.

 

[sepharih]

Here would be a fun exercise, list movies that had great acting performances, even though the direction and script were crap.

Off the top of my head:

Mark Strong in Green Lantern
Tom Jane in the Punisher
Chris Evans in the Fantstic Four
Michael Fassbender in Prometheus
Eric Bana and Peter O'toole in Troy
Tim Roth in Planet of the Apes

 

[C. Lee]

Honestly, with how frequently actors/actresses/directors/casting departments are getting thrown under the bus these days I'd like to sneak under the radar making a bad film, get it out of the way, make as little waves as possible, and chalk it up to experience. Take what I learned and go make a great movie.

I personally couldn't take the constant ridicule from fans/newspapers/etc. but thats just me

In todays world of the internet....the constant ridicule comes even if you do a good job with something.

 

[newwaveboy87]

Off the top of my head:

Mark Strong in Green Lantern
Tom Jane in the Punisher
Chris Evans in the Fantstic Four
Michael Fassbender in Prometheus
Eric Bana and Peter O'toole in Troy
Tim Roth in Planet of the Apes

I'd add Michael Chiklis to F4

Other than that, agreed. Solid list.

 

[NickNitro]

In todays world of the internet....the constant ridicule comes even if you do a good job with something.

Tis a sad, but true fact sir. I was talking in another Supes thread and someone commented "you know for years I've been hearing how Superman was such a ***** and people wanted to see him really take it to a villain on screen. We got that in MoS, and all of a sudden people are complaining and more concerned about property damage"

I couldn't help but just sit back and laugh because this happens more often than not....the harsh reality is....no fan boy is ever truly satisfied.

 

[doobie]

I always thought Kilmer was the best part of Batman Forever. Cool 70s personality Batman in a not great film.

 

[NickNitro]

Off the top of my head:

Mark Strong in Green Lantern
Tom Jane in the Punisher
Chris Evans in the Fantstic Four
Michael Fassbender in Prometheus
Eric Bana and Peter O'toole in Troy
Tim Roth in Planet of the Apes

I'd add Michael Chiklis to F4

Other than that, agreed. Solid list.

I'd also add

Liev Shrieber in Wolverine Origins