The Winter Soldier Captain America 2: News and Speculation - - - - - - Part 19

[cherokeesam]

He told Peggy that their conversation in the car was the longest he'd ever had with a woman… and that women weren't exactly lining up to dance with someone who looked like him. In fact, one dynamic in his relationship with Peggy Carter was that he didn't know a bloody thing about women. Fondue? Remember that?

From the sounds of it Bucky forced Steve to go on these double dates. And the girls ignored him in favor of Bucky. Steve was pretty inexperienced when it came to talking to women. There's nothing wrong with that, but I think it's okay to extrapolate from the evidence of the first film that dating wasn't something he did because of lack of opportunity.

In all fairness, there's plenty of ladies' men who never said more than a few words to their partner in a conversation. Talking =/= the other thing.

 

[Suzanne78]

Right, I hear you. But, at least in the movies, Steve is depicted as having some issues talking to women, that he's clumsy with his words and stuff.

Of course, that's not every woman. There's Natasha, but since he's been working with her his relationship is very different with her. Likewise, as the movie progresses, with him and Peggy, Steve gets better at talking to her.

But I'd say rather than him being a ladies' man of few words, movie Steve is rather tongue -tied and awkward around females.

 

[hafizbat]

For anyone who's interested, I made out 4 books in Steve's apartment.

The Night Stalkers
Never Surrender
Madam President
George H.W Bush

 

[Suzanne78]

For anyone who's interested, I made out 4 books in Steve's apartment.

The Night Stalkers
Never Surrender
Madam President
George H.W Bush

I thought I saw what looked like either Catch-22 and Catcher in the Rye too.

I also think he had a Barack Obama book too!

 

[Ms. Marvel]

So a 95 year old can't lie?

They kind of made a big point in the movie that Steve doesn't lie. When he said to Natasha "I'm always honest." And when Pierce asked him if he knew anything and all he said was "Fury's last words were not trust anybody" which was the truth. I highly doubt he'd lie over something as petty as kissing.

 

[NJCaliboi]

They kind of made a big point in the movie that Steve doesn't lie. When he said to Natasha "I'm always honest." And when Pierce asked him if he knew anything and all he said was "Fury's last words were not trust anybody" which was the truth. I highly doubt he'd lie over something as petty as kissing.

I wouldn't call a lie about a kiss petty, if anything it's personal and probably what he'd most likely lie about. With that said I believed him and have hard time believing that fine specimen of hunkiness hasn't gotten his hulk-smash on yet. If he hasnt gotten to smashing yet its some virtue moral type thing about finding the right woman- not very relatable but very Captain-esque. If he hasnt gotten any action he's likely embarrassed about his lack of experience and its understandable that he wouldnt be all that forthcoming w.details- so a lie about that is understandable and quite different than the examples of truth u referenced.

 

[Rock Sexton]

This conversation about Cap kissing is creepy.

 

[NJCaliboi]

This conversation about Cap kissing is creepy.

Creepy? Hmmm... Dont worry one day u will be comfortable talking about kissing and sex- its the most natural thing on earth. Considering that people were actually wondering what Cap's status was and that the dialog was actually written into the movie I think it's conversation worthy.

 

[Loki882]

I don't think that he was lying. I think that Cap probably tried to form relationships with women after getting thawed out, but they just didn't work out. He even has that line about it being hard to find someone with shared life experiences. Also, he's clearly still hung up on Peggy and what could have been had he not become a Cap-sicle (BTW I just watched TFA again the other day and how he got frozen is still really contrived and doesn't work). We'll see how things go with Sharon in Cap 3.

 

[Travesty]

Contrived? Compared to the rest of the movie, I don't see how it's that contrived at all.

 

[hafizbat]

Creepy? Hmmm... Dont worry one day u will be comfortable talking about kissing and sex- its the most natural thing on earth. Considering that people were actually wondering what Cap's status was and that the dialog was actually written into the movie I think it's conversation worthy.

I don't think thats for you to say. Some people would never be comfortable openly talking about it, including myself. It's a privacy/honor thing. If someone says they think talking about a comic book movie character's sex life is creepy, thats their opinion. And for the record, I agree with him.

 

[Rock Sexton]

Creepy? Hmmm... Dont worry one day u will be comfortable talking about kissing and sex- its the most natural thing on earth. Considering that people were actually wondering what Cap's status was and that the dialog was actually written into the movie I think it's conversation worthy.

Wondering what his status was? Again, creeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeepy. It's a comic book character and probably the least important thing on his resume. What's next? Wondering if he man-scapes his Cap marbles now?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Wondering what his status was? Again, creeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeepy. It's a comic book character and probably the least important thing on his resume. What's next? Wondering if he man-scapes now?

I wouldn't say that. A lot of his character in the MCU is caught up in his "man of time" status and tragic love with Peggy. There is reason it was brought up by Natasha.

 

[Rock Sexton]

I wouldn't say that. A lot of his character in the MCU is caught up in his "man of time" status and tragic love with Peggy. There is reason it was brought up by Natasha.

It was brought up by Natasha because she's his polar opposite and that whole conversation they had in the truck was about how different they were in all phases of life. But fixating on the kissing/sex stuff amidst all of that is a bit weird IMO, as these movies are not geared for that subject matter.

 

[TalismanRing]

Behind the Shield: The surreal making of 'Captain America: The Winter Soldier' -- EXCLUSIVE

By Anthony Breznican on Apr 11, 2014

http://insidemovies.ew.com/2014/04/11/behind-the-shield-captain-america-the-winter-soldier

Find out what it's really like to wear the Cap suit, what Mackie is screaming as he flies and the what Evan's calls the best day of work in Sebastian's life.

 

[Suzanne78]

Eh, it's not really weird to discuss the kissing stuff. I think if you find it strange, you're not viewing it like we are, or I am at least. I feel it's another facet of discussion regarding Steve's character. Also, usually when I bring up the thing with Cap's love life, it's typically joking around. And I think quite a few of us on here are joking about it.

But to say romance (or even interpersonal relationships, which is an extension of the romance discussion) doesn't play a significant part in these movies is very much mistaken. Peggy Carter played a very important role in Steve's first movie, and she proved to be such a breakout character that Marvel's finding ways to use her even more in the cinematic universe. In TWS, Peggy is used to reinforce the Man out of Time theme as well as giving Cap that connection to his past, one part of which will be gone soon. Natasha keeps bringing up people for Steve to date, and the conversation in the car after they kiss, because she wants him to develop bonds and connect with someone in the present instead of living in the past, as well as discussing their differences. There has even been some commentary that examines Falcon's role in TWS as more akin to a romantic interest rather than a mere "sidekick".

For Tony, Pepper is the "most important thing" in his life, his first actual relationship with someone. For Thor, Jane represents his connection to Midgard, a significant reason why he chose to leave Asgard in TDW and return to Earth.

These movies are about how these characters interact and relate to each other; anytime we discuss what Steve's done/who Steve's done it with, it's merely an extension of that discussion. Or it's a joke. But it's still a pretty big portion of the stories of these movies.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

It was brought up by Natasha because she's his polar opposite and that whole conversation they had in the truck was about how different they were in all phases of life. But fixating on the kissing/sex stuff amidst all of that is a bit weird IMO, as these movies are not geared for that subject matter.

And yet both TFA and TWS took time to cover it. I am not saying it is the central idea, but this isn't like the weird conversation about Bruce Wayne's love life before TDKR. That stuff really was out of left field. Cap's experience and how he is around woman has been a talking point in both of his solo films so far. They spent an entire film teasing him and Peggy. TWS ends with a chaste kiss from Natasha.

 

[Rock Sexton]

Eh, it's not really weird to discuss the kissing stuff. I think if you find it strange, you're not viewing it like we are, or I am at least. I feel it's another facet of discussion regarding Steve's character. Also, usually when I bring up the thing with Cap's love life, it's typically joking around. And I think quite a few of us on here are joking about it.

But to say romance (or even interpersonal relationships, which is an extension of the romance discussion) doesn't play a significant part in these movies is very much mistaken. Peggy Carter played a very important role in Steve's first movie, and she proved to be such a breakout character that Marvel's finding ways to use her even more in the cinematic universe. In TWS, Peggy is used to reinforce the Man out of Time theme as well as giving Cap that connection to his past, one part of which will be gone soon. Natasha keeps bringing up people for Steve to date, and the conversation in the car after they kiss, because she wants him to develop bonds and connect with someone in the present instead of living in the past, as well as discussing their differences. There has even been some commentary that examines Falcon's role in TWS as more akin to a romantic interest rather than a mere "sidekick".

For Tony, Pepper is the "most important thing" in his life, his first actual relationship with someone. For Thor, Jane represents his connection to Midgard, a significant reason why he chose to leave Asgard in TDW and return to Earth.

These movies are about how these characters interact and relate to each other; anytime we discuss what Steve's done/who Steve's done it with, it's merely an extension of that discussion. Or it's a joke. But it's still a pretty big portion of the stories of these movies.

We differ here in that I never got the impression Widow had this urgent concern for Cap connecting with people in the present day. My interpretation was she was sassing him because of the humor in the discomfort. Sort've like how I was California Pizza Kitchen last week with my little 6 year old cousin and I was teasing her about her crush.

Anyone trying to draw a relationship parallel for the Falcon is reaching at this point.

And yet both TFA and TWS took time to cover it. I am not saying it is the central idea, but this isn't like the weird conversation about Bruce Wayne's love life before TDKR. That stuff really was out of left field. Cap's experience and how he is around woman has been a talking point in both of his solo films so far. They spent an entire film teasing him and Peggy. TWS ends with a chaste kiss from Natasha.

It's an "ancillary" idea compared to all of the other themes and what I'm saying was it wasn't meant to be diagnosed like a complex mathematical equation. It's a surface "quirk".

Questioning if he banged women on tour and stuff like that (mentioned amidst the long drawn out conversation over his "sex" life) .... I just don't understand the concern.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

What's next? Wondering if he man-scapes his Cap marbles now?

Looks like it's time for a new thread.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

It's an "ancillary" idea compared to all of the other themes and what I'm saying was it wasn't meant to be diagnosed like a complex mathematical equation. It's a surface "quirk".

Questioning if he banged women on tour and stuff like that (mentioned amidst the long drawn out conversation over his "sex" life) .... I just don't understand the concern.

That is fine if that is how you feel about it, but I don't understand why you need to take jab at others for discussing it. It is clearly enough of a topic for some that it continues to come up on the boards and in the films.

 

[Suzanne78]

We differ here in that I never got the impression Widow had this urgent concern for Cap connecting with people in the present day. My interpretation was she was sassing him because of the humor in the discomfort. Sort've like how I was California Pizza Kitchen last week with my little 6 year old cousin and I was teasing her about her crush.

Anyone trying to draw a relationship parallel for the Falcon is reaching at this point.



It's an "ancillary" idea compared to all of the other themes and what I'm saying was it wasn't meant to be diagnosed like a complex mathematical equation. It's a surface "quirk".

Questioning if he banged women on tour and stuff like that (mentioned amidst the long drawn out conversation over his "sex" life) .... I just don't understand the concern.

Obviously not literal, but in terms of looking at how Sam was introduced and integrated into Steve's story (a "meet cute" moment with banter, personal connection at the vet's meeting, building trust throughout the movie, waking up with Sam next to him at the hospital&#8230 it's only an interesting way of looking at how TWS continually subverted audience expectations about Steve's relationships in the movie. We'd expect him to have that connection with one of the female characters, but it's Sam Wilson who gets that role. The analysis, faulty or otherwise, interested and appealed to me as an English literature major.

We'll likely have to agree to disagree on the whole kissing/Steve's virginity thing. For me, personally, I think it's absolutely hilarious and I love joking around about it, but that's kind of my sense of humor LOL! No intention to make anyone uncomfortable though…

In fairness, about 75% of me is joking around, and 25% is legit interested to see exactly how they're going to deal with this in future movies.

 

[Rock Sexton]

That is fine if that is how you feel about it, but I don't understand why you need to take jab at others for discussing it. It is clearly enough of a topic for some that it continues to come up on the boards and in the films.

It's not a jab. I just legitimately find the concern for it a little creepy, particularly taking it to the level of "sex". The conversation has been quite a bit more extensive than I could've ever imagined. I'm just not the type of person to sit there concerning myself with other peoples' "relations", particularly for a genre of film that only briefly glosses over it. Now if this were a movie like "Sex, Lies, and Videotape" or something I could understand the conversation a little more.

 

[Rock Sexton]

Obviously not literal, but in terms of looking at how Sam was introduced and integrated into Steve's story (a "meet cute" moment with banter, personal connection at the vet's meeting, building trust throughout the movie, waking up with Sam next to him at the hospital&#8230 it's only an interesting way of looking at how TWS continually subverted audience expectations about Steve's relationships in the movie. We'd expect him to have that connection with one of the female characters, but it's Sam Wilson who gets that role. The analysis, faulty or otherwise, interested and appealed to me as an English literature major.

We'll likely have to agree to disagree on the whole kissing/Steve's virginity thing. For me, personally, I think it's absolutely hilarious and I love joking around about it, but that's kind of my sense of humor LOL! No intention to make anyone uncomfortable though…

In fairness, about 75% of me is joking around, and 25% is legit interested to see exactly how they're going to deal with this in future movies.

I think we're just viewing this through the eyes of two different sexes. I never had any expectations of Steve's relationships heading into this film other than closure for Peggy. I see all that transpired between he and the Falcon as natural bonding, especially with everything the two had in common. Not to mention people like us already know the two characters have a history of friendship in the comics.

 

[hafizbat]

I agree with you, Rock. It's just a superhero movie. None of it is real...

 

[NJCaliboi]

Well I still don't quite understand how this convo can be viewed as "creepy"- but if thats how u feel i guess thats how u feel. Almost every superhero movie deals with romance in some shape or fashion- the hero and his lady. So I dont see how the convo about who he's kissed is creepy or inappropriate. And as others have said it was written in the movie so the writers purposely made it a topic and as such its a topic worthy of discussion, no big deal one way or the other.