Henry Cavill IS Superman: - - - - Part 13

[Kevin Smith]

I liked it much better the second time.

I walked out thinking "this is very good", as opposed to the empty and unmoved "....." feeling I had after the first viewing. Performances were great with what they were given. I blame Goyer for the problems.

 

[Nicko-Ray]

I was thinking about how they should approach Superman's disguise on my way home from my 2nd screening; rather than turning Clark into a clumsy buffoon (which would realistically draw more attention to him than he wants), why not go for a more quiet-spoken, "nobody" type of persona? In my opinion, that would work so much better, because -- let's face it -- no one really cares about the "invisible" guy. A buffoon, on the other hand, has a tendency of becoming infamous for his/her many faults.

Sure. If I remember correctly, that's kinda how it is in Superman Earth One. Not all clumsy overdoing it, but just quiet like how an outcast is nowadays. Not really a mute but yeah.

 

[The Sage]

I was thinking about how they should approach Superman's disguise on my way home from my 2nd screening; rather than turning Clark into a clumsy buffoon (which would realistically draw more attention to him than he wants), why not go for a more quiet-spoken, "nobody" type of persona? In my opinion, that would work so much better, because -- let's face it -- no one really cares about the "invisible" guy. A buffoon, on the other hand, has a tendency of becoming infamous for his/her many faults.

True. Clark could be occasionally clumsy at times not have it as a consistent part of his character.

Of course, Cavill would have to cover up that million dollar grin of his while being Clark or tone it down.

I liked it much better the second time.

I walked out thinking "this is very good", as opposed to the empty and unmoved "....." feeling I had after the first viewing. Performances were great with what they were given. I blame Goyer for the problems.

Same thing with me. I walked out the first time thinking it was good, and the more I thought about it, and after the second viewing I realized it was really good. The 2nd time around allowed to me to soak in everything one more time and catch things I didn't notice the first time.

 

[BH/HHH]

I liked it much better the second time.

I walked out thinking "this is very good", as opposed to the empty and unmoved "....." feeling I had after the first viewing. Performances were great with what they were given. I blame Goyer for the problems.

Wow that's a big leap in change, what changed for you?

 

[DoomsdayApex]

DAT CAVILL.

Hey, WB, I'd consider a contract extension right now.

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

Sure. If I remember correctly, that's kinda how it is in Superman Earth One. Not all clumsy overdoing it, but just quiet like how an outcast is nowadays. Not really a mute but yeah.

Jon Hickman, in one of his Avengers titles, recently wrote a story centering on a new character. The artist (who probably deserves most of the credit) did an amazing job of fooling the reader about the character's identity. He basically put said character in an environment where everyone you saw him with stood out in some way for various reasons: Some were louder, some were taller, some appeared extremely intelligent, and so on. As such, you, the reader, found yourself entirely focused on them, suspecting that they could be the hero in question. At the end of the book, however, it's revealed that the person you're looking for was actually right next to each of those aforementioned characters! You just didn't bother to look at him. It was a brilliant technique. It sure as hell fooled me when I read it.

 

[Nicko-Ray]

Jon Hickman, in one of his Avengers titles, recently wrote a story centering on a new character. The artist (who probably deserves most of the credit) did an amazing job of fooling the reader about the character's identity. He basically put said character in an environment where everyone you saw him with stood out in some way for various reasons: Some were louder, some were taller, some appeared extremely intelligent, and so on. As such, you, the reader, found yourself entirely focused on them, suspecting that they could be the hero in question. At the end of the book, however, it's revealed that the person you're looking for was actually right next to each of those aforementioned characters! You just didn't bother to look at him. It was a brilliant technique. It sure as hell fooled me when I read it.

Wow. Sounds intriguing.
So you're saying that maybe they don't exactly do that in MOS2 of course, but Clark should just camouflage into his work place. Without the nerdy, clumsy aspect. I can dig.
I'm curious to know how they're gonna write that in. How will his workplace view him? What kind of things will be said about him?

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

Wow. Sounds intriguing.
So you're saying that maybe they don't exactly do that in MOS2 of course, but Clark should just camouflage into his work place. Without the nerdy, clumsy aspect. I can dig.
I'm curious to know how they're gonna write that in. How will his workplace view him? What kind of things will be said about him?

Pretty much, yeah. I don't think he should be entirely low-key though. While in disguise, Clark should occasionally perform impressive feats, so that he's still respected on some level. People could say things like, "Guess who got the best lead? That Clark guy.. whoever he is.. the new guy who always hangs around Lois"

Yeah, I'm curious how they're going to write it in as well. Goyer recently said that he, along with Snyder, have no idea how they're going to approach the CK disguise though. Should we be worried? lol

 

[Nicko-Ray]

Pretty much, yeah. I don't think he should be entirely low-key though. While in disguise, Clark should occasionally perform impressive feats, so that he's still respected on some level. People could say things like, "Guess who got the best lead? That Clark guy.. whoever he is.. the new guy who always hangs around Lois"

Yeah, I'm curious how they're going to write it in as well. Goyer recently said that he, along with Snyder, have no idea how they're going to approach the CK disguise though. Should we be worried? lol

Haha! Not sure if I read that, no. But I think they have no idea how to approach it because of the realistic approach they're trying to go for. And the last scene of the movie is done and done. Those people at the Planet didn't recognize him, so I feel it's established that the glasses thing is gonna have to be the route to go. Idk.

But yeah he can't be entirely low-key. Being too much will get you noticed, and being too much of a nobody brings attention.

Is Snyder signed on officially for the sequel? I hope he is.

 

[DACrowe]

Cavill did look different with the glasses of course not enough for you to not know he's not Superman but something definitely looked off. I truly thought the ending was perfect t:

Honestly, he kind of looked like an aged hipster/pseudo-intellectual as opposed to the big dork of Reeve's take (which I love, btw).

They have to do something different. I know in Post-Crisis, it is popular to say Clark is his real identity, just as much as superman, but that leads to things like Lois and Clark and evenSuperman: The Animated Series where Clark and Superman are so alike, that it ridiculous to think anybody would be thrown off by a pair of glasses.

But you don't want to just copy the feckless nerd of Reeve. Besides it being boring and dated to retread (see Superman Returns), it is kind of campy and does not fit this style.

I like the idea of him playing kind of an introverted New York intellectual type with the glasses on. Sure, it in reality is not different enough from Superman, but just from the way he dressed and the pair of glasses he had in that one moment, I got that vibe. It is different and would be fun to go that route.

 

[ЯɘvlveR]

Pretty much, yeah. I don't think he should be entirely low-key though. While in disguise, Clark should occasionally perform impressive feats, so that he's still respected on some level. People could say things like, "Guess who got the best lead? That Clark guy.. whoever he is.. the new guy who always hangs around Lois"

Yeah, I'm curious how they're going to write it in as well. Goyer recently said that he, along with Snyder, have no idea how they're going to approach the CK disguise though. Should we be worried? lol

someone should send them your post then.

 

[BH/HHH]

DAT CAVILL.

Hey, WB, I'd consider a contract extension right now.

Yeah good idea before he becomes irreplaceable like Downey Jr and he can Renegotiate for three times the money or even walk away

 

[Glassjaw]

After seeing the film, the title of this thread is more apt then ever.

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

Haha! Not sure if I read that, no. But I think they have no idea how to approach it because of the realistic approach they're trying to go for. And the last scene of the movie is done and done. Those people at the Planet didn't recognize him, so I feel it's established that the glasses thing is gonna have to be the route to go. Idk.

But yeah he can't be entirely low-key. Being too much will get you noticed, and being too much of a nobody brings attention.

Is Snyder signed on officially for the sequel? I hope he is.

Not sure if Snyder's officially signed on yet. He'll definitely be back though.

Here's the part of the recent interview with Goyer I was referring to, along with the link to the entire article:

"In our minds there are people in Smallville who know Superman’s secret as well [as Lois], Pete Ross seems to know, there’s probably a couple dozen people who know and we thought it would be interesting if they’re protective of him.

We were able to sidestep the issue of the ludicrous glasses disguise in this film but going forwards, we’re going to find ourselves in a sticky wicket. Zack and I have definitely talked about “Okay, hmm, this will be interesting.” Clearly Perry White and Steve Lombard see Lois kissing Superman at the end of the film. Perry’s not an idiot. Moving forward, he’s probably going to say to Lois “What’s up with that?” We’re definitely going to have to go through some story gymnastics."

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/06...or-and-problems-with-the-man-of-steel-sequel/

 

[DKDetective]

Not sure if Snyder's officially signed on yet. He'll definitely be back though.

Here's the part of the recent interview with Goyer I was referring to, along with the link to the entire article:

"In our minds there are people in Smallville who know Superman’s secret as well [as Lois], Pete Ross seems to know, there’s probably a couple dozen people who know and we thought it would be interesting if they’re protective of him.

We were able to sidestep the issue of the ludicrous glasses disguise in this film but going forwards, we’re going to find ourselves in a sticky wicket. Zack and I have definitely talked about “Okay, hmm, this will be interesting.” Clearly Perry White and Steve Lombard see Lois kissing Superman at the end of the film. Perry’s not an idiot. Moving forward, he’s probably going to say to Lois “What’s up with that?” We’re definitely going to have to go through some story gymnastics."

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/06...or-and-problems-with-the-man-of-steel-sequel/

Yeah, that quote worries me a little because it implies that Goyer has no faith in the disguise. It worries me that they are either going to do away with it in the next film or come up with some crazy sci-fi explanation for it.

In regards to what everyone has been saying about how to approach the Clark Kent persona in this world (quiet, intellectual, hipster, who blends in and fades into the background), I completely agree with that take and that is part of what makes me so upset they didn't address the disguise or its merits in this film because Clark has proven that he can do all those things in this film. Eg. the slight bit of fake absent-mindedness on the fishing boat, blending in and disappearing into the background at the excavation site in the Arctic, Lois's little monologue about him spending a lifetime covering his tracks and being a ghost, etc. All of those things points towards a lifetime of practice leading up to the big show and the development of the DP Clark Kent disguise. I think it was missed opportunity.

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

Yeah, that quote worries me a little because it implies that Goyer has no faith in the disguise. It worries me that they are either going to do away with it in the next film or come up with some crazy sci-fi explanation for it.

In regards to what everyone has been saying about how to approach the Clark Kent persona in this world (quiet, intellectual, hipster, who blends in and fades into the background), I completely agree with that take and that is part of what makes me so upset they didn't address the disguise or its merits in this film because Clark has proven that he can do all those things in this film. Eg. the slight bit of fake absent-mindedness on the fishing boat, blending in and disappearing into the background at the excavation site in the Arctic, Lois's little monologue about him spending a lifetime covering his tracks and being a ghost, etc. All of those things points towards a lifetime of practice leading up to the big show and the development of the DP Clark Kent disguise. I think it was missed opportunity.

I could be wrong, but I think Snyder and Goyer wanted the last scene to resonate with audiences much in the same way the "Joker card" was used in Batman Begins. In that sense, they probably wanted to give us "just enough" to chew on, but not enough to satisfy our appetites.

 

[Nicko-Ray]

Not sure if Snyder's officially signed on yet. He'll definitely be back though.

Here's the part of the recent interview with Goyer I was referring to, along with the link to the entire article:

"In our minds there are people in Smallville who know Superman’s secret as well [as Lois], Pete Ross seems to know, there’s probably a couple dozen people who know and we thought it would be interesting if they’re protective of him.

We were able to sidestep the issue of the ludicrous glasses disguise in this film but going forwards, we’re going to find ourselves in a sticky wicket. Zack and I have definitely talked about “Okay, hmm, this will be interesting.” Clearly Perry White and Steve Lombard see Lois kissing Superman at the end of the film. Perry’s not an idiot. Moving forward, he’s probably going to say to Lois “What’s up with that?” We’re definitely going to have to go through some story gymnastics."

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/06...or-and-problems-with-the-man-of-steel-sequel/

Sure. Perry definitely knows something's up with Lois and Supes. As well as the other people that saw them kissing.

What do they mean by sidestep the ludicrous glasses disguise?

 

[N7 Joseph Shepard]

best thing to sort of help that situation, introduce another character for Henry to play who looks like Superman and Clark Kent, they actually did that recently in the comics (Spence Becker).

Surely Superman can't be 3 different people at the exact same time......surely lol

 

[DKDetective]

I could be wrong, but I think Snyder and Goyer wanted the last scene to resonate with audiences much in the same way the "Joker card" was used in Batman Begins. In that sense, they probably wanted to give us "just enough" to chew on, but not enough to satisfy our appetites.

Yeah, I know, but I still feel like it was a missed opportunity. My point was that other parts of the film made it feel like the creation of the disguise and explaining it would be more natural and better told in this film. It seemed like a natural conclusion to some threads being laid earlier.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I just go with the glasses flow. It doesn't make sense but neither does a flying Alien from another planet.

 

[ArmsHeldOut]

best thing to sort of help that situation, introduce another character for Henry to play who looks like Superman and Clark Kent, they actually did that recently in the comics (Spence Becker).

Surely Superman can't be 3 different people at the exact same time......surely lol

That's kinda clever and funny at the same time.

 

[Anita18]

I like the idea of him playing kind of an introverted New York intellectual type with the glasses on. Sure, it in reality is not different enough from Superman, but just from the way he dressed and the pair of glasses he had in that one moment, I got that vibe. It is different and would be fun to go that route.

...I wouldn't peg ANY introverted intellectual type with glasses for Superman. I come from an entire family of them. They don't have presence. Supes is the strong, confident, silent type. He has presence.

Yeah, that quote worries me a little because it implies that Goyer has no faith in the disguise. It worries me that they are either going to do away with it in the next film or come up with some crazy sci-fi explanation for it.

In regards to what everyone has been saying about how to approach the Clark Kent persona in this world (quiet, intellectual, hipster, who blends in and fades into the background), I completely agree with that take and that is part of what makes me so upset they didn't address the disguise or its merits in this film because Clark has proven that he can do all those things in this film. Eg. the slight bit of fake absent-mindedness on the fishing boat, blending in and disappearing into the background at the excavation site in the Arctic, Lois's little monologue about him spending a lifetime covering his tracks and being a ghost, etc. All of those things points towards a lifetime of practice leading up to the big show and the development of the DP Clark Kent disguise. I think it was missed opportunity.

Yeah, and teenage Clark looked so much different from Superman. Let his hair grow long (even if it isn't "realistic" from one scene to another ) put some big clothes on him, let Henry do his thing.

 

[Sun_Down]

Loved Cavill. He's fantastic as both Supes and Clark.

I actually liked the way they handled the secret identity thing. The hints of people in Smallville knowing his secret but protecting him. The scene at the end with the satellite. Those two things, but the disguise makes it plausible enough for me.

 

[DKDetective]

...I wouldn't peg ANY introverted intellectual type with glasses for Superman. I come from an entire family of them. They don't have presence. Supes is the strong, confident, silent type. He has presence.


Yeah, and teenage Clark looked so much different from Superman. Let his hair grow long (even if it isn't "realistic" from one scene to another ) put some big clothes on him, let Henry do his thing.

Yeah, exactly, I don't know if you saw my post a couple pages back, but I said the exact same thing. All of the tricks they used to make Cavill look, move, and sound younger during the tornado scene are perfect for making Clark look and feel different than Superman. Superman is very much defined by his maturity and masculinity. Things that minimize those traits go a long way.

I know we complained about the lack of spitcurl and how Clark's hair is more Superman-esque, but I think they actually made a good choice in slicking Superman's hair in this world as a result now. (It reduces how big his head looks and, thus, emphasizes how big his physique looks, it's a very manly silhouette). As you said, the bigger, more curly they make Clark's hair look, the more it reduces the Superman-esque silhouette. It makes him look gawky and less well built. Same with having him wear loose fitting clothes like they did in the tornado scene. It makes him look lanky and less filled out. The higher pitched voice for teenage Clark has a similar effect. Now Cavill shouldn't make it as nasally, since that is too distinctly teen, but if he can up the pitch of Clark's voice, then great.

 

[the last son]

But if Clark is hanging around Lois a lot and Superman is hanging around Lois a lot, wouldn't people put two and two together?