The Dark Knight Rises TDKR SPOILERS (read at your own risk) - Part 2

[kthevs]

From what I've read...

Spoiler

It seems like the whole and only point of the scene is to show people that Bruce is still alive and for Alfred to see that, but aside from that, the impression that I've gotten is that the scene only answers those two things, leaving everything else a mystery (new identity, status with Selina, etc).

Spoiler

That matches up with what a reliable person on Nolanfans told me. Except that he said the way they make a big deal out of the scene in regards to who Bruce is with inside the cafe, combined with the interaction between the two throughout the movie, leaves no doubt that Bruce and Selina ended up together. She changed her identity, but he said it's never explain if Bruce did too. Keep in mind that this person says that he didn't like how Bruce seems to give "everything" up just for the sake of being with Selina.

 

[Herolee10]

Spoiler

That matches up with what a reliable person on Nolanfans told me. Except that he said the way they make a big deal out of the scene in regards to who Bruce is with inside the cafe, combined with the interaction between the two throughout the movie, leaves no doubt that Bruce and Selina ended up together. She chagnged her identity, but he said it's never explain if Bruce did too.

Spoiler

Well I'm just going by what Name-That-Movie said about how the scene does show that Selina is there with Bruce, and how a person could interpret that the scene represents that both of them are starting a new life together, especially with Catwoman having asked Bruce to leave with her and away from Gotham during the climax, but he also said that the shot doesn't stay long on Selina to emphasize them being there together as much as it does to show Bruce and Alfred seeing each other.

But it is a nice thought to think that Bruce won't have to spend the rest of his life alone.

 

[kthevs]

Spoiler

Well I'm just going by what Name-That-Movie said about how the scene does show that Selina is there with Bruce, and how a person could interpret that the scene represents that both of them are starting a new life together, especially with Catwoman having asked Bruce to leave with her and away from Gotham during the climax, but he also said that the shot doesn't stay long on Selina to emphasize them being there together as much as it does to show Bruce and Alfred seeing each other.

But it is a nice thought to think that Bruce won't have to spend the rest of his life alone.

True. It's not in Nolan's nature to make things too obvious.

Spoiler

I didn't know that she asks him to leave with her (I thought Miranda did that). If that's true, that kind of seals the deal. I think the whole point of the ending is to show that Bruce finally has a life. Like Bale said, Bruce has missed out on all the stuff in life that life is worth living for.

What's going to bother me is not knowing whether or not he changed his identity. I mean who in their right mind would disown billions of dollars?

 

[Ras Al Fool]

Spoiler

Do you guys think Alfred is imagining things?

 

[Ferd]

Spoiler

That matches up with what a reliable person on Nolanfans told me. Except that he said the way they make a big deal out of the scene in regards to who Bruce is with inside the cafe, combined with the interaction between the two throughout the movie, leaves no doubt that Bruce and Selina ended up together. She changed her identity, but he said it's never explain if Bruce did too. Keep in mind that this person says that he didn't like how Bruce seems to give "everything" up just for the sake of being with Selina.

This is how it was described, so it's very clearly left up to interpretation

Spoiler

but seemingly mainly to be to show Alfred that Bruce is alive (since it was earlier confirmed that Alfred left Bruce, and then isn't seen again until at Bruce's grave when he believes he is dead.

Spoiler

It isn't implied that they will go on together or go their separate ways, they are shown for 3 seconds, and if you don't pay attention you'll just notice Bruce as he's the main focus of the shot.

 

[Herolee10]

True. It's not in Nolan's nature to make things too obvious.

Spoiler

I didn't know that she asks him to leave with her (I thought Miranda did that). If that's true, that kind of seals the deal. I think the whole point of the ending is to show that Bruce finally has a life. Like Bale said, Bruce has missed out on all the stuff in life that life is worth living for.

What' going to bother me is not knowing whether or not he changed his identity. I mean who in their right mind would disown billions of dollars?

Well...

Spoiler

from what I had read, Bruce's fortune is practically crippled by Bane's attack on the Stock Market Exchange, and I think it's also more of a personal thing for him, because being "Bruce Wayne", has really brought him nothing but pain and agony for last few decades of his life.

 

[Ferd]

True. It's not in Nolan's nature to make things too obvious.

Spoiler

I didn't know that she asks him to leave with her (I thought Miranda did that). If that's true, that kind of seals the deal. I think the whole point of the ending is to show that Bruce finally has a life. Like Bale said, Bruce has missed out on all the stuff in life that life is worth living for.

What' going to bother me is not knowing whether or not he changed his identity. I mean who in their right mind would disown billions of dollars?

According to Name-

Spoiler

She doesn't ask him to leave with her. She tells him she is going to leave after helping him at the end and he says he doesn't think she will. The only bit in regards to her 'asking him to leave with her' (again, according to Name,) is what she says in the 3rd trailer, "You don't owe these people anymore..." bit.

And he in essence, 'died penniless.' (though the door is open from what Fox said for the money to be recovered, I do believe...)

 

[kthevs]

This is how it was described, so it's very clearly left up to interpretation

Spoiler

but seemingly mainly to be to show Alfred that Bruce is alive (since it was earlier confirmed that Alfred left Bruce, and then isn't seen again until at Bruce's grave when he believes he is dead.

Spoiler

That ties in a bit to what the guy on Nolanfans told me. He said it's not really much of a debate if you pay close attention to their dialogue and interaction throughout the movie. She's the one who makes him feel alive again and their chemistry is great (his words, not mine). The guy also said that an accurate ending to the comic books would have been Catwoman going her own way and not being domesticated, but the fact that Jonah put this scene there and disregarded the comics can only be done for one reason, and that's to bring things full circle and show that Bruce has moved on from the death of his parents and found happiness and normalcy with someone. Also, he talked about how we have to remember how iconic the Bat/Cat relationship is in the comics, and how in the comics and BTAS, the ONLY reason they can't be together is because he will always be the batman, and she will always be the catwoman. If those walls are taken down, then it's quite probable and logical that they would be together.

Either way, can't wait to see how it turned out.

 

[Herolee10]

Spoiler

That ties in a bit to what the guy on Nolanfans told me. He said it's not really much of a debate if you pay close attention to their dialogue and interaction throughout the movie. She's the one who makes him feel alive again and their chemistry is great (his words, not mine). The guy also said that an accurate ending to the comic books would have been Catwoman going her own way and not being domesticated, but the fact that Jonah put this scene there and disregarded the comics can only be done for one reason, and that's to bring things full circle and show that Bruce has moved on from the death of his parents and found happiness and normalcy with someone. Also, he talked about how we have to remember how iconic the Bat/Cat relationship is in the comics, and how in the comics and BTAS, the ONLY reason they can't be together is because he will always be the batman, and she will always be the catwoman. If those walls are taken down, then it's quite probable and logical that they would be together.

Either way, can't wait to see how it turned out.

Spoiler

What's ironic is that IF Jonah hadn't convinced Chris to bring Selina in, I could see the ending having turned out where Bruce is just there on his own.

Though when I think about it, like you said, it does fit with a lot of what's been said and shown in the film supposedly. I mean, you supposedly have Alfred admitting that he had hoped that Bruce had settled down and gotten a family of his own during the time that he was missing.

In any case, if that last cafe scene was meant as a possibility to signify that the two ended up together, then Chris and Jonah Nolan have done what no one else outside of the comics have been able to do:

They've domesticated Bruce and Selina.lol

I am wondering though, and IF ANYONE that knows of this answer, please tell me but...

Spoiler

We've heard on how..well the effects that Selina has on Bruce's character, but given her personality, what makes her fall for Batman/Bruce since she pretty much fends him off to bane at first and by the time he comes back, they have to deal with Bane and Talia right away, so what's there in the middle that makes it different for Selina?

 

[kthevs]

Spoiler

What's ironic is that IF Jonah hadn't convinced Chris to bring Selina in, I could see the ending having turned out where Bruce is just there on his own.


Though when I think about it, like you said, it does fit with a lot of what's been said and shown in the film supposedly. I mean, you supposedly have Alfred admitting that he had hoped that Bruce had settled down and gotten a family of his own during the time that he was missing.

In any case, if that last cafe scene was meant as a possibility to signify that the two ended up together, then Chris and Jonah Nolan have done what no one else outside of the comics have been able to do:

They've domesticated Bruce and Selina.lol

I am wondering though, and IF ANYONE that knows of this answer, please tell me but...

Spoiler

We've heard on how..well the effects that Selina has on Bruce's character, but given her personality, what makes her fall for Batman/Bruce since she pretty much fends him off to bane at first and by the time he comes back, they have to deal with Bane and Talia right away, so what's there in the middle that makes it different for Selina?

Spoiler

Ha. That's exactly what the other guy said. I asked him what was the most memorable thing about the movie for him. He said that the most memorable thing was the Talia reveal, and the fact that Jonah exposed himself as a hardcore Bruce/Selina fanboy. Theshape said something similar when I asked him if it was believable that they would end up together given what happens in the movie (I hate foreced romances). He said that not only is it beliveable, it's logical and makes perfect sense.

As for the other thing, I don't know about the movie since I have not seen it, but in BTAS, she falls in love with him after one episode because it's her first time meeting someone who is just as screwed up and broken as her.

 

[Victarion]

A review mentioned there being some cameos in this movie, but didn't elaborate on them.

Spoiler

Can anyone say whether or not they were members of the rogues gallery, or simply Judge Crane and the Al Ghuls?

 

[Great Mind(s)]

Spoiler

Can someone tell me who Juno Temple plays please? I'm dying to know.

 

[Ferd]

Spoiler

Can someone tell me who Juno Temple plays please? I'm dying to know.

She plays

Spoiler

Selina's friend 'Jen' and from what I've heard it's not a very large part. She is a sort of 'apprentice' to Selina's thievery.

 

[silentrascal]

What kind of role does Daniel Sunjata have in TDKR? (I always know him as Franco from 'Rescue Me').

 

[Ferd]

Spoiler

We've heard on how..well the effects that Selina has on Bruce's character, but given her personality, what makes her fall for Batman/Bruce since she pretty much fends him off to bane at first and by the time he comes back, they have to deal with Bane and Talia right away, so what's there in the middle that makes it different for Selina?

From what I understand,

Spoiler

Bruce is intrigued with her from their first meeting, which causes him to look into her and then follow her to the party (thanks to a tracker in his mother's pearls she stole) where they share the dance and have that sparky chat. I think (as Bale put it) she isn't the sort of person you would expect him to be drawn to, but she makes him laugh in a time when he could really use some levity) and she is intriguing. I believe it was Name (or possibly Film Freak) who said he basically doesn't give up hope on her (which could be a callback to Alfred not giving up on him) but in Bruce's typical way he is trying to redeem her from her sordid ways. I think in the movie she does what she does out of necessity, but it turn has a conscience about it (there is that bit where she apparently calls out her friend Jen for looting and defending that it's 'somebody's home.') So I think that whole 'fresh start' thing is a main theme for her, and Bruce, too--and he sees a shred of good in her and wants to help bring that out. And in the end they both get to escape the darkness their past circumstances have led them to and get a fresh start--be it alone or together is up for debate. I think all of the guys have confirmed there is nothing 'mushy' or overly romantic about their relationship.

 

[Why do we fall?]

Guys.... It has a 100% on rotten tomatoes as of right now

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_dark_knight_rises/

 

[Meerski]

Name.
This isn't much of a spoiler but from what I've seen of bane he seems kind of cocky and arrogant. The way he holds his chest peice when walking and stuff. Is he this way in the movie? As does he ever brag about breaking the bat? If so I think it would be a good nod to the comics.

 

[TylerHaslett]

To Name (and also thank you for the previous information!) i myself dont mind spoilers, because reading and the watching experience are two completely different things.

My question is, does Batman ever

Spoiler

show his face to anyone but alfred, while in the costume

 

[TylerHaslett]

Also, to "name that movie"

Spoiler

is bane's teddy bear ever shown, and does he have any links to the teddy bears in begins?

 

[TylerHaslett]

The more I read about the movie's spoilers and plot points, the more I think that this movie isn't going to be all that great. Hope I'm wrong!

you're reading out of context spoilers. i really hope you go into watching the movie knowing that words on a forum, and witnessing it yourself will be very incredible, imax or not. just like how reading someones obituary in the newspaper, and going to a funeral itself are two completely different experiences.
not bashing your thoughts at all, i just hope you really enjoy it. for a few years, i could'nt fully enjoy the dark knight, because all i kept thinking about was Heath Ledger, but now when i watch it i can experience it second by second in a new sort of ray of light

 

[LorenzoVon]

How exactly does bane toy with batman?

 

[not_a_victim]

Ok, a question and a comment...

Question:

Spoiler

How is Bruce Wayne's death explained? What is the official story to what happened to him?

Comment, and I definitely haven't seen anyone talk about this, and it's a biggie to me...

Spoiler

So Batman himself never defeats Bane? Bane puts him our of commission in the first fight, and Selina saves his butt in the second one? I'm going to reserve judgment until I see it, but that renders our hero somewhat impotent, does it not? I mean, he NEVER gets the job done when it comes to Bane. I know Nolan is above cheesy story telling, but for the hero to NOT redeem himself against an enemy that defeated him...I don't know what to think about that...

 

[eal2727]

Name, question. In one the previews there is a quick shot of the well and it looks like about 6 people are either climbing up or falling back down at once. Is this part of the

Spoiler

Prison scene you mentioned where people are trying to escape, or is it earlier with young Talia and young Bane?

 

[Dangerman]

Spoiler

And so with these spoilers you have no choice but to reboot the whole Batman franchise because much like Superman Returns it wrote it's self into a corner unless you do the Superman Returns approach and do vague sequels

 

[Mreah]

Will Bane break Batman's back like in the comics?