The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - - - - - - - - - - Part 19

[Iceman]

Just reading articles that say $43 may be the highest Comcast could go if it wants to still have a "modestly accretive transaction".

 

[Big Bang]

I would argue that Comcast has already succeeded though even if they quit now (which they won't). Disney is spending an extra 20B (albeit not all in stock, but still an extra 20B). That could easily have been used to issue higher dividends, aggressive stock buyback, international growth (think fast growth of disney streaming service, hulu, espn+), theme park growth (20B = DL Chongqing, Texas, New Delhi, and buying up a hefty share of DL Tokyo or DL Japan 2/China 3).

As Comcast will drive the price up even further that will mess up Disney's expansions, stock buyback, and higher dividends plans even more. It'll also take longer for them to deleverage and get a clean balance sheet like they have now.

More or less. No matter what Disney was going to take a hit against any substantive internal investment post acquisition. I think we're already seeing the effects of that with the cancellation of the Star Wars spin off films, and upcoming personnel changes. With this much being spent (considerably more than any previous acquisition), Disney cannot afford any more big failures in its brands than it previously could.

Still, Comcast's attempts are going to have a lingering effect.

 

[Dark Raven]

I would argue that Comcast has already succeeded though even if they quit now (which they won't). Disney is spending an extra 20B (albeit not all in stock, but still an extra 20B). That could easily have been used to issue higher dividends, aggressive stock buyback, international growth (think fast growth of disney streaming service, hulu, espn+), theme park growth (20B = DL Chongqing, Texas, New Delhi, and buying up a hefty share of DL Tokyo or DL Japan 2/China 3).

As Comcast will drive the price up even further that will mess up Disney's expansions, stock buyback, and higher dividends plans even more. It'll also take longer for them to deleverage and get a clean balance sheet like they have now.

I hope Comcast aren't like these bidders on eBay who don't actually want the item but just want to drive up the price... until they actually win the item and then back out of paying and withdraw their bid after it has closed, meaning no-one gets it in the end.

 

[ADollarADay]

More or less. No matter what Disney was going to take a hit against any substantive internal investment post acquisition. I think we're already seeing the effects of that with the cancellation of the Star Wars spin off films, and upcoming personnel changes. With this much being spent (considerably more than any previous acquisition), Disney cannot afford any more big failures in its brands than it previously could.

Still, Comcast's attempts are going to have a lingering effect.

They would have had that opex cost regardless, but now they have to spend another 20B+ in capex. That's pretty damn big and a win for CMCSA.

 

[DyfeddRex]

100% agreed. If they let DP to be released (which is a major event in X-Men lore), then MCU X-Men won't ever get to use it again without looking like they're just recycling old ideas. I hope Disney will buy Fox in time and stop DP from going to the theatre. They can perhaps put it in their streaming service, and because it was Fox who paid for the whole movie, they won't be obligated to try to recoup its investment. MCU X-Men should be done right, and to do that they must not allow Fox X-Men to influence its future any further.

With Thanos, and Ragnarok now, I think Marvel Studios has shown a willingness to long game the big story arcs, doing the payoff at the end. Now, ten, fifteen years from now? Yeah, a finale on an XMen arc of DP would be beautiful, and that is how I see Fiege's crew doing it. Playing the long game, knowing you have to earn the biggest story lines.

 

[GoblinScrier]

With Thanos, and Ragnarok now, I think Marvel Studios has shown a willingness to long game the big story arcs, doing the payoff at the end. Now, ten, fifteen years from now? Yeah, a finale on an XMen arc of DP would be beautiful, and that is how I see Fiege's crew doing it. Playing the long game, knowing you have to earn the biggest story lines.

This is what I had hoped would happen if the Fantastic 4 rights return...I wanted to see Doom elevated as the Thanos of Phases 4 - 6...with Phase 6 culminating with Secret Wars and Doom's total control over the universe/multiverse...then that could be when the MCU goes through a total reboot....

 

[MasterCat]

This is what I had hoped would happen if the Fantastic 4 rights return...I wanted to see Doom elevated as the Thanos of Phases 4 - 6...with Phase 6 culminating with Secret Wars and Doom's total control over the universe/multiverse...then that could be when the MCU goes through a total reboot....

What about Feige's plan? You know, "I would never in a million years advocate rebooting Iron Man... to me it's James Bond, and we can tell stories for decades even with different actors"? Do you want/expect him to be gone for Phase 6 in favor of someone pro-reboot?

 

[GoblinScrier]

What about Feige's plan? You know, "I would never in a million years advocate rebooting Iron Man... to me it's James Bond, and we can tell stories for decades even with different actors"? Do you want/expect him to be gone for Phase 6 in favor of someone pro-reboot?

I can't tell by your tone what you mean if you are attacking my statement or what...all I meant is by the time Phase 6 is over, that will be 20 years roughly after the start of the MCU and figure there would be a big reboot by then since most actors will be probably done by then..

 

[Big Bang]

They would have had that opex cost regardless, but now they have to spend another 20B+ in capex. That's pretty damn big and a win for CMCSA.

The opex they've previously spent had tended to result in positive gains in revenue (with the occasional misstep here or there). Star Wars has been trending negative, and that is something that cannot stand. Not with the amount of capex they are looking to spend. That property is vastly underperforming right now and I fully expect upper management will rectify that sooner than later.

by the time Phase 6 is over, that will be 20 years roughly after the start of the MCU and figure there would be a big reboot by then since most actors will be probably done by then..

They might not even need to. Maybe a soft boot is all that will be necessary. There really won't be a need to restart things given how many different stories there are. That's a bit over the horizon as it stands anyway.

 

[MasterCat]

I can't tell by your tone what you mean if you are attacking my statement or what...all I meant is by the time Phase 6 is over, that will be 20 years roughly after the start of the MCU and figure there would be a big reboot by then since most actors will be probably done by then..

Why does the universe have to be rebooted to change actors?

 

[Detective Conan]

Marvel changed the actors for Rhodey & Bruce Banner and didn't reboot.

 

[MasterCat]

Marvel changed the actors for Rhodey & Bruce Banner and didn't reboot.

Exactly. Besides Iron Man, when will characters even need to be recast?
They have Sebastian Stan locked down for 4 films after Avengers 4.
Chris Hemsworth will do another Thor movie if Marvel Studios wants him. When he does want out, Hercules can replace him as an Avenger (unless they never do Hercules).
Evangeline Lilly will represent the Ant-family for 3 Avengers appearances once Paul Rudd leaves (if her A4 appearance is legally a cameo). Plus Cassie Lang will grow up.
Boseman will demand too much money after Black Panther 2 & Avengers 5 (he only contracted for 5 films), but does anyone actually love T'Challa/Chadwick Boseman, or just the concept of Wakanda and its superhero monarch? IOW, legacy or recast?
Carol Danvers can be replaced by Monica Rambeau after Brie Larson makes 6 appearances.

 

[Iceman]

A reboot would be a huge risk. You have something that has turned into the most lucrative project in cinematic history with unlimited potential. And if upon reboot audiences aren't quite as up for it suddenly the momentum is lost and things can change very quickly and many of those glorious plans get shelved like we've seen with Star Wars, Sony Spidey films, the Fox X & F4 films and the DCEU. I think it's the ongoing universe that has got people hooked, even when a fair number of the films don't really have a lot of crossover and merely exist in the same space, and it is that that needs to continue regardless of which actors want to retire or which characters are killed off.

 

[MasterCat]

I agree, Iceman. They should recast Peter Parker when Tom Holland wants out, recast Iron Man, and otherwise keep running with cycling heroes (BuckyCap, ShuriPanther?, Hercules, different female Captain Marvel, Nova) until MCU films actually lose money.

 

[KBX]

Marvel changed the actors for Rhodey & Bruce Banner and didn't reboot.

Not the best of analogies. This wasn’t by choice by contract disputes as well as the actors that replaced them haven’t been the lead in any movie.

 

[The Infernal]

Not sure, but I think Feige has alluded to potentially recasting the big names when it comes time to move on. However I can imagine them killing off certain characters like Iron-man just because RDJ embodies that version of the character so much. That way they could return a few movies later due to whatever macguffin with a new actor.

 

[Detective Conan]

Not the best of analogies. This wasn’t by choice by contract disputes as well as the actors that replaced them haven’t been the lead in any movie.

My point still stands. Just focus on new characters and retire the old characters long enough for the audience to finally accept a new actor in the role. Marvel has shown willingness to recast when the situation calls for it(be it contract disputes, or an actor simply choosing not to reprise a role for whatever reason). If the actor gets too old for the role or wants to leave then the solution is not to reboot but place more emphasis on other characters so you can supplant the old dogs as the centerpiece of the brand then bid your time until enough time has passed to recast those roles.

The smart thing Marvel are doing is not over-relying on familiar faces like Iron Man and Captain America but swinging for the fences by betting on the next generation of characters. Black Panther alone made more money than any Iron Man film. So now with the new characters like BP and Captain Marvel(which will be a hit) they have the luxury to let established characters like Iron Man rest a bit before they revisit those characters again using different actors. It’s a win-win for Marvel.

 

[Kuwolski]

A reboot would be a huge risk. You have something that has turned into the most lucrative project in cinematic history with unlimited potential. And if upon reboot audiences aren't quite as up for it suddenly the momentum is lost and things can change very quickly and many of those glorious plans get shelved like we've seen with Star Wars, Sony Spidey films, the Fox X & F4 films and the DCEU. I think it's the ongoing universe that has got people hooked, even when a fair number of the films don't really have a lot of crossover and merely exist in the same space, and it is that that needs to continue regardless of which actors want to retire or which characters are killed off.

I actually think the MCU would be due for a reboot in 10-15 years, especially if iconic charactes have been killed off. What if Cap dies, we never get the OG again? Feige says he envisions the MCU going on indefinitely, but he's entitled to change his mind. Plus he won't be running the show forever anyway, eventually new leadership will take over.

 

[MasterCat]

They don't need the Iron Man franchise until Black Panther finishes, but as far as a coherent universe, Iron Man technology suddenly disappearing would look stupid. I don't know how they plan to get around that.

 

[Protar]

They don't need the Iron Man franchise until Black Panther finishes, but as far as a coherent universe, Iron Man technology suddenly disappearing would look stupid. I don't know how they plan to get around that.

They can still have Stark tech feature in the films. If Stark dies, obviously that would explain why we're not seeing his tech as much anymore, but he could stick around in retirement, leaving the possibility open for cameos. Imagine seeing RDJ's Iron Man again for the first time in a decade.

 

[2kt09]

They don't need the Iron Man franchise until Black Panther finishes, but as far as a coherent universe, Iron Man technology suddenly disappearing would look stupid. I don't know how they plan to get around that.

BP's not the only other corner involving guys with advanced tech. They get around the loss of the guy who's known for this sort of stuff by having those other guys take over his limelight. What else is even left beyond the liquid metal suit?

 

[The Infernal]

Well Stark Tech wouldn't disappear. What's already built still exists. Plus Pepper would likely still be running the company and developing tech (though arguably with not the same brilliance). There's also Black Panther and other heroes like Spider-man and Banner and some villains too.

That and not every film needs to feature advanced tech, but it wouldn't disappear. Maybe less prominent.

 

[MasterCat]

They can still have Stark tech feature in the films. If Stark dies, obviously that would explain why we're not seeing his tech as much anymore,

That doesn't make for coherent worldbuilding. An analogy would be if a Hollywood studio made movies about Henry Ford as a motorist who fights crime, then went back to making Westerns when the Henry Ford actor quit instead of continuing to include cars in their movies.
A coherent universe calls for armed flying robots to be at least as prominent in post-Robert Downey America.

but he could stick around in retirement, leaving the possibility open for cameos. Imagine seeing RDJ's Iron Man again for the first time in a decade.

That's the demand I dread them giving into instead of letting Tony Stark be James Bond: an RDJ tease that costs Disney more than a million dollars per minute.

 

[Yowza]

You guys are such professional experts on this I might as well not comment.

[BLACKOUT]Yeah. I think this could be it until the shareholder meeting but I'm just guessing like everyone else unless Comcast places a higher bid for Sky or something.[/BLACKOUT]

 

[Iceman]

I actually think the MCU would be due for a reboot in 10-15 years, especially if iconic charactes have been killed off. What if Cap dies, we never get the OG again? Feige says he envisions the MCU going on indefinitely, but he's entitled to change his mind. Plus he won't be running the show forever anyway, eventually new leadership will take over.

Have there been many film series that were rebooted while successful?