The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - Part 4

[Willie Lumpkin]

they feel a cinematic universe lead by Doctor Strange, Captain Marvel, and Black Panther aren't good enough to lead a new chapter of the MCU.

I would personally have a problem with that. Sure, if they're great films, I'll probably check them out, but the characters don't interest me as much as other Marvel characters. With those characters, they would have to be great films.

With Hulk, Iron-Man or Spider-man, I'm going to show up even if the reviews aren't that great because I like the characters.

There's a big advantage to working with characters that people know and like - which is probably the reason Marvel is introducing Black Panther in Civil War rather than just starting him in his own film. They hope movie-goers will get to know him and like him in that film so they'll come back for more - even though at the moment most people don't know or care who Black Panther is.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

How about Fox lending Trank's FF cast to Marvel where they end up in a universe where FFINO was actually successful and warmly received, and all the FFINO defenders had their day in the sun? Would they want to go back to their own world after that?

Imagine a scene in which Ben goes back and forth. In the Foxverse he's shocked to find he has no d***, then he comes back to the MCU and it's there.

 

[ernesth100]

I wouldn't be surprised to see (at some point and it could come in bits and pieces) a Sony-type team-up that would give Marvel use of FF characters who would be integrated into the MCU while also setting up future crossovers with X-Men, Deadpool etc. that would have the Fox characters on an alternate Earth.

Exactly as long as they abandon and reboot Tranks F4 when(really if) it happens I'm cool.

 

[jaymes_e06]

It's funny how many different views on "camp" one sees on this board. To me camp is like the Schumacher Batman films, or even something like the new Lex Luthor. Exaggerated and overacted above the norm for the genre.

Admittedly that might have been the wrong word. Quippy to the point it breaks character?

I imagine it as something like this:

Let's say Fox has an idea for a story in which the Hulk would be transported to the X-Men world for some mayhem and fun. Marvel would 'lend' Hulk to them but both studios would have a basic understanding of who Hulk is and his character should be consistent. Fox would show Marvel the script for sign-off and commentary and if there were any concerns with how the character was being portrayed, they would work that out prior to shooting.

Similarly if Wolverine was going to appear in an Iron-Man film, Marvel would show Fox the script prior to shooting and change anything that Fox felt needed to be changed before proceeding.

Some of the 'culture shock' would be an interesting part of the stories. Wolverine actually being accepted as a 'superhero' in the Marvel world rather than being a freak could provide an interesting story-line and conflict. Would he want to return to his world or stay there? If he is forced to go back to his world through some set of events, could that create some interesting conflict and stories for future films?

I feel if they do a merger they need to do it all the way though and not a multiverse as those always feel shoehorned in to me. I would rather see Marvel's version of the characters presented with Fox taking a cut.

The whole draw is making it as close to the source as possible and mutants are apart of the Marvel landscape. If they just have them come from another universe it defeats the purpose.

 

[jaymes_e06]

Imagine a scene in which Ben goes back and forth. In the Foxverse he's shocked to find he has no d***, then he comes back to the MCU and it's there.

Or he yanks it off of the real Things....



Thing.

 

[Dark Raven]

Imagine a scene in which Ben goes back and forth. In the Foxverse he's shocked to find he has no d***, then he comes back to the MCU and it's there.

It's like all these issues or episodes of FF cartoons, or even the first Story FF movie where Ben is cured of being the Thing. But then he has to make the ultimate sacrifice to save his team mates and become the Thing again.

In this case, he'd have to sacrifice having a thing to save his team mates.

 

[Endeavor]

Countdown continues:
https://fncd.net/v?id=rTHR-PD

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Countdown continues:
https://fncd.net/v?id=rTHR-PD

I was looking for that earlier. We'll have to keep posting it so it's always on the active page of this thread.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Admittedly that might have been the wrong word. Quippy to the point it breaks character?


I feel if they do a merger they need to do it all the way though and not a multiverse as those always feel shoehorned in to me. I would rather see Marvel's version of the characters presented with Fox taking a cut.

I think the thing with most multiverses is we know the 'real' world and then they throw in some goofy alternate variation.

I think this one would be particularly interesting because we've seen both sides so they're both 'real' to us.

 

[Mike5575]

I would personally have a problem with that. Sure, if they're great films, I'll probably check them out, but the characters don't interest me as much as other Marvel characters. With those characters, they would have to be great films.

With Hulk, Iron-Man or Spider-man, I'm going to show up even if the reviews aren't that great because I like the characters.

There's a big advantage to working with characters that people know and like - which is probably the reason Marvel is introducing Black Panther in Civil War rather than just starting him in his own film. They hope movie-goers will get to know him and like him in that film so they'll come back for more - even though at the moment most people don't know or care who Black Panther is.

Had Iron Man 1 not been a great film, then the character wouldn't have been as popular as he is today. So, I fail to see your point. Ant-Man made over $500 million and nobody knew who he was. So, it's not all that important to introduce a new character in an ensemble movie first.

You mentioned Iron Man as one of your favorites, yet he was a B-lister at best before the MCU. Popularity in the comics really doesn't matter. Marvel is confident enough in their films that people will watch a brand new hero in their own movie first and they will make lots of money.

I'm just saying you should probably give these characters a chance before you judge them.

 

[Zarex]

Countdown continues:
https://fncd.net/v?id=rTHR-PD

There was a 19 month separation between the Phase III announcement and next month's release of CA:CW, and I suspect there may be a similar length of time between announcement and execution in Phase IV. With the highly anticipated film "Marvel Untitled Movie" kicking off Phase IV on May 1, 2020, that would put the announcement date sometime in the fall of 2018.

I wouldn't be shocked if we get hints at either this year's Comicon or next year's D23. But it's not all doom and gloom if we don't.

 

[ernesth100]

The fact remains Fox understands X-Men and does not understand F4. They act as if they're not still gonna be the owner of the characters if they do merge. They'll still make money, hell even more with Iron Man and the rest of the MCU in frame. They'll still have rights to do films and stuff. It'll just take place in the MCU and they'll have the input of Feige aka the Marvel God.

There's way more pros to a merger than there are cons. And all the lore of the past of MCU and Xverse stays the same as well! It's perfect!

Literally the only thing they need to do is faithfully and successfully reboot the F4. And once thats done..,it's done.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Had Iron Man 1 not been a great film, then the character wouldn't have been as popular as he is today. So, I fail to see your point. Ant-Man made over $500 million and nobody knew who he was. So, it's not all that important to introduce a new character in an ensemble movie first.

You mentioned Iron Man as one of your favorites, yet he was a B-lister at best before the MCU. Popularity in the comics really doesn't matter. Marvel is confident enough in their films that people will watch a brand new hero in their own movie first and they will make lots of money.

I'm just saying you should probably give these characters a chance before you judge them.

When it comes to spending my time and money, I'd rather spend it seeing things that interest me than things that don't. For a while, when there weren't very many Superhero films out there, I'd go to just about every one. But now it's getting to the point that there are new superhero films every few weeks.

I'm not a Dr. Strange fan and I probably won't be going to that one. I'll probably eventually see it on video, but I'm not going to go to the theater on opening weekend just because it's a Marvel film.

Just like I wouldn't go see a Baby Huey film just because I like comic books.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

There was a 19 month separation between the Phase III announcement and next month's release of CA:CW, and I suspect there may be a similar length of time between announcement and execution in Phase IV. With the highly anticipated film "Marvel Untitled Movie" kicking off Phase IV on May 1, 2020, that would put the announcement date sometime in the fall of 2018.

I wouldn't be shocked if we get hints at either this year's Comicon or next year's D23. But it's not all doom and gloom if we don't.

The reason I don't think they'd sit on it for an extended period is it's hard to keep a secret that long.

If there is something going on, more and more people will be knowing about it with each passing day, and eventually it would get out in the form of rumors from different sources.

I think they'd rather announce it on their terms and get some publicity out of it rather than waiting until it trickles out.

 

[Endeavor]

There was a 19 month separation between the Phase III announcement and next month's release of CA:CW, and I suspect there may be a similar length of time between announcement and execution in Phase IV. With the highly anticipated film "Marvel Untitled Movie" kicking off Phase IV on May 1, 2020, that would put the announcement date sometime in the fall of 2018.

I wouldn't be shocked if we get hints at either this year's Comicon or next year's D23. But it's not all doom and gloom if we don't.

Well, I wouldn't be devastated if they don't say it, but I think there's at least a decent chance that they'll do the reveal in SDCC.
The phase 3 announcement and how it came about was because of a lot of reasons that included contract finalizations (which prevented them from announcing things in SDCC) and probably even direct competition to the DC announcements.
I don't think it's something we need to take as a formula that Marvel is going to follow going forward. At least that's not how I interpreted that event.

 

[ernesth100]

Marvel does not have issues keeping things secret for periods of time. They kept Spideys design secret until the trailer revealed it and no fanart even came close to what it was. So...yeah if they did get the F4 back I can believe they can keep it underwraps as long as they want.

 

[jaymes_e06]

When it comes to spending my time and money, I'd rather spend it seeing things that interest me than things that don't. For a while, when there weren't very many Superhero films out there, I'd go to just about every one. But now it's getting to the point that there are new superhero films every few weeks.

I'm not a Dr. Strange fan and I probably won't be going to that one. I'll probably eventually see it on video, but I'm not going to go to the theater on opening weekend just because it's a Marvel film.

Just like I wouldn't go see a Baby Huey film just because I like comic books.

This.

And to Mike:[YT]eMF5MjzgJrM[/YT]

 

[Dasher10]

While I don't agree on your opinion on the FF4, I def agree with your statement there. People need to stop acting like comic popularity dictates the MCU and how it takes shape. Marvel already proved with properties like Guardians of the Galaxy and Jessica Jones that being obscure doesn't matter as long as there's potential for great storytelling. And with Black Panther, Doctor Strange, Captain Marvel, Luke Cage and Iron Fist all charting new ground, I can't wait!



Nobody loved Black Panther for decades, and he's getting his own movie. Nobody loved Carol Danvers for decades, and she's getting her own movie (and she still doesn't have a defining comic run!). Jessica Jones had one acclaimed run, and is now being turned into a multi-season tv show.

The Inhumans have two successful runs, the intial run with Jack Kirby and the 12-issue miniseries. Clearly, Marvel sees potential in these characters. The only shoving down the throats is the Nuhumans, which people see as threatening to the X-men. The movie version will be about the Royal Family. People will be def be more open to that.

Actually, that isn't true. BP was big under Don McGregor in the 1970s and Christopher Priest in the late 90s/early 2000s. Hudlin's run in the mid-late 2000s wasn't as much of a success but it still sold well. CM had three successful runs. First was under Chris Claremont which was only canceled due to the events of Avengers #200, then there was Brian Reed's run, then Kelly Sue DeConnick's. All were well-regarded.

Carol was also a major player in the Kurt Busiek, Geoff Johns and Brian Bendis Avengers runs and BP was a key Avenger back during the Roy Thomas run. Don't pretend like either of those characters have struggled to find an audience as much as the Inhumans have.

 

[Darth_Spock]

The reason I don't think they'd sit on it for an extended period is it's hard to keep a secret that long.

If there is something going on, more and more people will be knowing about it with each passing day, and eventually it would get out in the form of rumors from different sources.

I think they'd rather announce it on their terms and get some publicity out of it rather than waiting until it trickles out.

Fascinating!
This would be logical.

 

[Dasher10]

People don't want the F4 back because they think everything else sucks, people want the F4 back because they are a big chunk out of the middle of the Marvel Universe that Marvel don't have access to. They don't have the X-Men either, but they have often been off in their own corner so their exclusion has less impact but the F4 film rights bring a lot of characters with them that will help the MCU. Heck, it includes two characters big enough to be the antagonists for an entire Phase. The rights include the Silver Surfer and his characters, thats a lot of cosmic characters including Galactus, it would give Marvel full control of the Skrulls. Basically Marvel would have no limits to how they could expand the MCU Cosmically.

Then there are the F4 rights themselves who bring Doctor Doom, a guy who could serve as a villain for the characters of an entire Phase. In the comics they introduced the Inhumans, Namor, they served as a natural link between the Earth based and Cosmic characters. So its not that people think that the other characters are bad, its that having the F4 added opens up the possibilities of the MCU immensely.

There are still some X-Men characters that Fox have that Marvel could use, namely the Shi'Ar and Brood alien races who can be used in Guardians sequels, GW Bridge and Abigail Brand who can be used in Agents of SHIELD, Henry Peter Gyrich has major connections to the Avengers and Juggernaut who can be used for Doctor Strange, Hulk, Spider-Man and Thunderbolts. Even then, some of the characters that Marvel own have been X-Men like Spider-Man, Captain Marvel and Deathlok, while many of the X-Men characters have joined the Avengers like Storm, Beast, Wolverine, Rogue, Deadpool, Havok, Cable and of course, Quicksilver.

I mean, Marvel would get more back with the FF, but don't pretend like there aren't certain characters who Marvel would want back with the X-Men.

Now with the FF, Marvel get some really major villains back like Blaastar, Annihilus, Skrulls, Doom, Galactus and Kang. Especially the latter who's the obvious choice for an Avengers villain for Phase 4. Look at who the other options are. High Evolutionary, Namor, Green Goblin and Lord Templar are all minor-league players compared to Kang. So that's definitely the priority but don't pretend like Marvel wouldn't work out a deal to share the X-Men.

 

[TheVileOne]

Imagine a scene in which Ben goes back and forth. In the Foxverse he's shocked to find he has no d***, then he comes back to the MCU and it's there.

Brody in Mallrats would love that.

 

[jaymes_e06]

^I understood that refrence.

 

[ernesth100]

So if they get the F4 back does anyone really wanna see Doom again? We've seen him in all 4 films. Maybe a new villain is in order like Mole Man, Annihlus, or even Kang. There's alot of other interesting F4 rogues they can do.

 

[Endeavor]

So if they get the F4 back does anyone really wanna see Doom again? We've seen him in all 4 films. Maybe a new villain is in order like Mole Man, Annihlus, or even Kang. There's alot of other interesting F4 rogues they can do.

See him again? Of course! But not as the main baddie for their first MCU outing.
He should be a background threat that gets built up and hyped over several movies. But in order to do that he has to be introduced early on. If not when the 4 first show up then soon after.

 

[Mike5575]

There are still some X-Men characters that Fox have that Marvel could use, namely the Shi'Ar and Brood alien races who can be used in Guardians sequels

The sole purpose of the brood is for Carol Danvers to pummel them into oblivion.