The Rebooted "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) Thread - Part 4

[Eddie]

The Simon Kinberg thing is noise. He's an idiot and I'm not particularly worried about his latest ramblings. Let's focus on the good sign: Marvel cast MBJ. They avoid casting actors that are actively doing another Marvel franchise. There's a reason Fassbender and Jackman aren't in the MCU yet. With the Inhumans news (it's still planned to release, just not in phase 3) I'm wondering if we'll see four explorers take a trip to Attilan in Phase Four...

 

[Dasher10]

... And dropping this again, because I refuse to let Simple Simon crush my hopes:
https://fncd.net/v?id=rTHR-PD

Hope is gone. Fox are going to push out a sequel that while more true to the source material, has an even lower budget just to hold on to the rights which means fewer scenes with Ben, less action and probably a human enemy like the Red Ghost, Wizard or Mad Thinker.

And if it's the former, expect the Super Apes to just be trained chimps and not have the CGI facial expressions that the Planet of the Apes chimps have.

 

[Dark Raven]

That's what people seem to be forgetting here: that MBJ is cast in Black Panther. How could he do FFINO 2 now? Is he even going to want to even if there were the chance?

 

[DarknessOfDeath]

I will be happy once X-Men and FF go home to Marvel. I will be a happy fan like many others. I just hope Marvel doesn't wait too long.

 

[jaymes_e06]

It won't be any time soon so...

 

[Eddie]

Fox is probably not doing a sequel. They lost tens of millions of dollars on the last one AFTER home video sales, they just had their Torch cast in an MCU film, they're trying to mend fences with Marvel (TV co-production stuff, Deadpool's actually getting a bit of film tie-in merch), and it simply makes more sense to reboot. Now a reboot without Marvel would be a disaster, but the Russos DID say it would be cool to be able to use the Fantastic Four once, and they're the guys that thought it woyld be really neat the get Spider-Man into their Captain America movie...

 

[Chip Chipperson]

I think it'll happen one day, but we'll all be old and frail

I'll have my grandkids take me to see A vs X!

 

[Owl]

If the rumors about Fox not having rights to any format of a tv show were true, along with the meeting between Marvel and Fox, then it would be easy to assume that certain properties from Fox were traded to get those TV rights. It's possible that what went down was the same deal that Sony had received, yet it's doubtful that Fox would let Marvel get anywhere near the X-verse and more likely there was a buyout off the Fantastic 4.

Also, I wonder if Inhumane was pulled due to phase 3 overcrowding or something else. I'm sure we'll find out at SDCC.

 

[DarknessOfDeath]

I don't want to wait too long. Im in my early thirties and...I just wish Fox would give up already.

 

[Eddie]

X-Men may take a while. Realistically Fantastic Four should have a major status change within the next seven years. They either reboot it or it reverts. In a post Spider-Man in Civil War world Fox will have a helluva time convincing audiences to see any reboot that doesn't have that MCU hook. They thought the fans killed any hype for the last one they made...

 

[Tilapia]

The Kinbergstic 4, written, directed, and starring Simon Kinberg playing every character, grossing 10$ at the box office from Simon Kinberg's receipt. That's what I hope we get for this sequel if it is to be made.

 

[ernesth100]

Michael B. Jordan is in MCU now strange enough.

 

[TheVileOne]

There's no way Fox is ever making a sequel to this movie. It's damaged goods now.

 

[ADollarADay]

In regards to the "X-Men TV rights rights for the FF movie rights" trade, I believe I read somewhere that since Marvel's TV and Film divisions are separate, you can't simply trade for one to have the other. Fox's TV side worked out a deal with Marvel's TV side to do X-Men TV shows. Marvel is sure to get a cut of the money from it in exchange. Trust me, if Marvel Studios somehow got the rights back to the FF, we would have heard about it. Feige would have made a point to bring it up in the press run for Civil War.

Not saying Marvel has the rights, but if they did, that strategy would be the last they would follow. Think about it. Marvel got the rights late last year after allowing Fox to develop a couple of shows or whatever, it was already too late to integrate any of its members into CW without looking like an obvious shoe-in. They come out and say they have it anyways, GA goes and watches CW which has amazing new characters, character development of old characters, and a great story. Fans will still start wondering, man how would it look if FF was there? Can you imagine a Hulk vs Thing? What about Spidey vs Johnny Storm? Oh man, etc etc.

As others mentioned, if they have it, one of the best places to announce would be at comic con.

I don't think a Sony deal would work for the FF. Spidey moves over $1billion in merchandise annually, so Marvel was motivated to keep Peter as the world's most popular superhero. And even with his recent BO struggles, Spidey is still a cinematic A lister. His presence in Marvel films helps the BO.

As I have mentioned before, unless Marvel is playing the long game and getting the full rights back to spidey, they have given more than I would expect from any Sony subsidiary, ever. That's without counting the rumors and my personal conjectures on it. Anyways, you're right, FF would not get Marvel to give up close to what they did for SM, and at this point (or rather post Fan4stic), they would not give up a lot for them IMHO.

To answer your question, no I don't think Marvel is going to Fox asking to work a deal for the Fantastic Four. Even if they did, Fox would turn them down I believe. Fox and Marvel, or even more importantly Fox and Disney, do not have a good relationship. Rumors are abound that the two companies flat out hate each other. One of the things that always comes to my mind is how Fox is probably pissed that Disney got Star Wars and they didn't. I just don't believe these two companies would ever get along. The only way I see Marvel getting FF back is if the rights revert. That's going to take Fox from completely giving up and I don't think the egos at Fox are willing to do that. They have 4 years to come up with a new plan on the FF and I bet they will figure out a way. They probably know that Marvel would make it work and are not wanting their biggest competitor to get a chance at it. I hope I'm wrong but Fox is too pigheaded to let the rights revert.

Fox execs have mentioned at one point how they wish they could have made a play (for star wars) and how disappointed they were that Lucas didn't at least let them know so they could get in the game. They do have the consolation that they will have SW IV: ANH in perpetuity unless a deal is worked with Disney. I would laugh hard if Disney pulled the chair from under them again and purchased TWX. Hah.

Fox is probably not doing a sequel. They lost tens of millions of dollars on the last one AFTER home video sales, they just had their Torch cast in an MCU film, they're trying to mend fences with Marvel (TV co-production stuff, Deadpool's actually getting a bit of film tie-in merch), and it simply makes more sense to reboot. Now a reboot without Marvel would be a disaster, but the Russos DID say it would be cool to be able to use the Fantastic Four once, and they're the guys that thought it woyld be really neat the get Spider-Man into their Captain America movie...

Someone on this forum, I think, mentioned that there is only one or two merchs that are based off the movie (which Fox would get a percentage of the revenue). Supposedly, everything else is based off the comics, which Fox wouldn't see a dime. I don't remember which merch was based on the movie, or how he knew it was just that one or two, but when I look around deadpool merchandise, I haven't seen any that I said, "that's definitely based off the movie" like I have with CW and BvS.

 

[ernesth100]

There's no way Fox is ever making a sequel to this movie. It's damaged goods now.

I dunno, this is Fox, if they kept going after X-Men: Origins I'm thinking that Fant4stic isn't gonna stop them from making more films just to spite Marvel. Which doesn't make sense since they would make so much more money with Marvel in a Sony like deal.


But their atleast gonna finish the Fox-Verse X-Men series. Imma give it until after Infinity Wars to be announced. If it's not done by then then I guess we really aint gettin them in MCU.

 

[Eddie]

Most of the Deadpool merch is comic branded, yeah, but the fact that a couple of things aren't (including a very expensive collector figure later this year) is significant. Marvel is under no obligation to make any of the merch movie based (in fact, it's better for their bottom line if it's comic based), but they're doing some premium figures. The last few X-Men films received a lone Hot Toys figure, but at least two Deadpool toys were film toys. That's an improvement.

 

[Eddie]

I would hope they're over the Marvel spite since they're actively working with Marvel on television shows that Marvel didn't have to allow...

 

[TheVileOne]

I dunno, this is Fox, if they kept going after X-Men: Origins I'm thinking that Fant4stic isn't gonna stop them from making more films just to spite Marvel. Which doesn't make sense since they would make so much more money with Marvel in a Sony like deal.


But their atleast gonna finish the Fox-Verse X-Men series. Imma give it until after Infinity Wars to be announced. If it's not done by then then I guess we really aint gettin them in MCU.

That's not even in the same wheelhouse. That film still made $180 million domestic and $373 million worldwide. That's still more than First Class.

I'm not saying they wouldn't make another movie but they will never make a sequel to 2015. Impossible.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

There's no way Fox is ever making a sequel to this movie. It's damaged goods now.

I believe this is the plain, simple truth. We don't know the exact details - Will Marvel make a big announcement at Comic-con, or will the rights quietly revert back to Marvel several years from now? Will Marvel get the rights completely, or will it be a sharing deal? - but I'm as sure that Fox won't make another film by themselves as I am that the sun will come up tomorrow.

I believe anybody who can't see that is letting their emotions get the better of them and not applying common sense. Fox isn't evil. They're just a company that makes bad Marvel films. They exist to make money, and while their management may be foolish at times, anyone with an IQ above 50 can recognize there's no value left for the FF in Fox's hands.

Let's not let idiots like Kinberg allow us to take our eyes off the ball and ignore the obvious.

Good things are ahead and I'm looking forward to watching them unfold.

 

[Knight_SV]

Kinberg.... this guy really a hack...
my pa on seeing XMA will get post-poned it seems

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

We should probably pay a little more attention to the HBO release.

Last fall, we all knew Fox would pretend they were working on a sequel and pretend the film wasn't a complete disaster at least through the home video release. So we weren't surprised when they pretended they were interested in a sequel even though anyone with common sense knew they weren't

I had assumed by April/May, there would be no reason to pretend anymore and that's why these comments seem a little odd and surprising.

But the reality is, they're still trying to push this movie. They're getting money from HBO and they need to service that customer and continue to pretend this film wasn't a complete disaster at least through the HBO prime showings.

 

[Tilapia]

Pushing a ****** film on HBO? A network that Fox doesn't even own? That's a stretch. Kinberg is trolling fans again. They won't be able to get any high profile talent to this film. Why do you think MBJ was announced the same week in the MCU? He ain't coming back to this franchise. Neither is Teller. Mara probably goes back to TV, but it hardly matters. No one with any talent or credibility is touching this thing.

 

[Mike5575]

There are times that I just want Fox to die. If Marvel ever gets rights back to F4, I don't see Marvel integrating them back into the MCU right away like Spider-Man. They're damaged goods.

 

[SyntaxError]

Seriously - there is no way in hell F4-2 is happening now. Michael B. Jordan would never have been able to sign on to a competing studio's super-hero flick unless BOTH Marvel and Fox know that a sequel isn't happening.

Think about it. Why would Marvel cast MBJ in another superhero movie unless they were assured that he would not star as the Human Torch anymore? There are numerous great actors out there that could have played the role but they cast MBJ anyways. They would never cast him if he was still signed on to star in another superhero franchise; would confuse filmgoers.

Me thinks the deal is done, because Marvel is clearly sure that a sequel isn't happening.

Kinsberg is not a studio exec.

 

[Orba]

I've seen people suggesting this, and there's no truth to it.

The management of the TV divisions and film divisions report to higher level management and that higher level management has the final say in the purchasing or selling of assets.

If (just as a crazy example) Disney was considering selling their Animal Kingdom theme park to Universal, it wouldn't be the Animal Kingdom manager who could decide to sell or not. That would be a decision made much higher up the chain.

You wouldn't have low-level people who have a stake in one asset but not the other making a decision like that.

Yeah never understood this one. The idea that Fox didn't need to make a deal with Marvel Studios and instead made one with Marvel itself (and the TV division). The biggest issue with this idea is that it would have meant that Fox did a deal with Ike Perlmutter, the guy that had images with the Fantastic Four removed from the walls of Marvel offices, who had the characters removed from Marvel merchandise, and who had the Fantastic Four comic cancelled. Perlmutter hates Fox, he is believed to have gotten in the way when it came to previous attempts at deals with Fox. There is no way he would be interested in doing a deal with Fox for the X-Men TV rights in return for some cash.