The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion & Speculation Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 32

[Nevincer]

Batarangs>Mystery Weapon.

 

[batbax]

Yeah, TDK sucks because there aren't enough batarangs...and bats...and smoke bombs...



Just had a brain aneurysm :/

Sarcasm aside, I would agree about Batman's detective skills being practically non existant.


EDIT: Let's start bashing the
weapon Bats is holding in the trailer before we even know what it
does!

Yeah I can't really get behind someone not liking these movies because batman don't throw a couple batarangs. Jesus. However, his detective aspect being somewhat absent does kinda bother me. That's a rather big character trait. And if Miranda is who Miranda is rumored to be and gets a cushy Job at WE, it looks line his detective skills haven't developed at all since tdk either.

 

[The_Raganork]

I can understand someone's disappointment with the lack of Batman mystique in a Batman film.

It's a similar issue to what most people had complaints with in Casino Royale...No gadgets, No catchphrases...All the things they felt made up James Bond were missing.

I don't personally agree but I understand the thought process.

 

[kit1982]

EDIT: Let's start bashing the weapon Bats is holding in the trailer before we even know what it does!

I'm purely talking about how it looks, we've seen High res images of it aswell as briefly seeing it on screen, thats more than enough to form an opinion of it's look. Don't know how I can stress anymore I'm not against this weapon or it's use in the story, just that it LOOKS abit underwhelming. I'm also personally not bothered about the lack of gadgets, just that the few that have been used have lacked a certain aethetic oomph IMO.

 

[The_Fire_Rises]

I can understand someone's disappointment with the lack of Batman mystique in a Batman film.

It's a similar issue to what most people had complaints with in Casino Royale...No gadgets, No catchphrases...All the things they felt made up James Bond were missing.

I don't personally agree but I understand the thought process.

Fair enough. I guess it goes back to whether you enjoy the more realistic approach of Nolan's films or a more comics based approach.

 

[Travesty]

Yeah, TDK sucks because there aren't enough batarangs...and bats...and smoke bombs...



Just had a brain aneurysm :/

It's one of the many reasons why it's my least favorite, not the main driving force towards my complete disappointment for it.

EDIT: Let's start bashing the weapon Bats is holding in the trailer before we even know what it does!

Who is bashing the new gadget?

 

[The_Raganork]

I'm purely talking about how it looks, we've seen High res images of it aswell as briefly seeing it on screen, thats more than enough to form an opinion of it's look. Don't know how I can stress anymore I'm not against this weapon or it's use in the story, just that it LOOKS abit underwhelming. I'm also not bothered about the lack of gadgets, just that the few that have been used have lacked a certain aethetic oomph.

I understand what you're saying and my point about the Batarang was that if you had seen it for the first time in TDKR the way we're seeing the mystery gadget I'm not sure anyone would be overwhelmed with its look.

I think Batarangs are cool but I don't think their designs are particularly more interesting than that mystery weapon.

Their functionality ultimately is what sold them, to me.

 

[The_Raganork]

Fair enough. I guess it goes back to whether you enjoy the more realistic approach of Nolan's films or a more comics based approach.

I don't think the divide is there. Batman could still have his gadgets in these film and keep the 'realistic' tone.

Whatever the reason Chris has kept the gadgets out are his own, it doesn't personally bother me. I still feel that Batman is Batman in these films

 

[Nevincer]

I can understand someone's disappointment with the lack of Batman mystique in a Batman film.

It's a similar issue to what most people had complaints with in Casino Royale...No gadgets, No catchphrases...All the things they felt made up James Bond were missing.

I don't personally agree but I understand the thought process.

Cool, well at least you get it. I was impressed how they handled the mystique in BB, making us believe in it, but TDK/Post-TDK for me it was like they took it a step too far, where for me it almost felt devoid of it. Which didn't make me dislike TDK, still a stunning film, just as a fan of it's predecessor I was left somewhat disillusioned at these aspects before I came to accept them.

 

[kit1982]

I understand what you're saying and my point about the Batarang was that if you had seen it for the first time in TDKR the way we're seeing the mystery gadget I'm not sure anyone would be overwhelmed with its look.

I think Batarangs are cool but I don't think their designs are particularly more interesting than that mystery weapon.

Their functionality ultimately is what sold them, to me.

Thats fair do's and I can see what your saying (although I disagree). It's just one of those where we'll just agree to disagree. opinions eh!

 

[Sionis]

how is his detective side not shown in TDK? anyone remember the whole forensics-shattered-bullet-fingerprint-scene? if that and the hong kong scene, which actually showed you how batman set up his attack, executed it, and escaped, isn't enough for you, then i'm sorry.... but you're not going to get a damn CSI episode in a Nolan movie.

 

[Nevincer]

TDK expanded on the detective aspect. No question about that.

 

[The_Raganork]

how is his detective side not shown in TDK? anyone remember the whole forensics-shattered-bullet-fingerprint-scene? if that and the hong kong scene, which actually showed you how batman set up his attack, executed it, and escaped, isn't enough for you, then i'm sorry.... but you're not going to get a damn CSI episode in a Nolan movie.

That's the whole point. Some people would like to see more detective elements in these films and Nolan is going to deliver. So their preferences aren't being catered to and so they have a legitimate complaints.

Nolan's film are most certainly not all encompassing of the Batman Mythos (I'm not sure anything could ever be) so some fan's ideas of Batman are going to be left out unfortunately.

So again, the complaint is legitimate and not a knock on Nolan.

 

[KRIM]

how is his detective side not shown in TDK? anyone remember the whole forensics-shattered-bullet-fingerprint-scene? if that and the hong kong scene, which actually showed you how batman set up his attack, executed it, and escaped, isn't enough for you, then i'm sorry.... but you're not going to get a damn CSI episode in a Nolan movie.

The last two Sherlock Holmes movies are hardly CSI episodes or even anything remotely deeply intelligent. Yet with only a handful of scenes and thanks to Downey's informed performance, Sherlock easily shines due to his deductive prowess. You don't need to dedicate the entire film to his intellectual capacity in order to present it convincingly. Even people in the lowest common denominator would acknowledge how incredibly proficient Sherlock is. This simply hasn't been the case for Batman in Hollywood. It's completely understandable fans would like such a highly recognized trait in the books to be reflected on film.

 

[GarysMyOldman]

I think the mystery weapon is a hand held microwave emitter. All this talk of bringing things back to Begins makes me think it will be something like that. It doesn't look like it shoots anything and you can't see micro-waves so maybe thats it? Maybe Batman is evaporating Bane's pain serum to defeat him?

 

[The_Raganork]

The last two Sherlock Holmes movies are hardly CSI episodes or even anything remotely deeply intelligent. Yet with only a handful of scenes and thanks to Downey's informed performance, Sherlock easily shines due to his deductive prowess. You don't need to dedicate the entire film to his intellectual capacity in order to present it convincingly. Even people in the lowest common denominator would acknowledge how incredibly proficient Sherlock is. This simply hasn't been the case for Batman in Hollywood. It's completely understandable fans would like such a highly recognized trait in the books to be reflected on film.

Fair but; TDK is packed as it is. it's not as if the movie could have used some more detective work (same with BB) what happens in those two films doesn't leave room for the detective aspect of Batman.

I also think the bullet casing event in TDK was sufficient detective work for Batman

 

[Sionis]

I don't see how the complaint is legitimate if there is no possible way to make the films more detective-oriented without screwing the story over. I thought BB and TDK had a reasonable and great amount of Bat-Detective scenes. If they could offer examples of how BB and TDK could have had more detective scenes, then I would listen, but it would be extremely difficult to add in scenes to such carefully crafted stories, especially scenes that would be added just to show Batman as a detective more.

 

[Nevincer]

I think the mystery weapon is a hand held microwave emitter.

This is correct.
Ive read the comics.

 

[The_Raganork]

I think the mystery weapon is a hand held microwave emitter. All this talk of bringing things back to Begins makes me think it will be something like that. It doesn't look like it shoots anything and you can't see micro-waves so maybe thats it? Maybe Batman is evaporating Bane's pain serum to defeat him?

No.

The anesthetic is a gas to begin with.

also the mystery weapon is attached to the Batpod, so I'm guessing its an anti-vehicle sort of weapon.

 

[GarysMyOldman]

No.

The anesthetic is a gas to begin with.

also the mystery weapon is attached to the Batpod, so I'm guessing its an anti-vehicle sort of weapon.

Was just a guess, but didn't we see a brown liquid in the tubing of his mask? it's not all gas. Anyways, I was thinking maybe Lucious devised a way to take out the Tumblers with some sort of electronic pulse or something? It really doesn't look like it shoots anything physical.

 

[Nevincer]

No.

False. My confirmation is law.

 

[Sionis]

False. My confirmation is law.

I can confirm that his confirmation is law.
I've read the comics.

 

[Ramsay Snow]

False. My confirmation is law.

Has Nolan confirmed your confirmation?

 

[KRIM]

Fair but; TDK is packed as it is. it's not as if the movie could have used some more detective work (same with BB) what happens in those two films doesn't leave room for the detective aspect of Batman.

I also think the bullet casing event in TDK was sufficient detective work for Batman

From my viewing experience featuring highly intelligent characters, it's not so much about quantity as it is presenting the inherent traits consistently from scene to scene. It's how they talk, how they think, how they approach scenarios. You could feasibly have zero scenes purely dedicated to detective work, and it would still be possible to showcase Bruce's acumen with relatively little effort.

What's obvious in Nolan's films, as with others, is that the comic book depiction of Batman being so mentally gifted and a thorough tactician, has not been deemed a priority. Which is fine, but I would not say it is for lack of sufficient time or purpose within a narrative. To me, that just lacks imagination if anything.

I don't see how the complaint is legitimate if there is no possible way to make the films more detective-oriented without screwing the story over. I thought BB and TDK had a reasonable and great amount of Bat-Detective scenes. If they could offer examples of how BB and TDK could have had more detective scenes, then I would listen, but it would be extremely difficult to add in scenes to such carefully crafted stories, especially scenes that would be added just to show Batman as a detective more.

If there was any one statement to effectively end progress of a discussion while definitively stating an opposing view is invalid and has no possibility of providing a legitimate alternative; this is as good as an example as any.

 

[Banes_Dealer]

Watch this video a fan took at the football field: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wHQ7G2wFqQ&feature=related

and keep your eye on this guy in the red circle. It's the hostage:

When you actually WATCH the video, it kind of looks like

Spoiler

Commissioner Gordon wearing street clothes.

I'm not sure if we're allowed to post videos that fans bootlegged, and if I'm breaking the rules I'm not doing so knowingly and spitefully, and I apologize. I'm just trying to confirm a theory of mine and would like to know if anyone feels as I do.

Do you think it's

Spoiler

Dr.Pavel

or do you think what I do about it possibly being

Spoiler

Gordon

? Maybe this is the scene that

Spoiler

leads to Gordon's hospitalization.

IDK, just a theory I'm trying to confirm or cross off the list. Sorry about spoiler tag mania, I don't want spoil even though this is the spoiler forum.